-
This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.
For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here. -
We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.
Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.
Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page. -
Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.
The Monument Mythos Discussion Thread
- Thread starter Sans2345
- Start date
Chritin
He/Him- 527
- 348
What was the CRT?
- 11,413
- 2,548
Analog horror will be on the rise again. So maybe a lot of CRTs will be done to the characters.
- 11,413
- 2,548
We can't really make assumptions
- 32,358
- 20,298
It's out
Chritin
He/Him- 527
- 348
Ok, that was interesting. I'm really confused about what this means for the lore. From what it seems, this takes place before the great division. Maize is looking into wonderland using the Cthonaut to look around. The Horned Serpent/Wonderland seems to make copies of everything that enters into it, and thus when Virginia entered it, it created a copy of her when she left. Pretty interesting, especially since this copying aspect of the horned serpent is an almost Alcatraz-like ability.
Sans2345
He/Him- 5,232
- 716
- Thread starter
- #251
To be honest, if this season does something insane with The Horned Serpent, i feel like it might need a tier upgrade.
By the way since The Horned Serpent and Wonderland are the same being, shouldn't there be a key for The Horned Serpent and Wonderland itself?
Chritin
He/Him- 527
- 348
From what I heard on reddit, the Special Tree disappeared from the events in Washington Wormhole. So I think the point is that tree disappeared after it bent the monument.
- 32,358
- 20,298
wtf is alex cooking
Chritin
He/Him- 527
- 348
Ok so heres what it seems we get in terms of scaling
Serpent and Tree:
- Existed before really anything else in the universe. To be honest though, based on how the Horned Serpent functions and its connection to multiple universes, it's possible they could be Low-Multiversal in some way.
- Created the entire universe by making world eggs (which seem to be the planets themselves), gods (possibly TFMDs like the Suez Canal Crab), and all other living being.
Gods:
- So there are about 5 gods mentioned. Sadly they don't have too many feats, and 4/5 of them get blitzed by an SOL attack. Entropia could scale around that level too since even with her powers the serpents didn't think they could beat the gods without help from man, although that could be because they had control of Entropia's power.
Pyrasma:
- So no inherent AP feats to my knowledge. It does get SOL attacking speed.
The Horned Serpent:
- I think people might try to downplay the Horned Serpent after all this considering it only had fractions of the power of one god, but I don't think that is totally the case. The one serpent that survived was basically cooking inside the world egg, and from what we know the World Eggs > God Eggs. So by incubating over time, it seems that it was able to reach a power surpassing the gods.
Overall, this is the final hierarchy in my opinion.
Tree and Serpent > The Horned Serpent > Base World Eggs > Pyrasma >= Entropia = The Four other Gods (although she gave them control of her) > Standard God Eggs
Serpent and Tree:
- Existed before really anything else in the universe. To be honest though, based on how the Horned Serpent functions and its connection to multiple universes, it's possible they could be Low-Multiversal in some way.
- Created the entire universe by making world eggs (which seem to be the planets themselves), gods (possibly TFMDs like the Suez Canal Crab), and all other living being.
Gods:
- So there are about 5 gods mentioned. Sadly they don't have too many feats, and 4/5 of them get blitzed by an SOL attack. Entropia could scale around that level too since even with her powers the serpents didn't think they could beat the gods without help from man, although that could be because they had control of Entropia's power.
Pyrasma:
- So no inherent AP feats to my knowledge. It does get SOL attacking speed.
The Horned Serpent:
- I think people might try to downplay the Horned Serpent after all this considering it only had fractions of the power of one god, but I don't think that is totally the case. The one serpent that survived was basically cooking inside the world egg, and from what we know the World Eggs > God Eggs. So by incubating over time, it seems that it was able to reach a power surpassing the gods.
Overall, this is the final hierarchy in my opinion.
Tree and Serpent > The Horned Serpent > Base World Eggs > Pyrasma >= Entropia = The Four other Gods (although she gave them control of her) > Standard God Eggs
- 3,313
- 3,080
Bit early to theorise. The fact the information is presented through mythology, makes it very hard to tell what's actually real until we get more info.
- 32,358
- 20,298
New video explains a lot.
Old Timeline: Angel and Freedom fight ends in a stalemate. Great Division happens. Nixonverse follows suit.
New Timeline: Angel kills Freedom. Talks to Cthonaut A on the moon. Stops the Great Division.
Old Timeline: Angel and Freedom fight ends in a stalemate. Great Division happens. Nixonverse follows suit.
New Timeline: Angel kills Freedom. Talks to Cthonaut A on the moon. Stops the Great Division.
Chritin
He/Him- 527
- 348
Possibly. It seems though that the Angel as a whole was not able to change the course of time however. Honestly though, I think a more interesting question is asking what this means for the horned serpent. Like did the Angel somehow change the entirety of the horned serpent metastructure, or just the body of it in the world egg? Honestly, maybe that’s why there are multiple versions of people in wonderland. Maybe it’s the old past versions of people from the OG deanverse timeline
- 69
- 43
I think at minimum, the angel should get Fissionism since it did end up dividing itself into the ashes of its original being. However, when it comes to stuff beyond that, I think we should wait for further clarfication on what exactly happened. Currently, I'd be fine with giving the Angel some form of Causality Manipulation as well as Acausality (Types 1 & 3), but I stil think that we should wait just to be sure.
- 3,313
- 3,080
Bit of a sidenote, by Alex's QnA implies that the Horned Serpent justification is off in regards to Nixon.
Nixon being described as the "embodiment of all the power of the Deanverse" that assimilated and adapted the Horned Serpent metastructure (while being an amalgamation of all the Deanverse's forces) at least makes the Horned Serpent's justification
"...who is simply a piece of Alcatraz Matter imbued with some of the Horned Serpent's power and nature"
seem off. Heck, you could argue Nixon > Horned Serpent with that quote (although I won't). That justification should honestly be removed.
