Naruto: Kaguya Otsutsuki Regeneration Downgrade

[KLOL506]

She isn't at the epicenter. The epicenter would be the center of the actual ball. The ball was already like a tenth of the planet, it's impossible for her to be at the epicenter for something that big unless she broke inside the ball and stood in the middle of it

Remember my points about bombs like nukes themselves being too big to allow being at the epicenter? The shelling alone would never let you be in the dead center of the explosion's origin point, which would be the uranium cores situated somewhere in the middle of the missle shaft, protected by layers of metal casing. Similar case here.

There would be a point if she held the Orb in its smallest state right before it detonated (Like for example, it being hand-grenade-sized), but not here.

 

[Tdjwo]

Kaguya having such a high level regeneration never made sense me.

If it was that good then she wouldn't have been profusely bleeding and armless after Naruto tore it off. She literally shows no actual "regeneration" when she is injured and is instead ducking Sasuke right after. Then Naruto hits her and she still isn't regenerating her missing arm, why?

Like, literally turn on your brain and think about this. If Kaguya's regeneration was that good, why didn't she just easily regenerate her arm after Naruto tore it off? There's no logical reason behind that.

Or how about this, what did Team 7's plan of getting Naruto to tag Kaguya rely on?

It relied on Kaguya's arm being injured and unable to move after Kakashi cut it!

If Kaguya had such a high regeneration, this entire plan would have been worthless.
Therefore, it's clearly not that good or it is at least limited.

I agree with @KingTempest and their thread. I also agree with @Damage3245 and their suggestion for a new regeneration rating.

Kaguya, at the very least, has a limited form of regeneration as the only time she ever regenerated an injury was after she transformed. Even if she is not downgraded, she absolutely needs a LIMITED description since she only regenerates after transforming. Clearly after two important moments that she should've regenerated in, but does not, proves her regeneration is limited.

It's very easy to dismiss all of this as "Kaguya's chakra was massively depleted"

 

[KingTempest]

It's very easy to dismiss all of this as "Kaguya's chakra was massively depleted"

the weakest mfs in Naruto can heal but Kaguya with the most chakra in the series who has enough chakra to utilize ninjutsu strong enough to take down a susanoo can't heal an arm

okay now

 

[LordGinSama]

Wait a minute.

Six Paths users are resistant to the effects of TSB / TSB don't affect the user since they need to actively decide to erase things / destroy matter? Hence why Sakura wasn't automatically ****** by getting stabbed by one.



So why would the ETSB even affect Kaguya to begin with? Naruto literally kicked one away. She has six Paths Chakra correct?

 

[KingTempest]

Wait a minute.

Six Paths users are resistant to the effects of TSB / TSB don't affect the user since they need to actively decide to erase things / destroy matter?

they're resistant cause of the six paths chakra they got

Hence why Sakura wasn't automatically ****** by getting stabbed by one.

It's specifically the area it touches, which is why slashes like Madara slashing off Minato's arm slashed through the whole arm, but stabs like Sakura's only destroyed the specific portion it touched

So why would the ETSB even affect Kaguya to begin with? Naruto literally kicked one away. She has six Paths Chakra correct?

yeah, they're saying the AP of its expansion would **** her up apparently

they aren't affected by its insta dusting but they're hurt by the AP of it being used like a baseball bat

 

[KingTempest]

Remember my points about bombs like nukes themselves being too big to allow being at the epicenter? The shelling alone would never let you be in the dead center of the explosion's origin point, which would be the uranium cores situated somewhere in the middle of the missle shaft, protected by layers of metal casing. Similar case here.

There would be a point if she held the Orb in its smallest state right before it detonated (Like for example, it being hand-grenade-sized), but not here.

So it was either "Scale to the full yield for no reason" or "Regen from pulv for more reasons"
Okay

So since we can't quantify the yield of the boom, I'll scale the expansion to its creation of the new dimension.
The distance between the earth and the sun for the calc (basically the radius of the ETSB) is 1.496E+11 meters.
The energy to create the whole new dimension is 1.1184707e+42 Joules
Utilizing the inverse square law to see how much she'd take.
Yield of explosion / [surface area of sphere] * CA of character.
(1.1184707e42) / [4 *pi * ((1.496e11)^2]) * 0.68 = 2.7043349e+18 joules
2.7043349e+18 joules, or 646 Megatons. Mountain level.

So Kaguya would need to regenerate from being turned to dust after getting hit with a mountain level attack. Okay.

