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If we can't cite where we got it from then yes, give him weapon mastery too (no idea what that weapon would be called). Mean there are some things from summaries that I can add but I'd rather wait for translations to come because things often get misrepresented by other people.
 
'Aight, I made Valga's profile.

Lets get back to the light dodging issue, I believe we should, for the sake of it, lowball it to Sub-Relativistic because we can't really tell how much distance they moved in the process.
 
Thought we generally lowball light dodging stuff to relativistic? Then again i am no calc member so not sure.

I have seen ppl rate characters as relativistic+ for this without any calcs. Seems pretty much up in the air how to rate this stuff.
 
Hey, neither am I, whatever we generally do we should do here, I guess, 10% SoL doesn't sound rediculous, I suppose.
 
Well relativistic makes the most sense to me.

About Ryuzu for the time being i am deleting her profile based on what we already discussed above, she doesn't scale to Sphinx and hasn't done anything in the LN yet.
 
Ppl do that either way, pretty much up to preference really.

Btw is her intellect really below average? I just remember her being really animalistic in terms of how she goes about things, don't know if it's really that low, profile was made years ago when translations weren't around after all.
 
I wouldn't call her really stupid but iirc correctly she's illiterate and has no knowledge of almost anything (to be fair a lot of people in that world are uneducated, look at Cecilus, education was a privilege in the mid centuries or whenever the time setting theme is).

I guess she's not dumber than most people I meet irl, but "average" is just a label in this case. The difinition for "below average" we give is "Characters of below average intellects and unremarkable skills." so idk how much this fits her.
 
So have you reached an agreement?
 
Antvasima said:
So have you reached an agreement?
On Roswaal's profiles (plural)? Guess we'll just have them as different versions of the same characters linked with tabs (they are very different so should be fine, it's not like they're just a key or anything).
 
Did Sphinx keep up with Wilhelm and co? She is a magic user, and if she did i find it weird Sphinx, a creation of Echidna could perform that sort of feat while Echidna can't.

Then again Echidna is physically unfit, but magic castors have always been able to keep up with the physical fighters provided there is some distance.
 
I suppose she did:

Sphinx had retreated through the ceiling of the chapel up to the ground
floor of the castle, but she was stopped by a woman in a military outfit, who had chased her.

"You are quite persistent," Sphinx said. "You require extermination."

"Is that sooo? If you would hurry up and die, I could go back to being a normal woman." Roswaal kicked off the stone wall, vaulting into the air and punching at the levitating Sphinx. The girl dodged left and right, but Roswaal pushed off the wall again, her long leg tracing a beautiful arc in the sky. The kick connected with the witch, bringing her to the ground.

"Grimm, with me!"

"—!"

Carol and Grimm slammed into her from opposite directions in the corridor. Sphinx spun to meet the double attack, creating a shield of magic to defend herself against Carol's sword, the more deadly of the two instruments.

"Hrk!"

But of course, that left her to take Grimm's shield blow undefended. The girl stumbled at the strike from behind and was thrown into the large, open room beyond the corridor.
~ EX 2, Chapter 5, Section 6​
 
I have to unsubscribe from this thread due to time constraints. You can notify me later via my message wall if you need my help after you have reached a conclusion. I trust Celestial's ability to handle this though.
 
From what i am seeing there Sphinx speed does scale and seemingly her durability too.

She doesn't seem like a typical magic castor. I remember it being said Sphinx and the other clones were made like spirits, so there is a core clone that being the original Ryuzu, and more are created over time. Also remember their bodies being said to be different from a normal person.

So i guess Echidna wouldn't scale. I find it funny that the top tiers like Roswaal and Echidna would get speed blitz by Wilhelm in his prime and Theresia.
 
Well obviously there are missing links in out scaling, like nothing goes from the EX characters, technically there is scaling between 15 y/o Wil and Garf but that's useless to us.
 
It's very iffy but I'll say "no"

"This complicated design isn't about enhancing the effect of the magic so
much as making it harder to dispel. They seem to think quiiite highly of me. And they've still underestimated me." As she muttered, Roswaal got down in the dirt beside the glowing circle and began scratching something into the earth. She pointed a finger at the circle and closed one eye. Her yellow iris flickered weirdly, and an instant later, the design under her feet shattered with the sound of breaking glass.EX 2, Chapter 4, Section 7
 
This illustration of Reinhard is weird.

Re Zero Light Novel Volume 17 4


This is the Ln illustration of this scene here:

Reinhardt slashed.
A clean line swept neatly from Sirius's left shoulder to her right flank.

