Shinza banshou discussion thread~Revival~

[PrinceofPein]

I would agree, but there’s no reason to believe that the cosmology shrank when all merc did was increase it.

Merc brought into being the concept of infinite spiralling universes, and it won't be merc who destroyed every concept of abyss and sin or higher dimensions that draw power from Judecca it will be sataniel.

 

[Everything12]

Honestly I think we should just shelve this does fourth Heaven have Sefirot stuff. It doesn't change the existence of Higher Dimensions on the canvas, the position of the Singularity, nor if it has depths, nor if Taikyoku Transcends each other.

 

[PrinceofPein]

If I didn’t enjoy the series, I wouldn’t be here lol. Don’t give me that bs.

I don’t have a scan, but all K3 implies is that Mercurius expanded the cosmology further than what was already there. Now, does that mean that it’s still 14D? Not necessarily, but it’s still something to consider.

and again, there are things that are unchanged such as sefirot, which was there ever since mithra took the throne. No matter what Dies Irae would at least be High 1C if not higher.

also, what do you mean by misc? Would it be like a possibly 1A or just bringing back 1A entirely?

And again all these is your own head canon, he increased it by adding infinity universes to it not increase the dimensionality of the universes

 

[PrinceofPein]

Honestly I think we should just shelve this does fourth Heaven have Sefirot stuff. It doesn't change the position of the Singularity, nor if it has depths, nor if Taikyoku Transcends each other.

Exactly, whether it be 14D, 4D or infinite D, the throne is not accessible and not affected by it

 

[Tarang123]

Merc brought into being the concept of infinite spiralling universes, and it won't be merc who destroyed every concept of abyss and sin or higher dimensions that draw power from Judecca it will be sataniel.

It was already there, tho. It’s an integral aspect of the throne, it’s definitely not changing just because of the law overwriting.

 

[Catzlaflame]

Obviously, anything the new god does not want gets removed

Didn’t some1 else say that the structure of PL would stay even after magarison’s death? I was contending the point, mb if i misinterpreted what they said.

I would agree, but there’s no reason to believe that the cosmology shrank when all merc did was increase it.

That’s a false equivalency him increasing the singularity doesn’t mean he increased the size of the “normal” universe

 

[Everything12]

So what's people's opinion on he scan I posted?

 

[Tarang123]

And again all these is your own head canon, he increased it by adding infinity universes to it not increase the dimensionality of the universes

Bruh, this is literally headcanon vs headcanon, and you contradicted yourself. Infinite universes for a smaller dimensionality isn’t expanding the cosmology, it’s downgrading it, which Mercurius never did

 

[Tarang123]

Didn’t some1 else say that the structure of PL would stay even after magarison’s death? I was contending the point, mb if i misinterpreted what they said.

That’s a false equivalency him increasing the singularity doesn’t mean he increased the size of the “normal” universe

I didn’t say that, he expanded the cosmology by taking rule, not through the singularity

 

[Tarang123]

So what's people's opinion on he scan I posted?

Could you send it again?

 

[Tarang123]

Exactly, whether it be 14D, 4D or infinite D, the throne is not accessible and not affected by it

Welp, time to upgrade shinza to 1A ig

 

[Everything12]

Could you send it again?

You just have to scroll up, it's hard to miss.

 

[Tarang123]

You just have to scroll up, it's hard to miss.

Alr

 

[PrinceofPein]

It was already there, tho. It’s an integral aspect of the throne, it’s definitely not changing just because of the law overwriting.

Wait what?
Did you just say law of infinite universes and loop was in the throne before merc?
Now.you are just pulling stuffs out of the air

Bruh, this is literally headcanon vs headcanon, and you contradicted yourself. Infinite universes for a smaller dimensionality isn’t expanding the cosmology, it’s downgrading it, which Mercurius never did

Nothing I said is head canon. The laws of the former gods gets erased and the structure of the world also gets erased based on the new god and only what the new god wants stays so this is pointless when you bring proof we will talk.

So what's people's opinion on he scan I posted?

I need more stuffs about singularity layers

Welp, time to upgrade shinza to 1A ig

That would be for others to decide

 

[Everything12]

I though you had enough information on the layers itself, I was just hunting for stuff that stated the Singularity was outside the Laws.

 

[Tarang123]

Wait what?
Did you just say law of infinite universes and loop was in the throne before merc?
Now.you are just pulling stuffs out of the air

Nothing I said is head canon. The laws of the former gods gets erased and the structure of the world also gets erased based on the new god and only what the new god wants stays so this is pointless when you bring proof we will talk.

