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Star Wars Revision: Godly Sith Lords (Legends)

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Matthew_Schroeder

VS Battles
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Introductio

Yep. Yet another Star Wars revision. But hopefully this one will be the last for a while.

So, what exactly is being discussed and brought to the table here? Well, let me explain:

Currently, the characters of Lord Vitiate and Darth Sidious and currently ranked as Large Planet level and Large Star level respectively, due to the feats of the Ritual of Nathema and the Death of Darth Plagueis.

However, these ratings are not quite 100% accurate, particularly Vitiate's, which is quite lowballed. I'll explain why soon, but first, let's discuss some high-end Star Wars feats which are not directly Sidious' and Vitiate's:

The Feats
First, there is the Valley of the Jedi, one of the most well known Star Wars feats in Legends, which boosts a Force-user's power to such an extent that they can cause supernovas with utmost ease. As Qu Rahn puts it:

Jerec, the man who murdered your father, is a great evil. He searches for the location of a sacred place, the Valley of the Jedi. The Force of thousands of Jedi is trapped here. If Jerec captures this power, he will be a creature such as the universe has never seen. A supernova of stars in a fleeting thought—the eradication of life from a star system in a whisper—will be within his power.
~ Star Wars Jedi Knight: Dark Forces II​
There is also the power of Naga Sadow's Sith Corsair, which channels and controls Dark Side energy to the point where one is able to destroy entire stars:

https://imgur.com/a/0RenN

As well as Brakiss' feats, showing that it is possible for a Sith to destroy stars without a device to channel and better focus their power:

"More than five millennia ago the Denarii Nova exploded, ripping through these stars and reducing them to cinders," Brakiss said. "The powerful Sith sorcerer Naga Sadow caused this cataclysmic event to gain his freedom from pursuing Republic warships. With the extravagant power of the dark side, Naga Sadow tore these two stars apart and used giant flares like two slapping hands to crush the fleet behind him."
Zekk nodded again and finally found words.
"Another example of the power of the dark side."
Brakiss smiled proudly at him. "It is a power your friends Jacen and Jaina would never have shown you-much less taught you."
"No," Zekk agreed. "They never would have."
For years, he had been friends with the twin children of Han Solo and Leia Organa Solo. Zekk was just a street kid, though-a nobody, who lived by his wits scavenging items in the dangerous underlevels of the city-covered world of Coruscant.
His hopes for a better life had been little more than dreams until the Nightsister Tamith Kai snatched him and brought him to the Shadow Academy as part of a new recruitment drive.
In an earlier attempt to gain talented candidates, Brakiss had made an error by kidnapping the high-profile trainees Jacen, Jaina, and Lowbacca.
When that failed, he had decided the Shadow Academy might do better with a different sort of person: downtrodden young ones who wouldn't be missed, yet had just as much potential to acquire Jedi powers-and more to gain by swearing allegiance to the Second Imperium.
Zekk had resisted the transformation at first, fighting to stay loyal to his friends. But gradually Brakiss lured him, showing Zekk how to use the Force for one small thing, then another. Zekk discovered that he was strong in the Force, and he learned quickly.
The experience altered his feelings toward the twins from friendship to resentment. Jaina and Jacen had never thought to include him in Jedi testing, though he felt he had as much innate talent as any of their highborn friends. Zekk's main regret in leaving his old life was that he missed his companion, old Peckhum. But now he had much more of a future. Zekk was beginning to understand Jedi powers, and he had already done things he'd never dreamed of.
Gazing at the stormy suns, Brakiss raised his arms to each side, spreading his fingers. His silvery robe flowed around him as if knit from silken spiderwebs. He stared into the swirling flares of the Denarii Nova. "Observe, Zekk-and learn."
Closing his eyes, the Master of the Shadow Academy began to move his hands. Zekk watched through the observation port, his green eyes widening.
The ocean of rarefied incandescent gases between the dying stars started to swirl like arms of fire… writhing, changing shape, dancing in time with the hand motions Brakiss made. The dark teacher was manipulating the starfire itself!
He whispered to Zekk without opening his eyes, without observing the effect of his work. "The Force is in all things," Brakiss said, "from the smallest pebble to the largest star. This is just a glimmer of how Naga Sadow reached out to the stars and delivered a mortal wound five thousand years ago."
"Could you make the sun explode?" Zekk asked in awe.
Brakiss opened his eyes and looked at his young student. His smooth, perfect forehead creased. "I don't know," he said. "And I don't believe I ever want to try."
Zekk remembered the way Brakiss had enticed him to experiment with his innate Jedi powers, by giving him a flarestick and showing how simple it was to draw shapes in the flames with the Force. Here in the Denarii Nova, Brakiss had done the same thing-only on a scale the size of a star system.
Source: From Young Jedi Knights: Lightsabers

