SCARLET WITCH AND THE GRIEVER Revisions

[BunBun]

Yeah, watched it, both statements don't add anything substantial.

What—? Did you discuss with Yoko before watching The interview? The video clearly matches what Yoko stated. I really feel sorry for him having to answer the same thing over and over againT^T.

 

[Excellence616]

Thinking about it again, i disagree with the upgrade.

1. All Abstracts in their Omniversal Form are larger than the Multiverse.
2. You were right about Griever being able to control her destructive powers since Abstract in their Universal Form cam decide how powerful they want to be. Which is already stated on all of their profiles (Varies up to Low 1-A)
3. Most cases, when describing Abstracts in their Universal Form, they describe them using their Omniversal attributes.

I can see a Low 1-A, far higher with Immeasurable Speed

 

[FentyBeauty]

Ok—ok— even English isn't Yoko's first language ,his grammar is pretty clear tho-, but be for real, why did these discussions take so longT^T? Yoko even got confirmation from the Scarlet Witch's writer himself, yet people still try to downgrade her to fighting the Griever (Universal-state). Why can’t they just accept that the author has confirmed that she is the Griever (Omniversal-state)? The scan he got is pretty clear tho^-^.

( Should I refer to Yoko as 'he'? ,-,. )

i meannn sometimes authors can say things that dont line up with story logic or they dont know what they be talking abt

and idk if this is relevant to my point but i remember from a tik tok abt that same steve orlando guy tweeting that wanda didn’t gain chthon’s powers from absorbing him even tho in the darkhold omega it said she took his powers for herself- maybe i just misinterpreted it or he’s just saying stuff that don’t even go along with what he wrote

also even if he said that it rlly was omniversal griever u still have to think abt the contradictions and inconsistencies that come along w that and there r already points given in this thread abt how there would be problems if the griever in the comic was her omniversal self

i dont have much knowledge abt marvel abstract stuff either but i think the stuff abt their universal forms n multiversal forms i could understand a little so in this case i believe wanda was fighting universal griever since i dont think that their fight was on a very huge or multiversal level

 

[Roirr]

Steve Orlando: Hello there

If the author has already confirmed it—like the writer himself confirmed—why are you still disagreeing? Isn’t the interview clear— T^T Like-- You all wanted confirmation about the Omniversal-Griever, and Yoko found and provided it to you. Even though you got what you wanted, you still disagree. What’s the problem.-.? I'm just curious.

I explained 2 times above why he can't be an omniversal griever, man, you can go and read it. The fact that the author calls him an omniversal griever (which he doesn't) doesn't change the contradiction I presented to you.

Abstracts can use their powers in a certain proportion, yes this is true. But our brother who opened the crt threw a scan showing that griever used all his power. As a result, earth 616 or the local multiverse did not collapse. So it is very clear that it is M body or universal griever.

Stop ignoring the contradiction I mentioned

 

[Roirr]

I disagree High 1a Wanda because I don't think it is the multiversal form of griever in the event in question, while the multiversal forms of lord chaos and master order are in superflow of the dreamspace in the ultimates event. they state that they cannot use their powers in normal space because it will damage space

Griever's multiversal form is hierarchically much larger than that of Lord chaos and master order because in the ff 2018 series he was shown to be equivalent to never queen and multi Eternity

So if Wanda literally fought the true griever, the space they were in, the universe, and possibly the local multiverse would have to collapse.

I agree low 1a scarlet witch and imme speed.

.

 

[Yokoahh5743]

Thinking about it again, i disagree with the upgrade.

1. All Abstracts in their Omniversal Form are larger than the Multiverse.
2. You were right about Griever being able to control her destructive powers since Abstract in their Universal Form cam decide how powerful they want to be. Which is already stated on all of their profiles (Varies up to Low 1-A)
3. Most cases, when describing Abstracts in their Universal Form, they describe them using their Omniversal attributes.

I can see a Low 1-A, far higher with Immeasurable Speed

Sorry for interrupting, but what about the Waiting Room?

