Transduality Type 3 For Arceus(Original Spirit)

[Sniper670]

i'm not talking about Taiji nor Wuji, i'm talking about the primordial chaos. Mentioning Taiji or Wuji is not good evidence for your claim unless those concepts are effectively existing concepts in the series

But they are. That's literally the state of the Universe. You're going in circles buddy.

Go back and read the messages

 

[sen_]

Normal Multiverse=1 and Distortion World=0
The Pokemon world which includes both of those as two sides would be both 1 and 0

the normal Multiverse and the Distortion World are inside of a specific duality (existence and nonexistence) which is type 1. That does not prove that the pokémon world is both A and B simultaneously

 

[sen_]

But they are. That's literally the state of the Universe. You're going in circles buddy.

Go back and read the messages

are those concepts ever mentioned/explained in the series?

 

[theultimate5105]

the normal Multiverse and the Distortion World are inside of a specific duality (existence and nonexistence) which is type 1. That does not prove that the pokémon world is both A and B simultaneously

The two sides thing implies that the overall pokemon world is both (also the Distorting World/Normal Multiverse Duality covers more then just existence/nonexistence). And Arceus's Dimension contains both inside of it so even then it would be both and the same thing would happen here

 

[sen_]

The two sides thing implies that the overall pokemon world is both (also the Distorting World/Normal Multiverse Duality covers more then just existence/nonexistence). And Arceus's Dimension contains both inside of it so even then it would be both and the same thing would happen here

Type 3 (Plurality): Characters that exist in a nondual state regarding all dual systems within the scope of an entire level of reality and qualitatively superior or immune to the effects caused within it. Furthermore, these characters exist beyond the classical states of contradiction-allowing logic on some level of existence.

even assuming what you said is true, if you don't meet the other requirements it's still not TD 3 (and i disagree with what you said)

 

[theultimate5105]

Yes and it does actually include all of them seeing as Giratina represents the opposite

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"When I created the music for battling Giratina, I thought of the front/back, life/death. There's bipolar, opposite ideas. So that's something I kept in mind when I created the battle music."

 

[sen_]

Yes and it does actually include all of them seeing as Giratina represents the opposite
...

alright, this proves dualities in the verse but it doesn't prove that A and B are simultaneously True (just because the Pokémon World includes the duality doesn't necessarily mean both are true simultaneously in my point of view)

 

[sen_]

The Primordial Nothingness exists outside of that so it would be not 1 or 0 and 1 and 0 instead being neither 1 or 0

not really, existing outside of it has nothing to do with a 5th truth state

 

[Sniper670]

are those concepts ever mentioned/explained in the series?

Are concepts supposed to be mentioned as concepts to be conceptual? Lol

Again, Arceus literally mentions that's everything governed by a system of Duality. Fine

Primordial Chaos is the Undifferentiated state of the multiverse

In Chinese cosmology there was originally hun-tun, an undifferentiated luminous cloud, a void with no boundary, emptiness, a potential state. The hun-tun is sometimes considered a state of chaos in that is undivided, whole, a state where everything is mixed together. This potential, undifferentiated primordial state is also called Wu Ji. Wu Ji means literally “no limit” or “no polarity.” It is the “One,”

 

[Sniper670]

not really, existing outside of it has nothing to do with a 5th truth state

Okay. Let me break it down for you. It seems you don't understand

Primordial Chaos - Neither 1 nor 0. division/distinctions don't exist here. Literally take a good look at Touhou and Scarlet King. It's the damn same thing.

From that came differentiation

Now both are in the Consciousness Of the Spirit.

So A is such that, it predates a state that is neither 1, nor 0, it's not 1 and 2 and it's not a negation of that . It's outside and contains it inside himself.

Literally, Oblivion is the Nothing that precedes Wuji. Same as The Original Spirit

Type 3. Simple as that

 

[sen_]

Are concepts supposed to be mentioned as concepts to be conceptual? Lol

you cannot assume something to exist without any explanation/mention in the series

Literally, Oblivion is the Nothing that precedes Wuji. Same as The Original Spirit

except Oblivion has blatant mentions of Wuji and other concepts.

 

[Tatsumi504]

The Pokemon world which includes both of those as two sides would be both 1 and 0

The Pokemon world would be duality which is 0,1 not 0 and 1. You're jumping the gun here

 

[Sniper670]

you cannot assume something to exist without any explanation/mention in the series

And it has. Before creation was the Undifferentiated chaos


Primordial Chaos literally as explained as Wuji.

except Oblivion has blatant mentions of Wuji and other concepts.

I showed you the definition of Wuji. Wuji is Primordial Chaos so again you're wrong that Pokémon doesn't have it as a concept.

And it's explained. Seriously how many times should I repeat myself

 

[Sniper670]

The Pokemon would be duality which is 0,1 not 0 and 1. You're jumping the gun here

You're wrong. Pokémon world runs on a system of Duality

Primordial Chaos is undifferentiation. Neither 1 nor 0

Both states exists in the mind of the Spirit.

