Strong-Willed Mage VS Vengeful Scientist (Asuna Kamakura Vs Cobalt) (Bakuhatsu VS VeneficaVerse) (0-0-0)

[Javenplayz253]

Yeah because she was created as an adult woman, her true age is around 4, but mentally and physically she is in her prime

Idk whether I should be worried or...

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

Idk whether I should be worried or...

You always do this literally what’s wrong with this one, be very specific

 

[Javenplayz253]

You always do this literally what’s wrong with this one, be very specific

Now listen,

Cobalt's true age is 4/5-6 as of now but Marx is way older than that... so uhh yeh
(Doesn't mean she's not cool character tho)

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

Now listen,

Cobalt's true age is 4/5-6 as of now but Marx is way older than that... so uhh yeh
(Doesn't mean she's not cool character tho)

And? Are you suggesting she isn't actually a grown woman somehow? The person who is a professional extraordinary genius scientist, mother of 4, powerful fighter, and is highly respected across the hero apparatus and literally treated and respected as any other grown woman is/should be? Is this a troll, or are you genuine with this concern? I can't tell, like, at all I can sort of let this fly with Miro/Mirai, but there's not really an excuse with Cobalt because she's quite literally an adult in every single circumstance outside of her general creation.

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

We shouldn't clutter this up any more, but basically what I'm saying is that thinking Cobalt having relationships is problematic because of her technical age is, and pardon me because I don't mean to sound rude or whatever, stupid

 

[Rayfire]

Honestly? She can. I don’t know if I said it before, but all of Cobalt’s abilities were created by her on the fly even from just her limited understanding of her bodies energy and her DNA. This includes all of her Max Aura moves, like Plutonium Novas, Plutonium Max Hands, Plutonium Disks, and her three extremely efficient shield abilities all of which far outclass those she has access to in this key. She won’t be able to make up something like changing time but you can see how extremely efficient she actually is with her powers even with practically no experience, largely based on intellect alone but also her resolve and great genetics. I think you’re underestimating Cobalt’s ability to overpower Asuna through calculations alone.

Oki, makes sense, but Asuna could figure out how to use magic without even knowing how in chapter 1 as well, it was pure instinct, so I feel like she kinda does the same thing, which would make them 50/50 in this regard all things considered

Although impressive, a bunch of this is physical which is totally different. Put Asuna in Cobalt's shoes for a moment. Cobalt was genetically engineered in a lab with the DNA of Blast, with her sole purpose in life to be Marx’s baby making machine (because their children would all be crazy smart and have Blast’s powers over dimensions) and viciously manipulated and controlled for years and has completely fake memories planted in her head to make her believe everything Marx wants her to. Imagine learning everything about yourself and your life is a literal lie and your existence serves no good purpose to literally anyone. Not only this, but your very existence is technically evil due to all of your actions benefitting someone like Marx Gemini. Cobalt has also technically been pregnant her entire life, and everybody knows that even a single time does awful things for your body and mental health. Hell, she was pregnant when she killed Marx! All of a sudden Cobalt’s resolve seems a lot more impressive

Plus Cobalt has Plutonium Dissipation, which deconstructs. This could be fixed with her time thing but I imagine having her chest area totally deconstructed rather than stabbed or whatever would be far worse for her

It definitely seems like cobalt was in a rough position as well, which I said earlier, but she hasn’t ever had to risk her life up until she fought Marx, did she? Sure, she was being abused, but so was Asuna, and in my opinion, a lot worse ways, since she could have easily died many times because of how physically weak she described herself as. Nothing was ever said about cobalt being beaten up by Marx on the daily like Asuna on her profile, just that she was treated really badly and being pregnant all the time, which I don’t think should compare to having enough resolve to being beaten up daily, and not be hospitalised/incapable of moving altogether. Being pregnant is painful, but not cripplling level like Asuna went through, especially if you were literally engineered specifically for you to take such pain, which meant she wouldn’t have had to push herself Asuna’s torment was a lot more physical, sure, but I think that should translate to mental endurance too given the circumstances, especially since asuna’s done it for way longer than cobalt, since she’s lived longer. (15 Years > 4 Years)

Well, a huge hole in your body is a huge hole in your body, after all. I’m not sure I quite get what you mean when you say that’s way worse, but even if it is, Asuna’s resolve can jump from being able to endure daily beatings to literally resisting death itself after her reincarnation, and shrugging off your pain receptors firing at absolute overdrive (Which I think should also be comparable to the mental resolve of realizing your life is meaningless. I mean, Asuna was literally resisting a natural phenomena and then later outright ignoring it in the middle of her fight with Kedron too) And even if it’s somehow even more painful than that somehow, Asuna won’t have to endure it for long. She has healing magic and/or time magic to fix that.

Her sense is impressive but I have a hard time thinking that it’s better than an extraordinary genius’ intuition, who also has great knowledge on Cobalt’s very specific energy, the way it flows, its general power and special uses with it (he was in charge of the Synthetic Human project which lead to her creation), plus his scanners telling him a bunch of stuff too, and his general careful attitude about the whole thing. Please do not underestimate this it’s not as simple as you’re suggesting currently.

I know it’s definitely not something that simple to work around given the context of that, lol, I’m just saying that the circumstances here are very different. Danger sense works by sensing ill intent, not by sensing energy signatures/presences like marxs’ scanners do, which judging by the fact that you’ve said they are just “Cobalt-shaped energy things” it kind of means they aren’t sentient. So cobalt either has to attack and allow Asuna to sense her and know which signature is the actual cobalt from there, or just not bother with using that move at all, since she’d also be fighting in complete darkness like Asuna would be (Unless it’s some kind of paradox where it’s bright for her and dark for Asuna somehow) And this is assuming Asuna doesn’t use fortune or playback as mentioned earlier to get around this easier.

Plutonium Hand also deals with AOE pretty easily. Cobalt can use it from behind Plutonium Bend to make it even easier to handle. Doesn’t seem to matter due to previous arguments though. Cobalt is clearly smart and won’t resort to some pointless strategy after it becomes clear that it isn’t working

Plutonium hand doesn’t always work judging from its description, and it also is implied to have a cooldown of some sort, since it can only be used for up to 30 seconds a time. I’m not sure if cobalt would be expecting literal on-contact explosion magic, at least at first. We’ve only seen cobalt handle Marx with his missiles, lasers, guns, whatever, so far, and not super versatile magic, at least to my knowledge. I think this is something that would force Asuna to use nullify through power creation too, and while cobalt can always use her 6-C shields, she apparently can’t attack very well whilst she’s using that if I remember correctly.

 

[Rayfire]

Oh, and also, there’s one interesting thing I caught on cobalts profile, too.

Apparently, if her core is destroyed, she can’t regenerate:

• Regeneration: Cobalt can recover damages to her body relatively quickly as long as her core remains intact. Even large scars regenerate in little time. She can regenerate larger wounds over a short time as well, but larger wounds take longer.

Her core is definitely not immediately obvious due to her appearance, but if Asuna were to land enough hits given that she’s about twice as fast as powered-up cobalt with turbocharge, and can force her out of her comfort zone (Her 6-C shields) enough, then the damage could definitely build up, and Asuna could intentionally or unintentionally stop her regen. That’d require the fight to take place over a long period of time, but I think it’s a possibility that can’t be ignored.

^ One other interesting detail though is that cobalt doesn’t seem to regenerate larger wounds as fast as she can mere scratches or cuts for example. This would mean Asuna’s regen is way faster, since Shizu once used healing magic to regenerate Asuna’s what-should-have-been fatal injury extremely quickly, so that might also give Asuna an opportunity to incap her if Asuna can slow her down by injuring her enough overtime.

 

[Rayfire]

I feel like I should point out that your last response ignored where I said that Cobalts portals were being ignored

Oh yeah about that, uhh

It’s not on her powers & abilities section, I don’t see “portal creation” nowhere

Ain’t in notable attacks/techniques either

Edit: Found it a few hours later, but unfortunately max aura is restricted, (should put that in the rules tbh) since it’s way above Asuna’s tier, and even if she could use it here, it literally says she’s only been able to use it on accident. She hardly even knows how to use it, lol. No guarantee it’ll land either since Asuna can see all of her attacks coming with precog

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

Oh yeah about that, uhh

It’s not on her powers & abilities section, I don’t see “portal creation” nowhere

Ain’t in notable attacks/techniques either

Edit: Found it a few hours later, but unfortunately max aura is restricted, (should put that in the rules tbh) since it’s way above Asuna’s tier, and even if she could use it here, it literally says she’s only been able to use it on accident. She hardly even knows how to use it, lol. No guarantee it’ll land either since Asuna can see all of her attacks coming with precog

Just because plutonium hyperspace is listed in max aura doesn’t mean that cobalt all of a sudden doesn’t have the ability which her dna literally makes intrinsic to her. If she didn’t have portals, there wouldn’t be a reason for her existence (I guess I must have slumped putting them in the powers). Assuming this whole thing is after the Marx fight, Cobalt would be behind the point of using them by accident which is the case as soon as that fight ends. As in all previous threads involving Cobalt, I’ve made it clear the only thing holding her back in regards to portals is inexperience.

EDIT: Plus isn’t it clear from everything else I’ve said that cobalt is more than capable of learning how to use her own powers on the fly in the midst of fights? If this battle takes long enough the inexperience is going to go away. The thing about cobalt is that in the story she hasn’t really fought outside of her battle against Marx because she’s not a fighter at heart and she resents the reasons she has power at all, which is why throughout the story she remains inexperienced.

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

It definitely seems like cobalt was in a rough position as well, which I said earlier, but she hasn’t ever had to risk her life up until she fought Marx, did she? Sure, she was being abused, but so was Asuna, and in my opinion, a lot worse ways, since she could have easily died many times because of how physically weak she described herself as. Nothing was ever said about cobalt being beaten up by Marx on the daily like Asuna on her profile, just that she was treated really badly and being pregnant all the time, which I don’t think should compare to having enough resolve to being beaten up daily, and not be hospitalised/incapable of moving altogether. Being pregnant is painful, but not cripplling level like Asuna went through, especially if you were literally engineered specifically for you to take such pain, which meant she wouldn’t have had to push herself Asuna’s torment was a lot more physical, sure, but I think that should translate to mental endurance too given the circumstances, especially since asuna’s done it for way longer than cobalt, since she’s lived longer. (15 Years > 4 Years)

Cobalt wasn't engineered to be able to handle it better than anyone normal at all, not sure where you got that from. Why would a monster like Marx take that into consideration? It was just enough that she would barely survive, this is all Marx cared about. There is also no point to this trauma contest, since clearly both have mental and physical toughness able to handle each other. (Although, there are some characters in V. Verse with trauma that laughs at both Asuna and Cobalt combined )

Well, a huge hole in your body is a huge hole in your body, after all. I’m not sure I quite get what you mean when you say that’s way worse, but even if it is, Asuna’s resolve can jump from being able to endure daily beatings to literally resisting death itself after her reincarnation, and shrugging off your pain receptors firing at absolute overdrive (Which I think should also be comparable to the mental resolve of realizing your life is meaningless. I mean, Asuna was literally resisting a natural phenomena and then later outright ignoring it in the middle of her fight with Kedron too) And even if it’s somehow even more painful than that somehow, Asuna won’t have to endure it for long. She has healing magic and/or time magic to fix that.

