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Super Mario Bros. 2-A CRT

…What? This is not how scaling works
SuperMarioGamers3 said:
Definitely saved Mario, but we know Mario gets stronger over time, so it's possible he reached a point where wouldn't need to be saved.
Click to expand...
(Should clarify i agree with galaxy level baseform mario and fooder, and some uni to multi stuff. Just this thread isnt convincing for me)
 
Accelerated_Evolution said:
He didn't even survived It, Rosalina had to sabe him
Click to expand...
So THAT's why it's no longer on Bowser's profile or used as scaling, that makes a lot of sense actually.

Wait speaking of Galaxy, I just realized another contention towards 2-A Bowser: If Bowser already had well beyond Universal power in Mario Party 5, why did he need the power of the Grand Stars and his Galaxy Reactor in order to create his own galaxy in Galaxy 1? He could've done so effortlessly under his own power, yet needed an external source in order to create even a galaxy
 
The_Unknown_Warrior1 said:
So THAT's why it's no longer on Bowser's profile or used as scaling, that makes a lot of sense actually.

Wait speaking of Galaxy, I just realized another contention towards 2-A Bowser: If Bowser already had well beyond Universal power in Mario Party 5, why did he need the power of the Grand Stars and his Galaxy Reactor in order to create his own galaxy? He could've done so effortlessly under his own power, yet needed an external source in order to create even a galaxy
Click to expand...
That assumes that MP5 comes before Galaxy.
 
The_Unknown_Warrior1 said:


What does this statement from Bowser say in the Japanese version of the game if you have a source? And I'm not talking about his statement in Future Dream, I want to know what he says here in Pirate Dream and if he differentiates from the English version where he destroys the dreams by filling in existing ones with his own.

And I have a second question: How is this is not an outlier when Bowser's most direct durability feat in the series was surviving, but being knocked out by, a universe sized black hole at the end of Galaxy 1?
Click to expand...

"Bwahaha! I’ll destroy this Adventure Dream and turn it into my own, you heeear!!"
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/513744760645746691/857993095676166174/unknown.png?ex=6606d256&is=65f45d56&hm=73289c1fdffcb9cfec6d0eddc1ca8c99b64ae59512bd456ba200694baf667ce7&
 
SuperMarioGamers3 said:
HOW THIS AFFECTS CHARACTERS:

Bowser (and by extension the main cast) should recieve a 2-A rating, since Bowser was going to destroy the entire Dream Depot.

EDIT:
The Star Spirits Are Also Stated To Be The Creators Of The Dream Depot, And Bowser Seems To Scale Above Them Since They Can't Seem To Stop Bowser.
Click to expand...
Your conclusion is very unreliable based on the information being discussed.
  • Ratings from the Tiering System tend to be given when characters output a certain amount of energy from one action. There's no evidence that a single attack from Bowser would've destroyed every dream world in the Dream Depot simultaneously. Any available information suggests the opposite. Most obviously, if Bowser were capable of destroying an infinite multiverse with one attack instead of destroying individual universes, then the process of him performing his plan would've been infinitely faster than what it was proven to be: "Bowser is causing all kinds of trouble again! At this rate, he'll destroy the dream worlds one by one! Will you try to stop him?" ~ Misstar, clearly describing how Bowser didn't demonstrate Multiverse level+ power but was a threat to the Dream Depot nonetheless.
    • Of course, Bowser still had to be able to finish the job over time. This probably means his Range section should include "up to Multiversal+" and/or his Speed section should include "up to Infinite".
  • There's no evidence that Bowser was going to destroy the dream worlds physically, as far as I'm aware. Bowser has easy access to magic, which he uses for non-physical purposes. For example, at the beginning of Yoshi's Story, an "evil spell" from Bowser turned an island into a storybook and the sky into paper. Bowser could've been trying to use a similar "evil spell" during Mario Party 5 to destroy the dream worlds. Bowser was not only trying to destroy dream worlds, but he was trying to replace them with his own and make his dreams come true forever, as he said in the evidence that you presented, indicating that Bowser intended to use magic in some way. Bowser's punches don't have cosmic range, whereas his magic does, so the idea I presented is more reliable than yours.
  • Being the creator of something doesn't necessarily imply physicality scaling to what was created. If there's proof that the Star Spirits created the Dream Depot, then it's evidence that they have Multiverse level+ reality warping and dream manipulation, not evidence that they can punch that hard. Bowser went inside individual dream worlds to cause trouble, so it's a mystery why the Star Spirits didn't stop him with their magic, but perhaps they thought that the playable characters physically dealing with Bowser would've been more efficient, especially since the playable characters are known for being familiar with facing Bowser. Maybe the Star Spirits didn't want to deal with Bowser directly because they didn't want to risk getting hurt by him. Alternatively, maybe Bowser has a resistance to their magic, maybe they refuse to directly interfere with existing dreams, or maybe their magic can't be used offensively at its peak. There's no reason to prioritize the interpretation that Bowser "seems to scale above" the Multiverse level+ magic of the Star Spirits, when the circumstances are mysterious and there are other interpretations that are as likely to have been the case, if not more so.
 
Last edited:
SuperMarioGamers3 said:
That assumes that MP5 comes before Galaxy.
Click to expand...
If we go by real life dates? Yes because Mario Party 5 came out in 2003 while Galaxy 1 came out in 2007. And in universe, I would say Galaxy 1 takes place after MP5 because Koopa Kid/Baby Bowser had been replaced entirely by Bowser Jr at this point in the series.