I need more stuffs about singularity layers

That would be for others to decide

So…you can’t read? I said sefirot was there even throughout different heavens.

 

[Everything12]

Just showsthe scans a pbout the Sefirot being in multiple Heaven's or tell us what scene they can be found in. I really want this pointless argument over with.

 

[Tarang123]

Just showsthe scans a pbout the Sefirot being in multiple Heaven's or tell us what scene they can be found in. I really want this pointless argument over with.

It’s in one of the blogs that you linked earlier, but I’ll show it a bit later.

 

[Everything12]

“The feeling on one's skin is due to this colorless and transparent blank area. The darkness within had little effect on the Yakou.

It was as transparent as water.

Or like a sterile box that was thoroughly cleaned. While humans embody "nothingness" they also possess the potential and versatility to grow in any way they choose.

Is there a bottom?

For a sane person, you can't help but think about the sight. Just like how humans fear the vastness of the ocean, here as well, will spread even with such a half-hearted intent (?)

This unchanging space that continues forever. A colorless taiji that cannot become a medicine nor poison, simply existing. Those who are gigantic but do not assert themselves seemed to arouse the fear of the viewer.

That's what Yakou thought. This is a world only permitted by those of the divine.

The mind of any ordinary human cannot bear this transparency. It's similar to dropping a sugar cube onto freshwater that sinks into the continent. Naturally, the sugar will melt and there won't be a sweet taste in the water.

However, that is the convenience of ordinary people. By crossing over the line this place will sprout, transforming into a new world.

That is---the possession of taiji. Only those who obtain Hadou are allowed to paint everything within the present world even the very sky and thus creating a new reason. However, only one color is permitted. No god can stand side by side. Those of Gudou may not know, but Hadous are not allowed to coexist less they destroy the native occupants.

That is the reason why Yakou has come here, it is to sought after Taiji however at the same time, not one primarily on Hadou

To weave our other shells to be stronger and going deeper into the depths. Retaining our reason and eventually reaching the end.”

Basically the Singularity is a colourless Realm beyond the Canvas the Gods paint Creation on, and only those Gods themselves can enter this Realm.

 

[Tarang123]

Basically the Singularity is a colourless Realm beyond the Canvas the Gods paint Creation on, and only those Gods themselves can enter this Realm.

Yeah, in fact only an actual god can even interact with the space. They even say something about how gods can create new reasons which could be good supporting evidence in the conceptual manip.

 

[Ningenron]

A god cannot die outside the singularity as they cannot leave the throne and they can only interfere with the world through shades

We literally have been told that whatever events at the singularity do not affect the world thus when the god dies, the universe and souls remain.

 

[Tarang123]

Just showsthe scans a pbout the Sefirot being in multiple Heaven's or tell us what scene they can be found in. I really want this pointless argument over with.

https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/vsbattles/images/b/b4/First_Devi1.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/1000?cb=20180318110144

It says something about how Mithra could take Judecca for herself when everyone else was fighting for it, albeit I think it's likely best to wait for the new light novel as it will likely give far more detail about it.

 

[Tarang123]

We literally have been told that whatever events at the singularity do not affect the world thus when the god dies, the universe and souls remain.

To add on to this, Mercurius blatantly states this as it's the only real reason why he wanted Marie to kill him in the Twilight Beach as it wouldn't affect the rest of reality. Now, does it make much sense? Not exactly. The Throne itself is "part" of the singularity and yet Mercurius dying there could very well destroy the entire world, doesn't exactly make much sense, but whatever.

 

[Tarang123]

And we know from the fanbook that sefirot is something encompassed by the Throne.

Q: セフィロトツリーやアビスなどの高次世界は、 第三天以降の世界でも存在しているのでしょうか? また、これらは座の支配領域なのでしょうか? それとも特異点なのでしょうか?

A: あれらセフィロトツリーとか言っていたものが、イコール太極へ至る高次域への道行きです。王冠なりジュデッカなり、頂点なり底なり言われていたものが太極座。

Do higher worlds such as the Sefirot Tree and the Abyss still exist in the world of the Third Heaven and beyond? Also, are they the dominated areas of the Throne? Or are they Singularities?

The thing you call as the Sefirot Tree is equivalent to Taikyoku in that they are paths which lead to higher places. The Crown (Keter) and Judecca can be called the Top and Bottom of the Taikyoku Throne (太極座/Taikyouku-za).

 

[Everything12]

Image broke.

 

[Tarang123]

Image broke.

which image?

 

[Everything12]

Mithra one.