It's just the difference between having a repairable wound vs having a deconstructed wound. It's quite literally gone rather than just very hurt. Is that not worse? Also resisting death itself? Do you mean that normally fatal wound or is she unkillable? Why does it always feel like there's something new with Asuna that needs to be clarified

I know it’s definitely not something that simple to work around given the context of that, lol, I’m just saying that the circumstances here are very different. Danger sense works by sensing ill intent, not by sensing energy signatures/presences like marxs’ scanners do, which judging by the fact that you’ve said they are just “Cobalt-shaped energy things” it kind of means they aren’t sentient. So cobalt either has to attack and allow Asuna to sense her and know which signature is the actual cobalt from there, or just not bother with using that move at all, since she’d also be fighting in complete darkness like Asuna would be (Unless it’s some kind of paradox where it’s bright for her and dark for Asuna somehow) And this is assuming Asuna doesn’t use fortune or playback as mentioned earlier to get around this easier.

I clarified the signatures in previous posts already, I don't need to say specifically that they aren't sentient but to end that right now I will say that no they're not sentient at all (should have been clear after message 1 mentioning them though), they are energy constructs, they are just as alive as Cobalt's energy blasts. I also said earlier that cobalt won't mindlessly continue to attempt unsuccessful strategies (making most of the continued talk about it unimportant), and yes Plutonium bend doesn't work both ways. If it did, the move would be pretty pointless.

Also remember that it isn't just the scanners input, Marx's brain surpasses a supercomputer and it looks like that is far from true for Asuna, the only thing she could use to tell a difference would be danger sense. And what if Cobalt just stands totally still, with no intent of attacking? It may be contrary for winning the fight through immediate offense but if she isn't giving off those signals, Asuna can't tell, and it could be a way for Cobalt to regenerate those larger wounds without reverse dissipation.

Plutonium hand doesn’t always work judging from its description, and it also is implied to have a cooldown of some sort, since it can only be used for up to 30 seconds a time. I’m not sure if cobalt would be expecting literal on-contact explosion magic, at least at first. We’ve only seen cobalt handle Marx with his missiles, lasers, guns, whatever, so far, and not super versatile magic, at least to my knowledge. I think this is something that would force Asuna to use nullify through power creation too, and while cobalt can always use her 6-C shields, she apparently can’t attack very well whilst she’s using that if I remember correctly.

Doesn't always work? You imply that I meant that for the entire attack. No, it only sometimes doesn't send attacks in the desired direction, which is typically straight back to Asuna btw, but regardless it never just lets stuff through. You also either haven't checked Marx's profile or are underestimating him, because Plutonium hand still works against his much more versatile Monster-Cyborg moveset. I should also point out that Cobalt managed to beat him despite the fact that he had 'Save System' so she's dealt with reactive evolution, and his Master Aura which is a blanket damage reduction all the way at 50% (meaning that everything Cobalt did had only half the intended affects) so she's clearly deadly efficient.

Oh, and also, there’s one interesting thing I caught on cobalts profile, too.

Apparently, if her core is destroyed, she can’t regenerate:

• Regeneration: Cobalt can recover damages to her body relatively quickly as long as her core remains intact. Even large scars regenerate in little time. She can regenerate larger wounds over a short time as well, but larger wounds take longer.

Her core is definitely not immediately obvious due to her appearance, but if Asuna were to land enough hits given that she’s about twice as fast as powered-up cobalt with turbocharge, and can force her out of her comfort zone (Her 6-C shields) enough, then the damage could definitely build up, and Asuna could intentionally or unintentionally stop her regen. That’d require the fight to take place over a long period of time, but I think it’s a possibility that can’t be ignored.

^ One other interesting detail though is that cobalt doesn’t seem to regenerate larger wounds as fast as she can mere scratches or cuts for example. This would mean Asuna’s regen is way faster, since Shizu once used healing magic to regenerate Asuna’s what-should-have-been fatal injury extremely quickly, so that might also give Asuna an opportunity to incap her if Asuna can slow her down by injuring her enough overtime.

Well yeah, her core is her heart, without it she just dies, but I see no way for her to ever figure out that she even has a robotic heartdanger sense surely isn't gonna say so because the core has no offensive capability and she can't just look to see for herself. Also healing magic doesn't equal regen, regen is supposed to be a natural thing without magical things, otherwise it's just healing, even if they function the same. It's clear that Asuna doesn't actually have natural regen and she needs to be in a magic casting state in order to heal. There's a very real chance that Cobalt gets her into a state where she simply won't be able to use it at all.

(Edit: also hopefully my replies don't sound too frustrated, this is actually one of the more fun ones I've had )

 

[Javenplayz253]

Engineered? Is cobalt a robot?

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

Engineered? Is cobalt a robot?

So you're telling me after all the stuff I said yesterday as an explanation for Cobalt being allowed to have kids didn't get through to you that she isn't a human at all? She's a 'synthetic human', basically a human formed in a tube based on someone else's (Blast in this case) DNA. Her innards and skin and such were programmed into her core, which floated in a tube while her body grew around it naturally. So yes, pretty much everything about her is customized and 'engineered'. In a certain sense, she is indeed a robot.

 

[Javenplayz253]

So you're telling me after all the stuff I said yesterday as an explanation for Cobalt being allowed to have kids didn't get through to you that she isn't a human at all? She's a 'synthetic human', basically a human formed in a tube based on someone else's (Blast in this case) DNA. Her innards and skin and such were programmed into her core, which floated in a tube while her body grew around it naturally. So yes, pretty much everything about her is customized and 'engineered'. In a certain sense, she is indeed a robot.

Ohhhhhhh.
I get it.
Also for the question I forgot .

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

Ohhhhhhh.
I get it.
Also for the question I forgot .

Did you read her summary at all? I’m not sure if I spell it out explicitly and I haven’t read it for a while at all so not sure what it says, but I’m pretty sure I do point out the whole ‘synthetic human’ thing

Also, this could be important for the roleplay, Alva is also a synthetic human. Her deathmachine core is the exact same kind as Cobalt’s which is why she actually is able to walk without being a robot later

 

[Javenplayz253]

Did you read her summary at all? I’m not sure if I spell it out explicitly and I haven’t read it for a while at all so not sure what it says, but I’m pretty sure I do point out the whole ‘synthetic human’ thing

Also, this could be important for the roleplay, Alva is also a synthetic human. Her deathmachine core is the exact same kind as Cobalt’s which is why she actually is able to walk without being a robot later

I got a real funni battle now hehe

 

[Javenplayz253]

Did you read her summary at all? I’m not sure if I spell it out explicitly and I haven’t read it for a while at all so not sure what it says, but I’m pretty sure I do point out the whole ‘synthetic human’ thing

Also, this could be important for the roleplay, Alva is also a synthetic human. Her deathmachine core is the exact same kind as Cobalt’s which is why she actually is able to walk without being a robot later

I got a real funni battle now hehe

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

I got a real funni battle now hehe

What is this about Alva’s wheelchair

 

[Javenplayz253]

What is this about Alva’s wheelchair

No
Javen (SS) vs Cobalt
Now at first it might sound bad but The former has some dura ignoring abilities.

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

No
Javen (SS) vs Cobalt
Now at first it might sound bad but The former has some dura ignoring abilities.

How come it would be funni

 

[Javenplayz253]

How come it would be funni

Nah I said it'll be good despite tier differences.

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

Nah I said it'll be good despite tier differences.

Wait which tier cobalt and Javen?

 

[Javenplayz253]

Wait which tier cobalt and Javen?

Tier 7-C for jav
And Low 7-B with abilities cobalt

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

Tier 7-C for jav
And Low 7-B with abilities cobalt

When do you wanna do that

 

[Javenplayz253]

When do you wanna do that

Possibly after this thread preferably when we get into voting

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

Possibly after this thread preferably when we get into voting

Could be a while, I think both sides could still have arguments not even mentioned yet

 

[Javenplayz253]

Could be a while, I think both sides could still have arguments not even mentioned yet

Maybe sooner depending if I have time today hehe

 

[Javenplayz253]

Could be a while, I think both sides could still have arguments not even mentioned yet

Battle of the blue haired! (Javen (SS) vs Cobalt (V.Verse)

No story! Javen is 7-C whilst Cobalt is low 7-B Javen is aware that cobalt is more stronger and durable than him Speed is equal Distance is 1 kilometer Battle location is Y-City No battle music "Because Marx when you act out in this house you have to deal with the consequences of your...

vsbattles.com

 

[Rayfire]

Cobalt wasn't engineered to be able to handle it better than anyone normal at all, not sure where you got that from. Why would a monster like Marx take that into consideration? It was just enough that she would barely survive, this is all Marx cared about. There is also no point to this trauma contest, since clearly both have mental and physical toughness able to handle each other. (Although, there are some characters in V. Verse with trauma that laughs at both Asuna and Cobalt combined )

Fair, lol

It's just the difference between having a repairable wound vs having a deconstructed wound. It's quite literally gone rather than just very hurt. Is that not worse? Also resisting death itself? Do you mean that normally fatal wound or is she unkillable? Why does it always feel like there's something new with Asuna that needs to be clarified

Well, she does have Type 2 immortality, but I’m not saying she’s absolutely unkillable. Otherwise she’d have nothing to worry about at all in such a dangerous world as the one she was summoned to I was moreso saying that it’s something that falls in supernatural willpower categories. If Asuna was completely vaporized no amount of willpower will save her from that, I meant that it would take a lot of fatal injuries to slow down/kill her, and even then, she can always heal up from it. Cobalts High regen also makes her difficult to kill even if it’s slower than Asuna’s, right?

I clarified the signatures in previous posts already, I don't need to say specifically that they aren't sentient but to end that right now I will say that no they're not sentient at all (should have been clear after message 1 mentioning them though), they are energy constructs, they are just as alive as Cobalt's energy blasts. I also said earlier that cobalt won't mindlessly continue to attempt unsuccessful strategies (making most of the continued talk about it unimportant), and yes Plutonium bend doesn't work both ways. If it did, the move would be pretty pointless.

Also remember that it isn't just the scanners input, Marx's brain surpasses a supercomputer and it looks like that is far from true for Asuna, the only thing she could use to tell a difference would be danger sense. And what if Cobalt just stands totally still, with no intent of attacking? It may be contrary for winning the fight through immediate offense but if she isn't giving off those signals, Asuna can't tell, and it could be a way for Cobalt to regenerate those larger wounds without reverse dissipation.

Ok, mb lol, I just wanted to absolutely make sure because I tend to get stuff wrong sometimes. That would mean Asuna could tell them apart though

Would Cobalt think to do that if she uses plutonium bend this early in the fight before she can get a handle for what Asuna can do? Even then, I think Asuna would either call her a pu**y to dare her into attacking where Asuna would want her, and even if cobalt holds herself together, even the slightest amount of anger towards her could potentially set danger sense off, or could be another opportunity to use fortune to help her guess where she is at random. Even if it doesn’t work, since fortune isn’t a guarantee, Asuna can always try again.

^ In Volume 1, Chapter 6, Asuna could pick up haruka’s mere annoyance towards her with danger sense when she first met her in that alley, so if cobalt gets angry, Asuna would detect her in a similar fashion and know where she is.

Doesn't always work? You imply that I meant that for the entire attack. No, it only sometimes doesn't send attacks in the desired direction, which is typically straight back to Asuna btw, but regardless it never just lets stuff through. You also either haven't checked Marx's profile or are underestimating him, because Plutonium hand still works against his much more versatile Monster-Cyborg moveset. I should also point out that Cobalt managed to beat him despite the fact that he had 'Save System' so she's dealt with reactive evolution, and his Master Aura which is a blanket damage reduction all the way at 50% (meaning that everything Cobalt did had only half the intended affects) so she's clearly deadly efficient.

