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Leaning towards disagree. Even as a Mario Bros supporter, I have standards.
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Super Mario Bros. 2-A CRT
- Thread starter SuperMarioGamers3
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- 2-a mario bros.
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He didn't even survived It, Rosalina had to save him
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SuperMarioGamers3
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- #43
He very much survived it, as the Prima Guide and the Game itself showed.
Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara
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We don't use the Prima Guide for Galaxy.
ZespeonGalaxy
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Unfortunately Prima guides are not too fondly supported in vsbw.
SuperMarioGamers3
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- #46
Then just the game itself.
ZespeonGalaxy
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Ok even if we use the game, then its quite implied rosalina saved mario no?
SuperMarioGamers3
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- #48
Definitely saved Mario, but we know Mario gets stronger over time, so it's possible he reached a point where wouldn't need to be saved.
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Yes, it is
ZespeonGalaxy
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…What? This is not how scaling works
(Should clarify i agree with galaxy level baseform mario and fooder, and some uni to multi stuff. Just this thread isnt convincing for me)
SuperMarioGamers3
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Oh wait, the Universe destruction feat could have just affected the entire cosmology.
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So THAT's why it's no longer on Bowser's profile or used as scaling, that makes a lot of sense actually.
Wait speaking of Galaxy, I just realized another contention towards 2-A Bowser: If Bowser already had well beyond Universal power in Mario Party 5, why did he need the power of the Grand Stars and his Galaxy Reactor in order to create his own galaxy in Galaxy 1? He could've done so effortlessly under his own power, yet needed an external source in order to create even a galaxy
SuperMarioGamers3
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- #54
That assumes that MP5 comes before Galaxy.
SuperMarioGamers3
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"Bwahaha! I’ll destroy this Adventure Dream and turn it into my own, you heeear!!"
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Disagree for Fujiwara and Kirbonic’s reasons. Even if this were legit it’d be a major outlier.
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Your conclusion is very unreliable based on the information being discussed.
- Ratings from the Tiering System tend to be given when characters output a certain amount of energy from one action. There's no evidence that a single attack from Bowser would've destroyed every dream world in the Dream Depot simultaneously. Any available information suggests the opposite. Most obviously, if Bowser were capable of destroying an infinite multiverse with one attack instead of destroying individual universes, then the process of him performing his plan would've been infinitely faster than what it was proven to be: "Bowser is causing all kinds of trouble again! At this rate, he'll destroy the dream worlds one by one! Will you try to stop him?" ~ Misstar, clearly describing how Bowser didn't demonstrate Multiverse level+ power but was a threat to the Dream Depot nonetheless.
- Of course, Bowser still had to be able to finish the job over time. This probably means his Range section should include "up to Multiversal+" and/or his Speed section should include "up to Infinite".
- There's no evidence that Bowser was going to destroy the dream worlds physically, as far as I'm aware. Bowser has easy access to magic, which he uses for non-physical purposes. For example, at the beginning of Yoshi's Story, an "evil spell" from Bowser turned an island into a storybook and the sky into paper. Bowser could've been trying to use a similar "evil spell" during Mario Party 5 to destroy the dream worlds. Bowser was not only trying to destroy dream worlds, but he was trying to replace them with his own and make his dreams come true forever, as he said in the evidence that you presented, indicating that Bowser intended to use magic in some way. Bowser's punches don't have cosmic range, whereas his magic does, so the idea I presented is more reliable than yours.
- Being the creator of something doesn't necessarily imply physicality scaling to what was created. If there's proof that the Star Spirits created the Dream Depot, then it's evidence that they have Multiverse level+ reality warping and dream manipulation, not evidence that they can punch that hard. Bowser went inside individual dream worlds to cause trouble, so it's a mystery why the Star Spirits didn't stop him with their magic, but perhaps they thought that the playable characters physically dealing with Bowser would've been more efficient, especially since the playable characters are known for being familiar with facing Bowser. Maybe the Star Spirits didn't want to deal with Bowser directly because they didn't want to risk getting hurt by him. Alternatively, maybe Bowser has a resistance to their magic, maybe they refuse to directly interfere with existing dreams, or maybe their magic can't be used offensively at its peak. There's no reason to prioritize the interpretation that Bowser "seems to scale above" the Multiverse level+ magic of the Star Spirits, when the circumstances are mysterious and there are other interpretations that are as likely to have been the case, if not more so.