•The Waiting Room was crafted by Chaos magic. Chaos magic is much more than just magic- it's the concepts of Chaos and freedom. Since all magic relies on Chaos magic, it makes sense that she could establish a new location for the seat of magic to lives and grows(this could be an example of an upgrade for the magic). The mutants' souls were able to cross to the White Hot Room because they chose the pathway in the Waiting Room that led them there (this explains the similar clouds observed at the edge of the White Hot Room). The Waiting Room is described as a space between life and death, reflecting Chaos magic's nature as a force moving between these states, which aligns with the concepts embodied by the White Hot Room itself.

The Waiting Room exists on the Outside, as Storm can reach to the Mystery by choosing the pathway, the Tower, within the Waiting Room.

All of this should make the Waiting Room ' Likely H1-A '?

•The Scarlet Witch also threaten to the Grand Designs, the concepts of how all things begin and end, and is able to handle The Edge of reality. Should this make her 'Likely H1-A'?

•In series the Griever’s nature is a conceptual being that exists on the Outside ,the Void, beyond even the bounds of the Cosmos, if this is her Universal-state,should her universal-state be considered '1-A, Likely H1-A'?

 

[BunBun]

i meannn sometimes authors can say things that dont line up with story logic or they dont know what they be talking abt

and idk if this is relevant to my point but i remember from a tik tok abt that same steve orlando guy tweeting that wanda didn’t gain chthon’s powers from absorbing him even tho in the darkhold omega it said she took his powers for herself- maybe i just misinterpreted it or he’s just saying stuff that don’t even go along with what he wrote

also even if he said that it rlly was omniversal griever u still have to think abt the contradictions and inconsistencies that come along w that and there r already points given in this thread abt how there would be problems if the griever in the comic was her omniversal self

i dont have much knowledge abt marvel abstract stuff either but i think the stuff abt their universal forms n multiversal forms i could understand a little so in this case i believe wanda was fighting universal griever since i dont think that their fight was on a very huge or multiversal level

So you’re saying that fans know more than the author himself? If the author initially stated who appears in their series, that information shouldn’t be discussed.Like-- he discribed about the Griever (Omniversal) and you saying that is Universal-state?? BRO?! WHAT?! And wasn’t Steve Orlando’s intention for all the Wanda fans to focus on the fact that she gained freedom, not power? She’s free from Chthon. Isn’t that the whole point of what he’s saying?

 

[BunBun]

I explained 2 times above why he can't be an omniversal griever, man, you can go and read it. The fact that the author calls him an omniversal griever (which he doesn't) doesn't change the contradiction I presented to you.

Abstracts can use their powers in a certain proportion, yes this is true. But our brother who opened the crt threw a scan showing that griever used all his power. As a result, earth 616 or the local multiverse did not collapse. So it is very clear that it is M body or universal griever.

Stop ignoring the contradiction I mentioned

Wasn't she supposed to destroy the world by unleashing the portal-source to bring about its gradual destruction? If she claimed she could control her destructive energy and her power, what’s the issue? She is the end, she knows how to end things bro- ,-,. She even stated that she is superior to all abstract entities(Universal) combined, they will meet her end in someday.By your logic, even if this was her Universal form, the universe would be gone by now. The point is that you don't accept that she can control her destructive power.SHE IS THE END BRO—SHE KNOWS WHEN AND HOW TO END THINGS ><!!!.

 

[Yokoahh5743]

As for the higher dimensions, the characters in the event you mentioned (Blue marvel, tigra, america chavez, loki,) travel to much higher planes than themselves, to the layers of sephirot.

First out of the cosmos. Then to the white hot room. Then to the abyss. And finally the house of ideas. They completed their journey into mystery without any damage from these layers, so this is definitely not something that gives high 1a, this is not the first time we've seen this in Marvel. Also a lot of the characters I mentioned above. Solar or lower level.

Sentry's event takes place in the uncanny avengers event.

Lord chaos la master order's multi forms (omniversal forms for you to understand) say that we cannot use our powers in normal space, this will damage the space/universe

Griever is an abstract like Lord chaos and master order. But hierarchically it is much higher than them. It is on the same level with Multi Eternity.

