Son Goku vs Laharl Krichevskoy

[SaiyanWarlordX]

Copy? We go by the profiles here. Most of the movies are not canon. BOG and ROF have been retconned. Willpower won't help him getting haxed to death.

And even in the anime they were in space... -_-

 

[Promestein]

They have been repeatedly stated to be incapable of surviving in space even after that, so it is likely that they were in the high reaches of the atmosphere, not space.

 

[KuuIchigo]

Copy? We go by the profiles here. Most of the movies are not canon. BOG and ROF have been retconned. Willpower won't help him getting haxed to death.

And even in the anime they were in space... -_-

Earth's atmosphere.

 

[SaiyanWarlordX]

starting from the first light speed character which was Raditz.

Raditz is not light speed. That was from a translation and not in the original manga's text. He was did get calced at Sub-rel+, though, and everyone hit FTL by the end of the Frieza Saga, but not Raditz.

Ooh, I was hoping you'd mention that. Ahem, I actually never heard that dubbing error. Nope, I watched Kai Uncut, the closest to the actual version for English Dub. Where I got Raditz being at lightspeed was actually thanks to Goku. You see, during his training with Kami and Popo, Goku was pretty much trained to move faster than lightning. To react just as fast as it, and move faster than it. Lightning itself is 1/3 the speed of light, and Raditz is 3x Goku when they first fought, putting Raditz at lightspeed. A dubbing error that ended up being more correct than they thought, So I went to the largest solid powerlevel I could find that didn't really change during the saga, so Goku first time Super Saiyan was my target. Raditz is a 1200 and SSJ Goku is a 150,000,000 on the power levels, and it's solid power, so the "Powerlevels are bullshit" excuse cannot be use. First Time SSJ Goku is 125,000 times the speed of light, so now we triple it to match up with Buu Saga SSJ Goku, then times it by two for SSJ2, then by 4 for SSJ3, then two million for the Super Saiyan God transformation. Then I times it by fifty for the Super Saiyan Beyond god, then by eight for the Super Saiyan Blue form, and bam. I got my numbers.

 

[Blahblah9755]

So let me guess, you used "math" to find his power level compared to Raditz's and used that to find how fast he was? That would be nice except power levels aren't linear. Super Saiyan multipliers have never been stated to directly apply to speed. And Raditz's isn't FTl.

Ripping a hole in space time is often used as another phrase for creating a portal between "dimensions" like it was used here, and Janemba and his reality warping are still as non-canon to this version of Goku as ever.

 

[KuuIchigo]

That is some multiplier abuse... Regardless of the speed, if you can't show me Goku resisting to Laharl haxs, he ain't winning.

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

Ooh, I was hoping you'd mention that. Ahem, I actually never heard that dubbing error. Nope, I watched Kai Uncut, the closest to the actual version for English Dub. Where I got Raditz being at lightspeed was actually thanks to Goku. You see, during his training with Kami and Popo, Goku was pretty much trained to move faster than lightning. To react just as fast as it, and move faster than it. Lightning itself is 1/3 the speed of light, and Raditz is 3x Goku when they first fought, putting Raditz at lightspeed. A dubbing error that ended up being more correct than they thought

Different sites use different values for lightning, but traditionally, reacting to lightning or something of that ilk is treated as Massively Hypersonic. I also am pretty sure we went over the lightning thing, before. The best calced feat we have for Raditz's level is Sub-Rel+.

 

[Blahblah9755]

Hmhmhmhm... Hmhmhmhmhmhm!... Haaaaaaaahahahahahaha!!!!

Lightning isn't one third the speed of light, power levels aren't linear, unless you want to tell me a farmer with a shotgun is large town level to multi-continent level.

Goku has no feats of being that fast, in fact the feats contradict your "calc" don't they?

 

[SaiyanWarlordX]

So let me guess, you used "math" to find his power level compared to Raditz's and used that to find how fast he was? That would be nice except power levels aren't linear. Super Saiyan multipliers have never been stated to directly apply to speed. And Raditz's isn't FTl.
Ripping a hole in space time is often used as another phrase for creating a portal between "dimensions" like it was used here, and Janemba and his reality warping are still as non-canon to this version of Goku as ever.

