PrinceofPein
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space thing fro which era?
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Shinza banshou discussion thread~Revival~
- Thread starter Grand_Saver_Ritsuka
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Where did you get the idea (or more like, what's the statement) that it was a source Pre Throne Era? The entire plot of Mithra's story is that Taikyoku isn't a thing yet (and Sirius' law which is technically getting rid of it would have turned everything back to pre Throne Era).
I mean, we do get more stuff regarding Throne and co in Avesta, such as a dude being turned into geometrical stuff or whatever.
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Pre Throne.
PrinceofPein
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Well it is a speculation and we would know more with the pre throne era story coming soon, but clearly Taikyoku was born in the Zero Era because Mitra has it., then we dont know how but taikyoku is not granted by the throne alone as opposed to what was shown/said in the series also which supported that Godhood was possible outside of the Throne like Mercurius. so it wont make sense for the throne to be before the taikyoku, it will be taikyoku before the throne
oh the naraka rangers and mithra
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It is implied that Hado comes from Naraka in Avesta iirc. Merc is a bug so that's different I would say.
But the Throne itself doesnt grant Taikyoku yeah.
Yup
PrinceofPein
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Yes also, as long as the throne system is been operated, they will all operate under Mithra commandment.
But i just wish all of masada works can be translated, honestly instead of creating a new game so soon he should just get the curent ones translated first and the money from that can be used for games. cause i am psyched and tired of taking fluff pieces and MLT versions. Also pre throne era is coming in October iirc
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Taikyoku/Big Bang/Atziluth is just a way to describe ascension a God, and Taikyoku value is just a number used to describe the strength of their Craving. So we do know where they come from, emotions and its origin is from Mithra's Commandment.
As for the Naraka bit
As for the Naraka bit
Naraka's thing might have inspired Hadou, but it's also something else entirely.
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It's the next web novel story after Avesta of Black and White.
The peeps on spacebattles might disagree with that.
(you should read the previous pages before p.114 lol)
PrinceofPein
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yes but there is taikyoku outside the throne system that was what i was implying since i dont see how the naraka's or mithra buit someting like the throne without taikyoku and also merc coming from outside the throne system/universe already possessing taikyoku
So naraka transcend the gods and the hierachy nice, consistent with the hardware and software analogy used
Anyway what happens if we get solid statement of taikyoku predating existence? not just statements like it is the source of reality which can be translated in different ways
PrinceofPein
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thanksIt's the next web novel story after Avesta of Black and White.
it is just my own speculation according to what the story has been implying and also no one is sure currently, so we are waiting on the author but unless they think it was the throne that created taikyoku then they are most likely wrong
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PrinceofPein
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it comes down top.113, from the person who translate the glossary of the web novel
which one came first taikyoku or throne
i am with taikyoku comes first like it has been implied
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You are really caught up on Taikyoku. It's just a term used in one of the Thrones to describe the process of someone become Gods, the powers they possess as a God, and the natural Laws they birth through those powers. Taikyoku value is simply their strength, their Craving described in a way that's easy to understand with all the Gods that were running about it that work.
It's one of those things that are technically important to the story but you shouldn't be surprised if Masada only gives it passing footnotes about certain aspects of it as they focus on the actual story.
As for the creation of the Throne. Super advanced technology and Origin Coordinates (Naraka), there doesn't have to be any Taikyoku/Big Bang/Atziluth involved at all with its making, only its function.
It's one of those things that are technically important to the story but you shouldn't be surprised if Masada only gives it passing footnotes about certain aspects of it as they focus on the actual story.
As for the creation of the Throne. Super advanced technology and Origin Coordinates (Naraka), there doesn't have to be any Taikyoku/Big Bang/Atziluth involved at all with its making, only its function.
PrinceofPein
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nah when i say taikyoku, i mean big bang, taikyoku and all the terms that has been used to refer to it throughout the series. And the nature of the throne does not really make sense for them to create a technology so advanced that it will encompass the entire creation and its layers without some sort of magic behind it, that magic will be taikyoku
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Why does it not make sense? What has led you to believe that it doesn't make sense? Its easily to comprehend that with the super amazing technology we have been told the Pre-Throne era has combined with the knowledge they gain from the Origin Coordinates that sure they can make some sort of Hyper-Dimensional Realm through which to recreate the World creating based on the strength of an individual whose mere existence would destroy said World.