Ah, I see. Even then, Asuna’s parrying and blocking does basically the same thing, so we’d just get an epic high-speed pong match between them if cobalt uses plutonium hand lol . Even if the two are in a clash when that happens, I’m not sure if cobalt has dealt with this before:

• Clone Creation (Type 2, Via “Shadow Clone No Jutsu” Skill. later changed the skill name to simply “Clones”.)

Asuna could definitely summon a lot of clones of herself (No specified limit, but since I have WoG For Bakuhatsu I’d say up to 10 for Asuna’s skill level relatively speaking for her verse) to attack her from all directions once Asuna see’s that cobalt is able to deflect all of her attacks. Since plutonium hand is, well, concentrated energy into cobalts’ hand, she can’t block omnidirectionally, which is a minor unspecified flaw Asuna could take full advantage of and maybe even get a combo in. Cobalt could use her shields in response, sure, but she has to come out at some point, and while the shields’ durability is 6-C, How would it hold up against rapid and repeated 7-A/High 7-A attacks from a dozen asuna’s, exactly? It can’t hold forever. Cobalt will, again have to come out and fight multiple opponents at some point, unless she can hold it until the time limit runs out.

^ In case you are wondering, the clones have a 30 second time limit and cooldown, but this is only mentioned in the web novel (Vol 1 Chapter 5 I believe) for sum reason, so I’ll probably make this less vague on Asuna’s page, lol

Well yeah, her core is her heart, without it she just dies, but I see no way for her to ever figure out that she even has a robotic heartdanger sense surely isn't gonna say so because the core has no offensive capability and she can't just look to see for herself. Also healing magic doesn't equal regen, regen is supposed to be a natural thing without magical things, otherwise it's just healing, even if they function the same. It's clear that Asuna doesn't actually have natural regen and she needs to be in a magic casting state in order to heal. There's a very real chance that Cobalt gets her into a state where she simply won't be able to use it at all.

I did mention that it’d be hard for Asuna to figure that out I think, I just said if Asuna lands enough hits it might damage or destroy it. And no, that’s not something danger sense would tell Asuna about lol, All it does is tell Asuna that someone has ill intent towards/attacking her and how she can avoid/defend against it a couple seconds ahead of time . Well, yeah, but the issue with that is that Asuna has precog (danger sense) here, which would be really hard for cobalt to get around when Asuna can see all of her attacks coming. Even if Asuna isn’t in a position to dodge, she can always block or counterattack. And even if cobalt gets Asuna severely injured, Asuna can keep moving like normal even with most of her chest destroyed and losing basically all of her blood (Like guts!!! Wooo) so I really doubt Asuna wouldn’t be able to use healing magic at all.

(Edit: also hopefully my replies don't sound too frustrated, this is actually one of the more fun ones I've had )

(You’re good )

 

[Rayfire]

Even if the two are in a clash when that happens, I’m not sure if cobalt has dealt with this before:

• Clone Creation (Type 2, Via “Shadow Clone No Jutsu” Skill. later changed the skill name to simply “Clones”.)

Also, I made sure to check Marx’ profile for this one (Learnt my lesson) and I didn’t see any multiple selves or clone creation or none of that on there, but in any case, even if she has seen this before or can adapt cobalt will still have to fight multiple battles at once, even if it’s for a short period at a time

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

Well, she does have Type 2 immortality, but I’m not saying she’s absolutely unkillable. Otherwise she’d have nothing to worry about at all in such a dangerous world as the one she was summoned to I was moreso saying that it’s something that falls in supernatural willpower categories. If Asuna was completely vaporized no amount of willpower will save her from that, I meant that it would take a lot of fatal injuries to slow down/kill her, and even then, she can always heal up from it. Cobalts High regen also makes her difficult to kill even if it’s slower than Asuna’s, right?

Cobalt doesn’t have great regen but she should be able to recover from similar energy via reverse dissipation. After all, she’s only truly out of the game if her core is damaged enough. Otherwise all her wounds are repairable this way. Also he’s clearly she is very, very hard to kill based on the fact that Marx Gemini couldn’t manage to do it even though she didn’t really know her own power (while he did), and he has pretty good hax in his higher form. Although her max aura is a big part of her survival vs Marx in the later portion of their fight, her ability to deeper understand her energy on the fly in fights like these combined with her general intellect and intuition for fighting/her superior and modified genetics will help her hang in there during this fight.

Ok, mb lol, I just wanted to absolutely make sure because I tend to get stuff wrong sometimes. That would mean Asuna could tell them apart though

No problem, but also, like I said before Cobalt won’t keep doing it when she realizes that it doesn’t work. But if it helps I wasn’t imagining cobalt really attacking during that either which could complicate the whole danger sense thing

Would Cobalt think to do that if she uses plutonium bend this early in the fight before she can get a handle for what Asuna can do? Even then, I think Asuna would either call her a pu**y to dare her into attacking where Asuna would want her, and even if cobalt holds herself together, even the slightest amount of anger towards her could potentially set danger sense off, or could be another opportunity to use fortune to help her guess where she is at random. Even if it doesn’t work, since fortune isn’t a guarantee, Asuna can always try again.

It’s not guaranteed that she would use bend that early, after all I believe that I pointed out that she has many methods of defense so she may not pick bend. If she does, that strat from Asuna isn’t going to be very successful. It’s pretty hard to make cobalt angry (unless you’re Marx), and she’s above petty insults like that. It’s not the end of the if Asuna picks her spot out either Cobalt has plenty of methods of battling head on too

Ah, I see. Even then, Asuna’s parrying and blocking does basically the same thing, so we’d just get an epic high-speed pong match between them if cobalt uses plutonium hand lol . Even if the two are in a clash when that happens, I’m not sure if cobalt has dealt with this before:

• Clone Creation (Type 2, Via “Shadow Clone No Jutsu” Skill. later changed the skill name to simply “Clones”.)

Asuna could definitely summon a lot of clones of herself (No specified limit, but since I have WoG For Bakuhatsu I’d say up to 10 for Asuna’s skill level relatively speaking for her verse) to attack her from all directions once Asuna see’s that cobalt is able to deflect all of her attacks. Since plutonium hand is, well, concentrated energy into cobalts’ hand, she can’t block omnidirectionally, which is a minor unspecified flaw Asuna could take full advantage of and maybe even get a combo in. Cobalt could use her shields in response, sure, but she has to come out at some point, and while the shields’ durability is 6-C, How would it hold up against rapid and repeated 7-A/High 7-A attacks from a dozen asuna’s, exactly? It can’t hold forever. Cobalt will, again have to come out and fight multiple opponents at some point, unless she can hold it until the time limit runs out.

Also, I made sure to check Marx’ profile for this one (Learnt my lesson) and I didn’t see any multiple selves or clone creation or none of that on there, but in any case, even if she has seen this before or can adapt cobalt will still have to fight multiple battles at once, even if it’s for a short period at a time

I suppose you didn’t check deep enough () because Marx has Boss-Master Clones.

• Boss-Master Clones: Marx is able to create up to 50 clones of himself, all of which have similar power. However, they cannot act independently, and the actual Marx is weakened as long as the clones are fighting. He hides himself and commands them mentally. Usually, he will reserve some of them to protect his hiding spot. Exploiting him is very difficult, however, due to the sheer numbers of clones and the power they each possess. Unlike the original Marx, they cannot regenerate.

Because you are hyper specific about how abilities function I’m gonna go ahead and explain what exactly some phrases in here mean. So, when it says ‘cannot act independently’ this means that they act according to Marx’s thoughts. In this form, Marx is even smarter due to his brain Monsterizing and being combined with the specs of his mech, making him capable of commanding dozens to do different tasks at the same time. You say that Asuna can make up to ten clones, that’s nothing for Cobalt even without Max Aura. 50 from all directions easily surpasses that of ten from all directions. Each one can also use most of the original Marx powers.

Who says Cobalt has to come out from her shield? She doesn’t have the same methods as with max aura but she can easily play the waiting game. A barrage of High 7-A attacks still doesn’t mean much compared to the 6-C attacks she was taking with her barrier (relentless and rage filled barrage from Marx in Boss Mode complete with both laser danmaku and punches, and still held mostly fine), she should be able to time the clones out pretty easily since she doesn’t have much ability to just destroy them like with Marx because no Max Aura.

I did mention that it’d be hard for Asuna to figure that out I think, I just said if Asuna lands enough hits it might damage or destroy it. And no, that’s not something danger sense would tell Asuna about lol, All it does is tell Asuna that someone has ill intent towards/attacking her and how she can avoid/defend against it a couple seconds ahead of time . Well, yeah, but the issue with that is that Asuna has precog (danger sense) here, which would be really hard for cobalt to get around when Asuna can see all of her attacks coming. Even if Asuna isn’t in a position to dodge, she can always block or counterattack. And even if cobalt gets Asuna severely injured, Asuna can keep moving like normal even with most of her chest destroyed and losing basically all of her blood (Like guts!!! Wooo) so I really doubt Asuna wouldn’t be able to use healing magic at all.

I think we need a clarification on how exactly magic is cast in bakuhatsu. Do you need to voice it out loud, or can you say it in your mind? What about hand gestures, or waving of the staff? Are there no rituals required to properly use your abilities? And if not, why not? That kind of stuff makes magic cooler (at least to me ). Surely there’s something cobalt can do to at least slow it down. Perhaps Plutotnium Chains inflicting paralysis could give Cobalt the opening she needs

 

[Rayfire]

Cobalt doesn’t have great regen but she should be able to recover from similar energy via reverse dissipation. After all, she’s only truly out of the game if her core is damaged enough. Otherwise all her wounds are repairable this way. Also he’s clearly she is very, very hard to kill based on the fact that Marx Gemini couldn’t manage to do it even though she didn’t really know her own power (while he did), and he has pretty good hax in his higher form. Although her max aura is a big part of her survival vs Marx in the later portion of their fight, her ability to deeper understand her energy on the fly in fights like these combined with her general intellect and intuition for fighting/her superior and modified genetics will help her hang in there during this fight.

I see. That kinda makes them equal given that Asuna can also make new abilities and become more powerful/skilled on the fly through RE and Power Creation, but I do think a key difference is that cobalt relies on her core which can potentially be destroyed. If Asuna were to land enough hits on it (depends on where it is on her body I guess) she could be in trouble even if Asuna doesn’t know what it is.

No problem, but also, like I said before Cobalt won’t keep doing it when she realizes that it doesn’t work. But if it helps I wasn’t imagining cobalt really attacking during that either which could complicate the whole danger sense thing

Then what’s the point of using plutonium bend then if Asuna can fight just as well in darkness lol

It’s not guaranteed that she would use bend that early, after all I believe that I pointed out that she has many methods of defense so she may not pick bend. If she does, that strat from Asuna isn’t going to be very successful. It’s pretty hard to make cobalt angry (unless you’re Marx), and she’s above petty insults like that. It’s not the end of the if Asuna picks her spot out either Cobalt has plenty of methods of battling head on too

Asuna knowing where cobalt is within plutonium bend isn’t game over automatically, obviously, and cobalt definitely has plenty of offensive weapons like Asuna does, but the thing is, Asuna can still see anything cobalt can throw at her coming from a mile away with danger sense. Cobalt can adapt, sure, but so can Asuna. Cobalt is way smarter, obviously, but you can’t really predict attack patterns from things like million streaks for example, which launches danmaku thunder in random directions, and Precognition >>> Analytical prediction anyway due to the potential flaws that the latter can have (Opponent can suddenly switch strategies or movements for example and make it useless, whilst precognition generally doesn’t have that problem)

I suppose you didn’t check deep enough () because Marx has Boss-Master Clones.

