The Ultra Series Discussion Thread: Unleash! The Power of Imagination!

[Mr.Cutlery]

Ah, I see. Well, nevertheless, we know the upper ends we may potentially see in the future if it does come to it.

 

[Peter1129]

Yeah we know the multiverse is 2-B but we probably won’t be seeing anybody destroy it anytime soon. Since right now everybody is only stuck at barely having Low 2-C feats. The highest chances of anybody in the series going above Low 2-C is probably Delacion who is shown to be able to watch over multiple universes and has a straight up possibly Low 2-C statement. Everybody else is kinda just stuck at at least 3-A likely Low 2-C unless the Absolutians suddenly pull some 2-C shenanigans.

 

[Mr.Cutlery]

I'm hoping that given the stuff Z had been prone to showing us, the next series might finally be less restrained when it comes to major showings like that. I mean, we know they know the level of power they've been dragging their series too, so they can't really hide it for much longer.

 

[Peter1129]

I mean the stuff shown Ultraman Z also weren't that impressive. The damage and stuff were only limited to Earth. Ultraman Geed was pretty much the closest we got to anything close the tier 2 stuff. So yeah like I said Absolutians are our biggest chance of getting straight up Low 2-C if not 2-C feats as they will likely be Ultra Galaxy Fight or movie bosses which is where majority of the series’ budget goes to. Although I guess with how Ultraman Trigger has rumors of having something to do with fixing timelines it might be possible for tier 2 feats to happen in that series.

 

[Mr.Cutlery]

Yeah, but just the fact they placed emphasis on a dimensional destroying weapon is still something. And I was also referring to what it means contextually, since D4 is a weapon used in the series itself that isn't vague or held back by other potential factors like Belial Atrocious still requiring ties to having collected King's energy and being able to restart Crisis Impact which are previously established events that we know have been averted and is unlikely to have another explicit showing of.

But yeah, the Absolutians, too. If Tartarus' name is any indication, it's likely we'll get Absolutians based on other primordial deities, all of whom have ties to major fundamental aspects of the universe which the Absolutians have been shown to have control over. And on that rumor, yeah, I'm really hoping for it to have some influence as well.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

grains of sand

I read that as grains of rice and got hungry lol

 

[Peter1129]

They did say grains of rice and not grains of sand. So your hunger is understandable. Actually you just reminded me that I skipped dinner. Ah crap now I want to eat something before going to sleep.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

Hohohohohoho~

And ah, I was thinking something else that reminded me of sand.

But yeah, that sounds about 2-B there.

 

[Peter1129]

Also just a reminder that the Ultraman Z/Ultra Galaxy Fight 2 Super Complete Works will likely release around March 8-10 as that’s the date that the previous SCW were released around. However within the following week there will only be rumors of the contents. The actual scans of it won’t be released on Tieba until late March or early April due to various reasons like shipping time and the fact that it’s hard to get copies of it these days. Don’t remember the exact reason why though. But if we are lucky and somebody manages to get it ahead of time we could maybe see the contents in early March.

 

[Mr.Cutlery]

Oh, damn. I thought it was around June since that's what I heard in Discord. But that's nice.

Also, I've updated my sandbox a little last night, though I'm still gonna fix the pictures stuff since there's a level of inconsistency there.

 

[Peter1129]

Wait June? Hold on let me check.

Huh that actually seems to be true. Yeah I just search the release date and yeah seems like this year it will be released in June rather than March. This news was apparently just released rather recently a few days ago. That’s kinda weird. There aren’t even any movies or anything coming out so logically it should’ve came out earlier rather than later? I guess it might have something to do with them focusing on Shin Ultraman.

Well crap. So we’re gonna have to wait four months rather than just one to see the Super Complete Works then.

 

[Mr.Cutlery]

Oh no. Ah crap, whatever, as long as it's certain to come out.

 

[Mr.Cutlery]

Mr.Cutlery/SandboxBlog

vsbattles.fandom.com

Can anyone give this a check again? I know it's rough, but I'll be posting it anyway, while I try to figure out how to properly work the damn image system of the wiki.

