The Sword Saint faces yet another corrupted hero

[Peppersalt43]

You were a most unkind and inauspicious man : 0
Looking at him, you'd never guess he was a hero : 7
Incon : 0

7-C versions used
30% Villain Hunter Arc Deku used (Does that exist? I don't know, I've never done one of these before. Everyone else always used 45%)
Regular Isshin used
Speed equalized
Fight takes place in Ashina Estate, 5 meters apart

Welp, the newest MHA CRT means that Deku might just lose a large portion of his matches. Might as well join in on the Deku spam while it's worth something. This is for you, Guardian Ape

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

I asked myself, “what does Deku have here aside from danger sense” the divine dragon (which Issin scales to) is 15 (nearly 16) KT vs Deku’s >baseline AP and Durability, he has higher LS, and he is much more of a threat in martial combat.

Then i remembered Deku has levitation, true flight, the ability to cover every inch of the field with smokescreen, and can spam attacks from kilometers away

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

also yes 30% does exist, its how he got like 12 wins on his profile

 

[Peppersalt43]

Then i remembered Deku has levitation, true flight, the ability to cover every inch of the field with smokescreen, and can spam attacks from kilometers away

Anti air attacks are a common move for characters in the verse and Isshin is no different, being able to handle them just fine

Smoke bombs do little, he is already fully capable of fighting in a burning room

The place they're fighting in is a roofed room with very little place to dodge or fly. Also starting distance is 5 meters

And if all that doesn't work, I can always use the second key

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Anti air attacks are a common move for characters in the verse and Isshin is no different, being able to handle them just fine

Smoke bombs do little, he is already fully capable of fighting in a burning room

The place they're fighting in is a roofed room with very little place to dodge or fly. Also starting distance is 5 meters

And if all that doesn't work, I can always use the second key

Look man Deku has no advantages outside of that

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Danger Sense stops a large portion of this guys abilities from what I’m seeing.

It’s like if you were playing Sekiro but everytime an enemy went to hit you, you got the spidey sense dodge from a Spider-Man game, and you can fly.

Also add on that Deku will figure out Isshin’s combat style, techniques and any tricks he has very quickly, and he more than is capable of dealing with him despite having inferior LS.

Also 30% is stronger than 20% which is baseline, so the difference probably isn’t even 2x between him and Isshin. Then there’s Fa Jin which closes the distance more. Deku also has reliable air pressure attacks in this key, so he can outrange Isshin too.

If they’re in a contained room then Deku can just break the room to have more space if he needs it.

 

[Peppersalt43]

It’s like if you were playing Sekiro but everytime an enemy went to hit you, you got the spidey sense dodge from a Spider-Man game, and you can fly.

When you play Sekiro long enough, it does feel like that. Also our main character is already very acrobatic and can make giant leaps. If I recall, Deku's only ranged attack was Blackwhip, right?

Also add on that Deku will figure out Isshin’s combat style, techniques and any tricks he has very quickly, and he more than is capable of dealing with him despite having inferior LS

Wolf himself has Accelerated Development, being able to learn a technique that takes a lifetime to master with a few reads. Even he has to actually beat Isshin to figure out how his fighting style works

If they’re in a contained room then Deku can just break the room to have more space if he needs it.

A hero committing property destruction, awesome. (This is a joke, the strikethrough function doesn't work on mobile)

 

[Kingofwolves999]

When you play Sekiro long enough, it does feel like that. Also our main character is already very acrobatic and can make giant leaps. If I recall, Deku's only ranged attack was Blackwhip, right?

Wolf himself has Accelerated Development, being able to learn a technique that takes a lifetime to master with a few reads. Even he has to actually beat Isshin to figure out how his fighting style works

A hero committing property destruction, awesome. (This is a joke, the strikethrough function doesn't work on mobile)

He has Air Force when he’s at 30% because he can use 45% amps. And for this instance, it’s more like Deku is first time playing Sekiro while also getting these benefits while being a genius at predicting an enemies attacks already. I highly doubt Isshin has any tricks or skill that vastly outstrips what Lady Nagant could do with her bullets.

Deku has a bit more going for him than Wolf does, at least for a first encounter. He already knows when Isshin is going to try and hit him, he can predict his movements with Analytical Prediction, he outranges him and he’s ridiculously more mobile than even Wolf is.

I know it’s a joke but Deku destroyed a building to get to Lady Nagant, he doesn’t care in the Villain Hunter key about property damage lol

 

[Kingofwolves999]

There’s also a slight issue with 30%, that being his Mid Gauntlets. He has Mountain Level shields on his arms and legs. So he can straight up block Isshin’s sword swings and punch him in the face.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

There’s also a slight issue with 30%, that being his Mid Gauntlets. He has Mountain Level shields on his arms and legs. So he can straight up block Isshin’s sword swings and punch him in the face.

