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Toaru Majutsu no Index Discussion Thread 3

Level 6 Accelerator better happen. So i can get my tier 1 Accel and see all the salt.

If we ever get a cosmic tier fight between Accel and whoever it'll be interesting to see how Kamachi handles it. Instead of the earths rotation Accel throws a galaxy.

Hamazura stomping touma is a funny thought.
 
I doubt Kamachi won't show it after all this hype, tier 1 accel will be worth all the salt

Sound like great idea

Meanwhile Index may be the strongest character by the end of this lol

22687671 1659316710780261 7421126816341272998 n
 
It's because IT IS mobile game they make good looking images, imagine index iii with this level of art

Meanwhile there still people who care about shipping on facebook pages

Cancer i swear ┬»\_(Òâä)_/┬»
 
Compare that to the One piece treasure cruise pics. They look utterly garbage in comparison

And we should get super good quality for index iii. I mean common the hype is real.
 
I find this art to be perfect tbh "for index at least"

They said they will give index extra screen time iirc
 
LordAizenSama said:
Level 6 Accelerator better happen. So i can get my tier 1 Accel and see all the salt.

If we ever get a cosmic tier fight between Accel and whoever it'll be interesting to see how Kamachi handles it. Instead of the earths rotation Accel throws a galaxy.

Hamazura stomping touma is a funny thought.
Click to expand...
Galxyrasenshurikenimage
FUTON: GALAXY RASENSHURIKEN!

Accel throwing a galaxy would be awesome lol.
 
If Index III quality is close to the quality Railgun S had I'll be happy. I already know the anime will bork some things up, it's both a LN adaptation and a JCStaff series, but there's some moments I really want to see animated, even if things like the Saint level fights are a bit underwhelming.
 
Blanked said:
LordAizenSama said:
Level 6 Accelerator better happen. So i can get my tier 1 Accel and see all the salt.

If we ever get a cosmic tier fight between Accel and whoever it'll be interesting to see how Kamachi handles it. Instead of the earths rotation Accel throws a galaxy.

Hamazura stomping touma is a funny thought.
Click to expand...
Galxyrasenshurikenimage
FUTON: GALAXY RASENSHURIKEN!

Accel throwing a galaxy would be awesome lol.
Click to expand...
This anime is so edgy without even watching it
 
TTGL wasn't very edgy at all. Though things do take a turn for the more ridiculous by the last few episodes

I could understand why you would think that it is based off that one picture and the design though
 
It's true that photo is like saying don't watch this.

The anime though was pretty good in partciular a certain character...
 
Why we don't add "Limited Higher-Dimensional Manipulation" for Teleporters and Accel? Since the former uses the 11th dimension to move and Accel can interact with them while teleporting.
 
SchroKatze said:
Why we don't add "Limited Higher-Dimensional Manipulation" for Teleporters and Accel? Since the former uses the 11th dimension to move and Accel can interact with them while teleporting.
Click to expand...
Movement through higher dimensions Ôëá manipulating higher dimensions
 
The sword itself is a simple 3-D object swung by a human hand, so he could reflect that easily.

The spell alone he couldn't reflect, already because it is spatial stuff.
 
I've just noticed Aureolus' page could use some work. I'm going to reread OT2, might even notice something I missed when I first looked for his commands.
 
Apparently I had missed a command or two and I could add the magic barrier he made for the building. He might deserve an upgrade to Large Building level or City Block level. The Misawa Cram School are four 12-story buildings linked with passages, plus the Gregorian Chant scene shows he could affect not only those buildings but all buildings surrounding the school.
 
Hey guys i just wanted to let you know that Amata pull back punch had a bit of clarity in NT 4 :

"Yes, yes, I understand."
The writhing of the graphs on the monitors grew even more intense and the attacker girl's eyes absorbed some sort of information from them.
"Controlling hammer-level destructive power on the microscopic level. That was your combat pattern, right, Amata-ojichan!?"

he out calculated accelerator barrier and by knowing his life partner he knew how he would change it , same with Mina in the new novel; wing accel has probably infinite calculation so no more problem with that

ED: and problably the gloves were supposed to help him if accel had not been brain damaged
 
Not really, that is referring to Amata's superhuman level of control and finesse with his body/martial arts, which we would later see with his lethal technique that Yuiitsu uses. Amata's counter is explicitly reversing his melee attacks at the right moment. The BS part of it it's the timing required to pull it off, which should be impossible for any human being to reliably pull off, but then again, Toaru is the series where regular humans soak up more damage than some shonen characters without dying, nameless Skill-Outs are at olympic athlete levels of fitness, an expert soldiers is a bluer to regular people when moving and can defeat a hundred amred bodyguards on her own without much issue and a random American housewife has 200 kilos grip strength and breaks her safe open barehanded when she forgets the combination.

I disagree with the wing part.
 
Yes but he calculated and moved his hand, same with mina (and it was especially stated that she can move her body in different way from normal human) probably amata did the same, reversing doesn't mean simply pull back he calculates the moment in which the barrier would repel the punch and when accel tried to change the calculation amata just keep up with his calculation power ; in the field of Controlling hammer-level destructive power on the microscopic his calculation level is probably on par or better than accel, if you can keep up with accel calculation and changes of the barrier you can probably pass it

about the wing part, is feasible to pass the barrier once with luck, but then he would randomly change the input with infinite calculation power every ms

ED: to further prove it we have an example of someone passing accel barrier trying to copy amata and although he succeeded to go in without the calculation need to know how accel barrier redirect things he got a broken arm :

"I remember that Kihara Amata once used the technique of drawing back his fist an instant before receiving impact to break through the reflection obstacle."
"!?"
The voice came from his blind spot, along with a fist.
Accelerator flew backwards in a hurry.
Sugitani used footwork beyond the limits of a human that was almost like sliding to keep himself in the same distance between him and Accelerator.
After that, a 'boom' rang out.
Accelerator's face was feeling some numbing pain, while Sugitani jumped out of the ring for the first time in this battle.
"So that's it."
Sugitani shook his wrist.
It seemed to have sprained, the joints had swelled up a lot.
 