• Boss-Master Clones: Marx is able to create up to 50 clones of himself, all of which have similar power. However, they cannot act independently, and the actual Marx is weakened as long as the clones are fighting. He hides himself and commands them mentally. Usually, he will reserve some of them to protect his hiding spot. Exploiting him is very difficult, however, due to the sheer numbers of clones and the power they each possess. Unlike the original Marx, they cannot regenerate.

Because you are hyper specific about how abilities function I’m gonna go ahead and explain what exactly some phrases in here mean. So, when it says ‘cannot act independently’ this means that they act according to Marx’s thoughts. In this form, Marx is even smarter due to his brain Monsterizing and being combined with the specs of his mech, making him capable of commanding dozens to do different tasks at the same time. You say that Asuna can make up to ten clones, that’s nothing for Cobalt even without Max Aura. 50 from all directions easily surpasses that of ten from all directions. Each one can also use most of the original Marx powers.

That’s fair, but another key difference is that all of these clones act on their own, so Asuna isn’t wasting any brain power or focus using them, and they’d also be at least 2x as fast as cobalt with turbocharge speed amps against a powered up cobalt, while cobalt seemed to be equal speed with those clones of Marx’s, especially since it’s stated that she was fighting “toe-to-toe” with him. Imagine having to fight someone who can move twice as fast as you and then suddenly you have to do the same with 10 of them It’s definitely less clones, but they are ones that have a speed advantage, something that cobalt struggled with against “skate mode”. And once again, both have pretty fast adaptation, so simply powering up to try and close the speed gap won’t do much against them, especially when some of them can get even faster than that through skills like supercharge.

Even if cobalt isn’t completely overwhelmed by this, it does make abilities like plutonium hand useless, and the only way for her to omnidirectionally defend from all this is through her shields, which won’t work if some of them also use nullify through PC (They behave the same as Asuna and technically have the same memories) to disable said shields, which can leave her open for an attack. Not using shields is definitely bad news for cobalt, and while I don’t think it’d be completely over if this happens (Especially since the clones don’t last forever) I think this would definitely give Asuna an advantage and opening to deal damage, possibly to her core unintentionally too since it’s in her body somewhere apparently.

I think we need a clarification on how exactly magic is cast in bakuhatsu. Do you need to voice it out loud, or can you say it in your mind? What about hand gestures, or waving of the staff? Are there no rituals required to properly use your abilities? And if not, why not? That kind of stuff makes magic cooler (at least to me ). Surely there’s something cobalt can do to at least slow it down. Perhaps Plutotnium Chains inflicting paralysis could give Cobalt the opening she needs

You can say it out loud or in your mind, depends on how cool you wanna feel (Most characters say it out loud cause anime tho) staff users like Asuna and Shizu just use them for swag points and also for better aim, like a sight on a rifle (Which is why they can fight without them) And uh, no, no rituals needed. Every human soul has mana in them already, it’s just something they can channel through their mind and force of will, kind of like imagination powers but with a few limitations (Your output depends on your XP, and you need some insane concentration if you wanna control time or sumthin )

I doubt Asuna could be caught by the plutonium chains, especially since danger sense will alert of them, and she’s dodged far worse than those before (Kedron unleashed danmaku at Asuna that touhou players would have nightmares about )

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

I see. That kinda makes them equal given that Asuna can also make new abilities and become more powerful/skilled on the fly through RE and Power Creation, but I do think a key difference is that cobalt relies on her core which can potentially be destroyed. If Asuna were to land enough hits on it (depends on where it is on her body I guess) she could be in trouble even if Asuna doesn’t know what it is.

That doesn't work with stuff like intellect which Cobalt has an overwhelming advantage in. New abilities is cool and all but I've proven Cobalt has something similar going on. Entirely new abilities vs someone unlocking the real depths of their potential are also two pretty different things. I believe Cobalt will be able to get much more creative with her defenses to protect her core. She does have this thing called 'Brain Shield' she made even before her 'awakening', so i can see her making up a similar thing for her core. It could be as simple as manifesting an energy sphere around it which would give it similar protection as her 6-C full body barrier, likely moreso due to being compacted.

Then what’s the point of using plutonium bend then if Asuna can fight just as well in darkness lol

Because Cobalt doesn't know it isn't going to work the first time? it worked wonders against Marx, so why wouldn't she try it? All I said is that she won't be using it much more if Asuna proves that it doesn't mean much.

Asuna knowing where cobalt is within plutonium bend isn’t game over automatically, obviously, and cobalt definitely has plenty of offensive weapons like Asuna does, but the thing is, Asuna can still see anything cobalt can throw at her coming from a mile away with danger sense. Cobalt can adapt, sure, but so can Asuna. Cobalt is way smarter, obviously, but you can’t really predict attack patterns from things like million streaks for example, which launches danmaku thunder in random directions, and Precognition >>> Analytical prediction anyway due to the potential flaws that the latter can have (Opponent can suddenly switch strategies or movements for example and make it useless, whilst precognition generally doesn’t have that problem)

Cobalt being smarter means she is way less likely to get caught up in something like million streaks, plus I can use the same argument I just got finished making, Cobalt being 'creative.' She's got a bunch of different ways to defend against stuff like this (and just so we're clear, she has before, another feat from her Marx battle). She could be combining other abilities with Plutonium Hand in order to make a nearly impenetrable defense. Cobalt has been said many times to be far smarter and we both seem to agree on that, so I think even though Asuna has that limited precog (limited since she doesn't see visions exactly) Cobalt could come up with an intricate plot able to trick her. I've said before that she doesn't really get angry. Her control over her feelings and ability to discover deeper parts of her energy makes this more plausible.

That’s fair, but another key difference is that all of these clones act on their own, so Asuna isn’t wasting any brain power or focus using them, and they’d also be at least 2x as fast as cobalt with turbocharge speed amps against a powered up cobalt, while cobalt seemed to be equal speed with those clones of Marx’s, especially since it’s stated that she was fighting “toe-to-toe” with him. Imagine having to fight someone who can move twice as fast as you and then suddenly you have to do the same with 10 of them It’s definitely less clones, but they are ones that have a speed advantage, something that cobalt struggled with against “skate mode”. And once again, both have pretty fast adaptation, so simply powering up to try and close the speed gap won’t do much against them, especially when some of them can get even faster than that through skills like supercharge.

Don't discount the difference between ten and fifty. All of those clones were able to use all sorts of different moves/combos of moves against Cobalt, who handled it expertly even prior to using her strong shield techniques. She's able to weave through all this lasers danmaku (easily a couple thousand homing each from just one clone) and come up with moves/schemes in the midst of all this which led to her handling what was originally a very tricky situation with relative ease. Marx, once again, also far smarter than Asuna and is much more capable of strategizing when his brain is combined with his highly advanced technological apparatus. Just as well Asuna still doesn't have a way past her barrier able to block 6-C attacks well. Hyperspace gates will assist with barrages of attacks (I established earlier that cobalt indeed does have access to them in this key) and will work as a BFR against Asuna either. Plutonium hyperspace cannot be escaped unless Asuna has a method of reverse engineering Cobalt's exact energy which requires high knowledge on her DNA as well as the ability to use similar energy in the first place, neither of which Asuna can do. The biggest problem is time stuff as well as Cobalt's portal inexperience, but I've established that at least that much can be overcome.

Even if cobalt isn’t completely overwhelmed by this, it does make abilities like plutonium hand useless, and the only way for her to omnidirectionally defend from all this is through her shields, which won’t work if some of them also use nullify through PC (They behave the same as Asuna and technically have the same memories) to disable said shields, which can leave her open for an attack. Not using shields is definitely bad news for cobalt, and while I don’t think it’d be completely over if this happens (Especially since the clones don’t last forever) I think this would definitely give Asuna an advantage and opening to deal damage, possibly to her core unintentionally too since it’s in her body somewhere apparently.

Something not mentioned yet is Plutonium Knuckles

• Plutonium Knuckle: Cobalt infuses energy into her fists, forming a sparking sphere around them. When she attacks, she can bend the gravity of her attacks range and even wield it to absorb opponent attacks. Absorbing only allows for her to disperse their energy, however, there is no boost to herself from doing so.

Cobalt can easily infuse both hands with this. By bending the gravity all around her in this way, she can just outright block off clones from reaching her. As an extra precaution, it's also possible that she generates her aura as a sort of 'whirlwind' around her while she uses Plutonium Knuckles, acting as a sort of pseudo-shield causing great damage to Asuna or any clones entering it. In addition, she could use the knuckles to make a loop-like attack by bending gravity in the right way, keeping them trapped within her aura and bombard them with constant attacks. This could turn Asuna into bones before she can use something like Playback depending on if cobalt does this during a cooldown period. She can convert the whole thing back into full on defense if Asuna pivots for danmaku too. If she decides to try both, such as 5 charging Cobalt and 5 hanging back, she risks hitting her own clones and even then Cobalt still defends it. There's also no reason to believe that Cobalt doesn't just come up with 'mini' versions of her Max Aura abilities, such as Plutinium Sprit Shield, which is the one she came up with during Marx's clone swarm. This can be much more easily done since this Cobalt is afetr her Marx fight, and therefore she knows of everything she can do in Max Aura already. Although something like that could take lots of energy from her, so perhaps used in moderation.

I doubt Asuna could be caught by the plutonium chains, especially since danger sense will alert of them, and she’s dodged far worse than those before (Kedron unleashed danmaku at Asuna that touhou players would have nightmares about )

I mean, they are summoned up from the battlefield. Cobalt could just summon a few dozen and have them flop around while she diverges to other tasks such as all the defense stuff I mentioned before. They can certainly be an annoyance to Asuna and her clones.

To close this portion of arguments, I had a look throiugh Asuna's profile and I've noticed something VERY major which I believe will lead to Cobalt's win. She has no resistance to radiation, which is a direct byproduct of energy single attack Cobalt will be using. She doesn't resist 'adjacent' abilities either such as disease manipulation. Cobalt in her Awakened Form is no slouch when it comes to radiation. Asuna ought to be able to live this for a good while based on willpower and possibly healing magic (which explicetly lists fatal injuries, ie, non disease related things, and it hasn't been proven or implied to do it either so that's an arguement that shouldn't be attempted, and even if it could work she can't do such a thing forever. Plus Cobalt's stronger attacks leave much harsher radiation behind and if Asuna gets close she'll be infected much faster. Her radiation definitly exceeds that found in real life, although obviously hers is far more controlled. At the very least it should prove to be an extreme hinderance to her, but there's clear reason to believe that Cobalt has the advantage due to this.

 

[Rayfire]

Got stuff to do again, but I’ll reply to this as soon as i can

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

Got stuff to do again, but I’ll reply to this as soon as i can

I'll most likely be in bed by the time you get around to it

 

[Rayfire]

Cobalt being smarter means she is way less likely to get caught up in something like million streaks, plus I can use the same argument I just got finished making, Cobalt being 'creative.' She's got a bunch of different ways to defend against stuff like this (and just so we're clear, she has before, another feat from her Marx battle). She could be combining other abilities with Plutonium Hand in order to make a nearly impenetrable defense. Cobalt has been said many times to be far smarter and we both seem to agree on that, so I think even though Asuna has that limited precog (limited since she doesn't see visions exactly) Cobalt could come up with an intricate plot able to trick her. I've said before that she doesn't really get angry. Her control over her feelings and ability to discover deeper parts of her energy makes this more plausible.