His sword just breaks on contact with the mid gauntlets

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Smoke bombs do little, he is already fully capable of fighting in a burning room

So like how Big are the smoke bombs, because smokescreen could theoretically flood the entire estate with smoke (I don’t actually know what the estate is, so I’m only thinking of a very big house)

 

[Kingofwolves999]

What calc is getting Isshin to Class G by the way? I literally cannot find it

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

What calc is getting Isshin to Class G by the way? I literally cannot find it

The only explanation for class G I could find was on wolfs, and it’s for blocking the divine dragons strikes so idk

 

[Peppersalt43]

There’s also a slight issue with 30%, that being his Mid Gauntlets. He has Mountain Level shields on his arms and legs. So he can straight up block Isshin’s sword swings and punch him in the face.

Wait... it's not exactly a passive or something surgically grafted onto him, it's an equipment, doesn't that kinda get restricted by

7-C versions used

Anyway I'm gonna contact @Naitodesu before I count any votes, I'm kinda unsure about this since Isshin does have pretty broken skill

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Wait... it's not exactly a passive or something surgically grafted onto him, it's an equipment, doesn't that kinda get restricted by

Anyway I'm gonna contact @Naitodesu before I count any votes, I'm kinda unsure about this since Isshin does have pretty broken skill

Wouldn't that be like restricting Cap's shield because it has higher durability than him? By that logic he shouldn't be able to use his Iron Soles either.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Wait... it's not exactly a passive or something surgically grafted onto him, it's an equipment, doesn't that kinda get restricted by

Actual no, surprisingly enough (I forget about them Alot because it tends not the be a topic) but it’s apart of his standard hero outfit, which means that it can’t be restricted

 

[Peppersalt43]

Cap's shield because it has higher durability than him?

Yeah that happened once in a tourney. In fact it happens pretty often, or at least it used to

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Yeah that happened once in a tourney. In fact it happens pretty often, or at least it used to

I guess that was a bad example, since Cap's shield can be stronger them him (or was, since it got downgraded)

 

[Peppersalt43]

I guess that was a bad example, since Cap's shield can be stronger them him (or was, since it got downgraded)

Anyway it is merely durability and katanas aren't really meant for striking targets stronger than itself so Isshin probably knows enough self control to not smash his sword onto Deku's gauntlet

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Anyway it is merely durability and katanas aren't really meant for striking targets stronger than itself so Isshin probably knows enough self control to not smash his sword onto Deku's gauntlet

he likely does

 

[Naito-desu]

The only thing Isshin has going for him is his One Mind, which I am confident will overwhelm Deku's Analytical Prediction because even in speeds equalized matches, it moves much faster than regular speed. Otherwise, I don't see why Deku can just range spam. Sekiro might be a closer match, but then again, Isshin proved to be a match against Sekiro even with his sheer versatility.

Isshin Sword Saint might be better imo.

 

[Peppersalt43]

Isshin Sword Saint might be better imo.

Alright, changed

 

[Kingofwolves999]

From what I’ve seen of the One Mind (I think it’s the literal judgement cut from Vergil), Deku should be able to somewhat dodge it or at least not die instantly from it. Danger Sense helped him not get absolutely stomped by Lady Nagant’s bullets that were faster than him even when there were multiple being rapid fired from several directions. Also it seems there is a slight build up to the move itself that Deku would catch on to.

Since it’s Sword Saint now, he also gets a ton of other moves that shouldn’t be much harder to dodge than his air slashes, though the lightning sword is a bit sus.

Big problem though: Deku can’t stop immortality or resurrection. So he just loses I guess. Or he can maybe break Isshin’s arms and restrain him idk how his immortality works.

Also why is he class G again I legit cannot find the calc or reasoning other than the Divine Dragon, which is also Class G for no reason.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Yeah sword Saint can’t die without the mortal blade I believe so this becomes one sided as he has no way to restrain him around the class G LS

 

[Peppersalt43]

Yeah sword Saint can’t die without the mortal blade I believe so this becomes one sided as he has no way to restrain him around the class G LS

Then lets wait and see how that Class G came to be and if it's viable, it's back to regular Isshin

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

Then lets wait and see how that Class G came to be and if it's viable, it's back to regular Isshin

K, I can try and find it if you want?

 

[Naito-desu]

The Class G portion was from the comment section of the first calc. The calc was changed because Ugarik corrected the AP yield for Bambu's calc so currently 7181882561.347973 kg of force of the Divine Dragon is the amount of force Sekiro can deflect. This is the rating scaled to all Sekiro endgame characters.

 

[Peppersalt43]

Well then, Deku is ******. Back to regular Sword Saint we go

 

[Kingofwolves999]

The Class G portion was from the comment section of the first calc. The calc was changed because Ugarik corrected the AP yield for Bambu's calc so currently 7181882561.347973 kg of force of the Divine Dragon is the amount of force Sekiro can deflect. This is the rating scaled to all Sekiro endgame characters.

I'm like 99% certain that this is from before the lifting strength revision that made it so striking doesn't scale to LS. And why is that particular value used and not the one for the 7-C calc which is what is being used?