Finally, there is the Dark Side Demon Wutzek, who is stated by narration to have enough power to destroy a solar system

But what do these have to do with Sidious and Vitiate in particular? Well, basically: They have no reason to be inferior to these.

Both are constantly described as gods of the Dark Side, beings whose power is unlike anything else in the Galaxy, and greater than any other adept or wielder of the Dark Side of the Force.

I'll show them now:

Vitiate Statements

"The Sith Emperor has mastered the dark side's power to become the most dominating Force-user the galaxy has ever seen."
From (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Codex Entry titled "The Emperor's Fallen Jedi (Knight).")
"The Sith Emperor is the most powerful Force-user who has ever existed. Unless this implacable enemy can be defeated, the Jedi Order is doomed."
From (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia)
"The Sith Emperor, history's most powerful dark side master, performed a ritual of incredible scope to consume the life energy of every being on his homeworld."
From (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia)
"Over 300 years ago, the great Jedi heroes Revan and Malak stumbled upon long-hidden Sith Empire's capital of Dromund Kaas, and its ruler - a mysterious, almost godlike avatar of the dark side."
From (Star Wars: The Old Republic Encyclopedia)
"The Emperor is the dark side incarnate. You wouldn't stand a chance."
From (Emperor's Wrath II, Star Wars: The Old Republic: Shadow of Revan)
"A being of unfathomable power and insatiable appetite, he transcended death multiple times, shedding his physical shells as they were discovered, defeated, and destroyed... only to return in another form."
From (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Knights of the Eternal Throne: Codex Entry titled "The Fall of Valkorion.")
"The Emperor is more than a man - he is the living embodiment of the dark side."
From (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia)
"He was a living embodiment of the dark side of the Force who delighted in destroying the minds and spirits of those Jedi who came too close to him."
From (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Encyclopedia)
"The Emperor was no longer a member of the Sith species; his power and immortality had transformed him into a being unique in the galaxy."
From (Star Wars: The Old Republic: Revan)

The Sith Emperor Vitiate is not merely considered to be the most powerful Dark Side Force user in the whole galaxy's history, but also repeatedly stated to be a living embodiment of the Dark Side.

There is no reason for him to be beneath Brakiss, the Sith Corsair, or Wutzek, and likely the Valley of the Jedi as well (Living Embodiment of the Dark Side > Combined power of 1000s of Jedi)

Now for Sidious, who is even more powerful than Vitiate...

Sidious Statements
Due to the ridiculous amount of statements and explanations of his power, I feel that this should be divided into parts.

Most Powerful Dark Side User

"The Sith have waited millennium for the birth of one who is powerful enough to return them from hiding. Darth Sidious is that one—the Sith's revenge on the Jedi order for having nearly eradicated the practitioners of the dark side of the Force."
The Complete Visual Dictionary
"The Sith Order, in hiding for a millennium, had awaited the birth of one who was powerful enough to return the Order to prominence. Darth Sidious was the fulfillment of that prophecy, capable of exacting the Sith's revenge on the Jedi for having nearly eradicated the practitioners of the dark side of the Force."
The Complete Star Wars Encyclopedia