As for the scan you posted, this supports what I said on the contrary because it states that griever started to use all his power. If there was an omniversal griever, earth 616 and the local multiverse would collapse instantly. .D

I already told you the reason for this.

I will be honest too: you are ignoring me again. Please don't disregard the text I've provided above. I don’t want to say the same thing again and again .

In Defenders: Beyond, all the Defenders needed to fight high beings from the Mystery to reach another plane. It wasn’t easy, and they were able to reach the Mystery because of God of Stories Loki's protection spells and Eternity help. They clearly aren’t solar level, as Loki was able to battle the Beyonder. Also, you haven’t provided the panels where Sentry reaches the White Hot Room yet.

• The Griever used her power to destroy the world, as she stated. Why didn’t you understand this simple context? She can control her power. She embodies the concept of destruction itself, so why wouldn’t she be able to control her destructive force?

 

[Yokoahh5743]

Like, out of sheer curiosity, where does she say she can control her power? Not to say she ever had trouble with it ever before. She had a problem with focusing on small targets back in FF, and she still has the same problem, which is why she uses those giant constructs, to focus her powers. Here she states that she will destroy the planet and does nothing, so...

Plus, do you realise what would've happened if an Omniversal being tried to enter Eternity? Oblivion stated that him directly entering reality would cause an unimaginable catastrophe, and Griever is either compatible or stronger than him.

••When did she use her machines to control her destructive power in FF? And how is this not controlling her destructive power when she stated she never used her full potential, not until that panels,according to the scan I showed ?

• She just opened source of destructive force to slowly annihilate the world, and it was stopped by the Scarlet witch.

•You shouldn't compare the Griever to Oblivion; the Griever serves Oblivion.

 

[Yokoahh5743]

•I’m really confused. If the Griever is an entity that exists on the Outside, even in her Universal-state, why shouldn’t she be considered 'Likely H1-A'? Even Those Who Sit Above in Shadow, another entity that exists on the Outside, are classified as H1-A.

•the Never Queen also mentioned the Griever who appeared in the series to be the end of all creation, and exists along with her outside space-time.I have never seen other Omniversal- beings referring to an Universal-abstract entities on Omniversal-state. Please I answer this ,I have asked for this many times.

 

[MrKerf]

••When did she use her machines to control her destructive power in FF? And how is this not controlling her destructive power when she stated she never used her full potential, not until that panels,according to the scan I showed ?

She didn’t. Back in FF she was struggling with using her powers on lesser being, which Reed explained as hard as killing microorganisms. Here she used those machines to focus on one settlement, but those were broken.

She just opened source of destructive force to slowly annihilate the world, and it was stopped by the Scarlet witch.

She has no reason to do it slowly, the Universal Griever back in FF was destroying Franklin’s entire realities.

•You shouldn't compare the Griever to Oblivion; the Griever serves Oblivion.

Even in your own scan - she doesn’t claim that, only that she will be there when Oblivion swallows Eternity in the end of all things.

And in general - Oblivion exists outside Eternity, the Griever’s true form is supposed to be comparable to the Never Queen, who is far greater.

 

[Yokoahh5743]

She didn’t. Back in FF she was struggling with using her powers on lesser being, which Reed explained as hard as killing microorganisms. Here she used those machines to focus on one settlement, but those were broken.

She has no reason to do it slowly, the Universal Griever back in FF was destroying Franklin’s entire realities.

Even in your own scan - she doesn’t claim that, only that she will be there when Oblivion swallows Eternity in the end of all things.

And in general - Oblivion exists outside Eternity, the Griever’s true form is supposed to be comparable to the Never Queen, who is far greater.

•She had a reason. In 'FF,' she stated many times that she would end the 616 universe, but she didn't do it. I think it's the writers' plan that makes the series feel engaging.


•In the series, the Griever's domain is the Void. She is also described as an endless nothingness. And guess who embodies the Void and nothingness? Oblivion.

