The Watcher vs. Doctor Strange

[The_Wright_Way]

The Player has just stumbled into the Marvel Multiverse and is completely estatic that they have all these new Sims to play with. Over time, Doctor Strange catches wind of these sudden strange events. People's personalities have been altered, new people have appeared out of thin air, and even a paricularly morbid case where a man starved to death in his own house after all the doors and windows disappeared. After a bit of investigating, he links it all back to The Player, who had just discovered Steven and is all too happy to try to add him to his collection of Sims.

Speed Equal. Everything else is fair game.


vs.

 

[ZacharyGrossman273]

Veeeeeeeeeeeery close. Inconclusive for now due to how even it is.

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Veeeeeeeeeeeery close. Inconclusive for now due to how even it is.

You're gonna have to give some reasons there buddy.

 

[ZacharyGrossman273]

I mean, both have soul manipulation (Although The Player's might be higher if we scale him to death). Time Manipulation wouldn't work due to The Player being above the abstract form of time in his verse. But strange has a massive brute force advantage.

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Bump.

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Bump.

 

[Eating_Delicious_Pancakes_Right_Now]

This feels like something right up Doc Strange's alley. Finding and banishing an entity that believes that it has control over the entire universe? I'd totally read that comic. His success pretty much hinges on being able to retain his own facalties, and with spells that can protect his mind and soul I think thats within the realm of reason.

Vote Dr. Strange

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Bump.

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

Inconclusive, Stranges hax is quiet a bit higher than "mine", but I don't see resistance to Bio manip on stranges profile.

That, and "my" time stop affects those immune to time stop normaly.

 

[ZacharyGrossman273]

Risci is right about the time stop thing, actually. So it's who does what first.

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Bump.

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Bump.

 

[Imaginym]

1: Eternal Life: Characters gifted with this type of immortality cannot die from natural causes, such as old age or conventional illness, but can be killed by unnatural causes.

Would The Player/Watcher's biology manipulation get around Strange's Type 1 Immortality? Also, what of his Type 4? There's also the matter of the Biology Manipulation's citation being for creating stuff like meat & egg plants.

Strange also resists High Level Reality Warping, doesn't he? Does that protect him from any of The Player's tricks? (Also, Strange being an actual doctor & surgeon might make having a disease stick a problem, never mind the matter of time.)

I assume The Player/Watcher can't do something like summon a wizard or witch to try transmuting Strange, can it?

So, given both have Immortality of a few kinds, do they have any actual ways of beating each other?

Can Strange be Mind Controlled? Is there any form of prison that can hold him? Could The Player/Watcher use their Biology Manipulation to turn Strange into a Quadruplegic, multi-diseased baby, preventing him from properly gesticulating for his magic spells? (Also, infants have much weaker immune systems, so if extraordinarily fast diseases are an option, this helps a lot by making Strange much less physically capable to cast or cure it, & making him even more vulnerable to disease. Also, possibly less smart as a product of biology.)

Could they maybe get Strange stuck in space? What about Power Nullification options?

There's also the matter of who does what when.

Normally, The Player/Watcher Mind Controls first, but once they realize that doesn't work on this otherwise would-be-Sim, they have to figure out a new plan while Strange uses the time to attack, or plan himself, too.

What about their Void Manipulation?


Put simply, do either of them have a win condition, & what are they most likely to do IC?

From there, I'd assume we have to work out how both parties would interact, approaching towards what win condition(s) they may have. Death, incapacitation, BFR, mind control....

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Type 1 immortality can be bypassed by anything other than Age Manipulation.

If the Player did summon a wizard, said wizard wouldn't do any good, as Strange is a far superior sorcerer to any wizard in Sims.

Yes, but from what I can tell, they resist each other's hax to such a degree that they won't be able to use the powers that can kill the other person.

The Mind Control is a maybe. It's also something that the entire fight hinges on since The Player spams it relentlessly.

 

[ZacharyGrossman273]

If we scale the watchers mind manipulation to the crown of nightmares, it might be above strange resistance.

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

The age manip gets around immortality (Vampires, zombies, etc.), but it cannot do anything more than put the enemy seconds before they die of old age (or an infant too), which type 1 would still counter. He would get the normal problems that come with being a hundred year old man.


Bio manip is also used to change their body shape, species etc. You can make one Sim a completly different one in body and mind.


Reality Warping is far too broad to say he resists stuff he hasn't shown to.


I mean, it could summon any sim. They would be oblitarated, and be infinitly slower than both, but it could.


The Watcher can probably kill with some of it's stuff, but extremly difficult to actually do it. Not sure about strange, but he likely can.


That depends on how you interpret Newlows statement (Planetary, universal or multiversal on a ~5 timeline reality) and how resistant strange is. He could make him into a heavily diseased baby, not sure if strange resists biological mindhax.


Didn't he fight outside of reality? I doubt space is that deadly to him. Doub powernull, the direct one, would work.


Void gets resisted.

 

[Imaginym]

@Ricsi-viragosi: "The age manip gets around immortality (Vampires, zombies, etc.), but it cannot do anything more than put the enemy seconds before they die of old age (or an infant too), which type 1 would still counter. "

Do you mean Type 1 counters reduction of age, or just attempts to kill via old age?

