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The commoners thread: Discussing Ultima's "On the Many, Many Incoherences of the Tiering System"

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Trigger said:
Slowly agreeing, huh?
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I don't agree, but that's what Ultima's proposed system would entail, and it seems like it would likely get the majority of votes.
 
BestMGQScalerEver said:
Would something like that be allowed? I know it's not in same muddy waters as adding religion to the wiki and wouldn't really be controversial.
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We require something to have plot/story to be indexed. Philosophical cosmologies or thought-experiments that exist detached from any of that are not allowed. (Pretty lame but it is what it is)
 
Rakih_Elyan said:
A being at R level shouldn't be interacted (in normal case) by a being in F level, it is R>F after all. And R being should shown that they have absolute power over those in F level, if they being hurt by F being it isn't valid.
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F has Smurf hax 🗿
 
Agnaa said:
I don't agree, but that's what Ultima's proposed system would entail, and it seems like it would likely get the majority of votes.
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If u knew it will likely get the majority of votes then what was the point in continuing the debate all this time
🗿🗿🗿
 
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Robo432343 said:
yo ben do you plan on working on wizard101 upgrades anytime soon?
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Maybe. Don't know. If the wiki agrees that Dasein is transdual and has no qualms with God-tiers like the Player being able to affect them then there isn't much that needs to be done besides possibly defining a scaling chain. At least with regards to AP upgrades.
 
Rakih_Elyan said:
A being at R level shouldn't be interacted (in normal case) by a being in F level, it is R>F after all. And R being should shown that they have absolute power over those in F level, if they being hurt by F being it isn't valid.
Click to expand...
I would assume that cases where F is amped wouldn’t count as invalidating this?
 
Robo432343 said:
If u knew it will likely get the majority of votes then what was the point in continuing the debate all this time
🗿🗿🗿
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  1. In case I'm wrong. I don't want the system to be accepted only because my attitude was too defeatist.
  2. Even if I don't sway votes, I can still convince Ultima to change things, and I have.
  3. So I can say "I told you so" in 6-24 months time, like I did after the last tiering system revision Ultima performed, which was accepted by 95% of voting staff.
 
By the way, what will be the standards for what is a base reality?
As in, in a verse with R>F, which reality will the 3D normal one and which one will be less real or more real?

I say so because someone told me that if a verse has a plane of existence that the story takes in, but they view another world like a story, that the plane of existence where the story takes in would get buffed and the world seen as a story would be 3D.

Also, what if the world where the story takes place in is seen as fictional by a higher plane of existence? Would that nerf the world or buff the world above it?
 
Deidalius said:
By the way, what will be the standards for what is a base reality?
As in, in a verse with R>F, which reality will the 3D normal one and which one will be less real or more real?

I say so because someone told me that if a verse has a plane of existence that the story takes in, but they view another world like a story, that the plane of existence where the story takes in would get buffed and the world seen as a story would be 3D.

Also, what if the world where the story takes place in is seen as fictional by a higher plane of existence? Would that nerf the world or buff the world above it?
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In all cases that qualify for R>f, the plane most prominent in the story is treated as the baseline, which is simply common sense to ensure that the characters treated by the narrative as the baseline are treated the same here. Lower realities contained in the most prominent plane would be ranked as qualitative inferiorities, and higher planes encompassing it would be ranked as qualitative superiorities.
 
Example of the new Low 1-A definition provided by Ultima, in an OPM fan-fiction.

XPoehJy.png


Thank god this is no longer the Tier 0 meta. 😭
 
Iamunanimousinthat said:
why isn’t a more real space not apart of the Von universe?
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Because there aren't more or less real things IRL. Such things don't fall under the purview of physics, mathematics, etc. The place we decide to put them is arbitrary.
 
Agnaa said:
Because there aren't more or less real things IRL
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But the Von universe has things that don’t exist in real life. If you mean real life theory, then I can understand but also, anyone of us can formulate a realness hypothesis.

The von universe seems to contain things that are also just hypothesis and aren’t based on real world observations or haven’t been proven to exist via observations or experiment.

Is the concept of realness truly unconnected to math?
 
Iamunanimousinthat said:
But the Von universe has things that don’t exist in real life. If you mean real life theory, then I can understand but also, anyone of us can formulate a realness hypothesis.

The von universe seems to contain things that are also just hypothesis and aren’t based on real world observations or haven’t been proven to exist via observations or experiment.

Is the concept of realness truly unconnected to math?
Click to expand...
There is nothing in math demarcating certain numbers as being fake, such that alterations to and contradictions with them are irrelevant to real ones.

If there was such a concept relevant to RL stuff, you can bet that it would be incorporated, and it wouldn't really change the size of V.

But since it isn't, @Ultima_Reality can argue that real-ness transcends V.
 
Agnaa said:
  1. So I can say "I told you so" in 6-24 months time, like I did after the last tiering system revision Ultima performed, which was accepted by 95% of voting staff.
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If this thread passes, you are lurking to say it again soon... I feel it :eek:
 
Ikelaggan said:
The gross part is I searched that up plus scp and of course I found this.
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That's actually completely unrelated. It's just a mention of a von Neumann probe (a spacecraft that replicates itself). Bears the same name, due to being conceived of by the same guy, but has nothing to do with tiering.

While the substance of the article does talk about mathematics, it just talks about large primes.

Don't let tier brain make you upset at mundane things.
 
Ikelaggan said:
The gross part is I searched that up plus scp and of course I found this.
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Are people just forgetting von Neumann did things other than math in light of whatever implications it could have on wacky tiers.
A von Neumann probe isn't even related to the universe of sets, it's a theoretical spacecraft that could self-replicate to tldr.
 
deonment said:
Are people just forgetting von Neumann did things other than math in light of whatever implications it could have on wacky tiers.
A von Neumann probe isn't even related to the universe of sets, it's a theoretical spacecraft that could self-replicate to tldr.
Click to expand...
Well that's a man on the moon jumpscare avoided.
 
Rakih_Elyan said:
A being at R level shouldn't be interacted (in normal case) by a being in F level, it is R>F after all. And R being should shown that they have absolute power over those in F level, if they being hurt by F being it isn't valid.
Click to expand...
Yes, I know, and case in T7 is not like that.
 
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