 

[LordGinSama]

yeah, they're saying the AP of its expansion would **** her up apparently

It's literally only that high because of the matter manipulation, which Kaguya should be resistant to.


although I think the calculation should be thrown away all together given that it's Erasure of time and space. It's either EE or Deconstruction.

 

[KingTempest]

It's literally only that high because of the matter manipulation, which Kaguya should be resistant to.

not only, it has a dimensional creation statement

although I think the calculation should be thrown away all together given that it's Erasure of time and space. It's either EE or Deconstruction.

the calc is the "creation of the new timespace" they scale to, although this not the thread to tackle that

 

[KLOL506]

Utilizing the inverse square law to see how much she'd take.
Yield of explosion / [surface area of sphere] * CA of character.
(1.1184707e42) / [4 *pi * ((1.496e11)^2]) * 0.68 = 2.7043349e+18 joules
2.7043349e+18 joules, or 646 Megatons. Mountain level.

Wrong formula.

This is the right one:

Intensity in TNT per m^2 = (Yield in Tons of TNT) / (4 * pi * ((Distance from Epicenter in meters)^2))

Basically, inverse-square law is moot if you cannot find the distance between Kaguya and the epicenter of the ETSB.

Then you need to multiply the intensity with the CA (Cross-sectional area, not surface area), which is 40-50% that of Kaguya.

The 0.68 m^2 cross-sectional area is that of a male, so best to find Kaguya's individual rating for this.

 

[ArcaneAbyss]

Kaguya having such a high level regeneration never made sense me.

If it was that good then she wouldn't have been profusely bleeding and armless after Naruto tore it off. She literally shows no actual "regeneration" when she is injured and is instead ducking Sasuke right after. Then Naruto hits her and she still isn't regenerating her missing arm, why?

Like, literally turn on your brain and think about this. If Kaguya's regeneration was that good, why didn't she just easily regenerate her arm after Naruto tore it off? There's no logical reason behind that.

Or how about this, what did Team 7's plan of getting Naruto to tag Kaguya rely on?

It relied on Kaguya's arm being injured and unable to move after Kakashi cut it!

If Kaguya had such a high regeneration, this entire plan would have been worthless.
Therefore, it's clearly not that good or it is at least limited.

I agree with @KingTempest and their thread. I also agree with @Damage3245 and their suggestion for a new regeneration rating.

Kaguya, at the very least, has a limited form of regeneration as the only time she ever regenerated an injury was after she transformed. Even if she is not downgraded, she absolutely needs a LIMITED description since she only regenerates after transforming. Clearly after two important moments that she should've regenerated in, but does not, proves her regeneration is limited.

The fact she was expressly stated to be low on chakra already debunks this entire thing, she completely reformed her body from a pure chakra state after absorbing more chakra from the IT

Also she is not the first person to have a delayed healing, juubidara didn't regrow his lower side after being cut apart

Now take your own advice and think about how she would have survived her own etsb explosion if she couldn't regenerate or how....if she her regeneration was so weak, that Hamura and hagoromo made a specific seal JUST for her? OR the fact that her immortality was expressly stated as the reason the ETSB wouldn't kill her?

Wait a minute.

Six Paths users are resistant to the effects of TSB / TSB don't affect the user since they need to actively decide to erase things / destroy matter? Hence why Sakura wasn't automatically ****** by getting stabbed by one.



So why would the ETSB even affect Kaguya to begin with? Naruto literally kicked one away. She has six Paths Chakra correct?

Because she's not immune to the AP of its explosion/expansion, no one is

Juubito had to block his own tsb expansion as well

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

I see that I've been quoted a fair number of times since I made my post, and that KT has responded to me. That's great.
I'm currently having a wrestling match with real life, so I won't be able to get back to y'all soon quite frankly.
If y'all want to conclude this thread quickly, then I suggest y'all do so without me, and then I'll eventually revisit the topic when I'm able. If y'all don't have a problem waiting for a bit, that's cool too. I'll get to it as soon as I'm able.

 

[DaReaperMan]

I see that I've been quoted a fair number of times since I made my post, and that KT has responded to me. That's great.
I'm currently having a wrestling match with real life, so I won't be able to get back to y'all soon quite frankly.
If y'all want to conclude this thread quickly, then I suggest y'all do so without me, and then I'll eventually revisit the topic when I'm able. If y'all don't have a problem waiting for a bit, that's cool too. I'll get to it as soon as I'm able.