Also the Twilight Beach might be less because the Singularity and more because its the Realm of a Gudou God separate from the rest of the Throne God's Heaven.

 

[Tarang123]

Mithra one.

Also the Twilight Beach might be less because the Singularity and more because its the Realm of a Gudou God separate from the rest of the Throne God's Heaven.

Oh, my bad, I think it's better to just link the entire blog since the explanation is already there.

That's true, but the singularity itself is detached from the god's law, so ig you could argue that a dead god there wouldn't really affect Creation that much.

 

[PrinceofPein]

We literally have been told that whatever events at the singularity do not affect the world thus when the god dies, the universe and souls remain.

Yes and so?

That would Only happen if the god died outside the Singularity tho

You said this and I am saying throne gods cannot leave the throne area anyway so they cannot die outside it

https://static.wikia.nocookie.net/vsbattles/images/b/b4/First_Devi1.png/revision/latest/scale-to-width-down/1000?cb=20180318110144

It says something about how Mithra could take Judecca for herself when everyone else was fighting for it, albeit I think it's likely best to wait for the new light novel as it will likely give far more detail about it.

Judecca, sephiroth, keter are just words for throne

 

[Tarang123]

World of the Throne Gods

vsbattles.fandom.com

This is the link to that blog, so the scan should be there.

 

[Tarang123]

Yes and so?

You said this and I am saying throne gods cannot leave the throne area anyway so they cannot die outside it


Judecca, sephiroth, keter are just words for throne

Judecca and Keter make up the top and bottom of the Throne, so they're not merely substitutes for it.

 

[Tarang123]

Yes and so?

You said this and I am saying throne gods cannot leave the throne area anyway so they cannot die outside it


Judecca, sephiroth, keter are just words for throne

I'd also point out that gods can technically still have that affect by sending their shades to said realms, which would also work, which is exactly what he does in Marie's route to die at Marie's hand. His true form existed at the Throne, while a shade, Cagliostro, was sent down. Marie could have very well destroyed both the shade and the True form, so just some evidence for type 9 immortality negation.

 

[PrinceofPein]

Judecca and Keter make up the top and bottom of the Throne, so they're not merely substitutes for it.

Do you even know what judecca and keter represent in PL?

 

[Everything12]

Can we just agree to disagree, this is clearly not heading anywhere and does this minor point actual change anything about the characters Tiering or anything like that?

Anyway, what's people's opinions on using the scans I provided to prove that the Singularity is beyond the Heaven's of the Gods and thus the Higher Dimensions of the Sefirot and the like (1-A)

 

[PrinceofPein]

Can we just agree to disagree, this is clearly not heading anywhere and does this minor point actual change anything about the characters Tiering or anything like that?

Anyway, what's people's opinions on using the scans I provided to prove that the Singularity is beyond the Heaven's of the Gods and thus the Higher Dimensions of the Sefirot and the like (1-A)

I agree with the singularity been above any extension done to the multiverse

 

[Tarang123]

Do you even know what judecca and keter represent in PL?

I know...but that's literally what Masada says...

 

[PrinceofPein]

I know...but that's literally what Masada says...

Yes and he did not change anything please read PL before making assumptions, keter and judecca are both words for part of the throne
Keter exist on the top of the tree of life which consisted of another 8 Spehira. This is called Heaven, in which positive Quintessence flows. On another end lies Judecca, the bottom of the reverse side of Sephirot, also called The Abyss. Negative Quintessence or Sin flows here, hence all of Sin gravitated toward the abyss.
Keter is the top of the Sephirot Tree where the God resides, while Judecca is at the bottom of the abyss, also called "God's dumpster". You know where he dumps all the sins

 

[Tarang123]

Yes and he did not change anything please read PL before making assumptions, keter and judecca are both words for part of the throne
Keter exist on the top of the tree of life which consisted of another 8 Spehira. This is called Heaven, in which positive Quintessence flows. On another end lies Judecca, the bottom of the reverse side of Sephirot, also called The Abyss. Negative Quintessence or Sin flows here, hence all of Sin gravitated toward the abyss.
Keter is the top of the Sephirot Tree where the God resides, while Judecca is at the bottom of the abyss, also called "God's dumpster". You know where he dumps all the sins

ie. the top and bottom of the Throne lol. Nothing you said is contradictory to what I said as Sefirot is an integral aspect of the Throne.

 

[PrinceofPein]

Anyway I would post my revisions later this week

 

[Tarang123]

Anyway I would post my revisions later this week

Wait, explain where this would put them? At least Low 1C to countless 1B? Or are you going to bring in the 1A argument?