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One Piece: Black Hole Mechanics

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@Romeu08 Controlling who he can target with his gravity is a very different argument to saying he can moderate the output of gravity to only slightly destroy a town instead of completely destroying it.

1- Its stated inside the series and by the author himself he can control the yield of the darkness

You have the scans for this I presume?
 
All of you never considered that the town BB crushed was a higher D town:rolleyes: Classic OP downplayers.

On a more serious note here my own irrelevant opinion after reading the 4 pages of this : i tend to lean toward the opposition. I think they have better arguments and the fact that despite multiples uses of his fruit, BB never displayed anything like the level of destruction/power the statements he make imply.

Not to mention, that if his darkness had that much mass, what use would WB fruit be to him ? He would merely have to slam a bit of darkness on the ground to create much more powerfull earthquakes than WB or BW could ever hope to do with it.

Again

1- He can control what his fruit will do, if he chose to only Destroy X he will only Destroy X, there is literally 0 reason in the series for him to go all out and destroy everything around him because:
A- he would Destroy his crew
B- kill ace someone he needed to capture alive for his plan to work

So why its so surprising that a Guy who can control the yield of his power decides to not go all out for no reason?

The stuff about whitebeard is like asking why kizaru does not find the one piece if he's lightspeed

The gura gura no mi has a more directed and precise earthquake than bb would achieve by "punching the ground" there's is no point in destroying your own ship, Island, crew and half a sea to hit a target when the gura gura could do the same with less colateral damage

We also don't know if there's something special about wb fruit that will be useful for him
 
@Romeu08 Controlling who he can target with his gravity is a very different argument to saying he can moderate the output of gravity to only slightly destroy a town instead of completely destroying it.



You have the scans for this I presume?
Don't you see how its correlated? He's able to bring the gravity of it down to 0 allowing even fodders to not be harmed them amp it massively depending on what he needs to do

There's 0 contradictions about what his upper limit is and his smaller showing were all explained and contextualized in the series, the fact he didn't completely destroyed the town is simply that wans't his goal and his intentions could be showing off his pocket "dimension"

And for the scans check KingTempest reply
 
Don't you see how its correlated? He's able to bring the gravity of it down to 0 allowing even fodders to not be harmed them amp it massively depending on what he needs to do

That explanation doesn't make any sense. If the gravity of Blackbeard's darkness isn't conditional on the mass at all, but just on whatever Blackbeard feels like it should be then the calc itself has no basis.

There's 0 contradictions about what his upper limit is and his smaller showing were all explained and contextualized in the series, the fact he didn't completely destroyed the town is simply that wans't his goal and his intentions could be showing off his pocket "dimension"

Or it's because that level of destruction would have taken place either way and Blackbeard was just showing Ace what happened to the town he destroyed.

And for the scans check KingTempest reply

So you don't have any scans?
 
@Romeu08 Controlling who he can target with his gravity is a very different argument to saying he can moderate the output of gravity to only slightly destroy a town instead of completely destroying it.
I tackled this and you completely ignored it
 
Not to mention, that if his darkness had that much mass, what use would WB fruit be to him ? He would merely have to slam a bit of darkness on the ground to create much more powerfull earthquakes than WB or BW could ever hope to do with it.
why doesnt kizaru just blip around the world to find the one piece in a matter of hours?
 
That explanation doesn't make any sense. If the gravity of Blackbeard's darkness isn't conditional on the mass at all, but just on whatever Blackbeard feels like it should be then the calc itself has no basis.



Or it's because that level of destruction would have taken place either way and Blackbeard was just showing Ace what happened to the town he destroyed. GG



So you don't have any scans?
Yes, Blackbeard can control his Devil fruit power
He decides what the output will be and what will happen when he unleashes his darkness
He explicitly stated that he can control what will be affected or not as even tho his darkness was surrounding ace he did not get dragged in even tho later in the fight ace was getting thrown around by BB vortexs

He also made his crew walk across his darkness unscathed even tho at the same time the marines were getting sucked in

KingTempest calculations don't rely on any unfounded assumptions, he's using the information provided by DATABOOKS and volume statements by the author himself

The only thing happening here in an argument of incredulity around how much control blackbeard has over his own Power... Something never contradicted in any way shape or form.

