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Universe-sized Dimensions and Pocket Realms (Staff Only)

Thank you. It seems fine to me, except for that I removed the word "dimensions" to avoid confusion.

It is best to ask Sera for input first though.
 
I removed the "most certainly" as suggested by Ricsi and corrected a typo I noticed. It looks good.
 
ShadowWarrior1999 said:
>Saying that it "Mirrors your world" doesn't not automatically equate to mirroring the entire universe you came from as World can also mean planet. And it can even refer to locations in between planet and Universe. And even if the realms are larger than planet sized, the "Your World" aspect often refers to specific sceneries rather than the entire Space-Time Continuum.

No to this one. If a world is stated to mirror a world that is a universe, it would obviously make it a universe. World clearly doesn't only mean a planet if the "mirror world" is shown to contain celestial bodies beyond just the Earth. This is being excessively nitpicky when the context should be clear on what it's conveying. If it's explicitly only a planet that's contained in it that's a different story.
Click to expand...
The last point in that draft about mirror world was refuted tho
 
It's not enough on its own. It must still require backing from points in the first part such as having countless galaxies, etc.
 
Would having more celestial bodies than just the Earth not already be enough backing? It's not just a planet, so bringing up that world can mean a planet is a red herring, no different that if there was a conversation about astral planes and someone brought up that a plane can mean a vehicle with wings that flies. They're clearly not talking about that definition. To say it's just referring to specific sceneries doesn't make sense either. A mirror world is about as straightforward as it gets that it's universe sized since in order to mirror something, you have to be the same size and have the same contents as it. So if we have a world that's a universe, and another world that's said to mirror said world, then the mirror world would be a universe as well.
 
I mean, the answer to your question is right there:

And it can even refer to locations in between planet and Universe. And even if the realms are larger than planet sized, the "Your World" aspect often refers to specific sceneries rather than the entire Space-Time Continuum. And just because world frequently refers to universe doesn't mean everything larger than a planet that is called a world is a universe.
 
But here's the thing. Why would we assume something so arbitrary that world is only referring to specific sceneries in the universe rather than the universe itself? A mirror world is its own world separate from our universe while copying its traits. It's not a planet, it's not a star, it's not a group of stars, it's not a galaxy, and it's not a galaxy cluster. I think it's very much obvious that in this case, world means a universe.
 
If a person's reality is being mirrored, then it's not going to just be some tiny part of it. It's going to be the entire universe, because otherwise it's not being mirrored. Hell, even Kepekley agreed with that up above.

Kepekley23 said:
>No to this one. If a world is stated to mirror a world that is a universe, it would obviously make it a universe. World clearly doesn't only mean a planet if the "mirror world" is shown to contain celestial bodies beyond just the Earth.

Agreed. Sounds like something I said word-for-word in the past concerning some verse out there.

And you're correct.
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There are obviously exceptions, as there always is, like if the setting shows otherwise. But this would be especially ignoring the fact that several franchises use the term "world" in place for dimensions and universes. What then? How do you deal with that?
 
Keep in mind that "Your World" can also just mean "Your Imagination" or "The World that exists in your mind" which can often just be room sized and have varying sizes including but not limited to Tier 4 sizes and galaxy size. If they mirror, "The Real World" and larger than planet size, that would be a different story, but "Your World" doesn't always cut it.

Anyway, to the main point. Agnaa's bullet points based on my suggestions are good; and definitely helpful, but Sera said something about just needing one simple paragraph rather than a wall of text.
 
If it's in your imagination then it isn't even a feat because it's not even real. And I'm talking about verses in which "world", "universe", and "dimension" are interchangeable terms within a series. You ignored my question completely, so can I get an answer?
 
I didn't ignore it, I just didn't see it due to multitask restraints. The worlds and dimensions being used interchangeably with universe can hint worlds and dimensions being universes, but that doesn't quite mean every single use of the term world means Universe.

And I meant, pocket realities that mirror someone's imagination and having a starry sky is a thing. Which creating one of those is still a feat.
 
What you're describing is completely different. Someone's imagination isn't real and thus that would not be a feat, so its supposed size would be irrelevant. What we are talking about is an actual, real world that mirrors our own.
 
