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Shovel Knight 2-C

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OverlordDonnelly said:
I will only accept 2C Shovel Knight, if PSASBR is deemed canon, which gives us 2C Sweet Tooth, Sir Dan, and God Emperor Parappa.
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Not sure about those but uh... GoW has something juicy coming up on the All-Stars front.

OverlordDonnelly said:
Being serious though, this seems like the epitome of an outlier. There's no explanation for the increase in power, besides one shaky line from Kratos I think? I disagree right now.
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Option A then?
 
LephyrTheRevanchist said:
My guy... I'm not arguing against canonicity. It's 100% canon, I literally even said I knew about it already before this thread.

The point I'm arguing against is scaling to tier 2. You can try to stretch and bend the facts as much as you like, SK as a verse doesn't operate anything beyond tiers 8/7, with their consistent feats being tier 8/7. Thus, an enormous statistical anomaly like suddenly jumping to tier 2 is a text book example of an outlier.
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OverlordDonnelly said:
I will only accept 2C Shovel Knight, if PSASBR is deemed canon, which gives us 2C Sweet Tooth, Sir Dan, and God Emperor Parappa.

Being serious though, this seems like the epitome of an outlier. There's no explanation for the increase in power, besides one shaky line from Kratos I think? I disagree right now.
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I don’t even think this is necesssry to begin with, but there is a direct confirmation of it not being an outlier.
 
Just saying that option D of giving SK a separate key for tier 2 would still make the UES still apply to all of SK verse, since GoW would still be canon to it and vice versa
 
ZillertheBucko said:

I don’t even think this is necesssry to begin with, but there is a direct confirmation of it not being an outlier.
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That's not confirmation of not being an outlier, my guy. Again, an outlier is a statistical thing. You would need to show an actual consistent progression of power within the confines of SK to support the notion of tier 2.

WoG can say whatever, if the verse doesn't support it, it is what it is. And SK does not support it through feats, nor lore.
 
LephyrTheRevanchist said:
That's not confirmation of not being an outlier, my guy. Again, an outlier is a statistical thing.
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Let me just focus on your response here. You say it is not an outlier, and your evidence is that it is a statistical thing, and you say so in response to me bringing up the word of god statement that it was not an outlier. Something’s wrong here, because how does it being statistical debunk my claim? It is a statistical thing, sure, but it was directly confirmed to also not be the case that Kratos was nerfed due to PIS or anything, so it kind of renders it void.
Much more importantly, I’d like to see some anti feats. Can you show multiple instances of shovel knight being incapable of breaking something that he should be able to in a way that debunks him being 2-C? Specifically things that also wouldn’t be debunked by him being 8-C
 
ZillertheBucko said:
Let me just focus on your response here. You say it is not an outlier, and your evidence is that it is a statistical thing, and you say so in response to me bringing up the word of god statement that it was not an outlier. Something’s wrong here, because how does it being statistical debunk my claim? It is a statistical thing, sure, but it was directly confirmed to also not be the case that Kratos was nerfed due to PIS or anything, so it kind of renders it void.
Much more importantly, I’d like to see some anti feats. Can you show multiple instances of shovel knight being incapable of breaking something that he should be able to in a way that debunks him being 2-C? Specifically things that also wouldn’t be debunked by him being 8-C
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We have one single instance of a tier 2 feat.

We have a bunch of instances of tier 8/7 feats.

Tier 2 standouts very weirdly, right? Anything else around it doesn't measure up. That's an outlier.
 
LephyrTheRevanchist said:
We have one single instance of a tier 2 feat.

We have a bunch of instances of tier 8/7 feats.

Tier 2 standouts very weirdly, right? Anything else around it doesn't measure up. That's an outlier.
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AP vs DC, it is quite explicit that only making a small explosion or something isn’t an anti feat, or else literally every time he hits someone without destroying the room they’re in disproves he’s 8-C. The DC rule is specifically created to deal with abuse of outlier claims such as this.
In fact, I can bring up thousands of moments in which he is doing something that’s not 8-C. Wow, it takes TWO hits for him to break a regular stone cube? Or maybe him dying instantly from falling on spikes proves that he’s 9-C, maybe him being damaged by mole knight throwing literal dirt at him is an anti feat? Or maybe not, maybe that’s all stupid and doesn’t prove anything.
Shovel knight has shown the ability to harm a tier 2 character is the bottom line, now show the rest of us something against that.
 
ZillertheBucko said:
AP vs DC, it is quite explicit that only making a small explosion or something isn’t an anti feat, or else literally every time he hits someone without destroying the room they’re in disproves he’s 8-C. The DC rule is specifically created to deal with abuse of outlier claims such as this.
In fact, I can bring up thousands of moments in which he is doing something that’s not 8-C. Wow, it takes TWO hits for him to break a regular stone cube? Or maybe him dying instantly from falling on spikes proves that he’s 9-C, maybe him being damaged by mole knight throwing literal dirt at him is an anti feat? Or maybe not, maybe that’s all stupid and doesn’t prove anything.
Shovel knight has shown the ability to harm a tier 2 character is the bottom line, now show the rest of us something against that.
Click to expand...
Hell, black knight’s meteors don’t even scratch the floor’s polish the tiniest bit.
 
Mr._Bambu said:
The level of psychic recoiling I just withstood upon seeing Tier 2 Shovel Knight proposals is unfathomable, holy ****

I'll try to get to this when I can
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Because english isn't my forte are you accepting or not. Don't mean in this case but if that statement means sth good or bad.
 