 

[Roirr]

I will be honest too: you are ignoring me again. Please don't disregard the text I've provided above. I don’t want to say the same thing again and again .

In Defenders: Beyond, all the Defenders needed to fight high beings from the Mystery to reach another plane. It wasn’t easy, and they were able to reach the Mystery because of God of Stories Loki's protection spells and Eternity help. They clearly aren’t solar level, as Loki was able to battle the Beyonder. Also, you haven’t provided the panels where Sentry reaches the White Hot Room yet.

• The Griever used her power to destroy the world, as she stated. Why didn’t you understand this simple context? She can control her power. She embodies the concept of destruction itself, so why wouldn’t she be able to control her destructive force?

The fact that he uses his destructive power doesn't change the contradiction I was talking about because you threw a scan showing that griever uses all his power. So you proved that this is not omniversal griever

In the ff 2018 event, the mere appearance of the omniversal griever on earth caused the sky to shatter.

You call the one in sw 2024 an omniversal griever, and you also throw a scan showing that the griever uses all his power. But earth 616 or the local multiverse does not collapse. Some things shouldn't be hard to understand.

As for the Sentry event, I gave you the context, it is mentioned in the uncanny avengers event.

I never called gos loki a solar level, Don't take my words out of context. That was for characters like america chavez or tigra, which are even lower level characters than solar. If going out of the cosmos was h1a, these two characters would be h1a now.

The case of the twasis is different, there are scans that show that they are independent of the function of the cosmos and characterize them as beyonders.

 

[Roirr]

Sorry for interrupting, but what about the Waiting Room?

•The Waiting Room was crafted by Chaos magic. Chaos magic is much more than just magic- it's the concepts of Chaos and freedom. Since all magic relies on Chaos magic, it makes sense that she could establish a new location for the seat of magic to lives and grows(this could be an example of an upgrade for the magic). The mutants' souls were able to cross to the White Hot Room because they chose the pathway in the Waiting Room that led them there (this explains the similar clouds observed at the edge of the White Hot Room). The Waiting Room is described as a space between life and death, reflecting Chaos magic's nature as a force moving between these states, which aligns with the concepts embodied by the White Hot Room itself.

The Waiting Room exists on the Outside, as Storm can reach to the Mystery by choosing the pathway, the Tower, within the Waiting Room.

All of this should make the Waiting Room ' Likely H1-A '?

•The Scarlet Witch also threaten to the Grand Designs, the concepts of how all things begin and end, and is able to handle The Edge of reality. Should this make her 'Likely H1-A'?

•In series the Griever’s nature is a conceptual being that exists on the Outside ,the Void, beyond even the bounds of the Cosmos, if this is her Universal-state,should her universal-state be considered '1-A, Likely H1-A'?

Waiting room being the source of magic does not make it high 1a, there are many different sources of magic in marvel,

Darkhold
Book of vishanti
Crimson cosmos
Asgard
Universel Eternity
And many other things... with this logic it becomes high 1a, which is absurd in itself. So the fact that the waiting room is the source of magic doesn't make it h1a.

As for the concept of a primordial chaos, you can scale it to 1a in certain contexts, but I have not yet seen an argument for h1a.

 

[MadeByZiggy]

OP cooked icl.

 

[BunBun]

Chaos magic is much more than just magic—it's freedom. Chaos magic is pure chaos and freedom, The concept that exists in the Land of Can-Be-Shall-Be. This makes sense to me^-^, considering that the Scarlet Witch created the Waiting Room on the same plane as the White Hot Room. She learned to create the Waiting Room in a place where Chaos exists. the White Hot Room represents life and death, and Chaos is a force moving between these states, as Yoko has stated.This make sense.

Talking about primordial chaos, it should be H1-A, as it is stated to be chaos, possibility and freedom itself, which are concepts that exist in the Land of Can-be-Shall-be.

Maybe Oblivion should be compared to Chaos as the Chaos King’s being one aspect of his infinity. The Chaos King is the embodiment of Chaos that exists before existence itself. He was born out of the primordial void (chaos), which suggests that Oblivion might be the creator or embodiment of Primordial Chaos.Maybe it's time for Oblivion to be second only to TOAA again ^-^.