Well, get to suplexing! See you round

 

[UchihaSlayer96]

Well, get to suplexing! See you round

Omw to deliver the People's Elbow to that mf and give them a one way ticket to Suplex City!

 

[KingogKings777]

I'll wait to see what KingTempest has to say in his full response - but I personally don't consider this to be straightforward regeneration.

I think that characters could transform themselves into an "energy"/chakra state and transform back into their flesh-and-blood body and it could count purely as just a Transformation and not a form of Regeneration.

If a character for example had the ability to liquify their body and then turn back into a solid, I wouldn't automatically give them Low-High regeneration. Regeneration is primarily the ability to recover from wounds. The turning into water and then back to normal is not doing that. For another example I wouldn't say that Buggy the Clown has Regeneration either just because he can be "reduced to pieces" and then return back to normal.

I know there's a lot more to your post than just this, but I wouldn't to focus in on this line and try to explain my point of view on it a little.

Wouldn't that be unconventional regeneration or something?

 

[KingogKings777]

1. Because neither she, nor anyone is immune to tsb attacks? having access to senjutsu just allows you come in physical contact without being EE'd, both juubidara and juubito weren't immune to their TSBs, her arm was literally stabbed though by Naruto's tsb

Don't we see Naruto flat out kick one away in base or something? And proceeds to coat his fist in chakra and punch Madara's staff? The part about cutting her arm off we don't see a TSO cutting it at all.

 

[Ayewale]

Disagree with the downgrade, mostly thanks to Slayer's posts. Maybe Kaguya's regeneration should be 'limited' in some form but, eh.

 

[ArcaneAbyss]

Don't we see Naruto flat out kick one away in base or something? And proceeds to coat his fist in chakra and punch Madara's staff? The part about cutting her arm off we don't see a TSO cutting it at all.

Six paths senjutsu users can make contact with the orbs without being vanished, they can't however ignore attacks with the orb that would dwarf their durability.
Naruto kicked the orb away simply because it's AP wasn't high enough to harm him, Madara was trying to kill a guy who was turning to dust...note how Madara chooses to evade the tsb being kicked back at him showing he wouldn't have shrugged it off

 

[KingogKings777]

Bump?

 

[YungManzi]

This the real question

I think an easy counter is just the context of how the regen is treated and talked about in-verse.

Like, if Viktor really had better regen than Kaguya and co. there's literally no reason why people would talk about his regen like it's some kind of inferior technique and hype up Kaguya and others regen as "immortal".

 

[KingTempest]

I think an easy counter is just the context of how the regen is treated and talked about in-verse.

Like, if Viktor really had better regen than Kaguya and co. there's literally no reason why people would talk about his regen like it's some kind of inferior technique and hype up Kaguya and others regen as "immortal".

Victor instantly regrew a head and instantly regrew his arms
Victor's scales to Boro's who regrew his head, entire upper body, and entire lower body
Victor's regen was only bad to him cause he couldn't regrow specific parts gained prior to his regeneration like his eye and leg
Victor could regrow his head but not his previous eye, and he scales to Boro who regrew his bottom half but he couldn't regen his previous leg

Kaguya couldn't regrow an arm

Spare me the bs

 

[Trihexa102]

Victor instantly regrew a head and instantly regrew his arms
Victor's scales to Boro's who regrew his head, entire upper body, and entire lower body
Victor's regen was only bad to him cause he couldn't regrow specific parts gained prior to his regeneration like his eye and leg
Victor could regrow his head but not his previous eye, and he scales to Boro who regrew his bottom half but he couldn't regen his previous leg

Kaguya couldn't regrow an arm

Spare me the bs

I think what he means is contextually Kags scales above them , which isn't bs if you look at it from a logical stand-point.

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

I think what he means is contextually Kags scales above them

That's what KT is arguing against. Merely stating the opposing premise to KT isn't really furthering this discussion in a productive way. Everyone participating here, especially KT, is aware of the premises at play.

 

[Damage3245]

For the record I'm still most in favor of my suggestion here.

 

[KingTempest]

I think what he means is contextually Kags scales above them , which isn't bs if you look at it from a logical stand-point.