Nixon being described as the "embodiment of all the power of the Deanverse" that assimilated and adapted the Horned Serpent metastructure (while being an amalgamation of all the Deanverse's forces) at least makes the Horned Serpent's justification
"...who is simply a piece of Alcatraz Matter imbued with some of the Horned Serpent's power and nature"
seem off. Heck, you could argue Nixon > Horned Serpent with that quote (although I won't). That justification should honestly be removed.
Chritin
He/Him- 527
- 348
I think this basically lines it all up nice and well.
After the great division, Freedom was killed or died somehow while the Angel survived. The Cthonaut, provably the only other survivor, told the Angel to send his ashes back in time to stop the great division from happening. I’m doing so, it made the past Angel recognize he needed to die to stop the great division. So, Freedom kills the Angel and life goes on kind of as normal with the world now having knowledge of the Horned Serpent.
A few questions are left though:
- Why is there a Dwight Comics in the Deanverse
- How is the horned serpent effected by the Angel going back in time if the Horned serpent is supposed to be beyond time
- Is the Nixonverse connected to this? I mean going off of what Tyranno said before, I wonder if it’s possible that Nixon and the effects he had on both universes being fictionalized lead to the events where the Angel had the chance of going back in time.
- 69
- 43
I think this is just a cutesely homage to The Nixonverse rather than anything meaningful.
My guess is that alternate timelines are coming into play here (from what we know so far). Timeline 1 (The Nixonverse timeline) is the Angel and Freedom fight, cause the Great Awakening, both of them die during the awakening, and we get The Nixonverse. Timeline 2 (The ANGELASHES timeline) is where Angel and Freedom fight, but in this timeline the Angel kills Freedom, leaves for the moon, eventually makes contact with Cthonaut A, learning he needs to stop the great division and what to do. Timeline 3 (the AFTERANGEL timeline) is where the Angel realizes he must die in order to save that universe, and lets Freedom kill him rather than the two fighting.
However, this is just going off of what we know. Currently, I don't know how this would affect the Horned Serpent or if my timeline theory is correct, so we should just see what happens. Either way, turns out the Angel is much stronger than we though, and things are going to get weird.
Chritin
He/Him- 527
- 348
I tried doing a Calc on Entropis to see if her size was anything significant like how we calculated the size of the Croatoan. We see her head compared to some random humans, and assuming that they are 1.7 meters tall, it makes Entropis like 58.007 meters tall. So only edging out past standard 8-C. I was hoping it could’ve been a bit higher, but assuming I did my math right this is what it would come out to
- 32,358
- 20,298
The last video is fictional.
- 32,358
- 20,298
i mean yes its on youtube.
Sans2345
He/Him- 5,232
- 716
- Thread starter
- #272
I'm starting to think that both the Nixonverse and the Deanverse are just alternate timelines at this point due to the Angel basically preventing the Great Division caused by The Horned Serpent.
Speaking of the Horned Serpent, i feel like it needs a revision whenever season 3 is complete.
Speaking of the Horned Serpent, i feel like it needs a revision whenever season 3 is complete.
Chritin
He/Him- 527
- 348
Ok so this video is… weird. I think it really means we need to look back a determine what about the starry sphinx was fake, since this video is clearly showing that some fuckey shit is happening on mars.
From what I can tell, Elon Musk used Canyon Crowns to mine for a special kind of mars glass. At some point, Elon decided to nuke his mining site (a pyramid on one of Mars’s poles). This in terms released the Mars serpent. In this case though, I feel like that the mars serpent is actually just a corpse. Going off the Monument Mythology video, the two other serpents died before being fully developed. This is one of the two serpents that died which is now released in some way.
Chritin
He/Him- 527
- 348
I don’t really think that the story itself is fiction, just presented through a fictional source. Generally speaking, until confirmed later I think this should be a generally accurate source of information. Alex isn’t really one to send red herrings or things that try to totally confuse the viewer. The only time he sort of did something like that was with the Lincoln Looker.
- 3,313
- 3,080
Check the video description. It's... interesting.
- 69
- 43
"Cthonaut Transmission: -The Martian Serpent lives."
Also, for the last video I'm going to go out on a limb, and I'm going to guess that Alex is going to be taking a page from Grant Morrison's The Multiversity, and have it that fictional stories are going to be real events within alternate timelines, and that comics can be used to transmit messages between them. If this is true, then it will make the Alternate Timeline theory true as well as explain some weird shit. Plus it'll mean that the Angel's ability to break time would make sense.
Chritin
He/Him- 527
- 348
I have no clue how I missed that. Well I suppose then that the Mars serpent is alive, but if I had to guess it is less developed than the Horned Serpent. Considering the fact that it being released didn’t blow up the universe, and as well it is a lot smaller.
Also one other thing I thought of. I feel like at this point it might actually be a lot more plausible to compare The Angel to a nuke. Considering the fact that the mars serpent got release by a nuke, it seems pretty similar to how The Angel and Freedom cracked the Earth Egg. Just some food for thought though.
Notsussybaka900
He/Him- 684
- 391
I think Nixon could have an upgrade, I have a statement from Mr. Manticore where he says Nixon absorbed the Horned Serpent meaning he should be as strong as him, not sure if anything from the new season contradicts this.
- 3,313
- 3,080
While I wouldn't necessarily scale one above the other, my earlier post details why I think the wording should at least be changed so the Horned Serpent isn't directly scaled above Nixon. Nothing contradicts it yet either, but DC comics existing may mean this Deanverse is a bit different than the one we knew, or it could just be a reference.