 

[Excellence616]

Sorry for interrupting, but what about the Waiting Room?

•The Waiting Room was crafted by Chaos magic. Chaos magic is much more than just magic- it's the concepts of Chaos and freedom. Since all magic relies on Chaos magic, it makes sense that she could establish a new location for the seat of magic to lives and grows(this could be an example of an upgrade for the magic). The mutants' souls were able to cross to the White Hot Room because they chose the pathway in the Waiting Room that led them there (this explains the similar clouds observed at the edge of the White Hot Room). The Waiting Room is described as a space between life and death, reflecting Chaos magic's nature as a force moving between these states, which aligns with the concepts embodied by the White Hot Room itself.

She made the Waiting room with the help of Legion, Polaris and Proteus.

The Waiting Room exists on the Outside, as Storm can reach to the Mystery by choosing the pathway, the Tower, within the Waiting Room.

The Waiting Room is a pocket dimension that existed in a liminal space between life and death.

All of this should make the Waiting Room ' Likely H1-A '?

Nope, it's a pocket dimension that connects.

•The Scarlet Witch also threaten to the Grand Designs, the concepts of how all things begin and end, and is able to handle The Edge of reality. Should this make her 'Likely H1-A'?

This scan already disapprove of High 1-A because of the fact that The Griever is using a weapon

•In series the Griever’s nature is a conceptual being that exists on the Outside ,the Void, beyond even the bounds of the Cosmos, if this is her Universal-state,should her universal-state be considered '1-A, Likely H1-A'?

No Abstracts in their Universal state can be 1-A, Likely High 1-A

 

[Yokoahh5743]

Waiting room being the source of magic does not make it high 1a, there are many different sources of magic in marvel,

Darkhold
Book of vishanti
Crimson cosmos
Asgard
Universel Eternity
And many other things... with this logic it becomes high 1a, which is absurd in itself. So the fact that the waiting room is the source of magic doesn't make it h1a.

As for the concept of a primordial chaos, you can scale it to 1a in certain contexts, but I have not yet seen an argument for h1a.

•The point is that The Waiting Room exists on the Outside. The mutants' souls were able to cross to the White Hot Room because they chose the pathway in The Waiting Room that led them there, which explains the similar clouds observed at the edge of the White Hot Room. The Waiting Room is described as a space between life and death, reflecting Chaos magic's nature as a force moving between these states ,which aligns with the concepts embodied by the White Hot Room itself. This alignment suggests that The Waiting Room might be on the same plane as the White Hot Room, as it can serve as a route to the realm.

What do you think about this?

•And when did those artifacts or realms, or whatever they are, become the seat of magic?Maybe the Darkhold might be, as it is stated to be crafted from Chaos magic, and all magic requires Chaos magic. Wanda, as the living Darkhold, also created a new location for magic to live and grow on the Outside.

 

[Yokoahh5743]

The fact that he uses his destructive power doesn't change the contradiction I was talking about because you threw a scan showing that griever uses all his power. So you proved that this is not omniversal griever

In the ff 2018 event, the mere appearance of the omniversal griever on earth caused the sky to shatter.

You call the one in sw 2024 an omniversal griever, and you also throw a scan showing that the griever uses all his power. But earth 616 or the local multiverse does not collapse. Some things shouldn't be hard to understand.

As for the Sentry event, I gave you the context, it is mentioned in the uncanny avengers event.

I never called gos loki a solar level, Don't take my words out of context. That was for characters like america chavez or tigra, which are even lower level characters than solar. If going out of the cosmos was h1a, these two characters would be h1a now.

The case of the twasis is different, there are scans that show that they are independent of the function of the cosmos and characterize them as beyonders.

• In the Scarlet Witch 2024 run, the Griever also caused the dimensional tear.