Funnily enough, Asuna could also probably do the same thing, also coming up with an impenetrable defense. She’s seen this before from watching Haruka Vs Shizu in the adventurers tournament:

• Forcefield Creation (Via “Absolute Defense“ Skill. Can create an invisible forcefield around her, which can stop an attack that can overwhelm her from reaching her, though she seemingly cannot attack back in this state.)

It’s a bit like infinity from Jujustu Kaisen. Asuna can’t attack back with this skill (Though she might find a way around this with Genius Battle IQ), but if cobalt can play defensively, so can Asuna. Both of them will do basically the same thing, defend from any attack the other can throw at them (Which logically should make them equal again lol) although, once again, if both of them just defend the whole time, Asuna will eventually win that way, since cobalts’ powers would be draining her stamina, even if it’s slow. It’d also just become a staring contest at that point

Asuna is also quite skilled at copying skills from others (Hence why i brought up she could copy nullify from Haruka and Shizu in other threads, not just this one), and also making them better (As seen in Chapter 3 when Asuna one-upped Shizu by making supercharge) so given asuna’s flexibility, i don’t think she’d fall behind in this department either. She could maybe even reverse-engineer some of cobalts’ own moves if she see’s them clearly, too, as long as they are within her skill level/what she can output. Meanwhile, cobalt seems to just be limited to general energy manipulation and technology stuff, which while has lots of potential for creativity, it’s not always on par with, uh, literal mind magic

Danger sense isn’t really something that can just be “Outsmarted”. It’s listed as precognition for a reason, not analytical prediction. Asuna doesn’t get a whole vision of the future, yeah, but she knows the best way to dodge, defend, or counter an attack even if she can’t see an attack coming at all, like with fighting that golem in the dark or surprise attacks from Kedron, or sensing Haruka when she has stealth mastery (If i remember right, but even if she doesn’t, she definitely should, otherwise Asuna would never have sensed her mere annoyance and saw her to begin with) so, if cobalt for sum reason tries to get around that, Asuna will just see through it, ironically, unless cobalt tries to put her in a spot where she can’t dodge it no matter what, in which case, Asuna can always stop/reverse time briefly to do so, or just teleport away with a riftway.

Don't discount the difference between ten and fifty. All of those clones were able to use all sorts of different moves/combos of moves against Cobalt, who handled it expertly even prior to using her strong shield techniques. She's able to weave through all this lasers danmaku (easily a couple thousand homing each from just one clone) and come up with moves/schemes in the midst of all this which led to her handling what was originally a very tricky situation with relative ease. Marx, once again, also far smarter than Asuna and is much more capable of strategizing when his brain is combined with his highly advanced technological apparatus. Just as well Asuna still doesn't have a way past her barrier able to block 6-C attacks well. Hyperspace gates will assist with barrages of attacks (I established earlier that cobalt indeed does have access to them in this key) and will work as a BFR against Asuna either. Plutonium hyperspace cannot be escaped unless Asuna has a method of reverse engineering Cobalt's exact energy which requires high knowledge on her DNA as well as the ability to use similar energy in the first place, neither of which Asuna can do. The biggest problem is time stuff as well as Cobalt's portal inexperience, but I've established that at least that much can be overcome.

Handling 50 marxs’ at once is definitely impressive, but you still haven’t said how cobalt would deal with their superior speeds. It’s clearly implied that she’s struggled heavily against opponents faster than her even with her insane skill and Battle IQ:

At least Massively Hypersonic+ (Could fight toe to toe with Marx Gemini, who was easily much faster than Suppression Mode Abliter even when using skates. However, she was overpowered by his 'Skate Mode')

It’s also implied that she needed max aura to get around this (Hence why she seemed to have jumped to sub-relativistic) which is obviously barred since 6-B attacks will obviously oneshot Asuna and also means she can’t do anything to cobalt physically, so against MULTIPLE people who are much faster than her, cobalt without max aura seems pretty screwed if she can’t even keep up with a single Marx with skate mode on judging by the description.

Asuna can’t break throug a 6-C shield through brute force (Yet ) but she does have knowledge of nullify, which she could use to get rid of that, which Asuna’s clones can also do.

As for the hyperspace gates, even if we assume asuna somehow gets hit by that even with precognition, she can always reverse time itself to go back to her original position once she see’s Riftways wouldn’t work against that, and while cobalt could probably know that Asuna went back in time, she doesn’t really have anything to intercept that, And Asuna will also now also know what hyperspace gates are and how she can come back from them, (Time reversing) so it’s use kind of just… falls flat. Even if Asuna somehow can’t see it coming

Something not mentioned yet is Plutonium Knuckles

• Plutonium Knuckle: Cobalt infuses energy into her fists, forming a sparking sphere around them. When she attacks, she can bend the gravity of her attacks range and even wield it to absorb opponent attacks. Absorbing only allows for her to disperse their energy, however, there is no boost to herself from doing so.

Cobalt can easily infuse both hands with this. By bending the gravity all around her in this way, she can just outright block off clones from reaching her. As an extra precaution, it's also possible that she generates her aura as a sort of 'whirlwind' around her while she uses Plutonium Knuckles, acting as a sort of pseudo-shield causing great damage to Asuna or any clones entering it. In addition, she could use the knuckles to make a loop-like attack by bending gravity in the right way, keeping them trapped within her aura and bombard them with constant attacks. This could turn Asuna into bones before she can use something like Playback depending on if cobalt does this during a cooldown period. She can convert the whole thing back into full on defense if Asuna pivots for danmaku too. If she decides to try both, such as 5 charging Cobalt and 5 hanging back, she risks hitting her own clones and even then Cobalt still defends it. There's also no reason to believe that Cobalt doesn't just come up with 'mini' versions of her Max Aura abilities, such as Plutinium Sprit Shield, which is the one she came up with during Marx's clone swarm. This can be much more easily done since this Cobalt is afetr her Marx fight, and therefore she knows of everything she can do in Max Aura already. Although something like that could take lots of energy from her, so perhaps used in moderation.

THREE LITTLE WORDS:

Gravity Manipulation, Pressure Manipulation, Limited Existence Erasure, & Space-Time Manipulation (Type 1, Via Gravity Magic. Copied from Chidori in the endless library. Using skills such as “Mirrored Spacetime” Asuna can flip gravity around, confusing and taking opponents off-guard. Additionally, it was stated by Shizu that she used it to crush a book into thin air by focusing a massive amount of Spacetime on it, due to the fundamentals on how Gravity Magic normally works.)

GRAVITY. MAGIC. NERD.

(Serious reply: ) If cobalt tries that, and her intention is to trap them in there to deal damage, and most importantly, FRICKING KILLING THEM BRUTALLY, then… that just means danger sense would pick it up and stop them or the OG Asuna from trying to get in that range. Even if they find themselves caught in that, because of the above ^ Asuna already understands how to manipulate gravity, so Asuna would just counteract it with her own gravity magic, which should be doable, especially when Asuna’s gravity manip seems a lot more complex by bending space-time itself to do it, and as far as i know, that’s not something cobalt has. (Class T > Class M if this matters lol)

How would the “mini-versions” work, exactly? That just sounds like her awakened key’s powers with extra steps Asuna also has plenty of ways to avoid/defend against those, especially if they are just the same abilities but less powerful and with more drawbacks. (Teleporting out of her range and waiting for it to pass before jumping in again, reversing time to stop her from using said move, using fortune to help herself survive a killing blow, parrying/blocking, healing any damage taken, using absolute defense through power creation, etc)

I mean, they are summoned up from the battlefield. Cobalt could just summon a few dozen and have them flop around while she diverges to other tasks such as all the defense stuff I mentioned before. They can certainly be an annoyance to Asuna and her clones.

Yeah, but as I’ve mentioned earlier, Asuna has dodged way worse than that before and had no problems fighting back, even when she first starting out (Vol 1 Chapter 3 against some insane danmaku from Kedron). A few dozens projectiles won’t be anything new to Asuna.

To close this portion of arguments, I had a look throiugh Asuna's profile and I've noticed something VERY major which I believe will lead to Cobalt's win. She has no resistance to radiation, which is a direct byproduct of energy single attack Cobalt will be using. She doesn't resist 'adjacent' abilities either such as disease manipulation. Cobalt in her Awakened Form is no slouch when it comes to radiation. Asuna ought to be able to live this for a good while based on willpower and possibly healing magic (which explicetly lists fatal injuries, ie, non disease related things, and it hasn't been proven or implied to do it either so that's an arguement that shouldn't be attempted, and even if it could work she can't do such a thing forever. Plus Cobalt's stronger attacks leave much harsher radiation behind and if Asuna gets close she'll be infected much faster. Her radiation definitly exceeds that found in real life, although obviously hers is far more controlled. At the very least it should prove to be an extreme hinderance to her, but there's clear reason to believe that Cobalt has the advantage due to this.

Adventurers can actually survive in space, therefore can tank cosmic radiation, but obviously, i haven’t been able to show that yet, and neither can i with Asuna, so it can’t be used here and that’s a lil unfortunate. (Wait for next chapter and you’ll see) However, i do still have some points against this.

This is all depending on if cobalt can even land a hit on Asuna, which she’d struggle heavily to do at best. Not only does Asuna have precognition to see any of those attacks coming, but i think you’ve missed her speed edge, too. (2x against powered up cobalt) it’s also said that it’s an energy-infused thing on her profile, so it’s not like it’s an AoE thing. It’s implied to just be an add-on with her landed attacks. Although that can be said if she charges it in her hands to make it an “aura” which danger sense could also detect if her intention is to irradiate Asuna with it. And there’s no reason to think Asuna has to get in up-close and personal anyway. Even if Asuna DOES get hit by the radiation, there’s no reason to believe it’s game over straight away. You’ve said so yourself. Asuna also has the option of turning back time to reverse this as well even if healing magic doesn’t work against this.

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

Funnily enough, Asuna could also probably do the same thing, also coming up with an impenetrable defense. She’s seen this before from watching Haruka Vs Shizu in the adventurers tournament:

• Forcefield Creation (Via “Absolute Defense“ Skill. Can create an invisible forcefield around her, which can stop an attack that can overwhelm her from reaching her, though she seemingly cannot attack back in this state.)

It’s a bit like infinity from Jujustu Kaisen. Asuna can’t attack back with this skill (Though she might find a way around this with Genius Battle IQ), but if cobalt can play defensively, so can Asuna. Both of them will do basically the same thing, defend from any attack the other can throw at them (Which logically should make them equal again lol) although, once again, if both of them just defend the whole time, Asuna will eventually win that way, since cobalts’ powers would be draining her stamina, even if it’s slow. It’d also just become a staring contest at that point

Asuna is also quite skilled at copying skills from others (Hence why i brought up she could copy nullify from Haruka and Shizu in other threads, not just this one), and also making them better (As seen in Chapter 3 when Asuna one-upped Shizu by making supercharge) so given asuna’s flexibility, i don’t think she’d fall behind in this department either. She could maybe even reverse-engineer some of cobalts’ own moves if she see’s them clearly, too, as long as they are within her skill level/what she can output. Meanwhile, cobalt seems to just be limited to general energy manipulation and technology stuff, which while has lots of potential for creativity, it’s not always on par with, uh, literal mind magic

Danger sense isn’t really something that can just be “Outsmarted”. It’s listed as precognition for a reason, not analytical prediction. Asuna doesn’t get a whole vision of the future, yeah, but she knows the best way to dodge, defend, or counter an attack even if she can’t see an attack coming at all, like with fighting that golem in the dark or surprise attacks from Kedron, or sensing Haruka when she has stealth mastery (If i remember right, but even if she doesn’t, she definitely should, otherwise Asuna would never have sensed her mere annoyance and saw her to begin with) so, if cobalt for sum reason tries to get around that, Asuna will just see through it, ironically, unless cobalt tries to put her in a spot where she can’t dodge it no matter what, in which case, Asuna can always stop/reverse time briefly to do so, or just teleport away with a riftway.