That exquisite cut was so sharp that there was a delay of several seconds before Sirius's body could react. Finally, the blood in her body noticed the wound, and her body collapsed as blood began to spray.

Sirius: "… Ah, this gentle world."

Her internal organs spilling out, Sirius's body was cleft in half.

Her upper body continued soaring upward, pouring blood and intestines through the air, while her lower body, left in place, became a fountain, sprinkling blood through the square.

This was hell come to earth.

No one could bear to look straight at that horror. However, no one looked away. No one could look away.

Reinhardt: "…it can't be."

After landing, Reinhardt uttered a stunned mutter.

Subaru saw that his blue eyes were shaking with grief, a desperate shadow enveloping his fair, handsome face.

— And then Subaru could see no more.

Subaru: "——"

Subaru, and the rest of the crowd, lay scattered in the square that had turned into a pool of blood. From their left shoulders to their right sides, everyone had been clearly bisected.
~ Arc 5, Chapter 22​
Everyone else was bisected in 2, but Reinhard here is clearly not bisected.

I just chalked this up before to Sirius ability working on him and him resurrecting, didn't see this illustration, but this illustration makes it clear that didn't happen cause there is no blood on Reinhard.

So Sirius damage transferal clearly didn't work on him, which is weird cause we know authorities work on him, seems like there are caveats to it.

Also Reinhard says he won't be able to remain calm for much longer while in Sirius presence, btw this is a feat for his intuition, he understood her ability without even being told, and afterwards Subaru and everyone else were clearly under Sirius's ability, but Reinhard says he can't hold out for long meaning he currently is holding out.

Seems like the guy has some form of resistance to authorities.
 
Re Zero Light Novel 19 10
That's because of the way Sirius' authority works, they need to be under the empath manip to be effected by the damage transfer. In fact that was the whole point of Priscilla bringing Liliana along, to get people back to normal via her blessing and singing, and you can see it worked.

If you remember Beako too was uneffected by the damage transferal when Regu deleted Subaru's leg whilst everyone else was. I get him resisting this, other people have as well, Gluttony's authority is something different, it's strips the name and memories from your very soul. I mean authorities are stated to be like the upgraded versions of blessing but are the antithesis of Od Lagna and not all are equally strong, makes sense if he can hold against some of them.
 
Well i wasn't suggesting him being able to resist Ley's ability, just that he seemingly resists Sirius authority to an extent, when before i completely disregarded him having any resistance to authorities.

But yea Reinhard should have resistance to empathetic manipulation.

About dark magic, it's stated to be debuffs like slowing down ppl's movements, it's not darkness manipulation, that should be removed from the profiles, it's status effect inducement, not darkness manipulation.

So Reinhard should also have resistance to status effect inducement.
 
Yeah, that's about right, goes for other yin users, the status effect indecement. Pretty sure we didn't give Reinhard resistances for all the things we added to Ros and Echidna's profiles. Speaking of, might as well give those two AZ, we gave them everything else...
 
Petegeuse's attack potency and durability needs to be edited. Petelgeuse's physical strength should still be 9-B and his physical durability 9-C. In one of the side stories, Petelgeuse was pierced through and killed with a longsword by a tier 10-A character (won't spoil which). This means the author is inconsistent or Petelgeuse magic resistance is high enough to tank Julius 8-A attack potency, but still have a weak physical body (he's a spirit, after all).
 
We all know you are talking about Ayamatsu, a non-canon side story that only exists in WN version. Other inconsistencies would be like the time Reinhard got stabbed by Emilia's ice sword in Oboreru.

If you want more examples of imcomsistencies lets move to the LN. In Volume 5 this happened:

Having spoken her warning, Rem ignored her own bloody left shoulder and
swung the iron ball around above her head. She had sustained the wound to her shoulder when the dragon carriage went on its side, unable to completely evade the carriage as it bounced. If she had been by herself, she would most likely have escaped uninjured, but that wasn't possible with Subaru in her arms.

It was all she could do to use her own body to shield Subaru and throw him to a safe place.

She had seen him fall on the bush as she intended while she shared the same fate as the wrecked dragon carriage.