That is type 3. As both are literally just mental things as compared to the spirit

 

[Sniper670]

Literally

So you're wrong that Pokémon doesn't have it as a concept

 

[Tatsumi504]

Going with what I am pretty sure this is saying overall
Normal Multiverse=1 and Distortion World=0
The Pokemon world which includes both of those as two sides would be both 1 and 0
The Primordial Nothingness exists outside of that so it would be not 1 or 0 and 1 and 0 instead being neither 1 or 0
The Heart contains all of that within itself and is beyond all of it so it is not any of those. This seems to be 5 Truth States so I agree with Transduality type 3

Normal multiverse=1, distortion world= 0.
Pokemon world as two sides of a coin= 0,1 (duality).
Primordial nothingness exists as oneness bereft of division= both 0 and 1.
The heart then Contains and transcends this which would still be TD 2.
There is no 4th truth state here, the heart is only beyond 3 truth states.

The TD 2 is highly iffy in and of it self considering the scan says "a certain duality"= singular.
We don't just assume a verse has many different dualities.

 

[sen_]

The Pokemon would be duality which is 0,1 not 0 and 1. You're jumping the gun here

exactly

Primordial Chaos literally as explained as Wuji.

DT's post about philosophical/religious concepts without being directly explained by the series

Literally

So you're wrong that Pokémon doesn't have it as a concept

same as before.

 

[Sniper670]

exactly

DT's post about philosophical/religious concepts without being directly explained by the series

same as before.

And it's explained no?

Primordial Chaos is the Undifferentiation, also called wuji. SHOW me where it differs

 

[Tatsumi504]

You're wrong. Pokémon world runs on a system of Duality

Primordial Chaos is undifferentiation. Neither 1 nor 0

Both states exists in the mind of the Spirit.

That is type 3. As both are literally just mental things as compared to the spirit

I'm not wrong. Pokemon world runs on a system of duality. Duality= 0,1 not 0 and 1.
Primordial chaos is undifferentiation/ indivisible oneness= 0 and 1.

Once again, it also doesn't even mention multiple dualities, it mentions only 1 which would be all its superior to.

 

[Sniper670]

Normal multiverse=1, distortion world= 0.
Pokemon world as two sides of a coin= 0,1 (duality).
Primordial nothingness exists as oneness bereft of division= both 0 and 1.
The heart then Contains and transcends this which would still be TD 2.
There is no 4th truth state here, the heart is only beyond 3 truth states.

Again. A is such that its it precedes chaos, which is neither 1, nor 0. Nothing absence of any duality. Nondual Nep 2

Lets take the Spirit as A
That is to say, for any statement A about them they are in a state that can't be described as A is true, A is false, A is simultanously true and false or A is neither true nor false. And so they must obey a many-valued logic

Now show me which of the states the Spirit exists in. None

The TD 2 is highly iffy in and of it self considering the scan says "a certain duality"= singular.
We don't just assume a verse has many different dualities.

Everything is governed by a certain duality. And he's used the Pokémon world and Primordial Chaos as one example.

 

[Sniper670]

I'm not wrong. Pokemon world runs on a system of duality. Duality= 0,1 not 0 and 1.
Primordial chaos is undifferentiation/ indivisible oneness= 0 and 1.

Primordial Chaos is undifferentiation.

It's neither 1 nor 0. Which is why it's also referred to as NOTHING in the verse.

Spirit precedes that and contains it in his mind

Once again, it also doesn't even mention multiple dualities, it mentions only 1 which would be all its superior to.

He used that, as an example to show that EVERYTHING is governed by a certain duality

 

[sen_]

You're wrong. Pokémon world runs on a system of Duality

yeah, Duality is {A, B} not both of them simultaneously.

Primordial Chaos is undifferentiation. Neither 1 nor 0

Neither A nor B would be lacking both truth values, the scans clearly show both of them coexisting.

Primordial Chaos is the Undifferentiation, also called wuji. SHOW me where it differs

just because it's similar doesn't mean chinese cosmology applies to the verse.

 

[Tatsumi504]

Everything is governed by a certain duality. And he's used the Pokémon world and Primordial Chaos as one example.

Don't get why you bolded "everything". "Everything" is not referring to duality, unless your statement was trying to say all duality is governed by a certain duality.
Once again, "a certain duality"= 1 duality which is TD 1 as pain_to12 said

 

[Sniper670]

yeah, Duality is {A, B} not both of them simultaneously.

I don't get your point. What does this even mean

Neither A nor B would be lacking both truth values, the scans clearly show both of them coexisting.

That's A that is in a state that is absent from 1 and 0. It's neither. Undifferentiation

just because it's similar doesn't mean chinese cosmology applies to the verse.

And yet it does. Go back and read the comments. Stop ignoring evidence

 

[sen_]

Again. A is such that its it precedes chaos, which is neither 1, nor 0. Nothing absence of any duality. Nondual Nep 2

how is it absence of any duality? Your scans literally say duality is blended together which is Both A and B

 

[Sniper670]

Don't get why you bolded "everything". "Everything" is not referring to duality, unless your statement was trying to say all duality is governed by a certain duality.