•They were protected by Loki's spells. Do you get it? This is why I have to say the same thing over and over—you clearly haven’t read all the information I’ve provided. Those Who Sit Above in Shadow, another entity that exists on the Outside, is classified as H1-A. The Outside is where Lifebringer Galactus cannot endure for long, which is one reason why they are classified as H1-A'.

 

[Roirr]

•The point is that The Waiting Room exists on the Outside. The mutants' souls were able to cross to the White Hot Room because they chose the pathway in The Waiting Room that led them there, which explains the similar clouds observed at the edge of the White Hot Room. The Waiting Room is described as a space between life and death, reflecting Chaos magic's nature as a force moving between these states ,which aligns with the concepts embodied by the White Hot Room itself. This alignment suggests that The Waiting Room might be on the same plane as the White Hot Room, as it can serve as a route to the realm.

What do you think about this?

•And when did those artifacts or realms, or whatever they are, become the seat of magic?Maybe the Darkhold might be, as it is stated to be crafted from Chaos magic, and all magic requires Chaos magic. Wanda, as the living Darkhold, also created a new location for magic to live and grow on the Outside.

• In the Scarlet Witch 2024 run, the Griever also caused the dimensional tear.

•They were protected by Loki's spells. Do you get it? This is why I have to say the same thing over and over—you clearly haven’t read all the information I’ve provided. Those Who Sit Above in Shadow, another entity that exists on the Outside, is classified as H1-A. The Outside is where Lifebringer Galactus cannot endure for long, which is one reason why they are classified as H1-A'.

"Dimensional tear." It's open-ended. As for the white hot room, that sounds like a hypothetical. Also, residing in the outside or going to the realms there does not make you h1a, I have already explained the reasons for this. The fact that you reply to some of my messages and ignore others shows your current situation

 

[BunBun]

"Dimensional tear." It's open-ended. As for the white hot room, that sounds like a hypothetical. Also, residing in the outside or going to the realms there does not make you h1a, I have already explained the reasons for this. The fact that you reply to some of my messages and ignore others shows your current situation

I think you're the one ignoring it. He clearly stated that the Defenders can enter the Outside because they receive protection spells from Gos Loki (Yoko stated twice, and you keep insisting that the Defenders are solar level.Bro- read the context).The Outside is a plane where Lifebringer Galactus cannot endure for long, which is why most entities that reach the Outside ' H1-A '.

 

[Roirr]

I think you're the one ignoring it. He clearly stated that the Defenders can enter the Outside because they receive protection spells from Gos Loki (Yoko stated twice, and you keep insisting that the Defenders are solar level.Bro- read the context).The Outside is a plane where Lifebringer Galactus cannot endure for long, which is why most entities that reach the Outside ' H1-A '.

No, never h1a and never will be. With this logic, characters like quasar or sentry become h1a, but I'm not sure how much sense this makes to you anymore. I did not call the Defenders team solar level, I explained that situation.

You talk about ignoring it stubbornly, but you can't answer the contradiction I mentioned. The griever in Sw 2024. İs Not the omniversel griever.

 

[BunBun]

No, never h1a and never will be. With this logic, characters like quasar or sentry become h1a, but I'm not sure how much sense this makes to you anymore. I did not call the Defenders team solar level, I explained that situation.

You talk about ignoring it stubbornly, but you can't answer the contradiction I mentioned. The griever in Sw 2024. İs Not the omniversel griever.

Maybe they would if they did it after The Ultimates 2016& Defenders:Beyond events, which explain more about Marvel cosmology^-^. Also, when did the Sentry go to the WHR?

 

[Yokoahh5743]

She made the Waiting room with the help of Legion, Polaris and Proteus.

The Waiting Room is a pocket dimension that existed in a liminal space between life and death.

Nope, it's a pocket dimension that connects.

This scan already disapprove of High 1-A because of the fact that The Griever is using a weapon

No Abstracts in their Universal state can be 1-A, Likely High 1-A

•She created the Waiting Room before Legion, Polaris, and Proteus arrived. They later helped her cast a new spell that created a pocket dimension connected to the Eldritch Orchard(the true Waiting Room that exists on another plane of existence), known as the Waiting Room.

