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Naruto to Boruto Discussion Thread

MinatoSparkle said:
Based on the site stats sure

Base BoS Sasuke blitzed Naruto and Sakura, 3T Hebi Sasuke blitzed Suigetsu and Jugo (not just with Shunshin either since he wrapped them with snakes) and almost blitzed Deidara, Sasori blitzed Sakura, Kakuzu blitzed Asuma and in his merged state seemed to blitz Kakashi Ino and Choji, Gaara's sand perception blitzed Cee, Minato blitzed Mahiru, 3T Itachi blitzed Kakashi, no one seemed to see V1 Ay dashing away from Jugo's blasts, Armless Orochimaru blitzed Yamato, I could go on and on there are a ridiculous number of blitzes that Kage level characters perform on High Jonin level and higher characters.

Asuma is one of the strongest jonin and Hidan is the slowest Akatsuki member, not very analogous. And he couldn't even keep up with Base Kakuzu who I'd argue is the second slowest member.

Considering how many speed gaps there are between Early Shippuden Kakashi and Kirin/KM0 Mifune/P1 Itachi, it kinda is. Also either way that doesn't change my point later in the comment about lightning speed.
Click to expand...
Let's tackle them one by one.

1. Naruto doesn’t even have a scale putting him at Base to high jonin. The dude is irrelevant to your point. Sakura on the other hand at that point in the series is dependent solely on shunsin to keep up with others really due to her battle style of focusing chakra on her hands and legs. In essence 2 of them don't even qualify for high jonin in that state for speed. Take a look at other 2 there. Sai had no problem following Sasuke movement and was even the one that stopped his attack. Sai isn't even a high jonin. Yamato kept up with sasuke fully no problem. Only thing he said was sasuke was fast, that's all.

2. He never blitzed jugo and suigetsu. He was just faster. Their shock was due to his intense bloodlust and being able to casually stop their attacks. Read suigetsu comment after the scan. Nothing about speed. Also stop categorising all akatsuki and all kage at same level. It just makes you more confused. If you didn't you won't have this confusion honestly.

3. Almost blitzed Deidara? Right in your scan deidara foot is already in the air before sasuke can even get there. And specifically stated he was using shunshin.

4. Not only has that Sakura been so injured she had lost use of one hand, so many injuries everywhere and was infected with poison so this is not a good scan but she did actually slightly dodge. It was going for her heart. She then got up and managed to save chino from sasori. Read the next few pages.
Sakura even seems to think like me considering the things she considered setting her apart from sasori was battle experience and skill.

5. Scan doesn't work
6. That's not a blitz. Not even close, they were weakened, he grabbed them. Also ino is definitely not a high jonin.

7. Not every question mark is a blitz. They were suprised as to where the sand came from dude come on. Also are we talking about the sand fast enough to block amaterasu? I'm sure you're not implying cee should be able to react to that speed right?

8. No evidence of mahiru being a high jonin. And minato is the fastest of the fastest even among kages. Bad example

9. The healthy version of the guy that reacted to the impossible light speed kirin? Hell no , bad example. Dude is well into kage level. Bro actually whoops most of the kages.

10. I think in the midst of the blinding light of jugo blast it might be hard to miss the guy that is the highest of the highest among kages in speed and not akatsuki level. It's funny coz 2 panels before jugo reacted to and blocked his attack.

11. This is definitely not a blitz. You're throwing blitz around too much. Orochimaro came from behind, yamato was like "ah he's been followed". I see no blitz.

From this discussion I've realised there are 2 things making you not see our point of view.

A.. You're categorising all jonins together. Don't do that at all. There is a reason I didn't say jonin but I said high jonin. I was specifically trying to highlight that among the jonin there are people that clearly stand out and those ones have no problem keeping up with akatsuki and not just random fodder like you bringing Base naruto or ino

B. You're categorising all akatsuki together. Please take away obito, pain and itachi and go and put them among kages. They are akatsuki but clearly not just akatsuki level. Actually add kisame too.

C. Kage level ≠ akatsuki level. Sure at the low and high ends of the respective 2 there might be little to no difference but generally there is a difference. Coz tell me why you're expecting High jonin to keep up with one of the fastest kages in the series or expecting them to react with an healthy itachi who is faster than 90% of the current kages there.


And finally in fiction 50 times speed difference is ridiculous. You can be blitzed by a 2 times speed difference. So saying lightning to light speed isn't a ridiculous difference doesn't make sense.
I stand on my point. High jonin characters have no Problem at all keeping up with akatsuki level characters
 
NeoKingOfLight said:
Well, the Quiz Book says, “Speed and Effort”.

Idk if that matters though.

Edit: Just reread it. There is no comma between, “Effort Enough”, so the reference isn’t in regard to speed nor does it draw an equivalence between Speed and the Effort that is bending space.
Click to expand...
MinatoSparkle said:
You could read it as either speed and effort enough or speed and effort enough
Click to expand...
Why Guy's speed would be FTL instead of just relativistic is my question. I thought bending space is done using Einstein's General Relativity theory. There's no FTL in that. Guy in theory would need huge amounts of inertial mass to replicate the effect that celestial bodies have on space-time. For that to happen, he needs to move at high speeds, or somehow increase his mass using his chakra or power or sumn. But at best it would be relativistic iirc.
 
HelloThere1089 said:
Remember the time when Deidara blasted in Hebi Sasuke's ass? Good times.
Click to expand...
art is an explosion

N4t4bpK.png
 
Yeah, I concede that Naruto Characters aren’t durable to Cutting/piercing attacks outside of Cloaks and Special Cases.