As a result, her forehead had been lacerated, and a branch had stabbed her left shoulder fairly deeply. She seemed to have a fracture in her left femur close to her hip; moving sent a shot of ferocious pain through her that made her white cheeks go numb.
~ LN Volume 5, Chapter 5, Section 1​
Ok, Rem got injured by a wagon crash, would this be a reason to downgrade her? No, because it's an inconsistency, running against both logic and what happened in the previous volume:

"—I came here tracking Subaru's scent. What kind of disturbance is this?"
Tumbling end over end as she descended, Rem held down the hem of her skirt and landed with a boom. She brushed the dust from her sleeves as everyone gawked at her.

Rem made an adorable little tilt of her head.

"So, Subaru. Do you have something you wish to say to me?"

Subaru pointed at her feet and voiced his question.

"Let me start with, err… He's ah, not dead, is he?"

Rem lowered her gaze. Underneath lay Dumb, smashed to the ground the moment she landed.

Head buried in the city street, the hoodlum said one last thing before he ceased to move altogether.
~ LN Volume 4, Chapter 2, Section 8​
Here's a visual representation from the manga version because it's not in the anime. As you can see this she was unscratched by but later she got injured something even a regular personn can survive.

Anyways, the Pete stuff is inconsistent, when he was fighting Emilia he took a kick from her to the face and was fine, and Emilia>>>Subaru.
 
We have a problem.

So, I've recently found that that statement of Puck and Roswaal being equal, Tappei never actually said it... Here's the original quote , he doesn't actually mention Roswaal at all. The full translation is:

Q: Among the characters that have appeared until now, what would the five people with high battle strength look like when they are lined up in sequence?
A: Reinhard, Ram(with horn), Regulus, Sekhmet, and Puck in his True form. Even though they are like dangos under Reinhard but these guys are capable of bringing down the white whale by themselves. (June 02, 2014 arc 4)
That thing with Ros seems to have been taken from here but this and the above translation should be of the same comment which doesn't mention Roswaal. Further there are more problems, recently in his comments on the DC he said this:

I think you can tell fairly well when you see Emilia-tan fighting here, but Emilia-tan is fairly high in the combat strength rankings of characters that make an appearance. After arc four, she'll become Awakened Emilia, and that's even stronger. She'll knock you right down.
Why is that a problem? Because Tappei uses ÞªÜÚåÆÒé¿ÒâƒÒâ¬Òéó (Awakened Emilia) same way as he did in this comment:

Q: Out of the characters that have appeared in Re: Zero so far, please tell me the top five in magic attack strength. Does a serious Emilia-tan make the list?
A: Roswaal > Awakened Emilia > Echidna > Full-power Beatrice > Fortuna; something like that. (October 09, 2014 arc4)
So a scaling mess is what we seem to have here.

Now back to older issues, I seriously can't get where Daphne having the powers of the Whale came from.

Speaking of the Whale, what are we gonna do about the problems comming from its size being 50 m unlike what was assumed in the calc, it would actually put him below other characters as you've seen, or maybe it's time some other calcs get scrapped as well?
 
Does Roswaal not being mention matter at this point? Didn't Puck use his true form against him anyway?

Could have sworn there was also other statements that said Puck=Roswaal too, but i guess you're taking those as referring to Base Puck.

That Awakened Emilia stuff though.... Yea complete mess.

The current multi-city block level is from a feat performed by arc 6 Emilia, in other words Awakened Emilia who is explicitly stronger, but there isn't much time pass between Arc 5 and 6, so Sirius and thus Priscilla and thus Crusch still scale, but Emilia is above Echidna, but Roswaal=Echidna and he is said to be the greatest magician in the kingdom.

Like how can Roswaal being stated to be comparable to Echidna at one point, and at another be above Emilia who is above Echidna?

Holy hell this is a disaster. This probably is taking into account abilities and not necessarily dc, so Echidna could probably fight Roswaal but doesn't mean she can blow up as much stuff as him, only way it makes sense i guess.

The Whale would scale to whatever we figure out for this mess for the characters.
 
Well all there was said was this:

Emilia: [Puck, didn't you just show him even your starbeast transformation a little while ago….]
~ Bond of Ice​
It's a summary though, not a full translation, and we don't actually know if Puck showing his true form means Roswaal can keep up with it, it was after all a non-serious fight.

And I honestly can't remember other statements of Ros=Puck .Also Tappei only said Dona is around Ros' level of fighting power, not that they're equal.

To make more of a mess of this...

Q: How does the true strength of the first Roswaal compare with characters that have appeared so far?

A: It's around Emilia.

Q: Between the original Roswaal and the current Roswaal, which is stronger?

A: The current Roswaal is overwhelmingly stronger.