I’m sick of these giant replies being countered with giant replies

I think this should fall into the ‘not on profile’ category because if Asuna hasn’t been shown using it, as well as it not being in the profile currently (like with surviving in space mentioned) I don’t believe that it’s viable. ‘Might find a way around with genius battle IQ?’ I know I’ve said how much smarter cobalt is I firmly believe that she’ll find a way too, especially if Asuna can, and much sooner too. I also feel like Asuna’s key inexperience weakness is being ignored. Cobalt kinda has the same thing but she seems better at dealing with it considering she has zero guide/mentor or whatever to teach her anything about her powers.

Is she garou (who did successfully copy hyperspace gates) then? Cobalt’s powers are essentially the same as Blasts’ which has been described in OPM more than once as ‘manipulating dimensions’ so I have hard time imagining that Asuna can just copy this from Cobalt, especially when it’s also pretty clear that Cobalt’s energy is something entirely unique to her, hence why it can’t be transferred back as damage. You kinda need the DNA. Otherwise, Marx’s whole plot would be pointless because Neptune has technology easily beyond the comprehension of Asuna it’s highly unfair to assume Asuna can make a feat which far higher beings much smarter than Cobalt cannot.

I don’t think it’s fair to assume Asuna can get away perfect every time either, a lot of my last argument was basically that Cobalt can find a way to hit or corner her even through all of her defense/maneuvers. I don’t need to keep repeating how smart cobalt is. I think she can definitely create a situation where Asuna can’t dodge outright, and I know playback has cooldowns. Even at double speed cobalt has the methods to hit her (I’ve listed off some throughout the argument, and the speed advantage would most likely disappear as I say below)

Handling 50 marxs’ at once is definitely impressive, but you still haven’t said how cobalt would deal with their superior speeds. It’s clearly implied that she’s struggled heavily against opponents faster than her even with her insane skill and Battle IQ:

At least Massively Hypersonic+ (Could fight toe to toe with Marx Gemini, who was easily much faster than Suppression Mode Abliter even when using skates. However, she was overpowered by his 'Skate Mode')

It’s also implied that she needed max aura to get around this (Hence why she seemed to have jumped to sub-relativistic) which is obviously barred since 6-B attacks will obviously oneshot Asuna and also means she can’t do anything to cobalt physically, so against MULTIPLE people who are much faster than her, cobalt without max aura seems pretty screwed if she can’t even keep up with a single Marx with skate mode on judging by the description.

‘Overpowered’ does not mean ‘dominated.’ You see people in anime battle enemies with a speed disadvantage all the time. Plus, I find it strange that you brought this up while also ignoring that Cobalt can go toe-to-toe with Boss Mode, which combines all of Marx’s other modes, including Rocket Mode which is much faster than Skate Mode. I think it becomes clear that Cobalt gets faster due to her latent energy. It isn’t reactive evolution when you’re just tapping deeper into a power you already have (the reason why you don’t see reactive evo on her profile). She doesn’t get all that speed from Max Aura just by entering max aura you know. That power isn’t exactly completely locked behind a power up, although this key of Cobalt would find any max aura ability very difficult to use under these circumstances (hence why I mention ‘mini’ ones last time and also why they’re separated when listed as notable techniques as well), but mere speed boosts ought not to be a problem. In fact, she should be able to close the two times gap like she closed the gap between her vs Skate Mode in order to then face the much faster Boss Mode on similar footing.

Max Aura is like an explosion of her inner power being manifested outwardly, hence why she jumps tiers in both speed and AP, but the actual energy powers are with her regardless of which form she takes. Part of her ‘pre-awakening’ arc is discovering that this power of hers is latent within her and always has been/always will be, it belongs to her and she vows to make herself her own person with them. That’s why cobalt can be overpowered by skate mode and then fight even with Boss Mode even with the lesser AP. Her speed rose because she tapped deeper into her pool. She would be able to do more of the same through the course of this fight too.

(This should be listed on her profile, but like many I’ve made, I did get lazy with the sort of ‘inner aspects’ of some of my characters, fixing things such as this is high on my bucket list)

Asuna can’t break throug a 6-C shield through brute force (Yet ) but she does have knowledge of nullify, which she could use to get rid of that, which Asuna’s clones can also do.

As for the hyperspace gates, even if we assume asuna somehow gets hit by that even with precognition, she can always reverse time itself to go back to her original position once she see’s Riftways wouldn’t work against that, and while cobalt could probably know that Asuna went back in time, she doesn’t really have anything to intercept that, And Asuna will also now also know what hyperspace gates are and how she can come back from them, (Time reversing) so it’s use kind of just… falls flat. Even if Asuna somehow can’t see it coming

Hyperspace gates can be used to send her attacks right back at her too, or just send them away. It’s not like it takes much experience to just summon them in front of you to do so. Something like this Cobalt has even done on accident before

THREE LITTLE WORDS:

Gravity Manipulation, Pressure Manipulation, Limited Existence Erasure, & Space-Time Manipulation (Type 1, Via Gravity Magic. Copied from Chidori in the endless library. Using skills such as “Mirrored Spacetime” Asuna can flip gravity around, confusing and taking opponents off-guard. Additionally, it was stated by Shizu that she used it to crush a book into thin air by focusing a massive amount of Spacetime on it, due to the fundamentals on how Gravity Magic normally works.)

GRAVITY. MAGIC. NERD.

(Serious reply: ) If cobalt tries that, and her intention is to trap them in there to deal damage, and most importantly, FRICKING KILLING THEM BRUTALLY, then… that just means danger sense would pick it up and stop them or the OG Asuna from trying to get in that range. Even if they find themselves caught in that, because of the above ^ Asuna already understands how to manipulate gravity, so Asuna would just counteract it with her own gravity magic, which should be doable, especially when Asuna’s gravity manip seems a lot more complex by bending space-time itself to do it, and as far as i know, that’s not something cobalt has. (Class T > Class M if this matters lol)

How would the “mini-versions” work, exactly? That just sounds like her awakened key’s powers with extra steps Asuna also has plenty of ways to avoid/defend against those, especially if they are just the same abilities but less powerful and with more drawbacks. (Teleporting out of her range and waiting for it to pass before jumping in again, reversing time to stop her from using said move, using fortune to help herself survive a killing blow, parrying/blocking, healing any damage taken, using absolute defense through power creation, etc)

Knuckles can also absorb and disperse her attacks. And if she can defend against them so well why not allow Max Aura? /s

Plus I was more referring to the defensive aspects. Cobalt can come up with a shield move which can defend against Asuna well, and even a mini version of Plutonium Spirit Shield isn’t something Asuna has a much way to get around. It will literally bend her or clones out of shape if they attempt to approach, although it should be much more limited reaching since this cobalt is not using max aura.

Yeah, but as I’ve mentioned earlier, Asuna has dodged way worse than that before and had no problems fighting back, even when she first starting out (Vol 1 Chapter 3 against some insane danmaku from Kedron). A few dozens projectiles won’t be anything new to Asuna.

Adventurers can actually survive in space, therefore can tank cosmic radiation, but obviously, i haven’t been able to show that yet, and neither can i with Asuna, so it can’t be used here and that’s a lil unfortunate. (Wait for next chapter and you’ll see) However, i do still have some points against this.

This is all depending on if cobalt can even land a hit on Asuna, which she’d struggle heavily to do at best. Not only does Asuna have precognition to see any of those attacks coming, but i think you’ve missed her speed edge, too. (2x against powered up cobalt) it’s also said that it’s an energy-infused thing on her profile, so it’s not like it’s an AoE thing. It’s implied to just be an add-on with her landed attacks. Although that can be said if she charges it in her hands to make it an “aura” which danger sense could also detect if her intention is to irradiate Asuna with it. And there’s no reason to think Asuna has to get in up-close and personal anyway. Even if Asuna DOES get hit by the radiation, there’s no reason to believe it’s game over straight away. You’ve said so yourself. Asuna also has the option of turning back time to reverse this as well even if healing magic doesn’t work against this.

They are not projectiles they are chains. They would basically be protruding up from the ground and whipping around violently.

Not true, did I not say that it’s a BYPRODUCT of Cobalt’s attacks? The whole place is gonna get irradiated even with cobalt missing attacks, especially if she’s using expansive moves like having a bunch of chains whipping around. Pretty much every single thing cobalt does leaves radiation around. There will be a point in the fight where Asuna cannot go back to a time before there was radiation. I addressed speed earlier. It totally could be an aoe thing if she opts for something like Plutonium Storm, basically leaving big radiation amounts all around even with Asuna dodging it. The air itself will be irradiated too. Asuna will be on the clock regardless of what she does.

 

[Rayfire]

I’m sick of these giant replies being countered with giant replies

We can prolly slow down on that if ya want lol

I think this should fall into the ‘not on profile’ category because if Asuna hasn’t been shown using it, as well as it not being in the profile currently (like with surviving in space mentioned) I don’t believe that it’s viable. ‘Might find a way around with genius battle IQ?’ I know I’ve said how much smarter cobalt is I firmly believe that she’ll find a way too, especially if Asuna can, and much sooner too. I also feel like Asuna’s key inexperience weakness is being ignored. Cobalt kinda has the same thing but she seems better at dealing with it considering she has zero guide/mentor or whatever to teach her anything about her powers.

Why not? You said yourself that cobalt could also create new abilities, and those aren’t something that cobalt would have shown yet, so why can’t Asuna all of a sudden, especially if it’s something she’s seen from her friends before? That’d be basically ignoring an ability she has (Power Creation) I only brought up that she hasn’t been shown to survive in space (yet) because that’s not really something her power creation/adaptation can just grant her.

I meant ‘find a way around it with genius battle IQ’ as in getting around absolute defenses’ flaws of not being able to attack with it on potentially. I mean, Cobalt is way smarter, but it’s not like Asuna is dumb either. Cobalt can definitely come up with new moves herself since she’s already done so, But i will ask if the cooldowns and stamina drains are really something cobalt could, y’know, stop? Especially in the middle of a fight? If so, then why hasn’t she done that if this is after her fight with Marx? Lol. That’s the major issue with cobalts’ own power-making skills, even if it’s slow. It won’t mean much if one of them wins quickly, but if the fight goes on long enough that’s gonna add up. It’s mentioned as a weakness on cobalts’ profile for a reason, right?

Yeah, it’s true Asuna is comparatively inexperienced compared to the rest of her friends, at least with using magic. And even then, she can still go toe-to-toe with monsters who are stronger, faster, and most importantly more experienced/skilled than her (Like Kedron) and still win. She might not have much experience with magic (Though she at least knows how it works by now) but her sheer battle instincts carry her a lot with using it, which is why she seems so skilled in the web novel already.