The dude has shown damn near every regeneration possible, and the only thing he can't regenerate is his eye and leg

He said "If I get the god tree, I can heal my eye and leg", but he could already regrow his entire head and not his eye

It isn't a matter of level of regeneration, especially when he shows better feats, and he doesn't even mention Kaguya
It's the matter of his regrowing the things he had prior to his ability

That's like saying you can regenerate your entire arm but a slash mark on your arm is still there, and because you need something for that specific slash mark, that it's a different story

 

[KingTempest]

For the record I'm still most in favor of my suggestion here.

I'm fine with that, we're referencing her regular healing factor

 

[Trihexa102]

The dude has shown damn near every regeneration possible, and the only thing he can't regenerate is his eye and leg

He said "If I get the god tree, I can heal my eye and leg", but he could already regrow his entire head and not his eye

It isn't a matter of level of regeneration, especially when he shows better feats, and he doesn't even mention Kaguya
It's the matter of his regrowing the things he had prior to his ability

That's like saying you can regenerate your entire arm but a slash mark on your arm is still there, and because you need something for that specific slash mark, that it's a different story

Kaguya is basically the Shinju and ten-tails ain't she, I don't really understand Victor's regen , but what I do know is he survived Complete incineration though was still injured, yet he still needed a better form of regen, by attempting to make use of shinju(basically kaguya).

 

[Stryker861]

Kaguya is basically the Shinju and ten-tails ain't she, I don't really understand Victor's regen , but what I do know is he survived Complete incineration though was still injured, yet he still needed a better form of regen, by attempting to make use of shinju(basically kaguya).

hexa nobodys deniying that logically that should be the case but because she lacks the feats we cant give it to her.
At least, thats what im getting from this thread

 

[Trihexa102]

hexa nobodys deniying that logically that should be the case but because she lacks the feats we cant give it to her

yea ik, so you mean we need feats now for contextual statements? Ok lets assume Madara and Obito's base regen(from hashi cells) were boosted by Jubi jin regen and absorbing shinju.
Adding hashi regen won't even be discernable or notable when added to Jubi regen, due to the sheer difference.

 

[KingTempest]

You're not reading

Kaguya is basically the Shinju and ten-tails ain't she, I don't really understand Victor's regen , but what I do know is he survived Complete incineration though was still injured, yet he still needed a better form of regen, by attempting to make use of shinju(basically kaguya).

He was injured from injuries far prior to complete incineration

He was injured during the war and lost his eye and badly injured his leg
He could not grow them back

hexa nobodys deniying that logically that should be the case but because she lacks the feats we cant give it to her.
At least, thats what im getting from this thread

No

yea ik, so you mean we need feats now for contextual statements? Ok lets assume Madara and Obito's base regen(from hashi cells) were boosted by Jubi jin regen and absorbing shinju.
Adding hashi regen won't even be discernable or notable when added to Jubi regen, due to the sheer difference.

Nobody said it got boosted by juubi jin regen
They said it got boosted by becoming a juubi jin
This isn't hashi regen + juubi jin regen
It's hashi regen * juubi amp

 

[Trihexa102]

You're not reading

He was injured from injuries far prior to complete incineration

He was injured during the war and lost his eye and badly injured his leg
He could not grow them back

No

Nobody said it got boosted by juubi jin regen
They said it got boosted by becoming a juubi jin
This isn't hashi regen + juubi jin regen
It's hashi regen * juubi amp

Ok so what your basically saying is Juudara and Juubito only would have to scale above Victor's regen due to hashi regen amp? so Madara and Juubito can qualify for High regen.

 

[KingTempest]

Ok so what your basically saying is Juudara and Juubito only would have to scale above Victor's regen due to hashi regen amp? so Madara and Juubito can qualify for High regen.

They don't scale to his regen at all

What the hell is so hard to understand

They have NO SCALING TO EACH OTHER AT ALL.

He didn't need the god tree to "get relevant regen on the level of juubi jins". He got it TO REGROW THE FEW PARTS OF HIS BODY HE GOT PRIOR TO HIM GAINING HIS REGEN ABILITY

 

[Trihexa102]

They don't scale to his regen at all

What the hell is so hard to understand

They have NO SCALING TO EACH OTHER AT ALL.

He didn't need the god tree to "get relevant regen on the level of juubi jins". He got it TO REGROW THE FEW PARTS OF HIS BODY HE GOT PRIOR TO HIM GAINING HIS REGEN ABILITY

Are you listening to what your saying, if his own regen can't regrow those parts but the shinju can, doesn't that mean it's inferior or weaker.