This recalc that is used on every page should be whats there not that, no? Otherwise the dragon would be Low 7-B. It also seems the LS portion of the calc was completely abandoned? And why would you get LS from the force of a swing after the revision on LS unless I'm tripping?

Also why isn't this linked to literally anyone's page? Or the Divine Dragon linked to anyone's page? I might just have to fix these profiles cause what is happening.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

I'm like 99% certain that this is from before the lifting strength revision that made it so striking doesn't scale to LS. And why is that particular value used and not the one for the 7-C calc which is what is being used?

This recalc that is used on every page should be whats there not that, no? Otherwise the dragon would be Low 7-B. It also seems the LS portion of the calc was completely abandoned? And why would you get LS from the force of a swing after the revision on LS unless I'm tripping?

I mean either way his LS is over 10 times Deku’s so restraint is still not viable

 

[Kingofwolves999]

I mean either way his LS is over 10 times Deku’s so restraint is still not viable

The momentum of swinging the sword is that high, but I'm still very sure that that is not allowed to scale to lifting strength, otherwise Deku would be stronger than the dragon at 5%. It's not like he's physically pushing back the Dragon or actually moving the sword, he's just deflecting it (and honestly it looks like I-frames in some instances).

The mass of the sword itself is 14268 kg while the momentum of swinging the sword (which from my knowledge should not scale to lifting strength unless he stops it completely) is 17280197.3 kg*m^2. So I'm a little confused.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

The momentum of swinging the sword is that high, but I'm still very sure that that is not allowed to scale to lifting strength, otherwise Deku would be stronger than the dragon at 5%. It's not like he's physically pushing back the Dragon or actually moving the sword, he's just deflecting it (and honestly it looks like I-frames in some instances).

The mass of the sword itself is 14268 kg while the momentum of swinging the sword (which from my knowledge should not scale to lifting strength unless he stops it completely) is 17280197.3 kg*m^2. So I'm a little confused.

Im just as confused as you are (probably more)

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

if this is regular isshin then I’ll still vote for Deku

 

[Mr. Bambu]

The pages should use Ugarik's recalc, I guess whoever put through revisions didn't consider that bit.

I am curious which thread is being referred to.

I have little interest in the match itself. Weebshit and such.

 

[Peppersalt43]

The pages should use Ugarik's recalc, I guess whoever put through revisions didn't consider that bit.

I am curious which thread is being referred to.

I have little interest in the match itself. Weebshit and such.

I know, we just need clarification on how the LS works because @Kingofwolves999 seems to have a problem with it here

The momentum of swinging the sword is that high, but I'm still very sure that that is not allowed to scale to lifting strength, otherwise Deku would be stronger than the dragon at 5%. It's not like he's physically pushing back the Dragon or actually moving the sword, he's just deflecting it (and honestly it looks like I-frames in some instances).

The mass of the sword itself is 14268 kg while the momentum of swinging the sword (which from my knowledge should not scale to lifting strength unless he stops it completely) is 17280197.3 kg*m^2. So I'm a little confused.

I'm like 99% certain that this is from before the lifting strength revision that made it so striking doesn't scale to LS. And why is that particular value used and not the one for the 7-C calc which is what is being used?

This recalc that is used on every page should be whats there not that, no? Otherwise the dragon would be Low 7-B. It also seems the LS portion of the calc was completely abandoned? And why would you get LS from the force of a swing after the revision on LS unless I'm tripping?

Also why isn't this linked to literally anyone's page? Or the Divine Dragon linked to anyone's page? I might just have to fix these profiles cause what is happening.

 

[Mr. Bambu]

Oh, I didn't catch that.

Yeah you can deflect the Divine Dragon's sword swings. I suspect he's just not familiar with the game? While Divine Dragon isn't designed for this purpose, technically, most of the game is parrying, deflecting, and blocking attacks. As I mentioned, Divine Dragon isn't built to be like this, but you can absolutely do it.

The other criticisms appear to just be disliking how the pages are formatted, in which case... meh. Not really a big deal, frankly.

 

[Mapl3Sy4up]

So uh, what now? We get back to debating?

 

[Peppersalt43]

So uh, what now? We get back to debating?

Yeah it means the LS feat is legit and we're gonna have to use regular Isshin which means I get to count your vote

 

[Kingofwolves999]

Oh, I didn't catch that.

Yeah you can deflect the Divine Dragon's sword swings. I suspect he's just not familiar with the game? While Divine Dragon isn't designed for this purpose, technically, most of the game is parrying, deflecting, and blocking attacks. As I mentioned, Divine Dragon isn't built to be like this, but you can absolutely do it.

The other criticisms appear to just be disliking how the pages are formatted, in which case... meh. Not really a big deal, frankly.

I am not familiar with the game, no. So thanks for clearing that up.

I do think Class G is still incorrect though since the momentum of the swing was calculated differently in the current calc being used. So it should still be lower, even if it doesn’t matter for this fight.

 

[Peppersalt43]

it doesn’t matter for this fight.

It does for the discussion since if it's legit, I can't use the Sword Saint

Also I assume you vote Deku?