 
He decides what the output will be and what will happen when he unleashes his darkness
He explicitly stated that he can control what will be affected or not as even tho his darkness was surrounding ace he did not get dragged in even tho later in the fight ace was getting thrown around by BB vortexs

He also made his crew walk across his darkness unscathed even tho at the same time the marines were getting sucked in

Again, controlling what will be affected or not is not the same thing as controlling the yield of the ability.
 
Again, controlling what will be affected or not is not the same thing as controlling the yield of the ability.
💀
So lets ignore all the dozens of scans provided by me tempest moron and others

Do you have any scan that implies blackbeard not being able to control the yield of his ability? For now all his feats seem consistent so maybe you have something we haven't seen yet
 
I mean, with everything we know about Blackbeard's Devil Fruit, him having the ability to control the output of its gravitational force would be well within his capabilities. If he's manipulating the structure itself so it's unaffective against those he chooses then that same rule should apply to the amount of force it generates when affecting others as well since both qualities should be brought about through the same means. This is especially so since we have countless statements of Blackbeard's Devil Fruit having immense gravitational force that's well above the amount of damage it has caused.

You would have to discount all of those statements as hyperbolic by using evidence that doesn't inherently contradict the interpretation. It's just you providing another interpretation, which isn't an argument, it's a claim.

It also doesn't make sense that this character, regardless of personal interpretations of his power level and such, should be above the needed threshold to completely pulverize old, wooden structures. Unless you're making the argument that Blackbeard's main offensive tool is lesser than Buggy's explosions, using this as evidence is shaky at best.
 
If he's manipulating the structure itself so it's unaffective against those he chooses then that same rule should apply to the amount of force it generates when affecting others as well since both qualities should be brought about through the same structure.
Why? It doesn't seem like one has anything to do with the other.

Controlling the gravity to attack Ace or not is an all-or-nothing situation. The gravity can go from affecting his targets to not affecting his targets.

That isn't the same thing as him deciding, for example, to hit Ace with just 25% of the gravity that his mass should generate. That is something that I don't think it's been shown that Blackbeard can conclusively do.
 
Why? It doesn't seem like one has anything to do with the other.

Controlling the gravity to attack Ace or not is an all-or-nothing situation. The gravity can go from affecting his targets to not affecting his targets.

That isn't the same thing as him deciding, for example, to hit Ace with just 25% of the gravity that his mass should generate. That is something that I don't think it's been shown that Blackbeard can conclusively do.
We aren't arguing on what's conclusive evidence or not, we're arguing on interpretations. The interpretation you're presenting requires us to completely discount all of the countless statements made by knowledgeable characters and even the author themselves about the strength of Blackbeard's Devil Fruit as hyperbolic because it has supposed contradictory feats.

The problem with this interpretation is that it doesn't actually have good evidence supporting it, all of the evidence behind it has other logical explanations as to why it didn't completely destroy this structure or person, that are more probable and don't inherently contradict any statements made.

It's as simple as more evidence supports that side and that side doesn't actively contradict a consistent narrative about the power of Blackbeard's Devil Fruit.
 
We aren't arguing on what's conclusive evidence or not, we're arguing on interpretations. The interpretation you're presenting requires us to completely discount all of the countless statements made by knowledgeable characters and even the author themselves about the strength of Blackbeard's Devil Fruit as hyperbolic because it has supposed contradictory feats.
Blackbeard states he compresses objects with infinite power. If we're taking this to be non-hyperbolic, wouldn't this mean he has infinite AP?
 