"Darth Sidious proved to be the grim culmination of a thousand years of Sith philosophy and teachings."
Jedi vs Sith: The Essential Guide to the Force
"When the Sith finally emerged from a thousand years of watching and waiting, they numbered—in accordance with the tradition set down by Darth Bane—only two. The most powerful of these was Darth Sidious, an ice-cold, diabolically calculating genius equipped with the strength of the dark side of the Force, as well as an enormous wealth of Sith artifacts, equipment, and knowledge."
The Dark Side Sourcebook
"Plagueis the Wise, who in his time truly was, except at the end, trusting that the Rule of Two had been superseded, and failed to realize that he would not be excused from it. Plagueis the Wise, who forged the most powerful Sith Lord the galaxy has ever known, and yet who forgot to leave a place for himself; whose pride never allowed him to question that he would no longer be needed."
Darth Sidious, Darth Plagueis
"Beyond the vision of the Jedi Knights, somewhere within the darkness, the greatest master of evil ever to use Sith power bides his time. As his strength grows, his plans begin to shape the course of the galaxy, and his snares await the unsuspecting."
The Complete Visual Dictionary
"Vader imagined the power that could be his if he crushed Palpatine and established his own rule over the Empire. But first, he would need his own apprentice. By himself, he could not hope to defeat the most powerful Sith Lord the galaxy had ever known."
Vader: The Ultimate Guide
"When the most powerful Jedi battled against the most powerful Sith, the two sides of the Force clashed in spectacular style. Grand Master Yoda took on Darth Sidious in the Senate building on Coruscant and proved that strength and power have nothing to do with size."
Jedi Battles
"Emperor Zaarin? The idea isn't as ludicrous as it sounds. Demetrius Zaarin gambled everything on an audacious coup d'état and nearly killed the most powerful Sith Lord the galaxy has ever known."
Insider #66: Who's Who: Imperial Grand Admirals
"With the galaxy now ripe for conquest, the Emperor has become the most powerful Sith Lord of all and a master of the Dark Side of the Force, ordering the extermination of the Jedi Order with the aid of his apprentice, the deadly Darth Vader."
Legends Epic Collection: The Empire Volume 1
"Meet Darth Sidious ― the most powerful Sith Master who ever lived."
Darth Maul, Sith Apprentice
"The Emperor was completely in concert with the dark side of the Force. He was the most powerful Sith who had ever existed."
Death Star
"Yoda was a master at masking his emotions, but not even he could hide them from the greatest Sith Lord ever known."
Clone Wars: Wild Space
"Their clash transcended the personal; when new lightning blazed, it was not Palpatine burning Yoda with his hate, it was the Lord of all Sith scorching the Master of all Jedi into a smoldering huddle of clothing and green flesh."
Revenge of the Sith novelizatio
"Yoda went after Palpatine in the empty Senate chamber, but could not defeat the most powerful Sith Lord in history."
The New Essential Chronology
"When Yoda crosses sabers with the movie's arch-villain, he doesn't launch into a pinwheeling display of acrobatics, as he did against Count Dooku in Episode II. Instead, Yoda faces the dark side's fury, channeled by the most powerful Sith Lord in history. "Rob Coleman wanted Yoda to feel the power of his enemy," says Wheless, "like a force he's never dealt with before.""
Insider #86: Yoda's Right Arm
"Inside the spacious interior of the Galactic Senate chamber, Yoda challenged the Emperor. The two engaged in a spectacular duel—a contest between the most powerful practitioners of the Force's light and dark sides."
The Complete Star Wars Encyclopedia
"The two most powerful users of the Force's light and dark sides clash in a spectacular duel in the Senate building on Coruscant."
Epic Battles
"It quickly became clear to Luke that this decrepit and seemingly defenseless old man was masterfully adept in the ways of the Dark Side of the Force. Indeed, as Vader had warned, the Emperor had become the Dark Side's most powerful expression."
Dark Empire endnotes

Darth Sidious is not only the most powerful Dark Side user in the history of the Galaxy, but also the Dark Side's most powerful expression. Even Master Yoda, the most powerful Jedi in history, was defeated by him.