Is she garou (who did successfully copy hyperspace gates) then? Cobalt’s powers are essentially the same as Blasts’ which has been described in OPM more than once as ‘manipulating dimensions’ so I have hard time imagining that Asuna can just copy this from Cobalt, especially when it’s also pretty clear that Cobalt’s energy is something entirely unique to her, hence why it can’t be transferred back as damage. You kinda need the DNA. Otherwise, Marx’s whole plot would be pointless because Neptune has technology easily beyond the comprehension of Asuna it’s highly unfair to assume Asuna can make a feat which far higher beings much smarter than Cobalt cannot.

I did say ‘some of’ cobalts move for a reason, lol. Unless Asuna knows its basic fundamentals (about hyperspace gates) i doubt she could copy/reverse-engineer it, but for other moves that’s not really the case, like plutonium hand. All it is is “Reflect attack with hand for funni hehe” which would be pretty simple for Asuna to copy, even if it’s not the same with manipulating dimensions (Which Asuna sorta knows how to do too, she can throw herself into the 4th dimension for time travel) There’s a reason why i brought up that Asuna seems more versatile in that regard. Remember “It’s literal mind magic”?

I don’t think it’s fair to assume Asuna can get away perfect every time either, a lot of my last argument was basically that Cobalt can find a way to hit or corner her even through all of her defense/maneuvers. I don’t need to keep repeating how smart cobalt is. I think she can definitely create a situation where Asuna can’t dodge outright, and I know playback has cooldowns. Even at double speed cobalt has the methods to hit her (I’ve listed off some throughout the argument, and the speed advantage would most likely disappear as I say below)

I DID say that cobalt could definitely do that at some point or another, but then I’ve literally shown you all the others ways she can defend even if she can’t feasibly just dodge. Playback does have a cooldown, but that does mean Asuna now knows cobalts’ whole strategy to trap her, so she’ll just avoid it without needing to spam it, and i don’t see how cobalt is supposed to sneak attack her with danger sense thrown into the mix.

‘Overpowered’ does not mean ‘dominated.’ You see people in anime battle enemies with a speed disadvantage all the time. Plus, I find it strange that you brought this up while also ignoring that Cobalt can go toe-to-toe with Boss Mode, which combines all of Marx’s other modes, including Rocket Mode which is much faster than Skate Mode. I think it becomes clear that Cobalt gets faster due to her latent energy. It isn’t reactive evolution when you’re just tapping deeper into a power you already have (the reason why you don’t see reactive evo on her profile). She doesn’t get all that speed from Max Aura just by entering max aura you know. That power isn’t exactly completely locked behind a power up, although this key of Cobalt would find any max aura ability very difficult to use under these circumstances (hence why I mention ‘mini’ ones last time and also why they’re separated when listed as notable techniques as well), but mere speed boosts ought not to be a problem. In fact, she should be able to close the two times gap like she closed the gap between her vs Skate Mode in order to then face the much faster Boss Mode on similar footing.

Max Aura is like an explosion of her inner power being manifested outwardly, hence why she jumps tiers in both speed and AP, but the actual energy powers are with her regardless of which form she takes. Part of her ‘pre-awakening’ arc is discovering that this power of hers is latent within her and always has been/always will be, it belongs to her and she vows to make herself her own person with them. That’s why cobalt can be overpowered by skate mode and then fight even with Boss Mode even with the lesser AP. Her speed rose because she tapped deeper into her pool. She would be able to do more of the same through the course of this fight too.

I know, but it does mean cobalt needs a bit of time to adapt to that without sudden speed boosts like max aura able to be used. She wouldn’t be “Overpowered” if she could just adapt immediately, would she? Even if she does close the gap without getting wombo-comboed (lol) by Asuna and her clones, they can also adapt fairly quickly, and can get an even bigger speed boost through supercharge if they are desperate. Asuna would also have the option of turning back time to intercept cobalt before she adapts to said speed advantage, knowing her future movements. At best, cobalt could hope to become equal speed with them again if she’s lucky, Asuna doesn’t just use supercharge to get even faster, and has enough power to pull from, which may or may not drain her stamina faster since she’d seemingly have to use more of it i think.

(This should be listed on her profile, but like many I’ve made, I did get lazy with the sort of ‘inner aspects’ of some of my characters, fixing things such as this is high on my bucket list)

Hyperspace gates can be used to send her attacks right back at her too, or just send them away. It’s not like it takes much experience to just summon them in front of you to do so. Something like this Cobalt has even done on accident before

But then Asuna can just parry them, and then… you know where this is going

Knuckles can also absorb and disperse her attacks. And if she can defend against them so well why not allow Max Aura? /s

Plus I was more referring to the defensive aspects. Cobalt can come up with a shield move which can defend against Asuna well, and even a mini version of Plutonium Spirit Shield isn’t something Asuna has a much way to get around. It will literally bend her or clones out of shape if they attempt to approach, although it should be much more limited reaching since this cobalt is not using max aura.

I did mention just before that Asuna can counteract with gravity magic, nullify, etc. And if cobalt intends to crush them into oblivion using it then danger sense will pick that killing intent up and stop them from going in there in the first place. Plus, plutonium spirit shield can only bend you in every which way and stuff like that, and there’s also the fact that it’d be a “mini” version of it too, whereas Asuna can easily crush things OUT OF EXISTENCE with gravity magic of her own, hence why she has limited existence erasure. (Should be a potential wincon for her too )

They are not projectiles they are chains. They would basically be protruding up from the ground and whipping around violently.

Mb lol, but still, if they are just a few dozen of them i doubt Asuna will have trouble with them. She’s faced a lot worse than that before.

Not true, did I not say that it’s a BYPRODUCT of Cobalt’s attacks? The whole place is gonna get irradiated even with cobalt missing attacks, especially if she’s using expansive moves like having a bunch of chains whipping around. Pretty much every single thing cobalt does leaves radiation around. There will be a point in the fight where Asuna cannot go back to a time before there was radiation. I addressed speed earlier. It totally could be an aoe thing if she opts for something like Plutonium Storm, basically leaving big radiation amounts all around even with Asuna dodging it. The air itself will be irradiated too. Asuna will be on the clock regardless of what she does.

True, but you’ve said yourself earlier that supernatural willpower and healing magic can help slow down any consequential effects of that. It’s not like it’s an instant death. Plus, it all depends on how fast it is, too. Healing magic in Bakuhatsu can heal back limbs, organs, etc exactly how they were before in seconds, which would include their cells and DNA too. If Asuna just uses healing magic constantly, and she knows about the radiation (which she will if it starts affecting her) then it’d just become a minor inconvenience.

Even if that doesn’t work for some reason, Asuna can always teleport away to a random location where cobalt can’t follow her or know where she went with a riftway and THEN heal and come back for another round and then retreat again to heal and the cycle repeats, she can always use absolute defense to block it out, she could potentially come up with some other skill to aid her with dealing with this (Like she did with Riftways against chidori’s superior speed and manoeuvrability) etc.

And it’s not that Asuna is without moves that could cut cobalt off before she can do any lasting damage with that also. If Asuna gets desperate, which is exactly what she would do knowing that her opponent is trying to irradiate her, could just crush cobalt out of existence considering her magics’ range and likely superior LS (Class G, Likely Class T > Class G) like she did with a book before. Even if cobalt is able to resist it, there’s no reason to believe she won’t at the very least be heavily affected by the first attempt. Her core and body as a whole would still be put under immense stress.

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

Why not? You said yourself that cobalt could also create new abilities, and those aren’t something that cobalt would have shown yet, so why can’t Asuna all of a sudden, especially if it’s something she’s seen from her friends before? That’d be basically ignoring an ability she has (Power Creation) I only brought up that she hasn’t been shown to survive in space (yet) because that’s not really something her power creation/adaptation can just grant her.

Except that Cobalt HAS been shown doing, that’s what literally all of her notable techniques are. Technically, it isn’t even really power creation, I said on my last reply (a section you appear to have left on read) that part of her whole pre-awakening arc is discovering this power in her which has always been there, and that’s a continued theme up until Marx is dead. My point is that Clbalt has all of these powers already and this ‘power creation’ is actually just her continuing to discover more about it. Why this hasn’t really been shown since is that Cobalt is not a fighter at heart despite how great she actually is at it, and she wishes not to use these powers for hurting others. Also getting very creative with her current set in order to make up what would technically be a new ability isn’t actually power creation, it’s just expanding on what is still just latent for her waiting to be uncovered. Her intellect and efficiency can definitely make it seem like genuine power creation though, and her DNA energy/Blast’s power can be highly versatile. I will say that I won’t be attempting to claim that she could come up with something her powers have yet to show her though (like something poison related for example, Cobalt has never been shown to use her powers for such a thing outside of general radiation affects) although this doesn’t exactly limit her too much.

For Asuna, I guess she could have the Absolute Defense on account of her seeing it before, but I don’t buy the assumption that she’ll be able to come up with something even if she does take significant time trying to that can just auto-counter Cobalt’s stuff. Not only is it just not very plausible but it also reads like NLF and is generally feels unfair in vs context. I can see it being like with cobalt where she can only create things similar to what she’s already displayed creating.

I meant ‘find a way around it with genius battle IQ’ as in getting around absolute defenses’ flaws of not being able to attack with it on potentially. I mean, Cobalt is way smarter, but it’s not like Asuna is dumb either. Cobalt can definitely come up with new moves herself since she’s already done so, But i will ask if the cooldowns and stamina drains are really something cobalt could, y’know, stop? Especially in the middle of a fight? If so, then why hasn’t she done that if this is after her fight with Marx? Lol. That’s the major issue with cobalts’ own power-making skills, even if it’s slow. It won’t mean much if one of them wins quickly, but if the fight goes on long enough that’s gonna add up. It’s mentioned as a weakness on cobalts’ profile for a reason, right?

If the main drawback of absolute defense can be outright ignored after just thinking about ways to maybe do it for a while, then what is the point of any drawback at all? It might as well be a true absolute defense and exist as a passive shield blocking everything in that case. I don’t believe that Asuna is at the level of skill where she can outright surpass the flaws of moves, especially those she’s hardly even seen and can only just now copy and likely hasn’t even ever actually used for herself. That seems way out of line to me and even goes against the very point and purpose of the original move, this being to be ‘defense.’ I’ll have a much easier time believing it once Bakuhatsu has advanced further and Asuna has more powers and feats.

Nobody ever said Asuna is dumb, but as you said Cobalt is way smarter. There is a very clear difference between genius of Asuna, and the extraordinary genius of Cobalt (note, 'extraordinary' is there for a reason). Here are the wiki defined terms.

• Genius: Individuals with an exceptional capacity for knowledge and intelligence, usually in one area of varying depth. This level of intellect is the level of real-world geniuses, polymaths, and genuinely extremely prominent intellectuals, and, in the absence of better feats, should be the default intelligence category for fictional characters with exceptional or superhuman intelligence.

• Extraordinary Genius: Individuals whose knowledge spreads over multiple fields of science and who vastly surpass the real world's upper human limits. At this level, many are capable of creating extremely advanced futuristic technology, executing complex strategies even under high pressure, outperforming supercomputers, and even accurately predicting the future through sheer mental calculations. This is where super scientists of exceptional scientific knowledge begin to appear.

Obviously actual degrees of intelect differ between characters, but this is the minimum for Cobalt and Asuna. She simply cannot keep up with her mentally at all. Sheer skill is one thing, being completely outwitted and outsmarted against a fighter who, mind you, seems very similarly skilled already (lots of this thread has been about how equal they are in certain aspects) is a completely different thing. I’m still of the full belief that Cobalt can and will catch Asuna during playback’s cooldown.