Arceus says that everything is governed by a certain duality.

And how do you end up interpretating it the way you do it

Plus, the other translations back me up.

Once again, "a certain duality"= 1 duality which is TD 1 as pain_to12 said

Everything is governed by a certain duality. After giving an example in his first sentence. Keep ignoring that

 

[Sniper670]

how is it absence of any duality? Your scans literally say duality is blended together which is Both A and B

Yes. That's Wuji. Everything was one and the same. 1 and 0 does not exist. Which is exactly why it's called Complete Nothingness in some texts

In Chinese cosmology there was originally hun-tun, an undifferentiated luminous cloud, a void with no boundary, emptiness, a potential state. The hun-tun is sometimes considered a state of chaos in that is undivided, whole, a state where everything is mixed together. This potential, undifferentiated primordial state is also called Wu Ji. Wu Ji means literally “no limit” or “no polarity.” It is the “One,”

 

[Sniper670]

Literally

So you're wrong that Pokémon doesn't have it as a concept

And you ignored this. Primordial Chaos is literally called Wuji here

 

[Tatsumi504]

Primordial Chaos is undifferentiation.

It's neither 1 nor 0. Which is why it's also referred to as NOTHING in the verse.

Spirit precedes that and contains it in his mind

Even if I were to concede and agree primordial chaos= neither 0 nor 1, you'd still need to have something that's both 0 and 1 to qualify

 

[sen_]

I don't get your point. What does this even mean

duality = {A, B} where B = ¬A. Or in other words they are mutually exclusive in the sense that if A is true then ¬A or B is false and viceversa

 

[Sniper670]

Even if I were to concede and agree primordial chaos= neither 0 nor 1, you'd still need to have something that's both 0 and 1 to qualify

You don't. If A does not exist in such a state they'd qualify for type 3.

The Spirit, or what i like to Call it Brahman, is not True, nor false, nor is he true and false, nor is it neither true nor false

 

[Tatsumi504]

Arceus says that everything is governed by a certain duality.

And how do you end up interpretating it the way you do it

Plus, the other translations back me up.

Everything is governed by a certain duality= 1 duality governs everything not Everything has its own duality it's governed by

 

[Sniper670]

Everything is governed by a certain duality= 1 duality governs everything not Everything has its own duality it's governed by

That's what it means, everything has its own duality.

Don't ignore the other translations which supports what i just said

 

[Sniper670]

duality = {A, B} where B = ¬A. Or in other words they are mutually exclusive in the sense that if A is true then ¬A or B is false and viceversa

What does this prove exactly?

Arceus already used that as an example to show that everything is governed by a certain duality

I don't know where you're getting at

 

[Tatsumi504]

You don't. If A does not exist in such a state they'd qualify for type 3.

You have to exist in a state that is beyond 4 truth states not 3.
You need to be in a state that is beyond both (0 and 1), neither (0 nor 1) to qualify.
Just because you're neither (0 nor 1) doesn't mean you skip the need to be beyond both (0 and 1)

 

[Sniper670]

You have to exist in a state that is beyond 4 truth states not 3.
You need to be in a state that is beyond both (0 and 1), neither (0 nor 1) to qualify.
Just because you're neither (0 nor 1) doesn't mean you skip the need to be beyond both (0 and 1)

Which is the same as the Spirit.

It's not True nor false, nor True and False, nor neither True Nor False

That sounds like Type 3 to me

 

[sen_]

You don't. If A does not exist in such a state they'd qualify for type 3.

The Spirit, or what i like to Call it Brahman, is not True, nor false, nor is he true and false, nor is it neither true nor false

most of these are not proven, all you've proven is that the Primordial Chaos is both A and B because it is a Nondual state of indivisible Oneness

 

[Sniper670]

most of these are not proven, all you've proven is that the Primordial Chaos is both A and B because it is a Nondual state of indivisible Oneness

Undifferentiated NOTHING.

It's neither true, nor false. That's Wuji, primordial Chaos and I've proven that.

Literally

 

[sen_]

Undifferentiated NOTHING.

It's neither true, nor false. That's Wuji, primordial Chaos and I've proven that.

Literally

do i have to say it again?, unless it's explained in the series we cannot assume Chinese cosmology to apply. Btw you keep ignoring your own scans that clearly say Everything was one and the same which is literally both A and B, your claim is contradicted by your own scans but this keeps going in circles so i guess staff should be called to evaluate this.

 

[Sniper670]

do i have to say it again?, unless it's explained in the series we cannot assume Chinese cosmology to apply. Btw you keep ignoring your own scans that clearly say Everything was one and the same which is literally both A and B, your claim is contradicted by your own scans but this keeps going in circles so i guess staff should be called to evaluate this.

Again. It's Undifferentiated NOTHING.

Everything was one thing. It wasn't 1 and 0. It was NOTHING as mentioned in the game. 1 and 0 isn't there because the boundary seperating object from subject doesn't exist

Look, I'm tired of repeating myself. It was Primordial Chaos where the multiverse wasn't differentiated which is Wuji