While obviously his intellect was involved in the process in some part, calculations were never stated to be the focus of the technique not they were said to surpass Accelerator's like Mina's did, so he clearly didn't do the same thing Mina did. The focus of the counter is reversing the punch just as it touches Accelerator's AIM field. Simples as that in theory, really hard in practice due to timing. If calculations were an important part of it then someone like Sugitani would not be able to even try the technique given he's neither an esper nor a Kihara.

Accelerator's wings do not give him infinite calculation

The gloves are not part of the technique at all, they were bait for Accelerator.
 
mina moved her "hand" in different partner out calculating accel, amata skipped a lot by doing the pulling punch mixing calculation and martial art (as simple martial art already failed) maybe he cant outclass his calculation at full brain but maybe he can stay on par with accel with brain damage

the wings give him "near" infinite calculation power

and the gloves were not just bait they are made to work with super minuscule particle and even have artificial muscle
 
Amata's calculations are not a main part of the technique. The main part of the technique are martial arts combined with a deep knowledge of how Accelerator's power and Personal Reality work. Knowledge here doesn't mean calculation power, it means Amata knew the timing to reverse the punch, how to mess up with Accelerator's air manipulation, how Accelerator would try to change his reflection, etc.... Calculations were not an important part of this. And no, when I say Amata's calculations didn't surpass Accelerator's I meant both pre and post-headshot.

There's no proof of the wings having infinite calculation power.

The gloves have a function, but they are unrelated to Amata's counter and don't affect its effectiveness. Amata wore them mainly as bait to get Accelerator's hopes up and then shatter them because he's a prick like that, that was why he brought Accelerator's attention to them and faked surprise when Accelerator immediately destroyed them only to sucker punch him.

Don't edit the quotes like that. Sugitani also brings up Kakine's counter for the reflection because he's talking about the fact that Accelerator's reflection is not a perfect defense. And what does he do right after that? Confirm the issue is that he cannot recreate Amata's technique perfectly due to lacking his specialized field, a.k.a. the knowledge on Accelerator's timing. So no, it's not because calculations, but because while Sugitani has the martial arts skill he lacks the second component of the technique, experience and deep knowldge of Accelerator's power.

"Those special exceptions are all results of their own specialized fields. Just by observing them I can't perfectly recreate their techniques."

Look, especulating is nice and all, but you're going against what the novel and the character doing the technique actually tell you. Calculations are not a part of it. The timing is explicitly the important part.

"Your reflection isn't an absolute barrier."

Kihara slowly walked forward.

Accelerator could not move.

"It only reverses the vector of any force heading into it. That makes it simple to beat the shit out of you. I just have to pull back my fist the instant before hitting. You could say the trick is stopping at the last second."

He sounded like he was enjoying himself.

His smile was that of someone explaining the trick to a piece of stage magic they had thought up.

"You end up reflecting the fist that is moving away from you. That means you actually punch yourself. Do you get it now, ********* boy!? Or is it too complex for a little kid to understand!?

[...]

"So what's it like being stomped into the mud? I know your characteristics, your equations, your Personal Reality…everything about you. I didn't develop your power for nothing."
 
First I edited that part cause it was not needed in the discussion, im not here to make wall of text

second it's not as simple ass pull back cause accel can change the angle of redirection too so you still need to calculate the new punch angle and that's why even thought he hit accel Sugitani got an arm broken cause the angle was sightly wrong as x molecule moved in a direction while other moved a-0.000b he got lucky that is hand did not split, calculation are still needed to go in and out without problem, maybe they are not at accel lvl, but they are still needed (for example touma does subconscious calculation, but he still does it for his precog ex: at what angle do i need to deflect x wing)
 
The main problem with kihara counter isn't the calcultaion but the precision of body control. Kihara knew how accel reflection work and pull back his punch before redirected. Even after accel tried to alter his reflection kihara knew this change and adjust his punch.
 
As I've proven by linking the actual scene of Amata explaining his technique, you're going against the facts of the story. Sorry, but you're wrong. Unless you bring actual evidence from the story that retcons this (and no, Mina using vague calculations to get pass the reflection is not a retcon any more than the Coffin from the Accel manga doing the same was one), I won't continue this discussion.
 
Kihara counter is simple technique but really hard to do. Another method to use kihara counter is use mechanical hand that inputted about accel information just like kuroyoru so with her numerical hand
 
Guys im not arguing about active calculation,


touma make passive calculation and im talking about those the one that comes from experience, amata trained his body for that set of martial art but still he needs to do calculations (like we do every day to move x leg against x force of gravity or catch thing) lest say i put a super calculator vs an astrophysics obviously the super calculator will beat the physic in almost all but as he is specialized, and he trained he can be faster than the super cal. Because he make those calculations subconsciously as its an everyday task for him

even more simple think of it like rock paper scizzor accel calculate that the best move is rock amata caulculate that accel would use rock so he use paper , so that even if he changes the barrier setting amata already know what changes he need to make
 
Trulybehind said:
wait lazy i still have a question does accel reflection can reflect teleport attack like move point or kuroko
Click to expand...

he can, but wierd things happen with the 3 dimension quote: When he reflected teleportation powers, a strange phenomenon occurred in the 3 dimensional world, but this had felt entirely different.

ED: although in his manga he got as-ported because the machine-esper hybrid had more calculation power
 
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