Mr._Bambu said:
The level of psychic recoiling I just withstood upon seeing Tier 2 Shovel Knight proposals is unfathomable, holy ****

I'll try to get to this when I can
Click to expand...
KLOL handed me the ammo and I shot that shit at the nearest target

Anyways want me to just pre-emptively put you down for agree with nothing happening and full rejection?
 
yeah it is, alright y'all are worse off than I thought. I'll read the drivel to see if there's something resembling a good reason hidden here.
 
I am convinced that crts are just decided based on rng of which staff gets tagged that just happen to be on the agreeing or disagreeing side
 
LIFE_OF_KING said:
Shovel vs Kratos is more like a antifeat for Kratos then a feat for Shovel

Also, wtf, 3 pages
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4 pages
anyways it can’t be an anti feat for him since it was stated that he’s nerfed.
DaReaperMan said:
4 at this point, but Bambu boutta channel his inner Gordon Ramsay and make sure it stays to only 4 pages lmfao
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I’m about to make it 17 pages next time someone disrespects the godslayer goat shovel knight.
 
32:11 Shovel knight is canon to God of War
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this is not how we handle crossovers, there are countless verses that are "Canon!!!!" to other verses. In a significant enough context you could argue to merge the pages. Without that significant enough context (Cory Balrog saying "totes canon" is not that, for sure), you can't. The God of War shit for Shovel Knight isn't even on every platform the game features in lmao, they aren't owned and written by the same entities. This is lower on the scale of crossover priority than shit like Mr. X from Resident Evil appearing in Monster Hunter.

Crossovers are canon to an extent, but without substantial support in every single department, this shit doesn't fly on the wiki. I'd list myself under the "not canon" option in the OP as that most closely resembles my thoughts on the matter, but Lephyr is also correct in that it would almost certainly still be an outlier for the Shovel Knight to have one (1) 2-C feat of fighting Kratos and then never have anything again, in a currently rather expansive series of games.

TL;DR: Crossover rules say no, even if they didn't this disregards all logic concerning outliers.
 
Mr._Bambu said:
this is not how we handle crossovers, there are countless verses that are "Canon!!!!" to other verses. In a significant enough context you could argue to merge the pages. Without that significant enough context (Cory Balrog saying "totes canon" is not that, for sure), you can't. The God of War shit for Shovel Knight isn't even on every platform the game features in lmao, they aren't owned and written by the same entities. This is lower on the scale of crossover priority than shit like Mr. X from Resident Evil appearing in Monster Hunter.

Crossovers are canon to an extent, but without substantial support in every single department, this shit doesn't fly on the wiki. I'd list myself under the "not canon" option in the OP as that most closely resembles my thoughts on the matter, but Lephyr is also correct in that it would almost certainly still be an outlier for the Shovel Knight to have one (1) 2-C feat of fighting Kratos and then never have anything again, in a currently rather expansive series of games.

TL;DR: Crossover rules say no, even if they didn't this disregards all logic concerning outliers.
Click to expand...
Okay but this isn’t just god of war guy saying it’s canon, it’s god of war guys and literally yacht club saying it’s canon, that makes it come from both sides.
I didn’t even think that it being canon was still up for debate in the slightest.

And no it’s not an outlier, get me some anti feats or get outta here
 
Mr._Bambu said:
this is not how we handle crossovers, there are countless verses that are "Canon!!!!" to other verses. In a significant enough context you could argue to merge the pages. Without that significant enough context (Cory Balrog saying "totes canon" is not that, for sure), you can't. The God of War shit for Shovel Knight isn't even on every platform the game features in lmao, they aren't owned and written by the same entities. This is lower on the scale of crossover priority than shit like Mr. X from Resident Evil appearing in Monster Hunter.

Crossovers are canon to an extent, but without substantial support in every single department, this shit doesn't fly on the wiki. I'd list myself under the "not canon" option in the OP as that most closely resembles my thoughts on the matter, but Lephyr is also correct in that it would almost certainly still be an outlier for the Shovel Knight to have one (1) 2-C feat of fighting Kratos and then never have anything again, in a currently rather expansive series of games.

TL;DR: Crossover rules say no, even if they didn't this disregards all logic concerning outliers.
Click to expand...
Aite. Vote counted. Now we wait for the FRA train. Or not.
 
Mr._Bambu said:
this is not how we handle crossovers, there are countless verses that are "Canon!!!!" to other verses. In a significant enough context you could argue to merge the pages. Without that significant enough context (Cory Balrog saying "totes canon" is not that, for sure), you can't. The God of War shit for Shovel Knight isn't even on every platform the game features in lmao, they aren't owned and written by the same entities. This is lower on the scale of crossover priority than shit like Mr. X from Resident Evil appearing in Monster Hunter.

Crossovers are canon to an extent, but without substantial support in every single department, this shit doesn't fly on the wiki. I'd list myself under the "not canon" option in the OP as that most closely resembles my thoughts on the matter, but Lephyr is also correct in that it would almost certainly still be an outlier for the Shovel Knight to have one (1) 2-C feat of fighting Kratos and then never have anything again, in a currently rather expansive series of games.

TL;DR: Crossover rules say no, even if they didn't this disregards all logic concerning outliers.
Click to expand...
Honestly i thought it'd be an essay

Added vote to OP

So that's 2 for Not Canon, 1 for canon but doesn't scale but is canon, one for 8-C, possibly 2-C, two for solid 2-C, and 3 for a separate key.

Only counting evaluation staff(or other staff) because nobody else matters and knowledgeables are up there for prosperity.
 
Myguy said:
From 8-C to 2-C? Damn

Was kratos going all out against the shovel knight?
Click to expand...
He seemed pretty impressed with SK's skill, and Bruno also confirms it to be the case that SK is just that good.

Honestly I don't care much regardless, hence I am personally neutral.
 
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