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Sage Monarch Changes

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Muchacho_mrm

Muchacho_mrm

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Transduality Type 2:​


Currently, Ying & Yang has been accepted by staff as this:
Click to expand...
Dao existed pre-creation during primordial chaos and we see through this that Yin & Yang is just a branching aspect of the Dao.

Pre-ascension Yang Qi became the ten great daos, concepts that represent unity, duality and so on. Which would be TD2 for his first key.

Concepts were swirling within his heart.

Sage, Monarch, Ruler, Emperor, Sovereign, Lord, Hero, Hegemon, God, Nothing.

Ten daos.

They represented that which was perfect and preeminent: the unity of one, the duality of two, trinity of three, four divisions, five phases, six directions, seven stars, eight trigrams, nine palaces, and the completeness of ten.

The ten great daos of the many heavens.

In that moment, Yang Qi became like a sage, and at the same time, a monarch, a ruler, and a king. He was an emperor, a sovereign, a lord, a hero, a hegemon, and ambitious and ruthless. With one thought, he could shake all heaven and earth, and dominate everything that existed. He could achieve a dao of gods and become the ultimate ruler. - Chapter 1128



一道道的法则,流淌在心中。

“圣！”“王”“君”“皇”“帝”“主”“雄”“霸”“神”“无”。

这是十道。

代表着十全十美,就如一元,两仪,三才,四象,五行,六合,七星,八卦,九宫,十全一样。

诸天十道,为至极。

杨奇瞬息之间,觉得自己可以成为圣人,也可以成为王者,更能够成为君王,君子。又可以成为皇,成为帝,成为主,成为雄,英雄,枭雄,都在一念之间,更能够称霸天地,霸主凌尘。又可以成为神道,最后成为无道。- Chapter 1128
Click to expand...

Said Daos being inconsequential to Gods.


Transduality Type 3:​


As for the Gods, they enter a Buddhist state of enlightenment, a realm called nevasaññānāsaññāyatana; perception and non-perception. Anyways, King Immortal-Slayer is explaining enlightenment regarding the annulled and he ends up explaining nevasaññānāsaññāyatana:

“Consummate enlightenment,” King Immortal-Slayer said. “With one thought, flowers bloom. With one thought, trees wither. With one thought, life and extermination. With one thought, nirvanic rebirth. Remember, your thoughts are your everything. What you imagine in your sea of consciousness is true and real. You must come to understand what is true and real, and what is empty and void. Understand what are thoughts and what are not thoughts. This is called Nevasaññānāsaññāyatana, which is neither perception nor non-perception. It is a world, an expression of space-time, a place with neither desire nor physicality, a miraculous thought. Your fleshly body is surrounded by a world that doesn't exist. It is not thought. Yet it isn’t a lack of thought.” - Chapter 1275
Click to expand...

I'll try to break it down.




In this state (as visually illustrated below), they exist in a liminal state -- a state of being in which they exist in the realm of being perceivable and yet, outside of it, at the same time.
fV5Dklj.png



The next piece makes it clear that nevasaññānāsaññāyatana has no physicality to it: "a place with neither desire nor physicality".





The next quote: "It is not thought. Yet it isn’t a lack of thought.”.


2sS0FTv.png










Later MC got BFR into nearly this state (this isn't even the true extent of Nevasaññānāsaññāyatana). Through him we find out that people in Nevasaññānāsaññāyatana not only vanish from the reality, it makes reality nothing more than a dream:
However, his joy quickly faded as he realized that he didn’t know how to return from this state. If he couldn't return, it made reality like little more than a dream. This wasn’t the half-Annulled level. After all, in that level, it was supposedly possible to freely enter and exit the state of Nevasaññānāsaññāyatana. - Chapter 1516
Click to expand...
Technically r>f statement, however, it is not at the same time. It is paradoxical as it is one of the three realms, the realm that is neither true nor illusory, neither perception nor non-perception.

“Marquis Three Realms?” Yang Qi knew that in the god world, the ‘three realms’ were different than what people generally viewed the three realms to be. Normally, those three realms were the impure lands, immortal worlds, and god world. But in the god realm, things were different. The three realms referred to: the true realm; the illusory realm; and the realm that was neither true nor illusory. They were three realms that essentially represented reality, imagination, and Nevasaññānāsaññāyatana, that which was neither perception nor non-perception. - Chapter 1435
Click to expand...

The bottom diagram should illustrate it:

SfiWhSw.png


Which should be enough for Transduality Type 3 for the Gods. However I should state that this part is currently pending Ultima_Reality's input regarding whether or not we draw the line on r>f statements regarding transduality.



I believe they should also be a layer into TD 3 at-least.

