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One Piece downgrade thread

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Vzearr

Vzearr

He/Him
1,275
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Finally finished my Naruto thread, now I get to move onto one piece.

Calculation 1:​

Kaido's Thunder Bagua

The problems:​

1. It's calc stacking.
2. It's not actually a blitz? Why are we using blitz timeframes for something that isn't a blitz.

Calculation 2:​

Bajrang Gun

The problem:​

1. I don't believe it happens in 1 frame.

Calculation 3:​

Marco Dodges Queen's Beams

The problem:​

We don't actually have evidence that Marco did the full 180 degree spin before Queen's light beam got to his original position, the light beam was already on the ground and exploded when we see Marco finish his 180 degree spin. We also don't have evidence that Marco actually moved after the light beam was shot, so he could have moved before.

Calculation 4:​

Sanji dodges Queen's lasers

The problems/questions:​

Feat 1:
1. Pixel scaling to the height of his jump is baseless. Why not just pixel scale to the height of the highest laser that's moved the same distance as the furthest shot lasers? I don't really know how to explain it well sorry.

Basically pixel scaling to the height Sanji jumped is weird because we don't know if it happened in the timeframe of the first laser that was shot hitting Sanji's original position.
Screenshot_2024-02-16_133426s.png

I'm unsure about this one it's kinda confusing.
Feat 2:
1. Small complaint: It doesn't take a genius to realise the distance between Sanji and Queen is larger then 50cm.
2. The distance moved is a large highball without any evidence? Its literally "I think this happened so it happened". We don't know when nor how Sanji moved its as simple as that, lowballing it would be better, unless the anime provides evidence behind Sanji moving 2.82743338823 meters.

Feat 3:
Wouldn't this just be the rate of fire, not perception speed?

DISCLAIMER: Please don't be annoyed if some of my debunks and questions are bad, just tell me why they're bad.
 
Last edited:
Vzearr said:

Calculation 1:​

Kaido's Thunder Bagua

The problems:​

1. It's calc stacking.
2. It's not actually a blitz? Why are we using blitz timeframes for something that isn't a blitz.
Click to expand...
This calc shouldn't be brought up btw, there's an ongoing thread to determine whether or not such things would be calc stacking across all verses. And for the record, it's not a "blitz" timeframe, it's just from the fact that Luffy earlier considers light speed to be "too slow" and yet with Kaido's Thunder Bagua, a faster Luffy considers it "too fast" despite also seeing into the future
 
Hey a bit of advice mate. Since the issue you want to fix is entirely calc based these kinds of threads should be handled in Calc Group Discussions and not Content Revisions. Then once you establish a new/fixed calc you can make a Content Revision thread to apply the changes to the wiki.
 
Padaruyos said:
Hey a bit of advice mate. Since the issue you want to fix is entirely calc based these kinds of threads should be handled in Calc Group Discussions and not Content Revisions. Then once you establish a new/fixed calc you can make a Content Revision thread to apply the changes to the wiki.
Click to expand...
Yeah, already heard it. I can’t move it though.
 
Vzearr said:
Yeah, already heard it. I can’t move it though.
Click to expand...
You can ask a moderator to move it to the CGC section. I'm not sure if Thread Mods have the perms but Admins do. CGMs don't though.

Also, since I noticed you're also doing a Naruto downgrade thread. Don't start too many threads at once.

Edit: Yes Thread Mods do have the perms.
 
Vzearr said:
Finally finished my Naruto thread, now I get to move onto one piece.
Click to expand...

Your Naruto thread ain’t finished broski

Vzearr said:
Don’t jinx it. Even I’m a bit confused on the validity of my debunks.
Click to expand...

If you aren’t even sure about your reasonings why make a thread?



Don’t end up making too many threads.
 
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Vzearr said:

Calculation 2:​

Bajrang Gun

The problems/questions:​

1. I don't believe it happens in 1 frame.
2. Outlier? 40x increase. May be a non point. Saying it just incase.
3. How do we know the hollow to non hollow ratio?
Click to expand...
  1. Your Imgur compilation doesn't show the right part. This is the straight punch, not the 180 degree swing that happens (which does in fact happen in 1 frame). As you can see in your compilation, Luffy's fist is still there, meaning he hasn't done the swing yet.
  2. Considering the next highest tier is 6-A to 5-C and this is an ultimate attack that scales far above everything else in the series, I doubt it
  3. It's a standard assumption for this kinda thing. Much like how we typically assume 80% hollowness for the volume of a building.
 