Though given that Mario as a franchise doesn't give much of a shit about continuity, a lot of games happen one after the other so Galaxy 1 would take place after MP5.
 
The_Unknown_Warrior1 said:
And I have a second question: How is this is not an outlier when Bowser's most direct durability feat in the series was surviving, but being knocked out by, a universe sized black hole at the end of Galaxy 1?
Click to expand...
Bowser isn’t seen again until after the universe and everything in it resets, and the black hole is presented as a fatal threat to the entire cast, and Rosalina seemingly had to protect Mario from the blast (though via surface area this protection wouldn’t be uni), so there’s no reason to assume Bowser would have actually survived the black hole / reset itself.
 
Kirbonic_Pikmin said:
Bowser isn’t seen again until after the universe and everything in it resets, and the black hole is presented as a fatal threat to the entire cast, and Rosalina seemingly had to protect Mario from the blast (though via surface area this protection wouldn’t be uni), so there’s no reason to assume Bowser would have actually survived the black hole / reset itself.
Click to expand...
That's a fair point against that feat, I was mainly going off of memory from the past in regards to Bowser and the black hole so I didn't know that there were holes for Bowser outright surviving the blackhole in the first place.

But regardless, if even that feat is an outlier then that makes the 2-A stuff even more egregious to me
 
CloverDragon03 said:
Wasn’t there for when this passed so… why is that?
Click to expand...
I’d have to look for the exact reasoning, but it was because the Prima guide was originally used to argue universal base forms because of a statement about bowser planning to use the grand Star to collapse the universe and create a new one

But that’s completely contradictory to the actual plot and bowsers actual plan of the game and made literally no sense so it was disallowed. Iirc there were other inconsistencies / things that were completely unsupported in the original game stated in that guide that also lead to it, but the bowser/grand Star stipulation was like the main one.
 
Kirbonic_Pikmin said:
I’d have to look for the exact reasoning, but it was because the Prima guide was originally used to argue universal base forms because of a statement about bowser planning to use the grand Star to collapse the universe and create a new one

But that’s completely contradictory to the actual plot and bowsers actual plan of the game and made literally no sense so it was disallowed. Iirc there were other inconsistencies / things that were completely unsupported in the original game stated in that guide that also lead to it, but the bowser/grand Star stipulation was like the main one.
Click to expand...
If it's filled with inconsistencies, then sure, but I just find it strange to use arguments like "it was presented as fatal" and "Rosalina seemingly had to protect them" over actual statements of their survival. It's pretty much entirely conjectural, especially given that nothing in-game actually confirms whether they survived or not and this is all just personal speculation
 
CloverDragon03 said:
If it's filled with inconsistencies, then sure, but I just find it strange to use arguments like "it was presented as fatal" and "Rosalina seemingly had to protect them" over actual statements of their survival. It's pretty much entirely conjectural, especially given that nothing in-game actually confirms whether they survived or not and this is all just personal speculation
Click to expand...
I think that's another major issue with the feat as a whole lol. It's unclear, happens in the last five minutes of the game, is almost entirely symbolism, and gets absolutely no explanation inside or outside of the game. There ARE no statements about anything regarding it lol. Rosalina speaks in vague symbolic terms which read as the universe being reset, but otherwise there is no explanation given for what occurred, how or why they survived, etc. I think its not really usable for scaling because of the majority of that, but using what we do have as a basis, ie it being presented as a fatal threat, which IS blatant imho. Mario and co were trying to escape it and were unable to, and it was so severe the Lumas had to mass sacrifice themselves to stop it.

But outside of that there is no explanation for much of anything that occurs and a majority of it is just speculation on how things are interpreted by the person. I think its a lot easier to deem what DIDN'T happen in that scene, at the least.
 
Hard disagree.

Seriously, what is it with people and wanting stupid high ratings for verses? How strong some jackalope is shouldn't matter outside of verses threads.
 
SuperMarioGamers3 said:
https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/951382114086035507/1220486648081416332/image.png?ex=660f1dc4&is=65fca8c4&hm=3833febe4a4cd172f774674791193af5b54fb6cad44bc27152b77905937b0cbe&
Click to expand...
hey

hey hey hey

wait a minute. What is this scan from? I have the Japanese Mario Party 5 Official Guide and its not in that. It's not in the Japanese Mario Party 5 Website from what I've seen either. I do not recognize where this is from. Could you let us know where you got this scan from? Is it the Japanese Manual for MP5, or something else?
 
Kirbonic_Pikmin said:
hey

hey hey hey

wait a minute. What is this scan from? I have the Japanese Mario Party 5 Official Guide and its not in that. It's not in the Japanese Mario Party 5 Website from what I've seen either. I do not recognize where this is from. Could you let us know where you got this scan from? Is it the Japanese Manual for MP5, or something else?
Click to expand...
Smh way to copy my post, loser....................................................................
 
DaReaperMan said:
Seriously, what is it with people and wanting stupid high ratings for verses?
Click to expand...
Disposing of the overall context of characters and viewing them as mere stat sheets to find information for.
Kirbonic_Pikmin said:
hey

hey hey hey

wait a minute. What is this scan from? I have the Japanese Mario Party 5 Official Guide and its not in that. It's not in the Japanese Mario Party 5 Website from what I've seen either. I do not recognize where this is from. Could you let us know where you got this scan from? Is it the Japanese Manual for MP5, or something else?
Click to expand...
I tried using Google Search's function of finding an image's source, and I didn't find the source.
 
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