 

[Mr.Cutlery]

Was it fine to add new information regarding tiers or do we still have to make a CRT for that? Because I see that Juda Specter's key doesn't have his statements of destroying the universe.

 

[Peter1129]

I mean the universe stuff started from Juda and not Juda Spectre. So I really don’t think there’s any need to mention that his stronger form could do the same. Juda Spectre already has the Victory’s strongest enemy and stronger than Etelgar stuff on his profile. Which based off scaling is way above normal Juda. Like we don’t need to mention that every single 3-A character in the series can destroy the universe even though some of them don’t have universe statements right?

And about the sandbox I’ll take a look later. I have a test today so I’m gonna need to study.

 

[Mr.Cutlery]

I suppose that's reasonable.

Oh, alright then. Last thing you'd want is to get distracted, so good luck with the test.

 

[Mr.Cutlery]

Rewatching the first Zero Gaiden, and just realized that we technically have a potential 2-B feat in the form of the Salome's experiments causing instabilities throughout the multiverse which can lead to its collapse. And given how selective TsuPro has been with their word choices, we know collapse would mean total destruction.

And yes, I know this scales to nobody, but it could be a good base for future feats.

Honestly I should also probably clear up some terminologies by explaining the context in which they were used. This one alone has been ingrained in my head for quite a while, but like my planned blog, a lot of it would still need scans of the instances they've been used in.

 

[Peter1129]

Oh right yeah they did say something about her experiments causing instabilities in the multiverse. Man this really shows how during Zero's era there's a whole bunch of crazy feats even though they scale to literally no one.

And this reminds me I should start updating the profiles again now that Goku vs Zero has ended.

I'll probably make more sandboxes of other Ultras and post them here before actually posting it. Also we need to think about what we should do with Zetton's profile. Like should we just split it into Showa, Heisei, and Reiwa due to just how many variants of it there are?

Peter1129/Sandbox3

vsbattles.fandom.com

Pretty much done with revising the tiers on Belial's profile now I just need to add the abilities, techniques and etc. Which is rather annoying.

 

[Mr.Cutlery]

There's also a weird implication where they keep mentioning alternate universes when referring to the differing versions of their universe, but makes it clear that wherever Darklops Zero came from, was am entirely different and separate place. Almost seemed like they're saying a single series of universe refers to an entire set of differing timelines.

There's also this weird implication that dimensions is like a totally different layer to a universe that could potentially affect its various timelines when affected in its entirety. It could likely just mean the whole universe itself, this one used to specifically note that it refers to its entire 4 dimensional form.

The Gaiden does help in some way. Like it basically shows that iy doesn't matter whether timelines or time axes are mentioned, different universes already have differing histories which pretty much mean the same things. And then the Zero movie, with its showcase of a universe's boundary being represented in this psychedelic imagery and the fact it resides within a super/hyperspace, means that a universe does indeed mean a 4 dimensional construct which if affected, is indeed Low 2-C.

Alright, sorry and enough rambling, I just really wanted to get those out, in case I find newer evidences towards that inevitable upgrade.

Oh yeah, I was also thinking about helping to update the pages, but there I was getting distracted because I was frustrated at how a universe in Ultraman isn't accepted as something that could bump an outright Low 2-C on the profiles.

Yeah it should be best if you were to keep with sandboxes first. And as for Zetton, I guess it's fine if you want to.

Belial's sandbox looks good from what I'm seeing.

 

[Mr.Cutlery]

I just rewatched some of TAC's episodes and the more I did, the more I'm starting to believe the cosmology of the verse is really damn weird.

 

[Peter1129]

Yeah cause it seems like what UGF2 is saying is that whenever there’s a change made in the past, a new timeline gets created in the present similar to how Dragon Ball creates new timelines with each changes.

So we now have a 2-B multiverse that could spawn another 2-B multiverse in a different timeline if somebody with time powers decide to mess with the past.

 

[Mr.Cutlery]

There's also this implication how each a dimension encompasses a set of universes, as per episode 3 where 80 says "universe from other dimensions". Kind of supported by how Father of Ultra acknowledges Zero as being able to "cross dimensions" which implies that universes like U40's and R/B's are separated by "dimensions" as opposed to just a space-time.