• It still exists on the Outside, as Storm and Other mutants can reach to the Mystery by choosing a path in the Waiting Room, which led them there.That's why similar clouds from the Waiting Room can be seen at the edge of the White Hot Room.

•Sorry if I made it unclear, but I’m not talking about the Griever being H1-A. I’m referring to Wanda’s ability to battle the Edge and potentially threaten the grand design.

•If the Universal state couldn’t be H1-A, should it be her Omniversal state?

 

[Antvasima]

Thinking about it again, i disagree with the upgrade.

1. All Abstracts in their Omniversal Form are larger than the Multiverse.
2. You were right about Griever being able to control her destructive powers since Abstract in their Universal Form cam decide how powerful they want to be. Which is already stated on all of their profiles (Varies up to Low 1-A)
3. Most cases, when describing Abstracts in their Universal Form, they describe them using their Omniversal attributes.

I can see a Low 1-A, far higher with Immeasurable Speed

I think that this seems to make sense. Thank you for helping out.

 

[BunBun]

•She created the Waiting Room before Legion, Polaris, and Proteus arrived. They later helped her cast a new spell that created a pocket dimension connected to the Eldritch Orchard(the true Waiting Room that exists on another plane of existence), known as the Waiting Room.

• It still exists on the Outside, as Storm and Other mutants can reach to the Mystery by choosing a path in the Waiting Room, which led them there.That's why similar clouds from the Waiting Room can be seen at the edge of the White Hot Room.

•Sorry if I made it unclear, but I’m not talking about the Griever being H1-A. I’m referring to Wanda’s ability to battle the Edge and potentially threaten the grand design.

•If the Universal state couldn’t be H1-A, should it be her Omniversal state?

Waiting for this to be discussed, since the information about the Waiting Room from Excellence616 is completely wrong.>_<

 

[BunBun]

Sorry for interrupting, but I have found new information that suggests this might be the Griever's Omniversal-state, not her M-body. What do you think about it?(I also wanted to get an opinion from MrKerf and ProfectusInfinity.)

•6:09:The author also confirmed that the Griever in this series is the embodiment of the end of everything.

•7:14 In this series, the Griever is the one who will end the Cosmos. When the concept of Death vanishes and everything is obliterated, she will be the one to bring it all to nothingness. She will be the one there- to do it. So it's clearly her Omniversal-state not an M-body. Just like when she was drawn to Eternity.

Many of you are ignoring the fact that the author and the Never Queen explicitly stated that the Griever is in her Omniversal state, not Universal state. You shouldn’t use your opinions against what the author has stated about her. The author clearly said it is her Omniversal state, yet you still refer to it as her Universal state. Like-- seriously?

 

[Roirr]

Many of you are ignoring the fact that the author and the Never Queen explicitly stated that the Griever is in her Omniversal state, not Universal state. You shouldn’t use your opinions against what the author has stated about her. The author clearly said it is her Omniversal state, yet you still refer to it as her Universal state. Like-- seriously?

We gave you the reasons for this, but you did not understand. Treating it as an omniversal griever contradicts cosmology.

But Sure sure.The mommy is h1a of course...
.D

 

[ProfectusInfinity]

Many of you are ignoring the fact that the author and the Never Queen explicitly stated that the Griever is in her Omniversal state, not Universal state. You shouldn’t use your opinions against what the author has stated about her. The author clearly said it is her Omniversal state, yet you still refer to it as her Universal state. Like-- seriously?

How many times are we gonna hear this argument? Her name is literally "Griever at the End of All Things." Being called the "end of everything" absolutely, definitely, 100% means absolutely nothing since that's her name. How on earth can she not be described as the end of all things? The author at that given time stamp just said "she's the end of everything."

 

[BunBun]

How many times are we gonna hear this argument? Her name is literally "Griever at the End of All Things." Being called the "end of everything" absolutely, definitely, 100% means absolutely nothing since that's her name. How on earth can she not be described as the end of all things? The author at that given time stamp just said "she's the end of everything."

