• This forum is strictly intended to be used by members of the VS Battles wiki. Please only register if you have an autoconfirmed account there, as otherwise your registration will be rejected. If you have already registered once, do not do so again, and contact Antvasima if you encounter any problems.

    For instructions regarding the exact procedure to sign up to this forum, please click here.
  • We need Patreon donations for this forum to have all of its running costs financially secured.

    Community members who help us out will receive badges that give them several different benefits, including the removal of all advertisements in this forum, but donations from non-members are also extremely appreciated.

    Please click here for further information, or here to directly visit our Patreon donations page.
  • Please click here for information about a large petition to help children in need.

KingTempest

He/Him
VS Battles
Thread Moderator
21,162
30,151
Yerp

I wanted to work on this before we continued this thread, since this impacts this and many more threads to come.

It's a discussion about the Durability rating of Zoans, and why their full beast shouldn't be different from their hybrid forms.
We currently give a lot of Zoans higher ratings because of unknown reasons (that's my fault), and when we're in an arc where there's like 10 Zoan users, this needs to be tackled now.

What are the forms of a Zoan User?​

A Zoan user has 3 forms.
Human, Human-Beast (Mainly referred to as Hybrid), and Beast.

Human is the base form of a Zoan.
Human-Beast is the hybrid form which uses parts from both the natural form and the fruit's added form.
Beast is the fully transformed form.

Something to Note​

The bodies of Zoans don't actually get changed when they're turned into Hybrids.

We see Momonosuke transforming into his Zoan form, going through a phase where his human form has scales around him. This would be noted as an incomplete hybrid.
We see Queen after getting KO'd from his Zoan form, going through a phase where his head is the shape of a dinosaur. In comparison to his Hybrid form, the skin of the dinosaur doesn't actually leave. We see him later transforming from Hybrid to Zoan, showing a similar situation.
Same situation with Dalton, X Drake, and others that I can't think of.

When we're introduced to Kaido's dragon form, a huge point about them is his scales. Luffy doesn't want to get past his regular durability, he needed to get past his scales. His scales are a huge factor in his durability, to where when his scales are cut, it's a notable feat.
When Franky is fighting Sasaki, he cuts his chest, yet notes that his dinosaur skin is tough all over while he's fighting his hybrid form and not his chest area, noting it to be the same thing as his Zoan form.
When Sanji burns Queen's Hybrid chest and Queen transforms back to Zoan, his chest still has steam from the attack.

What's the point of these?​

The point is that the Zoan and Hybrid forms are the same when it comes to biology. It's the same body, just moved in different places.

Wounds dealt on a zoan form doesn't mean that it's superior or inferior when it's dealt on a hybrid form.

This will not stretch out for AP because AP varies too much, but durability would be fair game, since their skin and body is literally the same thing.

For situations like the Ancient Zoans or Kaido who have specific portions of their body more durable than the rest, they'd get "A-1, A-2 with Scales/Dino Skin/Etc".
 
Just a clarification question-

What's the point of using your hybrid form? Why wouldn't you just go full Zoan instead of hybrid.
 
Just a clarification question-

What's the point of using your hybrid form? Why wouldn't you just go full Zoan instead of hybrid.
More mobility (Dalton), physical physique with zoan strength (Kaido), animal limbs that assist human fighting style (Lucci, Kaku, Jabra, Who's Who), etc.
 
This makes sense to me.

I agree with keeping the durability of full zoan and hybrid the same, also some profiles claim higher speed in full zoan and then even higher in hybrid which shouldn't be the case unless there's evidence for it.
Definitely agree with this as well.
 
So this is just making the durability between Animal and Hybrid forms the same? I guess that makes sense so ill agree with it.
 
Well, i agree with adding "with scales" to characters who have specific parts with a higher dura, but i kinda disagree with putting this as some absolute rule like "hybrid will never be more durable than zoan", Chopper for example is clearly more durable in his Zoan than his hybrid and i think anyone with a small animal zoan would have more dura in Hybrid or even Base than Zoan.
 
Well, i agree with adding "with scales" to characters who have specific parts with a higher dura, but i kinda disagree with putting this as some absolute rule like "hybrid will never be more durable than zoan", Chopper for example is clearly more durable in his Zoan than his hybrid and i think anyone with a small animal zoan would have more dura in Hybrid or even Base than Zoan.
Not too sure, Brain Point Chopper has a lot of durability feats throughout the series.

It'd be like this

"A-1, A-2 with Zoan form"

sometimes with this

"A-1, A-2 with Zoan form, A-3 with Specific Enhanced Body Part"

I'm sort of neutral as well at the moment.

Some notes don't quite make sense to me like this:



I don't think I'd expect Queen to stop steaming from the attack whether he grew more durable, less durable or just stayed the same.
Alright that's fair
 
i mean, that's cool? unless heavy point took more damage than brain point in all these battles this does not mean much to what i said, i said Zoan/Heavy > Hybrid/Brain not Brain = fodder
Brain has taken hits on the level of Heavy tbh, hasn’t really shown anything different except the fact that he’s small
 
This seems alright for now. I like the change in rating, but if a character ever displayed a difference in durability between Full Zoan and Hybrid, then that will have to be noted
 
Back
Top