Cobalt cannot stop her stamina from being drained outright, but you also need to think of the context of it. Her highest draining moves are all mostly attributed to Max Aura, and her stamina was mainly a big problem before she ‘awakened’, as her first use of Plutonium Star got her feeling very winded. But against Marx, even after constant uses of her awakened attacks she wasn’t really tired. Even those high energy Max Aura attacks weren’t too draining, although it did have a clear effect on her throughout the battle, she was only genuinely feeling exhaustion after she finished using Plutonium Galaxy (granted she was REALLY tired) this all of this while pregnant with her fourth child in 3 years. Asuna still has the advantage but it’s not the crippling thing that’s going to give her the win, especially since Cobalt doesn’t have true access to those higher techniques. She still has some that do drain more, but once again her intellect ought to tie into that too. She knows better and can manage her stamina expertly, which is partly how she could contend with Marx at all.

Yeah, it’s true Asuna is comparatively inexperienced compared to the rest of her friends, at least with using magic. And even then, she can still go toe-to-toe with monsters who are stronger, faster, and most importantly more experienced/skilled than her (Like Kedron) and still win. She might not have much experience with magic (Though she at least knows how it works by now) but her sheer battle instincts carry her a lot with using it, which is why she seems so skilled in the web novel already.

I sort of addressed this during the absolute defense section, but seeing this I gotta mention Cobalt’s inexperience too and the fact that she’s literally also done pretty much the exact same thing but better. You say that Asuna at least knows how magic works by now, but Cobalt facing Marx didn’t even know that much about her own powers, hence what I mentioned before with her whole discovering powers thing. Marx is at least all of those things over Cobalt when their fight begins and he has various modes and such to maintain the advantage while cobalt discovers her powers more and more. When he Monsterizes this is basically put on steroids and Cobalt is forced to dig far deeper, unlocking Max Aura and adapting further with things such as Concentrated Aura. So I guess that the lack of experience doesn’t mean much for either side in this fight, although this does show that Cobalt is better at ‘on the fly’ battling in addition to the whole advantage package that comes with being that much smarter.

I did say ‘some of’ cobalts move for a reason, lol. Unless Asuna knows its basic fundamentals (about hyperspace gates) i doubt she could copy/reverse-engineer it, but for other moves that’s not really the case, like plutonium hand. All it is is “Reflect attack with hand for funni hehe” which would be pretty simple for Asuna to copy, even if it’s not the same with manipulating dimensions (Which Asuna sorta knows how to do too, she can throw herself into the 4th dimension for time travel) There’s a reason why i brought up that Asuna seems more versatile in that regard. Remember “It’s literal mind magic”?

Not even some of, I stated that you need her DNA. Does Asuna have that DNA? The answer is no, therefore she isn’t gonna just be replicating the stuff Cobalt does. Again, this is a very specific energy type which is specific to that DNA (ie Cobalt only). All Asuna can do is try to replicate something similar with her own powers. To copy Cobalt, you would need to be able to literally manipulate your own physiology to copy Cobalt’s genetic code AND have at least some knowledge on her energy, which is totally impossible for Asuna to do. Also her only knowing how to ‘manipulate dimensions’ for that one very specific instance (while using playback) doesn’t translate to being able to do anything like a hyperspace gate at all. It doesn’t help her that playback can’t be used offensively at all. You didn’t mention it before, but I’m assuming that Asuna can’t use a riftway to function like one either outside of travel based business, so that doesn’t count either.

I DID say that cobalt could definitely do that at some point or another, but then I’ve literally shown you all the others ways she can defend even if she can’t feasibly just dodge. Playback does have a cooldown, but that does mean Asuna now knows cobalts’ whole strategy to trap her, so she’ll just avoid it without needing to spam it, and i don’t see how cobalt is supposed to sneak attack her with danger sense thrown into the mix.

I’m tired of having to repeat this, but once more, Cobalt is smart enough to get her. What makes you think that playback is an absolute reset of the battle situation?She might not remember exactly what happened right before it’s used, but Cobalt can feasibly learn what she’s doing and time her whole assault and pure timing based solely around Asuna’s use of playback and logically should be coming up with many different strategies rapid fire style in her head as the fight continues. She has enough control over her powers to pivot strategies on a dime annd all the while she’ll be ‘digging deeper’ into this power of hers and learning more about it. Cobalt is ‘polite’ even in battle and doesn’t ever really intend to kill (earlier with that plan from cobalt to turn Asuna clones into bones was mostly pointing out a strat cobalt “could” use rather than an absolute, although there are lots of strategies available to her even without killing), and danger sense is much weaker without that killing intent. That speed boost isn’t going to be helping much once cobalt is deep enough into her power well to surpass her just as she did Boss Mode Marx.

I know, but it does mean cobalt needs a bit of time to adapt to that without sudden speed boosts like max aura able to be used. She wouldn’t be “Overpowered” if she could just adapt immediately, would she? Even if she does close the gap without getting wombo-comboed (lol) by Asuna and her clones, they can also adapt fairly quickly, and can get an even bigger speed boost through supercharge if they are desperate. Asuna would also have the option of turning back time to intercept cobalt before she adapts to said speed advantage, knowing her future movements. At best, cobalt could hope to become equal speed with them again if she’s lucky, Asuna doesn’t just use supercharge to get even faster, and has enough power to pull from, which may or may not drain her stamina faster since she’d seemingly have to use more of it i think.

Being overpowered, even if just for a short time, is still being overpowered all the same. Cobalt’s ability to adapt isn’t based on rising to the occasion against an opponent, it’s about rising to the occasion of her own power. The cobalt facing Asuna here is the one which has already killed Marx, so her adaptation is in the past and her knowledge over her abilities should make it all the quicker when it comes to closing this gap and then just surpassing Asuna. Her max aura is already unlocked, but she can’t use it which locks her ‘explosive’ growth of speed away, but she can still advance pretty significant just by repeatedly tapping deeper into her power like she has always done except she’s just as aware of it here as she was at the end of the fight. Cobalt doesn’t need to adapt again after time is reversed. Just like with her other powers and how they work, she’s already adapted.

But then Asuna can just parry them, and then… you know where this is going

Alright no, I’m sorry but I can’t let this one off free. A hyperspace gate cannot be interacted with physically, you can’t just parry a freaking portal like it’s just some punch. I know you based that on an RPG system but by no means does that imply she can do that for a portal such as this. In fact the only non-physical interaction Asuna has is the statement in her profile saying that magic can harm ghosts. This doesn’t translate to being able to parry a hyperspace gate at all. Unless you’re telling me that Asuna is akin to Saitama (who was shown to literally grab and move one), or show me a tangible feat of reflecting something very similar to a gate, I simply won't buy it.

I did mention just before that Asuna can counteract with gravity magic, nullify, etc. And if cobalt intends to crush them into oblivion using it then danger sense will pick that killing intent up and stop them from going in there in the first place. Plus, plutonium spirit shield can only bend you in every which way and stuff like that, and there’s also the fact that it’d be a “mini” version of it too, whereas Asuna can easily crush things OUT OF EXISTENCE with gravity magic of her own, hence why she has limited existence erasure. (Should be a potential wincon for her too )

I mentioned earlier that that plot was pretty of out of character for cobalt and rather just something that she could try to do. Also notice that even without that shield cobalt is easily capable of redirecting Marx’s graviton palms, even after he monsterized, so she’s packing resistance to gravity manipulation. The whole existence thing only applies if Asuna even manages to crush something, and she won’t. Cobalt has a boatload of methods to avoid that. Not to mention’s that’s out of character for Asuna, is it not? Why would she crush a random human woman out of existence? She’s no monster at all. According to the battle conditions this doesn’t apply until cobalt does something first, right?

Mb lol, but still, if they are just a few dozen of them i doubt Asuna will have trouble with them. She’s faced a lot worse than that before.

Alright I’ll let you have that one. Although cobalts intelligence would come into play again there.

True, but you’ve said yourself earlier that supernatural willpower and healing magic can help slow down any consequential effects of that. It’s not like it’s an instant death. Plus, it all depends on how fast it is, too. Healing magic in Bakuhatsu can heal back limbs, organs, etc exactly how they were before in seconds, which would include their cells and DNA too. If Asuna just uses healing magic constantly, and she knows about the radiation (which she will if it starts affecting her) then it’d just become a minor inconvenience.

‘Slow down’, not ‘stop entirely.’ Cobalt’s can certain get far faster when in super high concentrations. So when Asuna is fighting close by with cobalt, she’ll be irradiated all over the body fast, and she can’t just do everything at once by the way. Clones, boosts, thunder magic, fortune, healing magic, all cannot simply be cast at once, she’ll need to actively focus on doing thing thing. If this wasn’t true you would’ve already brought it up. Where are the feats of healing cells and dna? If she hasn’t faced anything which directly affects those parts of the body and would require healing for those specifically (such as healing cells back because the old ones were irradiated, which would’ve been in her profile already seeing as radiation and such isn’t mentioned at all), it leads me to start thinking maybe you’re being untruthful about the limitations/real uses of healing magic, so once again clarification would be nice (or, even better, proven feats). Plus again if she wants any hope of actually attacking constant healing magic uses are out the window.

Even if that doesn’t work for some reason, Asuna can always teleport away to a random location where cobalt can’t follow her or know where she went with a riftway and THEN heal and come back for another round and then retreat again to heal and the cycle repeats, she can always use absolute defense to block it out, she could potentially come up with some other skill to aid her with dealing with this (Like she did with Riftways against chidori’s superior speed and manoeuvrability) etc.

And it’s not that Asuna is without moves that could cut cobalt off before she can do any lasting damage with that also. If Asuna gets desperate, which is exactly what she would do knowing that her opponent is trying to irradiate her, could just crush cobalt out of existence considering her magics’ range and likely superior LS (Class G, Likely Class T > Class G) like she did with a book before. Even if cobalt is able to resist it, there’s no reason to believe she won’t at the very least be heavily affected by the first attempt. Her core and body as a whole would still be put under immense stress.

You can’t just remove yourself from the battle the battle and come back, that’s akin to fleeing isn’t it? Thats against SBA. Is that even in character for her to do as well? Why would Asuna adopt a strategy that’s so “safe” against someone hardly trying to kill her at all outside of radiation? Radiation which currently isn't being used to kill either.

I’ve already addressed how cobalt can do very similar things to that herself. Her superior intelligence will allow her to counter new abilities made by Asuna too via adapting and combining her own old abilities. She could plausibly come up with a counterplay for everything Asuna is trying to do.

I already addressed that she does indeed resist it. Marx’s graviton palms go up to 400 times earth gravity and her ability to counter those is basically effortless. It also doesn’t seem like a truly in character thing for Asuna to do. If she can deal with the radiation through other methods like healing magic easy enough, again, why would she kill this random human?

 

[VeneficaAuthor]

My next reply will be a different format to attempt to cut down on the massive back and forth here, it shouldn't take 90 minutes to type up responses to vs threads not that this hasn't been endearing

 

[Rayfire]

I’ve been busy most of the day again (Lol) so I’ll probably be back whilst your sleeping once again, mb lol

My next reply will be a different format to attempt to cut down on the massive back and forth here, it shouldn't take 90 minutes to type up responses to vs threads not that this hasn't been endearing

Not that I can’t handle those types of responses, but I will say that we definitely should cut down, it gets kinda annoying