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One Piece General Discussion: Elbaph

Mr.Cinos15 said:
Nah I just think that's the case cause Luffy is normally fine with dying (as seen with Loguetown) but in Wano he fully understands that him losing equals Wano's doom (his friends dying and the people of Wano being enslaved) so he fights with his absolute heart out.

Freedom is certainly the main aspect of who and what Nika is (Luffy's fruit), but another aspect of it is liberation and the desire to liberate those that are chained down, and while Luffy absolutely embodies aspect A (freedom) all the time, it's in Wano where aspect B (liberation) truly shines within Luffy at it's peak, and his mind becomes completely in sync with the fruit.

I won't say Luffy never desired to liberate other's (cause he has), it's just that Wano imo is whenever his desire to do so is at it's strongest. Combine this with his near perfected mastery of his DF at that moment and you get a recipe for awakening.
Click to expand...
I see where you coming from

But... 🙈
 
TheMonkeMan said:
I wonder if they would have beat Kaidou if Luffy didn't awaken in time or something and they had to fight Kaidou.
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Law and Kidd could've maybe kept fighting a bit but they probably would've only lasted a minute at most before the sheer lack of stamina knocked them out or killed them.

Marco was willing to fight back (as seen with him blocking an attack after Luffy was down) but I just don't think Marco has the sheer power to take down a Yonko unless they're on the cusp of falling.

Zoro is out like a light and couldn't fight and Sanji was still recovering from his fight, so at best only Sanji could've joined up (but he would be exhausted).

Honestly Yamato was likely the only one fine enough to keep fighting Kaido normally.

So you have Yamato the main fighter, Marco as the second fighter, Law and Kidd available for a minute at most before going Zoro mode and slumping out, and Sanji just barely able to assist.

So at the absolute best case scenario, they would just BARELY beat Kaido and that's only if he doesn't use his flame dragon form. But in most cases, I just don't see them winning without Gear 5th.
 
0051-Enhanced.png

戦い方からやられ方まで何もかもが″自由„!!

↑ 全ての動きが誰もの”想像„を超えていく!他のどんな実とも似ていない、唯一無二の能力だっ!!
—————————
Everything from how to fight to how to get hit is "free"!

↑ Every movement is beyond anyone's "imagination"! It is a unique ability that is unlike any other!
Click to expand...
 
0049-Enhanced.png

極めると未来予知すら可能に!!

けんぶんしょく
(見聞色)

相手の気配を強く感じる力で、敵の位置や数が分かるように。さらに攻撃を先読みし回避できる!!
——————————
When mastered, even future foresight is possible!

the color of seeing and hearing
(Kembunshoku) (the color of seeing and hearing)

The power to strongly sense the presence of an opponent, and to know the position and number of enemies. Furthermore, you can anticipate and avoid attacks!
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Yee... I think sanji has advanced obs haki

which also means..... I'm always right yet again 🙈

0049-Enhanced.png

身体や武器が鋼のように硬くなる!!

そうしょく
(武装色)

鎧を着たかのように身体が超頑丈になる!!悪魔の実の能力者に対する、唯一の対抗手段なのだ!!
————————
Body and weapons become as hard as steel!!!!

(color of armament)
(Armament color)

The body becomes super sturdy as if wearing armor! It is the only countermeasure against those who have the ability of devil's fruit!
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
I feel like we should downscale Yamato from Kaido instead of making her fully scale. Makes no sense.

She was literally on the backend the entire fight, spilling and coughing blood. Whenever Kaido attacked her she could only block for small moments before getting hit back. Even when they exchanged Thunder Baguas, Kaido had a tiny stream of blood, while Yamato, while blocking with Ice Mirrror, had it shattered and was left with bleed pouring from her head, and even said herself that she didn't even come close to blocking it.
 
Kachon123 said:
I feel like we should downscale Yamato from Kaido instead of making her fully scale. Makes no sense.