 

[KingTempest]

Are you listening to what your saying, if his own regen can't regrow those parts but the shinju can, doesn't that mean it's inferior or weaker.

Imma break something
Or I might throw my laptop off the roof of this ******* hotel
Because if i say imma ignore you (which i want to do) then other staff will agree with this stupid ass point cause I didn't contest it

Imma say everything involving this point mentioned in the last 3 pages because other than Shadow, nobody watches Boruto


Victor can regenerate his entire head
He cannot regenerate his eye

And his health was deteriorating from the jutsu he used to regen
Which is why he was dying after the god tree's shit happened

That is not a matter of what he could regrow or it being better or anything, it's a limit to his regeneration

He wants the god tree's fruit because for some unknown method, he would fix his health, said health that has been getting shat on and shortened by his jutsu, and the god tree's fruit gives people longevity, which is why he got a cursed seal that prolongs his life instead of looking for some shit like Mitotic Regeneration

This isn't "it can regen things that the regen Victor has isn't sufficient enough to do, so it scales above"
This is "the mf has many issues that the god tree is known to fix"

I did not mention Juubito, Juubidara, Kaguya, no juubi jins
I mentioned the shit that everybody with a god tree's fruit has shown
NONE OF IT IS REGEN

 

[eibwen]

Imma break something
Or I might throw my laptop off the roof of this ******* hotel
Because if i say imma ignore you (which i want to do) then other staff will agree with this stupid ass point cause I didn't contest it

Imma say everything involving this point mentioned in the last 3 pages because other than Shadow, nobody watches Boruto


Victor can regenerate his entire head
He cannot regenerate his eye

And his health was deteriorating from the jutsu he used to regen
Which is why he was dying after the god tree's shit happened

That is not a matter of what he could regrow or it being better or anything, it's a limit to his regeneration

He wants the god tree's fruit because for some unknown method, he would fix his health, said health that has been getting shat on and shortened by his jutsu, and the god tree's fruit gives people longevity, which is why he got a cursed seal that prolongs his life instead of looking for some shit like Mitotic Regeneration

This isn't "it can regen things that the regen Victor has isn't sufficient enough to do, so it scales above"
This is "the mf has many issues that the god tree is known to fix"

I did not mention Juubito, Juubidara, Kaguya, no juubi jins
I mentioned the shit that everybody with a god tree's fruit has shown
NONE OF IT IS REGEN

so no one scale to that guy level of regen
still, god tree will offer some degree of regen?

 

[Ped2018]

It's always fun to see KT argue

 

[KingTempest]

so no one scale to that guy level of regen

None at all

still, god tree will offer some degree of regen?

They scale to their own logic and don't scale to their own antifeats

 

[LordGinSama]

Or I might throw my laptop off the roof of this ******* hotel

Probably ur best bet lmfao

 

[Serlock_Holmes]

Imma break something
Or I might throw my laptop off the roof of this ******* hotel
Because if i say imma ignore you (which i want to do) then other staff will agree with this stupid ass point cause I didn't contest it

Imma say everything involving this point mentioned in the last 3 pages because other than Shadow, nobody watches Boruto


Victor can regenerate his entire head
He cannot regenerate his eye

And his health was deteriorating from the jutsu he used to regen
Which is why he was dying after the god tree's shit happened

That is not a matter of what he could regrow or it being better or anything, it's a limit to his regeneration

He wants the god tree's fruit because for some unknown method, he would fix his health, said health that has been getting shat on and shortened by his jutsu, and the god tree's fruit gives people longevity, which is why he got a cursed seal that prolongs his life instead of looking for some shit like Mitotic Regeneration

This isn't "it can regen things that the regen Victor has isn't sufficient enough to do, so it scales above"
This is "the mf has many issues that the god tree is known to fix"

I did not mention Juubito, Juubidara, Kaguya, no juubi jins
I mentioned the shit that everybody with a god tree's fruit has shown
NONE OF IT IS REGEN

This thread is doing wonders for your blood pressure.

 

[Arc7Kuroi]

Y’all being instigators rn

 

[HelloThere1089]

I agree with downgrading the regen. It seems like it was implemented as a cop out in the first place. Even in their 2nd forms, none of the otsutsuki show regen like that. Her saying "I'm immortal" just means that only way N&S can defeat her is by sealing. So if any of them die by the ETSB, she can't be stopped. Her saying "I'm immortal" isn't because she needs it to survive her own attack. It's to bring attention to the fact that she only needs to kill one of them.