This is about all I'll get to for the moment. I'll look at the 3rd and 4th calcs later, but I never actually evaluated those ones, so those will take some more time
 
CloverDragon03 said:
Your Imgur compilation doesn't show the right part. This is the straight punch, not the 180 degree swing that happens (which does in fact happen in 1 frame). As you can see in your compilation, Luffy's fist is still there, meaning he hasn't done the swing yet.
Click to expand...
Kaidos body is literally turning to the side and moving off screen, why would it be a straight punch.
CloverDragon03 said:
Considering the next highest tier is 6-A to 5-C and this is an ultimate attack that scales far above everything else in the series, I doubt it.
Click to expand...
Okay.
CloverDragon03 said:
It's a standard assumption for this kinda thing. Much like how we typically assume 80% hollowness for the volume of a building.
Click to expand...
Yeah but the calc assumes 20% hollowness, on what basis? Is there like a reason or is it just feeling.
 
Vzearr said:
Kaidos body is literally turning to the side and moving off screen, why would it be a straight punch.
Click to expand...
It's a straight punch to his cheek. You can see this because his head is moving straight out and Luffy's fist isn't turning like it would be if this was when it moved at 180 degrees.
Vzearr said:
Yeah but the calc assumes 20% hollowness, on what basis? Is there like a reason or is it just feeling.
Click to expand...
If you close your fist right now, you'll see that there is very little hollowness to it (as opposed to a building which is mostly hollow). The exact figure isn't set in stone, but it doesn't change much to begin with.
 
CloverDragon03 said:
It's a straight punch to his cheek. You can see this because his head is moving straight out and Luffy's fist isn't turning like it would be if this was when it moved at 180 degrees.
Click to expand...
If Luffy’s fist wasn’t turning, Kaido wouldn’t move to the edge of the screen.
 
KLOL506 said:
I assume square-cube law won't work here?
Click to expand...
Not sure how you'd go about that
Vzearr said:
If Luffy’s fist wasn’t turning, Kaido wouldn’t move to the edge of the screen.
Click to expand...
Not sure what you're trying to argue here, but if you look at the video frame by frame, you'll see that Luffy's fist doesn't turn at all. The camera simply zooms in on Kaido, and then in the very next possible frame, we see that Luffy's arm moved 180 degrees
 
Arceus0x said:
Technically the fist being rubber pumped with air makes it more hollow
Click to expand...
Yeah.
CloverDragon03 said:
Not sure what you're trying to argue here, but if you look at the video frame by frame, you'll see that Luffy's fist doesn't turn at all. The camera simply zooms in on Kaido, and then in the very next possible frame, we see that Luffy's arm moved 180 degrees
Click to expand...
Do we have any reason to believe the one frame thing isn’t just a budget saver?
 
SlendVeny said:
Yeah, but then the density is also altered by G5's use of G4 effects, the Haki is added onto it, etc.
Click to expand...
Even just pumping air makes Luffy's fist way more powerful. Gigant Pistol broke Lucci's Tekkai when not even Jet Bazooka could. That's without any Haki shenanigans.

So either this is one of those rubber imagination abilities his DF gave or Luffy is pumping so much air it's actually compressed inside Luffy's fist and makes it much more dense.
 
Padaruyos said:
Even just pumping air makes Luffy's fist way more powerful. Gigant Pistol broke Lucci's Tekkai when not even Jet Bazooka could. That's without any Haki shenanigans.

So either this is one of those rubber imagination abilities his DF gave or Luffy is pumping so much air it's actually compressed inside Luffy's fist and makes it much more dense.
Click to expand...
I think it's the second one, considering the weird stuff it originally made his body go through.
 
Vzearr said:
What would you suggest? A thread per calc? Or a thread for speed calcs and one for Ap?
Click to expand...
Either of those sounds better. I'm just a little mindful of how this may get bogged down with discussion.

I'll give my thoughts on the calcs in the OP later today.
 
Damage3245 said:
Making a thread for four unrelated calcs at once doesn't seem like a great idea.
Click to expand...
Damage popped in to disagree immediately after being mentioned. Curious.

I'm actually kind of curious about this. What makes calcs related? Like, what's our threshold? Obviously it's a case-by-case basis, but typically, would it be like, same arc, same character, that kinda thing?
 
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