Also, his power was so great, that this is stated about it:

DestroyingAPlanet
Living Embodiment of the Dark Side
Much like Vitiate, Sidious is also a living avatar of the Dark Side:

"A welter of voices, near and far, present and from eons past, drowned his thoughts. Raised in praise, the voices proclaimed his reign and cheered the inauguration of a new order. Yellow eyes lifted to the night sky, he saw the trembling stars flare, and in the depth of his being he felt the power of the dark side anoint him."
Darth Plagueis
"The dark side had made him its property, and now he made the dark side his."
Darth Plagueis
"Raw emotion was a consequence of leading a double life. While he relished his secret identity, he wanted at the same time for it to be known that he was a being who could not be trifled with; that he wielded ultimate authority; that merely to gaze on him was tantamount to glimpsing the dark matter that bound and drove the galaxy…"
Darth Plagueis
"And then there was Palpatine, of course: he was beyond power. He showed nothing of what might be within. Though seen with the eyes of the dark side itself, Palpatine was an event horizon. Beneath his entirely ordinary surface was absolute, perfect nothingness. Darkness beyond darkness.A black hole of the Force."
Revenge of the Sith novelizatio
"Palpatine affected the simple clothing of a simple man, but drew his powers of persuasion and control from the blackest depths of the dark side of the Force."
The Complete Visual Dictionary
"The Dark Side flowed through him like some primordial ichor and was the key to all his power."
Dark Empire Sourcebook
"But early on, Palpatine learned that addiction to the fathomless energies of the Dark Side carried a great price: age and decay hastened their pace, and his body collapsed toward ruin, like a world oppressed."
Dark Empire endnotes
"Palpatine had become such a creature of the dark side that its powers consumed him. It constantly fed at his core and withered his flesh. The very power that cemented his rule over the galaxy threatened his life, and so he ingeniously turned to technology to cheat death."
The Dark Empire Saga
"The key to Luke's turning is the moment when he and Leia realize the Emperor is no longer defined by his physical form, but has become a chaotic nexus of dark energies that swell and burst open the fabric of space, tearing apart everything in the vicinity, human and machine."
Dark Empire endnotes
"When Luke had been brought before the Emperor, Palpatine's visage had been familiar to him from images that had reached even remote Tatooine, and his inherent power was immediately evident.
The Supreme Overlord, however, was a void Luke could not fathom. He wasn't a shell of a human in a hooded cloak, more energy than flesh. Nor was his face that of a Sith Master, prematurely wizened by years of calling on dark power."
The Unifying Force
"The 10 years that followed were tumultuous, but nothing rivaled Hethir's shock when summoned to the planet Byss to face a miraculously reborn Emperor Palpatine. Hethir re-pledged his loyalty immediately, coming to understand Palpatine not as a man but as a vessel for the darkness of the universe, an avatar of the dark side itself."
Aliens in the Empire, Part II
"When those blades met, it was more than Yoda against Palpatine, more the millennia of Sith against the legions of Jedi; this was the expression of the fundamental conflict of the universe itself."
Light against dark.
Winner take all.
Revenge of the Sith novelizatio
Depowered lampdisks were rings of ghostly gray floating in the gloom. The shimmering jewelscape of Coruscant haloed the knife-edged shadow of the chair.
This was the office of the Chancellor.
Within the chair's shadow sat another shadow: deeper, darker, formless and impenetrable, an abyssal umbra so profound that it drained light from the room around it.
And from the city. And the planet.
And the galaxy.
Revenge of the Sith novelizatio

Also, Sidious' presence turned the planet of Byss into the central nexus of the Dark Side in the whole galaxy, if not the universe:

