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Possible Ki Manipulation page? (Dragon Ball)

Even if we disagree Ki page for DB/Z/S, the game verse still have enough reason for a Ki page of their own, Ki in game verse have a long list of abilities and resistance, and with the ever growing list of DBH/XV abilities, listing all of them just make the process of apply nee revision longer and waste more energy, and the profile look more of a mess
If the game’s version has the ability where if the characters have it, they automatically get a number of abilities, it should be created just for THAT
Also, it’s not just copy and paste, because if it’s an ability not every ki user has, then it’s not a general ability
 
What exactly is unique enough about Ki in the games that is deserving of an entire page?
The five extra abilities that God Ki users have?
 
It just means we can add those other abilities to the Dragon Ball profiles, we do not need to make a Dragon Ball version of Ki Manipulation just to say he has Ki Manipulation + a bunch of other abilities rather than just listing the abilities they have on the profiles.
Uh why? Ki page would make things less messy, plus it's literally different than chi manipulation, the only thing that is similar are : it's your fighting power, it increases your strength , and gives you flight, big beams, and sensing.
And that's it, dbz ki has literally different techniques, moves, requirements, even different sub versions such as evil ki, good ki, dark ki, spirit, god ki
You can't say that both are the same when they are fundamentally different
 
What exactly is unique enough about Ki in the games that is deserving of an entire page?
The five extra abilities that God Ki users have?
: creation, teleportation fusion, fission, ki suppressing, space bending, construct creation, regeneration bypassing, god ki [which it has its won set of rules. Techniques, usages] telekinesis, demon, dark, evil, good ki, spirit, absorption rendering, environmental damage, explosion manipulation
god ki has it's own rules
demon ki hasit's own rule
Spirit has it's own usages
evil and good ki
 
Other Dragon Ball medias include stuff like Dark Ki, Evil Ki etc... Which do have general abilities for all its users

Although do whatever you want with these
 
it's literally different than chi manipulation
ehhhh...
dbz ki has literally different techniques, moves, requirements
That is the issue. Most of the noteworthy abilities are not universal like Chaos Energy or Verse-specific Physiologies, they are usually exclusive to a small amount of characters. At that point, the page is going to be structured like:
1. Summary
2. Applications
2.1 Basic Applications (i.e., generic Chi Manipulation abilities)
2.2 Advanced Applications (i.e., Ki Sense, Ki Suppression, etc.)
2.3 Unique Applications (i.e., literally everything else; majority of the page)
evil ki, good ki, dark ki, spirit, god ki
Those first three are the same thing, just colored differently.
"Spirit"???
God Ki literally only grants Resistance to Extrasensory Perception.
Five???? Did you really play the game bro??
Can you list me the game-exclusive God Ki abilities? You can't use Resistance to Dark Magic, Portal Creation, Summoning, Space-Time Manipulation, or Pocket Reality Manipulation. I already pointed those five out.
creation, teleportation fusion, fission, ki suppressing, space bending, construct creation, regeneration bypassing, god ki [which it has its won set of rules. Techniques, usages] telekinesis, demon, dark, evil, good ki, spirit, absorption rendering, environmental damage, explosion manipulation
Could you explain the ones in bold?
demon ki hasit's own rule
You're just saying things, but you're not empowering these words with evidence.
 
Buuuuuut, what does having ki automatically give you is the question, because that’s truly what matters when making a verse specific ability. As we know, there are abilities that you have to actually train for. Some abilities you can have within the ability isn’t something everyone has, there are masters of ki usage that can’t use certain abilities. There are masters of ki who can’t fuse, who can’t fly, who can’t seal, who can’t sense energy
 
Creation : ki users can create dragon balls, ki construct, ki shields, planets and stars
Teleportation: they can teleport with ki techniques such as IT
Fission and fusion: ki users can fuse or defuse and render stolen ki useless [forced spirit fission]
Space bending : ki uses can create holes in space with high enough ki
Regeneration bypassing: ki uses that are stronger than the opponent can negate their regeneration [cell and buu are the note worthy examples]
 
I disagree with this.

While I do agree that ki in dragon ball has a lot uses. The abilities gained from it can easily be added to the profile.

You would also need to specify what abilities different characters can use which would make it messy.
 