" the Griever is destined to end the Cosmos. When the concept of Death vanishes and everything is obliterated, she will be the one to bring it all to nothingness. "


Is it hard to understand that this statement clearly refers to her Omniversal state?

 

[BunBun]

We gave you the reasons for this, but you did not understand. Treating it as an omniversal griever contradicts cosmology.

But Sure sure.The mommy is h1a of course...
.D

What reason is there to challenge the author's ideas about who appears in the series? She's the end she knows when and how to end things.

Ohhh!! OMG!! I get it now why you always ignored!!!Thank you so much for doing this. It clearly shows why you want to downgrade her so much- because you're biased.

Your opinion is 0% reliable given that it stems from biased behavior.

 

[Antvasima]

The author may not be well-informed about Marvel's Manifestation Body system set up by Mark Gruenwald, or the universal fragments system further defined by Al Ewing. Marvel Comics writers are frequently less well-informed about the mechanics of the established cosmology than we are.

Also, we should preferably rate our characters by what has been established in the stories, not in unofficial private social media statements.

 

[BunBun]

We gave you the reasons for this, but you did not understand. Treating it as an omniversal griever contradicts cosmology.

But Sure sure.The mommy is h1a of course...
.D

And stop replying to these revisions if you're being biased. It's not good behavior, it wastes people's time. If someone like the replies, you should recognize that their comments stem from biased behavior. It's not a fact, it's a falsehood .

 

[BunBun]

The author may not be well-informed about Marvel's Manifestation Body system set up by Mark Gruenwald, or the universal fragments system further defined by Al Ewing. Marvel Comics writers are frequently less well-informed about the mechanics of the established cosmology than we are.

Also, we should preferably rate our characters by what has been established in the stories, not in unofficial private social media statements.

The problem isn't just with the author's ideas. The Never Queen also stated that the Griever is truly the end of all creations and exists alongside her ,outside space-time ,as a sister. What seems to confuse Yoko, and probably me, is when an Omniversal being referred to her sister as a Universal being on the Omniversal scale?

 

[Antvasima]

Yes, the full scale Griever entity does that, but that does not mean that she entered reality in her entirety, especially as that would likely destroy it.

 

[Roirr]

And stop replying to these revisions if you're being biased. It's not good behavior, it wastes people's time. If someone like the replies, you should recognize that their comments stem from biased behavior. It's not a fact, it's a falsehood .

I'm not prejudiced or anything. You're just talking for the sake of talking.

If the author says 2+2= 9128, will you accept it? Because that's how you are talking right now.

The author's statement never changes the contradiction with cosmology, I have stated this 3/4 times in this thread but neither you nor the person who opened the crt could refute it.

 

[BunBun]

Yes, the full scale Griever entity does that, but that does not mean that she entered reality in her entirety, especially as that would likely destroy it.

But it's not going to change the fact that the Never Queen refers to the Griever Omniversal state, who is in the town.And Wanda, as the Ultimate Nexus, has the power to stop her ,stop the concepts of what will be. The Griever has stated many times that she knows when to end; the time of the end hasn't arrived yet. She embodies the concepts of destruction and the end itself, so why wouldn't she be able to control it? She is the solution for how all things begin and how all things end.

 

[Roirr]

But it's not going to change the fact that the Never Queen refers to the Griever Omniversal state, who is in the town.And Wanda, as the Ultimate Nexus, has the power to stop her ,stop the concepts of what will be. The Griever has stated many times that she knows when to end; the time of the end hasn't arrived yet. She embodies the concepts of destruction and the end itself, so why wouldn't she be able to control it? She is the solution for how all things begin and how all things end.

Bro is really uses quaro.

Just because Wanda is a solution for this does not mean that griever is the omniversal griever.

 

[BunBun]

Bro is really uses quaro.

Just because Wanda is a solution for this does not mean that griever is the omniversal griever.

Use 'quaro' and then what? Your behavior is something I've never seen- quite toxic.

You have to reread what I replied again and again because you clearly don't understand the point.