It sounds to me that you have some preconceived notion that Taikyoku is the end all and be all and that it's not possible the Throne couldn't be made without it. And while that's true to an extent, it's not so vital to the setting that everything has to revolve around it and that impressive feats can't be achieved without it or to manipulate it. Just look at Satanael's creations and the Pre-Throne was firmly stated to be beyond his trchnology level.
It sounds to me that you have some preconceived notion that Taikyoku is the end all and be all and that it's not possible the Throne couldn't be made without it. And while that's true to an extent, it's not so vital to the setting that everything has to revolve around it and that impressive feats can't be achieved without it or to manipulate it. Just look at Satanael's creations and the Pre-Throne was firmly stated to be beyond his trchnology level.
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Dude, we know that Taikyoku wasn't a thing. It is litteraly stated that Sirius' law would put things back to Mithra's era.
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It seems more logic to me too. Not to mention that while it likely got retconned, Masada said the Throne technology was the result of space-time scientific shenanigans; going under the idea that it wasn't Taikyoku-based.
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One of the reasons Naraka causes the Heavens to change being so that their technology level does not reach the level of the Pre-Throne era, and that when talking about creating the Throne their technology level is even talked about should make it clear that advanced technology has some part to play.
Seeing as the Origin Coordinates is the goal of the Pre-Throne era, that Naraka was stated to inspire the Hadou that the Throne relies on, and that Naraka is simply Naraka, it makes sense that their existence also contributed in some way.
I don't see why it's hard to understand that these two things could lead to the Throne's creation. Especially when it's clear that Taikyoku is nothing more than emotions and desire made into power. It might lead to the creation of the World and its Laws, but it's nothing more than a power derived from individuals' twisted wants, and nothing more mystical than that.
Seeing as the Origin Coordinates is the goal of the Pre-Throne era, that Naraka was stated to inspire the Hadou that the Throne relies on, and that Naraka is simply Naraka, it makes sense that their existence also contributed in some way.
I don't see why it's hard to understand that these two things could lead to the Throne's creation. Especially when it's clear that Taikyoku is nothing more than emotions and desire made into power. It might lead to the creation of the World and its Laws, but it's nothing more than a power derived from individuals' twisted wants, and nothing more mystical than that.
PrinceofPein
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i am a bit confused, is it not stated that it was because of them encountering Naraka that the throne came to be and they gained their said powers or can you answer this question
who is Naraka?
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There's "two" Naraka. Mithra's gang and an unknown entity.
Taikyoku is technically just the power of the soul, which Mithra's commandment made avaiable across all era.
We just don't know enough things yet, but we know Taiji (at very least its Hado form) wasn't a thing before the 1st Heaven
Taikyoku is technically just the power of the soul, which Mithra's commandment made avaiable across all era.
We just don't know enough things yet, but we know Taiji (at very least its Hado form) wasn't a thing before the 1st Heaven
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Who or what Naraka is, is a question we are all asking, but considering their whole stick is they are an Eldritch Abomination even worse than Mercurius we aren't getting that anytime soon.
As for Naraka being the Origin of their powers and the Throne. I mean it was already stated that Hadou; which the Throne can't function without, was inspired by it, that the Throne was created to keep Naraka outside of creation, and that there are deeper layers in the Throne devoted to keeping the Souls of the residents of the Heavens so they can be used to create the army to fight Naraka. Plus the whole emotion-based power system the Gods work on (Taikyoku) being created by Mithra because she was salty that Naraka just noped what she believed to be the strongest power.
Yeah Naraka is a vital part of the Throne's creation
As for Naraka being the Origin of their powers and the Throne. I mean it was already stated that Hadou; which the Throne can't function without, was inspired by it, that the Throne was created to keep Naraka outside of creation, and that there are deeper layers in the Throne devoted to keeping the Souls of the residents of the Heavens so they can be used to create the army to fight Naraka. Plus the whole emotion-based power system the Gods work on (Taikyoku) being created by Mithra because she was salty that Naraka just noped what she believed to be the strongest power.
Yeah Naraka is a vital part of the Throne's creation
PrinceofPein
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oh well now i get this part better, Naraka that made mithra and gang go crazy is connected to the Origin cooridnates?
But fighting something that made all of them go crazy just by seeing a fraction of him seems like a fool's errand, so basically merc likely came from outside where naraka is a thing into throne a place that stops naraka from interferring with creation?
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Naraka was found by Mithra and her companions at the Origin Coordinates.
PrinceofPein
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Where can i read all these, i just started avesta tho is it in avesta or atwiki or another source?