Can literally everyone every application? Like I said, even the greatest of ki users can’t use all the applications
 
I disagree with this.

While I do agree that ki in dragon ball has a lot uses. The abilities gained from it can easily be added to the profile.

You would also need to specify what abilities different characters can use which would make it messy.
i dont like this reason, theres literally a bunch of ways around it and I've seen pages do it and look marvelous, take a look at the chaos energy page
 
Buuuuuut, what does having ki automatically give you is the question, because that’s truly what matters when making a verse specific ability. As we know, there are abilities that you have to actually train for. Some abilities you can have within the ability isn’t something everyone has, there are masters of ki usage that can’t use certain abilities
Depends on the type of Ki, but Dragon Ball games usually have stuff like Dark Ki which gives you Corruption/Madness Manipulation and some other stuff, Evil Ki gives you Corruption/Madness and Morality Manipulation, and Godly Ki gives you some abilities + some resistances

These are the types of Ki which universally give you something in Dragon Ball, as far as I know.

I'm neutral on the page though
 
Depends on the type of Ki, but Dragon Ball games usually have stuff like Dark Ki which gives you Corruption/Madness Manipulation and some other stuff, Evil Ki gives you Corruption/Madness and Morality Manipulation, and Godly Ki gives you some abilities + some resistances
This is what I mean. If it’s something that automatically gives you hella abilities just for having that verse specific power, then it deserves to be an ability page
 
i dont like this reason, theres literally a bunch of ways around it and I've seen pages do it and look marvelous, take a look at the chaos energy page
Yes, I just checked it out and it does look good. But even then they still listed all of the abilities that the character would gain from using it.
 
Creation : ki users can create dragon balls, ki construct, ki shields, planets and stars
Only "genius-level Namekians" are capable of creating Dragon Balls, and they use Magic Materialization to do that.
Creating ki constructs and barriers is not "Creation".
The Supreme Kai also use Magic Materialization when they create planet and stars.
None of these examples of "Creation" are ki-based.
Fission and fusion: ki users can fuse or defuse and render stolen ki useless [forced spirit fission]
Fusion is not a ki-based ability—it's a fusion-based ability.
Forced Spirit Fission forces stolen energy from out of a target—Energy Absorption.
Space bending : ki uses can create holes in space with high enough ki
Really? Do you have any proof of ki being involved?
Regeneration bypassing: ki uses that are stronger than the opponent can negate their regeneration [cell and buu are the note worthy examples]
Gohan and the Super Spirit Bomb did not negate Cell and Buu's Regeneration, respectively. Their healing factors had limits, and their respective finishing blows simply overpowered their limits (i.e., destroyed every last cell in their body so they had nothing to regenerate from).
 
Gohan and the Super Spirit Bomb did not negate Cell and Buu's Regeneration, respectively. Their healing factors had limits, and their respective finishing blows simply overpowered their limits (i.e., destroyed every last cell in their body so they had nothing to regenerate from).
i can see for cell, but buu is verbatim stated to have endless regeneration in some guides so saying his regen has "limits" is an assertion

ill post the scan when i get it
 
Yes, I just checked it out and it does look good. But even then they still listed all of the abilities that the character would gain from using it.
The Chaos Energy page is 80% to 90% done. There is some uncertainty over some minor things like who exactly qualities for what level of Mastery (not including Sonic and Tails, who are largely outliers to the whole concept structure of Mastery) but the general concept of the page has been sorted out.
 
Ki users generally get the ability to shoot ki beams [the only person who doesn't have this ability is videl], you can strength yourself, fly [only roshi doesn't have it because it's a technique the his rival uses] ability to create explosions and control their size and the power behind them, regeneration bypassing, telekinesis .
Only "genius-level Namekians" are capable of creating Dragon Balls, and they use Magic Materialization to do that.
Creating ki constructs and barriers is not "Creation".
The Supreme Kai also use Magic Materialization when they create planet and stars.
None of these examples of "Creation" are ki-based.

Fusion is not a ki-based ability—it's a fusion-based ability.
Forced Spirit Fission forces stolen energy from out of a target—Energy Absorption.

Really? Do you have any proof of ki being involved?