Gaara’s Sand Shurikens are implied to be able to cut through steel, and Naruto tanked them in Chunin Exams (And this is before his Mental Amp). Anyone who scales over that version of Naruto, cutting/piercing them would automatically scale you over the level required to cut steel…

Base TYBW Kenpachi can’t cut Naruto 💀

Edit: Did I say that right? 🤔
 
ssgengar said:
So with the water fang bullets can we use lightning speed? Or does it seem more hyperbolic the way it’s stated
Click to expand...
Here on this site, as far as I know, texts in bold are considered "hype texts". So it is not taken into account. I don't know if it's a rule, but I read this in a thread in the past.

But if you want an opinion from someone who understands a little bit of Japanese (I studied a little and I have a fluent friend).There is no hyperbole in the sentence about speed.
 
Whether or not the statement is hyperbolic is debatable. Anyone who tells you it is objectively hyperbolic or not is just lying to you. Just as “he flew at the speed of light” can be literal or hyperbolic depending on context, so can Itachi’s water bullet statement.
 
The_one_you_least_expect said:
Do we just assume that all the LS statements are hyperboles cuz I’m pretty sure there’s a couple floating around
Click to expand...
No, rn Kirin’s are accepted as literal, Mifune’s is as well, and then obviously Light Fang is. It’s all context dependent. Rn on wiki we accept that the most consistent speed tier for like high/top tiers in Shippuden is lightning speed, so we look at the other statements in the light of that.
 
Apollonir.Scale said:
Sasuke's Kirin, Haku, and Mifune's LS expression were not seen as exaggerations, but were considered not to measure up to the other characters. Only Attack Speeds are LS
Click to expand...
Arc7Kuroi said:
No, rn Kirin’s are accepted as literal, Mifune’s is as well, and then obviously Light Fang is. It’s all context dependent. Rn on wiki we accept that the most consistent speed tier for like high/top tiers in Shippuden is lightning speed, so we look at the other statements in the light of that.
Click to expand...
Then shouldn’t itachi have LS reaction speed? And what about the laser circus statement?
 
Arc7Kuroi said:
Whether or not the statement is hyperbolic is debatable. Anyone who tells you it is objectively hyperbolic or not is just lying to you. Just as “he flew at the speed of light” can be literal or hyperbolic depending on context, so can Itachi’s water bullet statement.
Click to expand...
Not exactly. There are ways to say speed of light in a hyperbolic context, you can see a hyperbolic sentence or text according to the way it was written. In Itachi's sentence specifically, the only argument for it to be hyperbolic is that it is written in bold text. Because the way the sentence is there is no indication of hyperbole.
 
GTsek said:
Not exactly. There are ways to say speed of light in a hyperbolic context, you can see a hyperbolic sentence or text according to the way it was written. In Itachi's sentence specifically, the only argument for it to be hyperbolic is that it is written in bold text. Because the way the sentence is there is no indication of hyperbole.
Click to expand...
You’re wrong. Because the sentence doesn’t need to be structured in any specific way to be hyperbolic. It’s context dependent, as Japanese is a very context dependent language, you’re not going to get a special character used that always denotes hyperbole or not.
 
There are better ways to find a consistent relativistic scale for Mid/top tiers. Haku coming out of the mirrors is SoL on the site, and the base Lee and Guy react to his movement in the war. I asked Arc to calc it a while ago but I forgot to remember him.
 
Arc7Kuroi said:
You can argue his Susanoo can form itself at comparable speeds but it doesn’t scale anywhere. Laser circus violates our laser beam standards for light speed.
Click to expand...
Itachi would still need to consciously activate the the technique so his reaction speed should be LS. Ya cuz they move weirdly but isn’t that due to darwi controlling them?
 
Arc7Kuroi said:
You’re wrong. Because the sentence doesn’t need to be structured in any specific way to be hyperbolic. It’s context dependent, as Japanese is a very context dependent language, you’re not going to get a special character used that always denotes hyperbole or not.
Click to expand...
Yes, it is possible. Because there are certain ways to use "speed of light" in a hyperbolic tone. You can also check the ways in which the text is structured, and whether it makes any sense in terms of technique or character. For example, Itachi's text says nothing other than "Bullets emerge from the water and travel towards the enemy at the speed of light". There is no way to see a hyperbole here, the onus is on whoever indicates that it is a Hyperbole, if he cannot, then there is no reason for us to consider it a hyperbole.
 
Arc7Kuroi said:
Formation speed =/= activation speed
Click to expand...
He reacted to it regardless so idk why your trying to downplay it
Testarossa002 said:
More like perception speed
But like I said a few pages ago, it's not really useful in the long run as nobody moves FTE to either him or EMS Sasuke
Didn't crosscheck the Juubito stuff so I may be wrong
Click to expand...
Ya which scales to his reaction speed. That’s kind of a big thing with the shargian as shown in sasuke fight with Naruto.
 
GTsek said:
Yes, it is possible. Because there are certain ways to use "speed of light" in a hyperbolic tone. You can also check the ways in which the text is structured, and whether it makes any sense in terms of technique or character. For example, Itachi's text says nothing other than "Bullets emerge from the water and travel towards the enemy at the speed of light". There is no way to see a hyperbole here, the onus is on whoever indicates that it is a Hyperbole, if he cannot, then there is no reason for us to consider it a hyperbole.
Click to expand...
Your translation is misleading. A more proper translation would go as follows: “Light speed bullets produced from water emerge from the blind spot to gouge out the opponent”. But regardless, yes you can deduce either translation to be hyperbolic or literal depending on the context. It is not be default either. Again you are wrong.
 
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