Blackbeard states he compresses objects with infinite power. If we're taking this to be non-hyperbolic, wouldn't this mean he has infinite AP?
Not inherently since "infinite" used in both statements doesn't inherently mean true infinity, "infinite" could just mean vast or great in scope/power. It all depends on the context, of which in either scenario, it still paints a picture that Blackbeard's Devil Fruit is incredibly powerful and holds immense gravitational force.

My post wasn't in reference to the semantics of the stated strength itself, but rather the interpretation that Blackbeard can't control the force of his gravity because of this supposed contradictory evidence. I had an issue with your interpretation in regards to control, not in regards to strength.
 
Not inherently since "infinite" used in both statements doesn't inherently mean true infinity, "infinite" could just mean vast or great in scope/power. It all depends on the context, of which in either scenario, it still paints a picture that Blackbeard's Devil Fruit is incredibly powerful and holds immense gravitational force.

My post wasn't in reference to the semantics of the stated strength itself, but rather the interpretation that Blackbeard can't control the force of his gravity because of this supposed contradictory evidence. I had an issue with your interpretation in regards to control, not in regards to strength.
Okay. Cool.
 
Can't he control the yield? He can make it to where he can pulverize buildings but choose to not pierce guards' skin
The bazooka troops are shown to be injured by being immersed in his darkness, and same for the guards at the prison entrance. It doesn't look like he "chose to not pierce their skin" as you phrased it.

Idk why damage asked this question again when he had accepted it before on page 1-2

Because as far as I can tell, we're talking about different things whereas to you it is the same thing.
 
Is there any other objection for this calc going through?
Seems like all of them got adressed already
 
Is there any other objection for this calc going through?
Seems like all of them got adressed already
Just because they were responded to doesn't mean the objections no longer exist.

Weren't they hurt by being thrown by him tho
I doubt being amidst all this fragments would be good for a person
No. I don't think there's anything suggesting the throw is what hurts them... They all appeared injured before they land.
 
Well the vote is still 3-2 against the thread, I think people are waiting for DT and others to comment again after the ongoing debate from the last few pages (story of OP calc threads ong), so ig it’s be patient and wait
 
I believe basically everything has been addressed and debated to death to be honest. So I'm personally fine with ending the debate here. We just need more calc group members to comment on this thread since we don't have enough votes either way to have an actual validated conclusion.
 
No. I don't think there's anything suggesting the throw is what hurts them... They all appeared injured before they land.
1- The bazooka troops were already being attacked and being injured by blackbeard crew wayyy before he even did any attack[1] they were also offscreened so we can't know what exactly happened but its heavily implied Shiryu helped the bb pirates defeat them thus explaining the injuries of the rest[2]



2- The gates guards were literally thrown to the ground at a high speed in the middle of thousands of tons of steel rocks and fragments, its logical to assume being in the middle of a literal shrapnel storm would injury some of them
 
@Romeu08; if that's your interpretation then fair enough. I don't see it the same way you do.
 
@Romeu08; if that's your interpretation then fair enough. I don't see it the same way you do.
I would agree with being an interpretation if we didn't have enough information to make an objective statement
But that's not the case we are explicitly shown the marines being punched, shot and injured on-screen

so i would appreciate you to send some scan that can support your subjective view or otherwise concede on this point
 
Discord debate mfs, when people agree to disagree rather than debate in circles ^

Like clearly you don’t think the opposition has substantiated their claim and same goes for the opposition towards you, repeating the same arguments over and over again ain’t changing that dude. Ain’t anyone have to concede shit lol, you’ll just have to accept that
 
@Romeu08; I'm not particularly interested in trying to convince you on this point.

But when it comes to the bazooka troops, we're shown them being directly absorbed without being beaten up first.

The ones you posted above of them being punched and shot and injured on-screen aren't actually shown being absorbed by Blackbeard.

So will you concede on that point?
And then shot back out for liberation iirc. As we established, liberation is used for projectile attacks and not crushing.
 
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