Also, summons/created Sims get outsped? But wouldn't Speed Equalization apply to them? Or just to the Watcher? Also, while they would be outclassed on their own, isn't it possible The Watcher would have means of distracting them while the summon tries to transmute Strange?

How many Sims could they control while trying to deal with Strange, if it's even more than 1 at all?


In any case, if the Watcher COULD turn Strange into a heavily diseased, physically crippled baby, Strange could have a lot of difficulty casting, his immune system would be pathetic, & it would be really rough on his stamina.

Supposing both resort to Time Stop, but The Watcher is immune due to being outside of time, then The Watcher, after realizing they can't Mind Control Strange would be faced with someone they can't make into a new Sim, but still want to kill, or otherwise defeat.

So I'm assuming that they'd resort to Time Stop, assuming it actually stops Strange, & begin testing out typical ways of getting him.

Unfortunately, I'd assume stuff like drowning strange in a pool, sealing him in a room with no exits, throwing him into space or dropping him into a volcano wouldn't work because they probably require flowing time to do so, can't get past Strange's durability, & once time IS flowing, he can fly, teleport or portal or WHATEVER out of there.

Similarly, the kill-by-disease approach seems like an option... but time needs to flow for the disease to advance.

What can Strange do about disease if & when he realizes he's been de-aged? Can The Watcher break his arms? Make him a quadruplegic? What diseases can they inflict?

Mind Manipulation almost certainly isn't going to work, meaning Strange probably will have his knowledge. The Watcher can't take that chance at least, & would HAVE to ENSURE Strange can't cast spells, but they seem to lack means of incapacitating him.

The reason crippling him so bad is necessary is to prevent Strange healing himself or stopping the Watcher once time resumes so the disease(s) can progress. What can Strange do to fight this, once the Watcher trial-&-errors its way to knowing to do this, thanks to the power of being above time & able to stop time?

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Bump.

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Bump.

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Bump.

 

[ABoogieYesSir]

Uh would Strange's power absorb be good enough here?

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

Oh, didn't see the answer.


Old age makes the target as old as the watcher decides. It can only set it to only a few minutes before death, which means that those few minutes needed wouldn't pass due to type 1. So beyond back pains, not many problems for strange. I didn't think about turning into a baby tough, that could work.

Stuff stays relative to their speed. An attack twice as fast as the user (say a weapon or something like that) is still twice as fast in speeed equal. Something twice as slow is still twice as slow.

They could control at least 1 nation, possibly a planet of them, and at mlst the universe. The sims mediaval for the first, and the interpretation of newlow saying that everyone is controlled by them for the other two.

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

Uh would Strange's power absorb be good enough here?

What is it's vest feat, how us it activated and such would decide that.

 

[ABoogieYesSir]

Uh would Strange's power absorb be good enough here?

What is it's vest feat, how us it activated and such would decide that.

He absorbed SHuman-Gorath= 2-C power's and destroyed him.

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

Great.

Was it an invisible formless being outside of time?

And how is it activated?

 

[ABoogieYesSir]

To be honest when I read it, I was confused where he activated it.

 

[ABoogieYesSir]

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

Dood, I think you missed something about sHuman

If he is defeated, whoever was responsible will absorb his power and have their personality destroyed, literally turning into SHuman-Gorath

Strange only resisted his mind being overwritten.

 

[ABoogieYesSir]

But he did absorb it according to it

 

[Ricsi-viragosi]

But everyone absorbs it.

If a normal dude somehow killed it, they would absorb it as well.

 

[ABoogieYesSir]

Wait w0t?

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Bump.

 

[Imaginym]

Wait w0t?

If I may butt in, & I understand things right:

If he is defeated, whoever was responsible will absorb his power and have their personality destroyed, literally turning into SHuman-Gorath

What Ricsi is saying & quoting this for is to indicate that absorbing SHuman-Gorath & its powers is not something Strange initiated himself.

Be it Doctor Strange or anyone else, whoever defeats SHuman-Gorath becomes SHuman-Gorath in mind & abilities, regardless of the abilities of whoever did defeat SG. Strange resisted his mind becoming SG's, but SHuman-Gorath's own abilities still caused Strange to gain them.

Hence, Doctor Strange did not gain SG's abilities through a Power Absorption ability DS has, but because of SHuman-Gorath's own abilities. So DS doesn't have a Power Absorption ability of his own. (And if he does, his profile needs a revision.)

 

[ABoogieYesSir]

Yeah it needs a revision

 

[Imaginym]

Well, I'm not super knowledgeable on Marvel, & anyway, Versus Threads on the Versus Threads boards aren't for revisions. If you wanna revise it, I recommend making it a thread with your claims & evidence.

 

[ABoogieYesSir]

I'm not good enough

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Bump.

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Pump

 

[The_Wright_Way]

Bump.

 

[Abstractions]

Mmm. I feel like the Watcher has a distinct advantage in being able to de-age Strange, as I feel the doctor doesn't have a counter for that.

Will the de-aging function in the way I think it does, by that I mean it will effect Strange's memory and by proxy his ability to use his magic at all, or will his mind be unaltered but simply be reduced to an infant?

If it's the former, then I'd give it to the Watcher based off that.