A Half-Annulled God went deeper into Nevasaññānāsaññāyatana to avoid truly dying after being absorbed and became undetectable and incomprehensible to another of the same realm and Yang Qi was only able to sense him because of his circumstance:

Yang Qi exhaled slowly as he saw Proud Heaven reaching the half-Annulled level. He knew the truth: King Immortal-Slayer wasn’t dead. In the very last moment, he had entered an incomprehensible state of existence that not even Proud Heaven could be aware of. But Yang Qi was aware of it. King Immortal-Slayer wouldn’t be King Immortal-Slayer if he were that easy to slay. - Chapter 1560
Click to expand...

Because Yang Qi had ordained King Immortal-Slayer as his imperial preceptor, he was connected to the destiny of the Sage Monarch Empire. And because of that, Yang Qi was able to sense that he wasn't gone. He was in a state that surpassed even Nevasaññānāsaññāyatana, yet wasn’t the Annulled level. -1560
Click to expand...

I say at-least because the next realm they're all trying to reach is the Annulled level and the Annulled level transcends Nevasaññānāsaññāyatana. If the above is accepted as a layer, then Annulled should probably be the second layer.




Plot Manipulation/Armour:​



Protagonists gain plot manipulation due this CRT. Granting DT characters it and one Sage Monarch character plot armour. However, Yang Qi should also qualify as his Destiny value was unknown until recently, however his destiny value is great enough to make him a protagonist with plot armour:

Despite thinking that he understood many of Yang Qi's changes, he still couldn't fathom his potential. Yang Qi is a living "protagonist," and every time he faces a crisis, he is blessed by a mysterious power. He doesn't know what this mysterious power is, but every time, he turns danger into safety and averts disasters.

This is the terrifying extent of Yang Qi's state.

In the depths of the unknown, destiny favours him, while fate does not seem to exert its influence on his life, making it impossible for people to grasp the trajectory of his fate. Looking at him, it's as if he is an invincible monster, and no one knows when he will erupt completely. - Chapter 1126

尽管他自以为把握到了杨奇很多变化,但是杨奇的潜力,他仍旧无法把握到,杨奇此人就是一个活生生的“主角”,每一次到达危机关头,都会受到一种神秘力量的眷顾,他也不知道这神秘力量到底是什么,反正杨奇每一次都会逢凶化吉,化险为夷。

这就是杨奇的恐怖境界。

冥冥之中,一股气运在眷顾他,命运不加持在他的身躯上,使得人无法把握他命运的轨迹。傲天看着此人,就好像打不死的怪胎,不知道什么时候会彻彻底底爆发出来。- Chapter 1126
Click to expand...



Agree: Rakih_Elyan, Setsuna_tenma, Unqver, Fixxed (Agrees with possibly TD3 for Annulled), Elizhaa (Plot Armour & TD3 Gods), Dereck03 (Plot Armour & TD3 Gods)​

Disagree:​

Neutral:​

 
Last edited:
Muchacho_mrm said:

Transduality Type 3:​


As for the Gods, they enter a Buddhist state of enlightenment, a realm called nevasaññānāsaññāyatana; perception and non-perception. Anyways, King Immortal-Slayer is explaining enlightenment regarding the annulled and he ends up explaining nevasaññānāsaññāyatana:



I'll try to break it down.




In this state (as visually illustrated below), they exist in a liminal state -- a state of being in which they exist in the realm of being perceivable and yet, outside of it, at the same time.
fV5Dklj.png



The next piece makes it clear that nevasaññānāsaññāyatana has no physicality to it: "a place with neither desire nor physicality".





The next quote: "It is not thought. Yet it isn’t a lack of thought.”.


2sS0FTv.png










Later MC got BFR into nearly this state (this isn't even the true extent of Nevasaññānāsaññāyatana). Through him we find out that people in Nevasaññānāsaññāyatana not only vanish from the reality, it makes reality nothing more than a dream:

Technically r>f statement, however, it is not at the same time. It is paradoxical as it is one of the three realms, the realm that is neither true nor illusory, neither perception nor non-perception.



The bottom diagram should illustrate it:

SfiWhSw.png


Which should be enough for Transduality Type 3 for the Gods. However I should state that this part is currently pending Ultima_Reality's input regarding whether or not we draw the line on r>f statements regarding transduality.



I believe they should also be a layer into TD 3 at-least.

A Half-Annulled God went deeper into Nevasaññānāsaññāyatana to avoid truly dying after being absorbed and became undetectable and incomprehensible to another of the same realm and Yang Qi was only able to sense him because of his circumstance:





I say at-least because the next realm they're all trying to reach is the Annulled level and the Annulled level transcends Nevasaññānāsaññāyatana. If the above is accepted as a layer, then Annulled should probably be the second layer.