She was literally on the backend the entire fight, spilling and coughing blood. Whenever Kaido attacked her she could only block for small moments before getting hit back. Even when they exchanged Thunder Baguas, Kaido had a tiny stream of blood, while Yamato, while blocking with Ice Mirrror, had it shattered and was left with bleed pouring from her head, and even said herself that she didn't even come close to blocking it.
Click to expand...
Yeah she shouldn't, I've already been working on a new crt for this.
 
Kachon123 said:
I feel like we should downscale Yamato from Kaido instead of making her fully scale. Makes no sense.

She was literally on the backend the entire fight, spilling and coughing blood. Whenever Kaido attacked her she could only block for small moments before getting hit back. Even when they exchanged Thunder Baguas, Kaido had a tiny stream of blood, while Yamato, while blocking with Ice Mirrror, had it shattered and was left with bleed pouring from her head, and even said herself that she didn't even come close to blocking it.
Click to expand...
Well Kaidou was bleeding too and even got slammed into the ground by her, so she should only be like 70-80% as powerful as Hybrid ACoC Kaidou.
 
Eminiteable said:
Yeah she shouldn't, I've already been working on a new crt for this.
Click to expand...
Pretty sure you made a CRT in the past for this, but it just fizzled out.

Kachon123 said:
I feel like we should downscale Yamato from Kaido instead of making her fully scale. Makes no sense.

She was literally on the backend the entire fight, spilling and coughing blood. Whenever Kaido attacked her she could only block for small moments before getting hit back. Even when they exchanged Thunder Baguas, Kaido had a tiny stream of blood, while Yamato, while blocking with Ice Mirrror, had it shattered and was left with bleed pouring from her head, and even said herself that she didn't even come close to blocking it.
Click to expand...
I don't dislike this proposal, especially since I'm not fond of using the Zoan fruit argument to say Base Yamato > Base Kaido.

You can argue her Zoan durability scales via taking that monstrous beatdown from Hao+Hybrid Kaido like a champ, but yeah there is a power gap.

Her Base did block Hybrid Kaido's attack meant to kill Dragon Momo, who is comparable to Greenbull and took hits from him, so she should be comparable in Base to Dragon momo.
 
Eseseso said:
Pretty sure you made a CRT in the past for this, but it just fizzled out.


I don't dislike this proposal, especially since I'm not fond of using the Zoan fruit argument to say Base Yamato > Base Kaido.

You can argue her Zoan durability scales via taking that monstrous beatdown from Hao+Hybrid Kaido like a champ, but yeah there is a power gap.

Her Base did block Hybrid Kaido's attack meant to kill Dragon Momo, who is comparable to Greenbull and took hits from him, so she should be comparable in Base to Dragon momo.
Click to expand...
Technically it's durability and endurance to take like 4 ACoC hits and be relatively fine afterwards.
 
TheMonkeMan said:
Well Kaidou was bleeding too
Click to expand...
And so was Kaido when he got hit by Rooftop Zoro's no Buso Onigiri, and yet he downscales.
TheMonkeMan said:
even got slammed into the ground by her
Click to expand...
I'd imagine that getting hit in the head by someone who downscales from you would lead to you falling down. No one is saying that she shouldn't scale, but hitting someone in the head and making them fall isn't grounds for full scaling at all, especially considering all the anti-feats.
 
TheMonkeMan said:
Technically it's durability and endurance to take like 4 ACoC hits and be relatively fine afterwards.
Click to expand...
True, but her Hao + Base still clashed with Hybrid Hao Kaido, even if she was still a bit inferior to him the whole fight.

Fireld said:
Momo's bones and jaw were making cracking sound when GB attacked him
Click to expand...
Didn't notice that (scans would be appreciated), but he still endured getting slammed into the ground by Greenbull IIRC, and wasn't even defending himself since he was busy sobbing that Yamato shouldn't intervene.
 
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