Gohan and the Super Spirit Bomb did not negate Cell and Buu's Regeneration, respectively. Their healing factors had limits, and their respective finishing blows simply overpowered their limits (i.e., destroyed every last cell in their body so they had nothing to regenerate from).
1- As for kiai it's a ki technique

buu uses kiai to break out from The Hyperbolic time chamber.
2- forced spirit fission is a spirit techniques which is just another synonym For ki

Spirit is what we know as chi/Ki
3- if they destroyed every cell and [buu who can regenerate from vapours?] Shouldn't they get matter manipulation no? I know it's done by Raw power
 
What about for the characters in the first part, which we have several profiles for, that use ki? If these abilities don’t apply to literally everyone who has ki, why should it even be an ability page? Verse specific powers get pages when having said ability gives you multiple abilities automatically. As we know, the abilities need training to pull off, you can’t just have them by having ki
 
i can see for cell, but buu is verbatim stated to have endless regeneration in some guides so saying his regen has "limits" is an assertion
huh
buu uses kiai to break out from The Hyperbolic time chamber.
Kiai are just considered to be invisible ki attacks by the Daizenshuu. Aside from that, we have never seen any other character a similar feat, not even when the concept of deities and the Jiren-natural were introduced.
Spirit is what we know as chi/Ki
Spirit has it's own usages
2- forced spirit fission is a spirit techniques which is just another synonym For ki
Does this prove me wrong?
if they destroyed every cell and [buu who can regenerate from vapours?] Shouldn't they get matter manipulation no? I know it's done by Raw power
You do not need Matter Manipulation to obliterate every cell in a target's body. I believe you could destroy a target's cells if you keep their bodies inside of a fire for long enough.
 
I honestly don't know what to say I disagree with this we have literally no reason to create a page for an ability that only exist in a single show what's the purpose of doing this in the first place?
 
If the ki manipulation page for Dragon Ball is similar in structure to the chaos energy manipulation page for Archie, then I'll agree to it.

Since my initial thoughts were to disagree to this but the ones in favor of this have good points as well, so count me as neutral for now.
 
@Nullflowerblush I mean, Magic does even have more complex uses, such as Transmutation, Mind manipulation, Sealing, Life-force absorption, corruption thanks to Dark Magic from Towa, Mira, etc..., Ilusion creation, elemental manipulation, such as Moro's Magma manipulation, or Moro's fire manipulation, Magic materialization (create things out of thin air).
 
@Nullflowerblush I mean, Magic does even have more complex uses, such as Transmutation, Mind manipulation, Sealing, Life-force absorption, corruption thanks to Dark Magic from Towa, Mira, etc..., Ilusion creation, elemental manipulation, such as Moro's Magma manipulation, or Moro's fire manipulation, Magic materialization (create things out of thin air).
dont forget law manipulation and physics manipulation because of demigra
 
@Nullflowerblush I mean, Magic does even have more complex uses, such as Transmutation, Mind manipulation, Sealing, Life-force absorption, corruption thanks to Dark Magic from Towa, Mira, etc..., Ilusion creation, elemental manipulation, such as Moro's Magma manipulation, or Moro's fire manipulation, Magic materialization (create things out of thin air).
You mean Magic?

Magic in Dragon Ball suffers the same problem that Ki has: only a minor percentage of the abilities are universal abilities and even then, those are generic abilities already pointed out by the Magic and Chi Manipulation pages, respectively. The unique and noteworthy applications (i.e., Elemental Manipulation, Portal Creation, Reactive Power Level, Corruption, Duplication, etc.) are not universal and are typically only used by one or two character with zero explanation as to why they can do these things with their ki.

This is not like Haki, or Chakra, or Nen where they are relatively unique and nuanced concepts with universal applications for the verse; Ki is just inherently conventional for the most part, and there is no reason to give such a conventional ability an entire page.

Once again...
That is the issue. Most of the noteworthy abilities are not universal like Chaos Energy or Verse-specific Physiologies, they are usually exclusive to a small amount of characters. At that point, the page is going to be structured like:
1. Summary
2. Applications
2.1 Basic Applications (i.e., generic Chi Manipulation abilities)
2.2 Advanced Applications (i.e., Ki Sense, Ki Suppression, etc.)
2.3 Unique Applications (i.e., literally everything else; majority of the page)
 
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