"The dark side energies that Palpatine and his minions wove about Byss began to leach the life energies of the people. Many had been specifically selected to make this process easier and more fruitful for the Emperor. Slowly, the planet itself became as corrupted as it's people until, as seen from space, Byss seemed to be bathed in an unnatural glow."
Official Starships and Vehicle Collection #64
"Over time, the Emperor's dark side energies slowly corrupted the world and transformed it into one of the most powerful dark side sites in the entire galaxy."
Byss and the Deep Core
"If there is a dark center of the universe, this is it, Artoo…"
Luke Skywalker, Dark Empire
"You think you could conquer me by coming here… to Byss… to the very heart of the dark side!"
Reborn Palpatine, Dark Empire audio drama

Speed Upgrades
This is secondary, but recently these two feats came to notice:

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/U...s_-_Dark_Empire:_The_Speed_of_the_Sith_Spirit

https://vsbattles.fandom.com/wiki/U...-_The_Old_Republic:_Vitiate_Travels_to_Zakuul

When reduced to incorporeal dark-side spirits, both Sidious and Vitiate had displayed the ability to traverse across galactic distances, equating to Massively FTL+ speeds.

Conclusion
Both Lord Vitiate and Darth Sidious need to be upgraded to Solar System level, do to their supremacy in the Dark Side which surpasses everything else in the setting, be them mortal Force Users, or manifestations of the Force (With the obvious exception of The Ones).

They should also be upgraded to Massively FTL+ speeds due to their feats.
 
@Teen

They aren't really barely in all cases. Old Republic characters scale to exaton-level feats.

@Js

Dark Empire Luke, Darth Caedus, Shimrra Jamaane, Mother Talzin, the Hero of Tython, Novel Revan, Arcann, Yoda and Mace Windu out of the top of my head. There may be more, but they're escaping me at the moment.
 
I personally think the likes Legends Vader or Galen Marek should be higher than they are currently. I do vaguely recall that Galen Marek was thought to be comparable to the combined powers of Vader and Sidious at his peak.
 
I wasn't aware, the only justification I saw for her was her encounter with Windu.

Someone should add the Sidious stuff to better justify it. Don't need to give those Vader/Dooku wankers any more ammo.
 
Lol no, he got stomped by a casual Sidious.

@Matt

It's basically Sidious > Talzin but not to the point of a tier gap.
 
DarkDragonMedeus said:
I personally think the likes Legends Vader or Galen Marek should be higher than they are currently. I do vaguely recall that Galen Marek was thought to be comparable to the combined powers of Vader and Sidious at his peak.
He is definitely stronger than Vader. But Sidious? **** no.
 
Sidious casually stomped Starkiller guys.

But I do think that High 4-C / 4-B Mace Windu is very, very weird.
 
One of the profiles literally states that Vader thought an ancient Sith Artifact would help him overpower Sidious, but that this is not the case because Vader doesn't even know Sidious' full power.
 
I wish i could do Sidious versus Emperor of Man...kill the Sith once and for all!!!

Anyways, yeah this looks pretty reasonable for the god tiers like Legends Sidious and such.
 
I mean, he was being electrocuted before that.

Are there any better feats to scale other Jedi to? It feels weird that they're all stuck at Multi-Continent level.
 
It's weird, but it's the best any other Force users have besides a Padawan busting a planet in a non-canon comic.
 
It's pretty that or we get crazy scaling just because of Vader (man Anakin, you really like to **** shit up even in death).

Basically Ever's been making a point over and over on why Vader can't and won't scale. So the ones he pointed out on that scales to this will, others...well that's for what he and others of SW will have to figure that out.
 
Well, pretty much everyone else agrees High 4-C/4-B Vader is ridiculous. But there's one guy (I don't wanna point fingers or name names) who just WON'T let it go.
 
Yeah, no one's scaling Vader to Sidious, just that he's easily higher than the average jedi that scales to the High 6-A feat. But in both the book and in the game, but a friend of mine told me that in the books, Starkiller was knocking Darth Sidious aside and was about to finish him. But the only reason he didn't was because he held back and a giant rock fell on him.

Not sure where he got that from, but the Game did something similar; except it was Force Lightning when Starkiller's guard was down instead of some random giant rock.
 
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