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Shovel Knight 2-C

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Lynieryz said:
And I don't know anything about Shovel Knight but are there any anti-feats regarding 2-C? [And I'm not referring to "calculations only reach X" because following this logic Kratos would not be 2-C]
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Not only Kratos has feats, but he also has statements, Shovel Knight, as far as i'm aware, has none.
 
Ped2018 said:
Not only Kratos has feats, but he also has statements, Shovel Knight, as far as i'm aware, has none.
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By the time those responsible have defined that both are canonical, SK has everything you just mentioned by being comparable to Kratos.
 
KLOL506 said:
This is Kratos after he killed himself with the BoO, aka his Fallen God self. No more juicy hax because Hope was given away by his sacrifice. He resurrects due to immortality curse and is now just his Norse self before he gets the Norse hax. Slightly weaker than or on par with that era.
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Well, he still has the concept, vector, soul, etc with all attacks right?
 
Lynieryz said:
By the time those responsible have defined that both are canonical, SK has everything you just mentioned by being comparable to Kratos.
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He quite literally hasn't dawg, Kratos comes out of nowhere, fights him, and then dips, we are provided no more context.
 
Ped2018 said:
He quite literally hasn't dawg, Kratos comes out of nowhere, fights him, and then dips, we are provided no more context.
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And we don't need any more by the fact we know where this fits in GOW's chronological order.
 
Ped2018 said:
Outliers, inconsistencies, etc. are all things that we take into account here, the story is canon? Yes. But does this makes sense from a powerscaling view? No.
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I’m not talking about scaling inconsistencies. I’m talking about story inconsistencies.
 
Zamasu_Chan said:
I’m not talking about scaling inconsistencies. I’m talking about story inconsistencies.
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Oh, i am not arguing that then, i think it has enough confirmation of being canon to GOW, i just think that it is an Outlier at best for Shovel Knight.
 
omegabronic said:
Well, he still has the concept, vector, soul, etc with all attacks right?
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Yes. He has all his innate powers from his Demigod self and then some. He is essentially Norse Kratos but without the Axe, the Spear and the Norse runes, enchantments, amulets, Hilts and shit.

Resistances are all retained from his Demigod, GoW and and Norse keys minus those provided by Hope of course.
 
That would still result in SK Kratos being merged with canon Kratos as they are now the one and the same person, and the Cestus and lightning shit cannot be added to that key.
 
KLOL506 said:
That would still result in SK Kratos being merged with canon Kratos as they are now the one and the same person, and the Cestus and lightning shit cannot be added to that key.
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Yeah, just say that those make the Canon shaky for the reason of possibly
 
to the people saying this is an outlier, I'm not buying it.
It is made very clear over and over again that it's the real deal, so him not having other 2-C feats doesn't really matter. Outlier implies that it's just some sort of one time inconsistency, not something that is insisted on as being canon over and over again.
It's just blatantly true, and we should go all the way with this.
 
ZillertheBucko said:
to the people saying this is an outlier, I'm not buying it.
It is made very clear over and over again that it's the real deal, so him not having other 2-C feats doesn't really matter. Outlier implies that it's just some sort of one time inconsistency, not something that is insisted on as being canon over and over again.
It's just blatantly true, and we should go all the way with this.
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Its not an outlier from the perspective of canonicity. It's an outlier in relation to his in universe feats. You can't sit there and straight face tell me that a character with only 8-C feats fighting a 2-C character isn't the literal definition of an outlier.
 
KLOL506 said:
RN I see three options.

A: No upgrades but it is noted to be canon.

B: 8-C, possibly 2-C route

C: Flat out 2-C

Whatever one is chosen, SK Kratos still gets merged into Canon Kratos. Literally no way we can keep them separate anymore.
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What is your opinion on which option?
 
Ped2018 said:
It is

Shovel Knight being canon to GOW is valid, him scaling to Kratos that it's inconsistent.
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well in the tweets above the Bruno guy seemed to double down on Kratos not being nerfed, saying "shovel knight is just that good"
I'm guessing he's important but I'm not familiar with him
 
Vote tally added to OP, please read the fact that I'm only counting Staff/knowledgeable votes before you start complaining that you're vote isn't up there
 
ZillertheBucko said:
well in the tweets above the Bruno guy seemed to double down on Kratos not being nerfed, saying "shovel knight is just that good"
I'm guessing he's important but I'm not familiar with him
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Bruno is the lead animation director at SMS, one of the head honchos of GoW since at least GoW2. He is best with the power scaling side while Cory himself (director of most of the GoW games minus 3, Ascension and Ragnarok) is the lore guru.

Kratos was weakened due to killing himself, being resurrected and then healing his gaping hole in his torso, yes, but he's still a god with god-level stats for the most part. Not much to argue there.
 
I'm leaning towards B and not opposed to C if enough evidence is brought forth. For A to be a thing we'd have to have a blatant anti-feat within the story of Shovel Knight to prove that Shovel Knight being 2-C is out of the question, but from what I remember I don't see one. That, combined with Bruno doubling down that 'Shovel Knight is just that good', means from an Author perspective he believes Shovel Knight was definitely strong enough to fight Kratos here, which considering he's one of the heads of GoW, increases the likelihood of him scaling to 2-C, as crazy as that sounds.
 
KLOL506 said:
Bruno is the lead animation director at SMS, one of the head honchos of GoW since at least GoW2. He is best with the power scaling side while Cory himself (director of most of the GoW games minus 3, Ascension and Ragnarok) is the lore guru.

Kratos was weakened due to killing himself, being resurrected and then healing his gaping hole in his torso, yes, but he's still a god with god -level stats. Not much to argue there.
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okay then yeah we should just 100% go with the full rating
possibly 2-C is the coward's way out.
 
The_2nd_Existential_Seed said:
I'm leaning towards B and not opposed to C if enough evidence is brought forth. For A to be a thing we'd have to have a blatant anti-feat within the story of Shovel Knight to prove that Shovel Knight being 2-C is out of the question, but from what I remember I don't see one. That, combined with Bruno doubling down that 'Shovel Knight is just that good', means from an Author perspective he believes Shovel Knight was definitely strong enough to fight Kratos here, which considering he's one of the heads of GoW, increases the likelihood of him scaling to 2-C, as crazy as that sounds.
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Honestly I doubt we'd need the "Shovel Knight is just that good" statement regardless. Norse Kratos even without his magics has been hammered down repeatedly to be equal to his GoW self by numerous official sources, at least when going all out (The Norse > Greek stuff is bullshit tho).

Bruno stating this is just icing on the cake.
 
feel like this whole thing is powerscaling brainrot

i gotta ask though, why would Bruno's opinion matter here? Is he a dev of Shovel Knight?
 
Lonkitt said:
I'm more in favour of Shovel Knight being flatout 2-C
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I'm not. In fact I'm in favor of completely rejecting this. Kratos has access to the Nemean Cestus, the Golden Fleece and his Olympian magic. At the end of GOW3 Kratos loses all his magic and weapons. If Bruno says this takes place after GOW3, how does Kratos suddenly have access to them if this game is canon? That literally contradicts the story. GOW3 and Shovel Knight cannot coexist in the same world and make sense at the same time.
Source material >> twitter statements.
 
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