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They went insane from it, if I'm not mistaken.
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PrinceofPein
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thanks, i will check it out
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Speaking of which, do you know the truth about what Muzan is yet?
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forums.spacebattles (Trexalfa, Asvatereta, Fabtastic Glasses.
Fanverse Boomy/Boomster, Trexalfa, Porshion).
They're less into power levels and more about the lores and story.
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Given how the web novel payment stuff work, he's definitely making a lot.
Seems he is making a lot of money from his subscribers
If you want to keep money, the VN may be a better option to take.
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Isn't he like a Mado God or something like that? A mix between Hadou and Gudou
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It isn't a kind of god, but is as strong as one. And unlike Hajun which is an actual mix, Muzan just isn't Hado nor Gudo, just pure killing.
PrinceofPein
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he would get more subscribers if they can be translated to english i mean i will subscribe and may more from what i know, Does anyone know How much does translation cost?
Seems he is making a lot of money from his subscribers
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You would get 500 dollars or so for (VN) translations which are between (approximatively) 15k and 30k words.
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So about Muzan. Magsarion for spoiler reasons can gather the Prayers (Cravings/Sins) of those he kills into himself, and through that, he creates a path completely different to the Transcendence/Hegemony paths previously know, called Madou.
Hadou is washing over everything with your own desire. Gudou is isolating yourself from everything else with your desire. Hajun desires to isolate himself by washing away everything else. Madou however is Magsarion encountering everything one by one and taking their individual desires into himself. (I don't think he ever reaches Godhood through this path though, and he needed to kill everyone so the World was narrowed down only to himself to reach the Throne.)
However, when he reached Mithra she fought back by creating an infinite number of herself... And Magsarion mowed them down like grass with his power that reached the Gods, but no matter how many killed there was more to come, and as he fought the ones previously defeated would revive. In the meantime, Mithra would be birthing Everyone and one day there would be a new Hadou candidate who would come and break this stalemate.
To get around this he created a fourth "Commandment" solely from his own power to remodel his previous Commandments into something new that did not rely on Avesta. He then cloaked himself in the Prayers of those he killed, including those who were Hadou (one who reached Big Bang but whose Commandment contradicted their Craving those weakening them, and the other who was killed an instant before reached Big Bang) to become a Hadou God himself, and creating a World filled with the Prayers (Sin) of those he cloaked himself in. Meanwhile, his own personality lay deep in Muzan until it was needed again.
Hadou is washing over everything with your own desire. Gudou is isolating yourself from everything else with your desire. Hajun desires to isolate himself by washing away everything else. Madou however is Magsarion encountering everything one by one and taking their individual desires into himself. (I don't think he ever reaches Godhood through this path though, and he needed to kill everyone so the World was narrowed down only to himself to reach the Throne.)
However, when he reached Mithra she fought back by creating an infinite number of herself... And Magsarion mowed them down like grass with his power that reached the Gods, but no matter how many killed there was more to come, and as he fought the ones previously defeated would revive. In the meantime, Mithra would be birthing Everyone and one day there would be a new Hadou candidate who would come and break this stalemate.
To get around this he created a fourth "Commandment" solely from his own power to remodel his previous Commandments into something new that did not rely on Avesta. He then cloaked himself in the Prayers of those he killed, including those who were Hadou (one who reached Big Bang but whose Commandment contradicted their Craving those weakening them, and the other who was killed an instant before reached Big Bang) to become a Hadou God himself, and creating a World filled with the Prayers (Sin) of those he cloaked himself in. Meanwhile, his own personality lay deep in Muzan until it was needed again.
Also, Nadare is a Pseudo-Gudou God with the whole her body is the Universe thing and Bhavan atomised her when he met her (she Regened because of the Immortality of the place they were in) and this was before he fought Magsarion and Kvarenah (granted Magsarion's Commandments means that likely wasn't his base stats)
PrinceofPein
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oh thats fairly okay after i converted it to my currency i thought it was in thousands, anyway thats okay at least i can save up for that. so to get a translator for KKK all i need is 500$ it is dream come true would not mind if he said $1000 at least now the game would be playable
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Hm, K3 is waaaaay beyond 15k/30k words.
What I said is the length of a VN which can be done in like, 2 hours? 5 if you are reaaaally slow? Shinza VNs are in the 70 hours in comparison.
And that's without including the fact that you would need a new interface, since you can't just write text the way K3 did, needing changes in the VN's system; that japanese is still, well, japanese and others factors.