Like, I don't even know if he means post or pre arc 4 Lia here...
 
If Echidna is around Roswaal level of power, there isn't a major difference, yet Roswaal>Awakened Emilia>Echidna, this at least means the difference between them isn't massive.

If it's Awakened Emilia being compared to Original Roswaal, this is just stupid at this point. Roswaal would be overwhelming stronger but at the same time being around the same level.

Like this scaling is completely messed up, Emilia after arc 4 isn't some powerhouse, there are characters on her level, and going by his other statements basically everybody including the previous Emilia scales to her. There is a difference as in Pre-Awakened Emilia obviously can't beat someone like Elsa on her own, while Awakened i think can, but it's not massive.

We will have to take every statement Tappei made with a massive grain of salt and try to sort this with stuff from the series itself. But that doesn't help with Echidna and co since they haven't done much, besides Subaru stating Echidna is above the Whale.
 
Certainly painful to deal with, for the time being the way we scale the high tiers to big Puck appears baseless without that statement, all there is to it now is that very vague mention on Bond of Ice that doesn't mean much and we also aren't getting the fight in the OVA animated so we're screwed, guess we have to downgrade them.

Well small Puck did at least fight Roswaal for a day, that seems reasonable, and in the LN Ram uses him to help her fight Ros at the end of arc 4 but without translations (thanks Yawn Press) that train of logic isn't going far. Like, I'd say idk how I fell about those feats from that flashback in Memory Snow, maybe that's how they chose to animate it but it may be contrary to the novel version, at this point I need to be skeptical of everything.

Regarding that 8-A calc, Heinkel got it by assuming a 10 length from "several tens of meters" tall ice tower laid sideways and a height of 4 m from t the fact that Emilia was covered by the wall too even though she was atop a tall cariage...except actual translation (not Google Translate) say "around 10 m tall" for the tower and the wall was never stated to be covering Emilia, it was just to shield Subaru, so yeah...

Also that statement about the Whale and Echidna, pretty sure he was just comparing their presence/aura.
 
Downgrade Roswaal to small Puck then? The Emilia stufff still makes absolutely no sense though, scaling her to Roswaal is very iffy, idk what to make of Echidna and co.

So the 8-A calc is screwed too? This is a complete disaster.
 
Mean I'm kinda at a loss, if we scale people to that Low 7-B Puck feat we'll end up with rating that are too ridiculous to be true for many of the characters, there's only so far we can go before we say "there's no way a Low 7-B character got injured by what this character just got injured by", talking about when characters get injured by things that aren't supernatural. Now, Tappei does have a lot of those and a lot of 'em are just PIS but at some point it all just won't add up (trying to say I find scaling from that feat dubious, especially with how much the flashback seemed like a cameo).

Now, there are some things I can try, it may require going back through to see I'm not just misremembering stuff, so not much hope honestly (dammit, that ******* delay and slow releases hinder my calcs).
 
Think we will have to put our foot down and say scaling Emilia to Roswaal and Puck is ridiculous and disregard it, cause this backward scales to everyone.

There was the a calc for Rem's al Human which was city block level, maybe we can scale ppl to that? I did a Ricardo calc a while back too which was like building level+, and there is your Petelguese durability calc and al goa calc, plus a statement somewhere of Garfiel being able to destroy buildings, so at the very least the characters can scale to building level.
 
Can't argue with the first part, common sense is a thing I have.

There is in EX 2 a giant earthworm that Wil and Grimm meet, it was able to cause earthquakes, in arc 6 Meili also brought one like that too, I belive it was the same size too and Shaula rekt it and characters have been able to block attack by her so that's something too.
 
Ok, let's say we can use the Al Human calc, there's a small difference in it's size between versions, in the anime it was measured at about 13.5 m and in the LN it's like 10 m but IMO that's getting too nitpicky, if we do that we won't be able to get anything done.

I went and checked and the earthworm from the EX that caused earthquakes is roughly the same size as the one in arc 6 (**** Yawn Press with their imperial units messing this up, I'm confident every time they say "30 foot range" they're just being too lazy to look up how much 10 m are) so it would scale to Shaula and comparable people, the earthquale seems like magnitude 3-4.

That said, regarding the tree falling on the Whale, there's no way it's as short as that calc makes it out to be, it had clouds around its top. Scaling the Whale's size off other things leads to innacurate results and also its size varies from scene to scene so it serves a terrible measuring stick for the tree.

Mean things are still very much a mess, just trying to somewhat sort it out.
 
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