Adding to that alongside your deduction, it hints to a possibility that every M78 are one of many branching timelines that all source from a main point which we see the perspective of.

Anyway, should probably drop it for now until we get proper explanation on how they work exactly. For now, we're grasping at straws. Or I could again ask about it and see what can be interpreted from it.

 

[Peter1129]

So basically in a nutshell we might have a 2-B multiverse that has a DC Comic esque universe cluster (Actually I’m not sure if they are considered separate dimensions) on top of Dragon Ball’s timeline time ring shenanigan all in one as the Ultra Series cosmology. Cool.

 

[Mr.Cutlery]

That's probably the closest approximation to what we've been shown. Kinda sucks now that its gone this way since the original bubble multiverse interpretation was much simpler, and could have simplified stuff if they had just said each bubble is a 4D space-time continuum.

 

[Mr.Cutlery]

@Qliphoth_Bacikal

Hey, sorry for the bother, but can you translate a portion of this?

Specifically these ones with nicknames: Neo Frontier Space World, Future Earth World and The World Where Planet Kanon Exists. Even more specifically, I need translations on sentences with the word space-time (時空). And if possible, also the main title and the yellow words beside it, and how you would interpret what it says.

Again, sorry for bothering ya.

 

[Mr.Cutlery]

Something that I just realized, what exactly is Greeza's needle? It seems to be something physical, but it's born from inside of him. Then there's Beliarok, whose existence is a mix of that needle and Belial's genes. There's likely some paradoxical stuff going on that Z's SCW is probably going to reveal.

All in all, however, this is only something to consider once there's free time on anyone's part.

 

[Mr.Cutlery]

More ramblings.

In the Blue Shadow novel, Tregear says this: "People have dreams. Dreams are the gateway to the abyss. Sometimes it's a nightmare, and sometimes it's a hint of inspiration. People are subconsciously accessing the "Abyss"."

Through this statement, Tregear calls Grimdo's prison or Grimdo itself "The Abyss" that's used in metaphores. At face value this means seemingly nothing, but I believe it sets something. If Grimdo is that abyss in people's subconscious, and his powers innately includes affecting that and more, that would mean Grimdo's powers at minimum could affect the minds and souls of at least billions of lifeforms with its connection to the subconscious of people. And of course, the Tri-Squad directly resists this power.

 

[Qliphoth_Bacikal]

This looks pretty neat.

 

[Peter1129]

Been busy with real life so I haven’t been on much but anyway.

@Mr.Cutlery Yeah Greeza’s Space Needle is actually kinda weird. Like it kinda just took some of Geed’s blood even though Geed seemed rather far away from it. So it seems like the needle might also be sentient like Greeza.

And that stuff with Grimdo. That might work I guess? Not entirely sure though. Man now I really want the super complete works to come out already.

@Qliphoth_Bacikal Ahh yeah I’ve actually seen quite a few of these figurart things. Looks neat though I’m not really a collector so I probably won’t get it. Not to mention by the time I figure out how to get it it will probably be sold out. Cause a lot of these stuffs get sold out like just a day or two after their release.

 

[Mr.Cutlery]

The only FiguArts I've got is a lucky catch from a long time ago on something that isn't even Ultra. Specifically Another Agito. Bruh moment.

If we consider the needle as sentient, then it kinda makes sense since the Xlugger, which may have been a prototype (production wise) needle, had some kind of sentience or power that specifically allowed it to absorb external stuff that allowed it to defeat Greeza, like X's memory data I think.

Of course, Grimdo's potency is, as of now, theoretical. But we still have a good base from his very nature alone.

 

[Peter1129]

Yeah now that I think about it they still never really explained what the Xlugger was and why it has the ability to grant people’s wishes. It being X’s version of the Space Needle would make a lot of sense. Guess we just need the SCW to confirm it.