​

Click to expand...
Shouldn't Transduality type 3 be measured by Truth States rather than layers? (What about levels/layers of abstraction)
 
Muchacho_mrm said:
Transduality Type 3:
Click to expand...
NO for the Nevasaññānāsaññāyatana

You know right TD 3 need beyond 4 truth state, A and B, simulteneously A and B, neither A nor B. What you show in this just that the Nevasaññānāsaññāyatana is just in the state of neither A nor B, you not really show it beyond that state

I not even see the state of simultenously A and B being mention in that

Muchacho_mrm said:
I say at-least because the next realm they're all trying to reach is the Annulled level and the Annulled level transcends Nevasaññānāsaññāyatana.
Click to expand...
This one yeah possibly can be TD 3, because it the completely different state that surpassed the Nevasaññānāsaññāyatana
 
Transcendence, or a higher layer of a character than a character with TD type 2 could be equated with another truth state, like shown in Obilvion's profile.

T= true
F = false
I see Yin Yang as both T and not F, not T, not F.
Dao could be out both T and not F, not T, not F, neither T and F since it predate the Yin and Yang.
Gods would have another truth state from being above Dao hence being Type 3 for more than 4 truth states.
 
Elizhaa said:
Transcendence, or a higher layer of a character than a character with TD type 2 could be equated with another truth state, like shown in Obilvion's profile.

T= true
F = false
I see Yin Yang as both T and not F, not T, not F.
Dao could be out both T and not F, not T, not F, neither T and F since it predate the Yin and Yang.
Gods would have another truth state from being above Dao hence being Type 3 for more than 4 truth states.
Click to expand...
So it will be like this, right?
Yin and Yang = 3 truth states, Dao = 4 truth states, Gods = 5 truth states, Nevasaññānāsaññāyatana = 6 truth states, A Half-Annulled God = 7 truth states, Annulled = 8 truth states
 
Elizhaa said:
More or less, I think something similar; though, wasn't one based on apophatic theology; if so, it could have been basically truth states since description or true states won't define it, almost similar to the root.
Click to expand...
Wait, So Apophatic theology is basically TD type 3 but transcends any number of truth states (including infinite)?
 
Elizhaa said:
More or less, I think something similar; though, wasn't one based on apophatic theology; if so, it could have been basically truth states since description or true states won't define it, almost similar to the root.
Click to expand...
Isn't this Apophatic theology?
There are still literal parts despite it being hyperbole-like
He's dead! Tai Cangyi is dead, and his immortal item has been taken and assimilated. What kind of fiendish monster is this? That cultivator from the Yore-Wilds, Yang Qi! The Yore-Wilds were nothing but ruins. How could they have given birth to someone so strong? The Yore-Wilds are now in ruins! "

"It doesn't matter. The fact that he can kill people in the World of Mirages is a miracle in and of itself. You can't use common sense to describe him. No wonder the consummate Invincible Dugu from the Invincible Society wanted to take him as an apprentice. The people from the Invincible Society are all freaks!"

"No. This Yang Qi isn't just a freak. He leaves people speechless. People who are speechless are called gods!"

Everyone was rendered speechless by a person's strength. There were no words that could describe it. That person could be called a god.

As the saying goes, people who are speechless are called gods.

By now, Yang Qi was so strong that it was no longer possible to describe him as freakish, hellion, dazzling, consummate genius, or someone who only appears once every ten thousand years.

There were no words to describe him. He was a god. Omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent, and omnipresent.

That was what the legion of gods were like. Chapter 400
 
Rabbit2002 said:
Isn't this Apophatic theology?
There are still literal parts despite it being hyperbole-like
He's dead! Tai Cangyi is dead, and his immortal item has been taken and assimilated. What kind of fiendish monster is this? That cultivator from the Yore-Wilds, Yang Qi! The Yore-Wilds were nothing but ruins. How could they have given birth to someone so strong? The Yore-Wilds are now in ruins! "

"It doesn't matter. The fact that he can kill people in the World of Mirages is a miracle in and of itself. You can't use common sense to describe him. No wonder the consummate Invincible Dugu from the Invincible Society wanted to take him as an apprentice. The people from the Invincible Society are all freaks!"

"No. This Yang Qi isn't just a freak. He leaves people speechless. People who are speechless are called gods!"

Everyone was rendered speechless by a person's strength. There were no words that could describe it. That person could be called a god.

As the saying goes, people who are speechless are called gods.

By now, Yang Qi was so strong that it was no longer possible to describe him as freakish, hellion, dazzling, consummate genius, or someone who only appears once every ten thousand years.

There were no words to describe him. He was a god. Omniscient, omnipotent, omnipresent, and omnipresent.

That was what the legion of gods were like. Chapter 400
Click to expand...
The first scan you listed is used for hde, which it clearly is only that. And if we took the second one seriously I kid you not every chinese novel would have apophatic theology.
 
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