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If we go by real life dates? Yes because Mario Party 5 came out in 2003 while Galaxy 1 came out in 2007. And in universe, I would say Galaxy 1 takes place after MP5 because Koopa Kid/Baby Bowser had been replaced entirely by Bowser Jr at this point in the series.
Though given that Mario as a franchise doesn't give much of a shit about continuity, a lot of games happen one after the other so Galaxy 1 would take place after MP5.
ZespeonGalaxy
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I think showing how you got this translation would really help your case"Bwahaha! I’ll destroy this Adventure Dream and turn it into my own, you heeear!!"
Kirbonic_Pikmin
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Bowser isn’t seen again until after the universe and everything in it resets, and the black hole is presented as a fatal threat to the entire cast, and Rosalina seemingly had to protect Mario from the blast (though via surface area this protection wouldn’t be uni), so there’s no reason to assume Bowser would have actually survived the black hole / reset itself.
ZespeonGalaxy
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Would you look at that. I agreed with fuji and kirb in a mario crt. That is insane!!!111!!! 
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Wasn’t there for when this passed so… why is that?
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That's a fair point against that feat, I was mainly going off of memory from the past in regards to Bowser and the black hole so I didn't know that there were holes for Bowser outright surviving the blackhole in the first place.
But regardless, if even that feat is an outlier then that makes the 2-A stuff even more egregious to me
ZespeonGalaxy
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perhaps its a case by case…? Assuming you mean Mephistus’s last crt.
Kirbonic_Pikmin
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I’d have to look for the exact reasoning, but it was because the Prima guide was originally used to argue universal base forms because of a statement about bowser planning to use the grand Star to collapse the universe and create a new one
But that’s completely contradictory to the actual plot and bowsers actual plan of the game and made literally no sense so it was disallowed. Iirc there were other inconsistencies / things that were completely unsupported in the original game stated in that guide that also lead to it, but the bowser/grand Star stipulation was like the main one.
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If it's filled with inconsistencies, then sure, but I just find it strange to use arguments like "it was presented as fatal" and "Rosalina seemingly had to protect them" over actual statements of their survival. It's pretty much entirely conjectural, especially given that nothing in-game actually confirms whether they survived or not and this is all just personal speculation
Kirbonic_Pikmin
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I think that's another major issue with the feat as a whole lol. It's unclear, happens in the last five minutes of the game, is almost entirely symbolism, and gets absolutely no explanation inside or outside of the game. There ARE no statements about anything regarding it lol. Rosalina speaks in vague symbolic terms which read as the universe being reset, but otherwise there is no explanation given for what occurred, how or why they survived, etc. I think its not really usable for scaling because of the majority of that, but using what we do have as a basis, ie it being presented as a fatal threat, which IS blatant imho. Mario and co were trying to escape it and were unable to, and it was so severe the Lumas had to mass sacrifice themselves to stop it.
But outside of that there is no explanation for much of anything that occurs and a majority of it is just speculation on how things are interpreted by the person. I think its a lot easier to deem what DIDN'T happen in that scene, at the least.
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There is this statement:
Kirbonic_Pikmin
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Yeah, this is from the Prima Guide though lol
I think its clear enough that once the Lumas get involved that the universe is effected, its moreso just a matter of the casts survival not getting an explanation in game.
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Hard disagree.
Seriously, what is it with people and wanting stupid high ratings for verses? How strong some jackalope is shouldn't matter outside of verses threads.
Seriously, what is it with people and wanting stupid high ratings for verses? How strong some jackalope is shouldn't matter outside of verses threads.
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Kirbonic_Pikmin
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hey
hey hey hey
wait a minute. What is this scan from? I have the Japanese Mario Party 5 Official Guide and its not in that. It's not in the Japanese Mario Party 5 Website from what I've seen either. I do not recognize where this is from. Could you let us know where you got this scan from? Is it the Japanese Manual for MP5, or something else?
Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara
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Quick question, what's the source for this statement?EDIT:
The Star Spirits Are Also Stated To Be The Creators Of The Dream Depot, And Bowser Seems To Scale Above Them Since They Can't Seem To Stop Bowser.
Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara
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Smh way to copy my post, loser....................................................................
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Disposing of the overall context of characters and viewing them as mere stat sheets to find information for.
I tried using Google Search's function of finding an image's source, and I didn't find the source.
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I know that I'm just taking a shot at people without my philosophy on profiles
Probably means it's 100% faked
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i agree the scan is fake but just coz the google search function cant find it doesn't mean its fake
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I’d rather wait for him to respond first before jumping to conclusions
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I did say "probably" did I not?
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