Oh yeah, you're right, SSJ were never directed to speed. They were directed to power, speed, durability, ECT. And if I'm wrong tell me exactly what it means when you are three times stronger, faster, and more durable than someone who's as fast as lightning, you aren't as fast as light? Because common sense! You're basically telling me I'm wrong because you don't want me to be right, you can come up with every excuse in the book, but I'm actually doing this correctly. You're just telling me you don't want me to do that. And Janemba is a what if, it's how Goku would react to reality bending, which he actually did very well in, considering Janemba was more powerful than him in every eay.

 

[KuuIchigo]

So far the votes are 5 Laharl, 1 Goku and Cal is leaning towards Laharl and Perp is not voting?

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Oh, I'm not just leaning. This is clearly in Laharl's favor. Like the outdated and no longer relevant SB Janemba victories, Laharl wins via speed and hax lol

 

[ThePerpetual]

I, as the OP, probably shouldn't vote, I'm just here more or less to elaborate, articulate, and provide commentary on points made.

I can provide some pretty hype-inducing music though, if you'd like, one from DBZ and one from Disgaea. Because, you know, music makes any imagined fight scene better.

 

[KuuIchigo]

Well, one more vote and Laharl wins.

 

[CrossverseCrisis]

I'm going by Laharl due to what's been said above already. Mainly due to speed and hax like what Cal said.

 

[SaiyanWarlordX]

That is some multiplier abuse... Regardless of the speed, if you can't show me Goku resisting to Laharl haxs, he ain't winning.

I already have, you aren't accepting it. I can hand you your birthday present to you directly, but if you don't accept it, don't get after me for not getting you anything. And multiplier abuse? Nah, I'm actually playing fair. Goin' by the rules. Doin' it correctly. Reality Bending, Goku can adapt to it. He's done it with Janemba. Time and space attacks, Buuhan was at that level, and SSJ Vegito knocked him down a size. Time freeze was already taken out. Dimension Slash? Simple, two attacks balanced out. An uncondensed full power Kamehameha can do the same thing, only it would probably be in another universe after a sip of juice, And if you think I'm abusing the multipliers... Goku X3 =Raditz X125,000 =SSJ Goku X3 =Buu Saga SSJ Goku X2= SSJ2 Goku X4 =SSJ3 Goku X200,000,000 =God Form Goku X50 =SSJ Beyond god X8 =RoF Blue Goku.

 

[KuuIchigo]

Well, with Cross voting Laharl he wins. I'll add this to the profiles.

 

[SaiyanWarlordX]

Y'know, I'm getting bored, and tired. All I hear is Hax and speed, and even though I give clear points, no one wants the "Overrated" character to win, whatever. In all honesty, this was all just fun and games for me. I know who'd win, and I can't argure against those who don't want to listen. I know there are characters that can beat Goku, but this guy a'int it. He's just another character with unnatural powers, each one Goku has beaten before. I'm out, working on a collab with Animation Rewind.

 

[Blahblah9755]

Lightning isn't 1/3 the speed of light

And power levels aren't linear, unless you mean to say an average farmer is small city level and supersonic, or that master Roshi is relativistic, or some other ridiculous… stuff

 

[ThePerpetual]

Just going to point out that, if no one liked Goku winning ever, there'd not be a whole of twelve different wins on the guy's profile

He seriously has the most of any character on this wiki

 

[KuuIchigo]

Most of what you said, Blahblah has rebutted. Anyway, since this is over, it should be closed.

 

[SaiyanWarlordX]

The return stroke (the current that cause the visible flash) moves upward at a speed of about 320,000,000 ft per second or about 220,000,000 miles per hour (about 1/3 the speed of light). And all power levels before the Cell Saga that were written in the Daizenshu are linear/stable.

 

[Faisal_Shourov]

Oh, I'm not just leaning. This is clearly in Laharl's favor. Like the outdated and no longer relevant SB Janemba victories, Laharl wins via speed and hax lol

LMAO hahahaha

SaiyanWarlordX Goku surviving in space has been debunked like countless times with statements from DBS anime and manga. You are quite biased in your opinion as it appears

 

[Azathoth_the_Abyssal_Idiot]

The return stroke (the current that cause the visible flash) moves upward at a speed of about 320,000,000 ft per second or about 220,000,000 miles per hour (about 1/3 the speed of light).

Just to answer this real quick, the reason different sites have very, veeeeerrrryy different values for lightning is because lightning has an incredibly variable speed based on atmospheric conditions. However, the return stroke is almost always a massive amount slower than that unless is absolut, near 100% optimal conditions.