And if it is true than Greeza would pretty much be the Ultra Series‘ walking Hax + Hax generating machine. Like it itself is already really haxxed as hell and pretty much unkillable in canon. And yet on top of that Greeza has the space needle which created the Beliarok that could hit itself and maybe also the Xlugger which has wish granting/reality warping powers. Heck X or Z should give Hikari the Beliarok and Xlugger to analyze so every Ultra can have their own version of the Space Needle.

 

[Mr.Cutlery]

For real. And when it comes to Beliarok, not only does Deathcium Slash pretty much points to Dura Negate due to its nature, but the weapon himself is hard to get rid of, given that he basically has Mid-Godly thanks to it reforming after a point blank D4 burst. So yeah, DRC isn't just very versatile, but he has a weapon that will literally not die and always comes back to him. Beliarok may also have a pseudo abstract existence going by what we've just discussed too.

Still though, how many instances has the Xlugget actually showcased that wish granting ability?

 

[Peter1129]

About the D4 destroying Beliarok. I think it‘s probably better if we gave it High-Mid. Since upon closer inspection it seems like Beliarok only exploded into pieces rather than being completely destroyed. But if the SCW says something about Beliarok having the same properties as Greeza I guess we could also give it a possibly Mid-Godly.

I think all the times we have seen Xlugger in action are considered wish granting. As according to the interview wish granting is the Xlugger’s true ability not power nullification. Examples include removing Dark Thunder Energy from a bunch of monsters. Negating the Gua Siblings Immortality. Like three times different against Greeza. First time gave Greeza a partial physical body which negated its non-existence. Second time managed to free all the monsters that Greeza absorbed. Third time gave Greeza a permanent physical form which completely negated its Mid-Godly regeneration and killed it. And I think i heard somebody say that the Xlugger was also used by Daichi’s parents to change the future or something. Like I think there was some mentions of there being no future 15 years later because Greeza might’ve destroyed the planet in an alternate future but due to the Xlugger the future was changed or something like that.

Although from what I remember the SCW mentioned that Zaigorg can ignore the effects of the Xlugger because Daichi’s thoughts can’t reach it or something like that.

 

[Mr.Cutlery]

I don't think it's needed for Beliarok to have the same properties since D4 pretty much bypasses physical form. Normally it seems he can resist those kinds of power by absorbing but he was still overloaded with D4, which he regenerated from.

That's what's considered wish granting? And all this was from X's SCW? That's really weird, but I guess they're still good stuffs. Though the whole future changing might come across as dubious for now. Speaking of which, is there anyone who has the complete SCWs of series from Ginga to Taiga?

It was because of Zaigorg's otherworldly nature, as the wiki says it, but yeah, he seems immune to it.

 

[Peter1129]

Super Complete Works

It’s probably best if you don’t share this to too many people. Cause I’m kinda worried that these compilation threads might get deleted if somebody from Tsuburaya finds out. For some of the images if you want to take a closer and clearer look all you have to do is click on them.

 

[Mr.Cutlery]

Well, I can't quite read all of them anyway since I wasn't able to see everything. In any case, it's fine if you want to remove the links afterwards.

 

[Peter1129]

I could put the links in a google docs. That way it won’t directly show the links.

Edit: Done. This way should be safer

 

[Mr.Cutlery]

Alright then. I'll give them another check later.

 

[Mr.Cutlery]

Breaking news, Doctor Gourman from X is now the true god tier.

A quote from episode 5: "I'm sorry, it seems I've also eaten the fourth, fifth and sixth dimensions."

Low 1-C confirmed

Edit: On a serious note however, the scene is problematic. They talk about dimensional linking, but seemingly considers the universe as merely a three dimensional space. They are trying to downgrade themselves despite numerous contradicting statements. Pls don't do this, X.

 

[SunDaGamer]

Breaking news, Doctor Gourman from X is now the true god tier.

A quote from episode 5: "I'm sorry, it seems I've also eaten the fourth, fifth and sixth dimensions."

Low 1-C confirmed

Edit: On a serious note however, the scene is problematic. They talk about dimensional linking, but seemingly considers the universe as merely a three dimensional space. They are trying to downgrade themselves despite numerous contradicting statements. Pls don't do this, X.

Lmao but what a headache this will cause