He's not describing someone's imagination that's inapplicable to feats.

He's just mentioning that "a world that mirrors our own" can simply mirror people's conception/knowledge of their world, which may not actually be an entire universe.
 
I personally feel what Shadow said is more applicable, it does get to the point in few words and explains that there can be exceptions but depends what's shown/said.

As for the world thing, to put it as short as possible, World ca mean universe or whatever, but it is not what we assume is meant to be said unless enough proof is brought up to back this up. Simple as that. Or that's what I think at least.
 
"And I meant, pocket realities that mirror someone's imagination and having a starry sky is a thing. Which creating one of those is still a feat."

That depends on what's in their imagination. What is their imagination based on? Is it based off the real world or something completely random?
 
Agnaa said:
He's just mentioning that "a world that mirrors our own" can simply mirror people's conception/knowledge of their world, which may not actually be an entire universe.
Click to expand...
This is a very unreasonable point of view to have. Do you really expect a character to always state that they know every single little detail about our universe in order to create another world that's a mirror image of it? To put this on a smaller scale, lets say a character creates a planet that mirrors the Earth. If the character doesn't say he knows how every single person's house looks like, does that mean the planet he created is not 5-B?

Also. If said person's knowledge is on a cosmic scale and the term "world" is used in reference for it when it's also used interchangeably with "universe", does that not imply a universal size?
 
Seems like a pretty weird standard to go by if you can misjudge even the term alternate "reality" to mean just the conception of how far the scenery goes in the sky like "world".

Going by that, the alternate reality Majora made was just a reference to the scenery on the planet / sky since it doesn't say something silly like""entire""alternate reality and reality is just what we see.
 
Alternate Reality means Alternate universe in general consensus. But just being called "World" or "My World" or "Your World" is not enough.
 
Sounds like a downgrade to Zelda then since they use such terms as parallel world interchangebly with universe and its gonna get passed off as vague.
 
This is a staff only discussion also, and please stop derailing the thread talking about other verses. Anyway, Zelda only has Termina being called "Alternate Reality" and currently treated as a Universe. But everything else should be saved for another thread and not this one.
 
This isn't derailing. It's questioning the standards in the face of different contexts in relation to the purpose of this thread which remain unaddressed and also questioning the standards that are being proposed. Claiming what we're saying is derailing is ignorance, and I believe non-staff commenting on a staff thread is allowed so long as it's meaningful to the discussion at hand. Don't try to pull that card on me.

DarkDragonMedeus said:
Alternate Reality means Alternate universe in general consensus. But just being called "World" or "My World" or "Your World" is not enough.
Click to expand...
You're still ignoring my question. Of course it's not enough, but in the contect of a verse where they use that term for universe then it seems to be.
 
Obviously it depends on the context. That's what that whole point is all about.

"Saying that it "Mirrors your world" does not automatically equate to mirroring the entire universe", it needs further context from the first half of that draft. Even if the verse consistently use the terms for world and universe interchangeably, we wouldn't automatically assume that to be the case without looking at the context.
 
Agnaa said:
Here it is in collapsible format. I also cleaned up a typo.
Click to expand...
Is somebody willing to ask Sera if this is fine to apply to the footnote section of the Tiering System page?
 
I would appreciate some help and input here.
 
Okay. Thank you. Would you, Agnaa, or Medeus be willing to handle it?
 
I have some RL stuff to take care of first, but I may get to it after that. Plus, if a Universe page is made, there may need to be more stuff on it; my bullet list appears to be a section for comparing universes to pocket realities and/or comparing multiverses to collections of pocket realities. But a Universe page should generally start with general universal feats such as 3-A vs Low 2-C.
 
Okay. Thank you for helping out. Feel free to ask for input from Sera and Agnaa.
 
Yes, it seems great. Thank you very much for helping out. It is very appreciated.

What should we call the page?
 
I have to agree, "Universe Standards" is far less likely to be confused with something else, as we all know "Universe" by itself is a word that's pretty common and more prone of being incorrectly linked.

However, a redirect link from "Universe" to "Universe Standards" also works.
 
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