Son Goku vs. Superman (Pre Crisis)

[Angelicus_ONE]

Super Saiyan Blue


Super Saiyan Blue Kaioken x 10


Superman (Pre Crisis)

Round 1) Super Saiyan Blue Goku vs Superman (Pre Crisis); Death Match; No prep;
Round 2) Super Saiyan Blue Kaioken x 10 Goku vs Superman (Pre Crisis) No prep;

Round 3) Super Saiyan Blue Kaioken x 10 Goku vs Superman ( Pre Crisis) 3 day preperations;

Supes at his Peak, not with the SoS

 

[LeopoldTheBrave]

Pre-Crisis Supes, no contest. He has the better powers and hax.

 

[Angelicus_ONE]

Pre Crisis Superman is listed as Tier 3-B at peak, Goku's at 3A with SSBKx10, so..

 

[Cropfist]

Superman takes this with speed and hax.

 

[Wingding341]

Pre Crisis Superman is listed as Tier 3-B at peak, Goku's at 3A with SSBKx10, so..

And Pre-Crisis Supes is listed as Low 2-C with The Sword of Superman, so...

 

[Angelicus_ONE]

Pre Crisis Superman is listed as Tier 3-B at peak, Goku's at 3A with SSBKx10, so..

And Pre-Crisis Supes is listed as Low 2-C with The Sword of Superman, so...

Without the Sword of Superman.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

I think pre crisis still beats goku he has the speed advantage and has hax like time travel and inventing new powers so he could put goku down, goku needs to up his speed to win this.

 

[Angelicus_ONE]

I think pre crisis still beats goku he has the speed advantage and has hax like time travel and inventing new powers so he could put goku down, goku needs to up his speed to win this.

Well, Goku has some impressive feats with speed, that being that he blitzed through frozen time.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

I think pre crisis still beats goku he has the speed advantage and has hax like time travel and inventing new powers so he could put goku down, goku needs to up his speed to win this.

Well, Goku has some impressive feats with speed, that being that he blitzed through frozen time.

Lets not go there this has been argued on this wikia a number of times and its been chalked up as some kind of time resistance as if it wasn't then goku would have infinite speed but thats not the case because a number of things need to be shown for it to be anyway i am not getting into that argument. Goku is at best being generous in the trillions of time ftl and this is using the accepted calc for whis that places whis at like 180 billion times ftl but as we know goku isn't as fast as whis so its not scalable. Superman on the other hand can cross the universe in seconds that's got to be at least in the quadrillion of times ftl.

 

[Derpmaster9000]

I think pre crisis still beats goku he has the speed advantage and has hax like time travel and inventing new powers so he could put goku down, goku needs to up his speed to win this.

Well, Goku has some impressive feats with speed, that being that he blitzed through frozen time.

Lets not go there this has been argued on this wikia a number of times and its been chalked up as some kind of time resistance as if it wasn't then goku would have infinite speed but thats not the case because a number of things need to be shown for it to be anyway i am not getting into that argument. Goku is at best being generous in the trillions of time ftl and this is using the accepted calc for whis that places whis at like 180 billion times ftl but as we know goku isn't as fast as whis so its not scalable. Superman on the other hand can cross the universe in seconds that's got to be at least in the quadrillion of times ftl.

I would like to point out that the calc was low balled and whis was most likely being casual about it.

 

[KazarianFahs]

The fact that goku or literally anyone in DB doesn't have a speed feat of his/her own and all scale from one single travel feat from whis,makes discussing the validity of speed feats in DB a pain,and feats>scaling,even if two chars have similar stats,but one of them is scaled and the other has genuine feats,most of the times the scaled character loses purely because he/she lacks feats of his/her own.

Not to mention general DB speeds are regarded at billions-trillions of C by scaling,while supes goes from billions of C - infinite,with legit feats

 

[RouninOtaku]

Supes takes this

 

[Angelicus_ONE]

If this was Post Crisis Superman, do you think Goku would take him,?

 

[Strmi]

This is too controversial,better just close this

 

[RouninOtaku]

If this was Post Crisis Superman, do you think Goku would take him,?

Goku stomps all versions of Superman except Silver Age, so yes Goku would demolish Post Crisis Supes.

 

[Ryukama]

@Kaz I don't know how many times you need this told to you but powerscaling is a legitamate form of indexing a character's powers. If you can keep up with a character who is capable of going at certain speeds you can go at those speeds as well. Dodging attacks from a MFTL+ character or just managing to not get blitzed is also a feat in of itself.

And no what you said about feats > scaling is not true. If we have a guy who destroyed a planet and a guy who perfectly scales to a planetbuster, no one is gonna go with guy A since he is a "more true planet buster."

 

[CaptainFalcon64]

Superman vs Goku threads are banned, this one will be closed.

 

[KazarianFahs]

@RYU i am quite literally quoting the guy who Did the Whis travel speed calc,this quote is from the Hit vs superman thread

Faisal Shourov - "When has Hit demonstrated MFTL+ Combat speed in DB Super? All his stats come from scaling from Goku, who in turn is scaled from Beerus. Beerus himself has unknown value of MFTL+ combat speed (he surely doesn't fight at 120x billion FTL). It can go both ways. Superman has much more feats honestly"

Again,Powerscaling works when you have an well established and defined feat ladder in a series,which TBH DB seriously abuses and defies.

 

[Ryukama]

@Kaz What does it matter what the creator of that calc thinks about this? The fact that he made the calc doesn't make his opinion any more valid or that his point is now automatically right because of who he is. Also the main issue he had was that he believes combat speed =\= travel speed. Not that he has an issue with power scaling.

Whatever you mean by feat ladder doesn't change that the speed scaling is legitamate. If you can keep up with a MFTL+ being, you are MFTL+. There's really no way to refute that. Not only that but keeping up with someone who moves at MFTL+ speeds is an actual feat.

 

[KazarianFahs]

well,we are detracting from the match here,anyways.

So,what i am basically saying is,supes has far better speed feats and combined with his hax,should take this matchup,with fair mid diff.

 

[Yojimbo1989]

Round 1 - Probably Superman (via speed and hax)

Round 2 - Probably Goku (via power durability and possible resistance to time hax)

Round 3 - Depends if both have prep time or only one of them

But it doesn't matter since this is the definition of a controversial match-up and is almost certainly going to be closed

 

[ShutUp123]

Superman win this due to speed advantage although Goku does have firepower to put away supes but he won't be hitting him in this case and i do think Goku vs Beerus shockwaves had to be done at MFTL+ combat speed.