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Megami Tensei General Discussion Thread
- Thread starter Lukewoesal007
- Start date
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I believe it just referring to yhvh manifestation head or whatever it call, not quite reffering to yhvh true form. Same as krishna statement aswell. Hence how he can equal to yhvh while himself just part of satan, and also satan just mere aspect of yhvh.
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according to the new tier system, a verse necessarily needs a high 1-B cosmology to be 1-A, so why is SMT as 1-A?
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SMT revisions take a long time because of the absurd amount of games and lore that are not easy to get ahold of
I think
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- Thread starter
- #85
Where is this stated?
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in the tier page description and in the discussions it had at the time it was changed
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- Thread starter
- #87
Quote? Link?
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low 1-A must necessarily transcend a high 1-B cosmology, and 1-A must be greater than low 1-A
vsbattles.fandom.com
And here is an explanation that low 1-A handles a transfinite number of layers
vsbattles.fandom.com
Tiering System
The following is a comprehensive overview of the hierarchical system the VS Battles Wiki utilizes to properly categorize and index fictional characters, entities, and objects based on the scale of their feats and the varying scopes that they can affect or create/destroy. Though Destructive...
vsbattles.fandom.com
And here is an explanation that low 1-A handles a transfinite number of layers
Set Theory Explanation Page
The following is an explanation of the upper bounds of this wiki's Tiering System, namely the parts encompassed by Low 1-A and above, although the concepts presented here do have great influence on the functionings of much lower tiers. For information on the primary measuring stick used to...
vsbattles.fandom.com
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Yes, but basically if a verse gives enough context that some structure is infinitely transcendent above the rest of the cosmology no matter how "layers" are put one atop the other, this too qualifies for 1-A and don't necessarily the verse needs a High 1-B structure. That's the case for SMT because in Digital Devil Saga novel the protagonist states that he reached the Atzluth after he "gained so many dimensions that he eventually transcended the concept of dimension".low 1-A must necessarily transcend a high 1-B cosmology, and 1-A must be greater than low 1-A
Tiering System
The following is a comprehensive overview of the hierarchical system the VS Battles Wiki utilizes to properly categorize and index fictional characters, entities, and objects based on the scale of their feats and the varying scopes that they can affect or create/destroy. Though Destructive...
And here is an explanation that low 1-A handles a transfinite number of layers
Set Theory Explanation Page
The following is an explanation of the upper bounds of this wiki's Tiering System, namely the parts encompassed by Low 1-A and above, although the concepts presented here do have great influence on the functionings of much lower tiers. For information on the primary measuring stick used to...
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No, in the scan it says Serph uses only 3 dimensions as an example saying that it is beyond the concept of dimension, I agree with being "beyond the concept of dimension" being a 1-A feat because concept is everything we define, the description itself, so if something is beyond the definition of dimension it should be 1-A, but on the wiki this rule does not apply and the verse must necessarily describe that the character exists beyond infinite dimensions even though it does not exist on the verse, as in case of warhammer 40k where the realm of chaos is described as a non-geometric space so that it cannot be defined by a finite or infinite number
Tanin_iver
He/Him- 605
- 637
SMT is safe to keep it's 1-A rating for now according to the wiki standards.
I dunno anything about Warhammer 40K tho.
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There isn't something about this in the Tiering System page, however if you go to the Tiering System FAQ page, you will see that they permit just what I have said in my comment.
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- Thread starter
- #93
Make a CRT then.
IdiosyncraticLawyer
Username OnlyVS Battles
Joke Battles
Administrator
Content Moderator
Translation Helper
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I made one for them.
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After this has concluded, I think the wording on profiles should change so it includes the context that it transcends any dimension no matter how high it is
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isn't there an infinite hierarchy/infinite dimensional shit here??
- 1,527
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I didn't read the whole CRT but I saw someone else explaining it didn't, but it would still transcend any number of hierarchies
IdiosyncraticLawyer
Username OnlyVS Battles
Joke Battles
Administrator
Content Moderator
Translation Helper
- 3,256
- 3,962
The evidence referenced is insufficient to establish that they transcend any dimension no matter how high it is.
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I am not 100% sure but they say there's other evidences after the revision of the verse besides this statement, including one mentioning "infinite dimensions".
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Anyways, we need to wait for Ultima to reply.
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- Thread starter
- #102
10-A, 9-C with Weapons
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I genuinely can't tell if you're joking or not
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Hedgehogs are weaker than humans, so 10-C for Sonic
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I thought that was a place and not a character
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Well, i think it's a literal tree but where would it scale?
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I have a few questions
I noticed that SMT if lacks any profiles. From what I understand when looking at the profiles, both the protagonist and Hazama would scale to 1-A (according to current profiles) because of Angra Mainyu / Ahriman being the penultimate boss, right? Hazama also defeated Zurvan, who is more powerful than Angra Mainyu according to Zurvan, who stated that Angra Mainyu looked to rule time as well, and he described himself as the God of Time.
I also notice that Nyarlatothep appears as an enemy in the final dungeon of SMT if. I assume there would have to be a different key for it than the Nyarlatothep from Persona, right?
Ringo from Soul Hackers 2 would also be 1-A because of Sandalphon, and later Shiva and Parvati (and Ardha), right?
Lastly, are there any plans to cover Last Bible or Demi Kids?
I know the Megami Tensei verse is in current revision which may affect the tiers afterwards but I wanted to ask since I was curious if I am understanding the scaling properly
I noticed that SMT if lacks any profiles. From what I understand when looking at the profiles, both the protagonist and Hazama would scale to 1-A (according to current profiles) because of Angra Mainyu / Ahriman being the penultimate boss, right? Hazama also defeated Zurvan, who is more powerful than Angra Mainyu according to Zurvan, who stated that Angra Mainyu looked to rule time as well, and he described himself as the God of Time.
I also notice that Nyarlatothep appears as an enemy in the final dungeon of SMT if. I assume there would have to be a different key for it than the Nyarlatothep from Persona, right?
Ringo from Soul Hackers 2 would also be 1-A because of Sandalphon, and later Shiva and Parvati (and Ardha), right?
Lastly, are there any plans to cover Last Bible or Demi Kids?
I know the Megami Tensei verse is in current revision which may affect the tiers afterwards but I wanted to ask since I was curious if I am understanding the scaling properly
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Seeing that this verse is getting looked at and revised, my question might be seen as stupid, but here goes
Because a lot of complicated stuff flies over my head, would anyone be able to explain why SMT (and by extension, Persona) is so comfortably set in 1-A, in a simplistic as way possible?
God damn, is this verse confusing (also sorry if im potentially necro-posting lol)
Because a lot of complicated stuff flies over my head, would anyone be able to explain why SMT (and by extension, Persona) is so comfortably set in 1-A, in a simplistic as way possible?
God damn, is this verse confusing (also sorry if im potentially necro-posting lol)
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Been playing nocturne pretty fun. Gonna get to Persona 5 Royal after although I heard I'd be pretty disappointed with the combat going into it straight after nocturne.
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Play P5R on hard difficulty. It's not gonna be grindy
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Cause press-turn is peak combat!
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Ok so I rage quit SMT Nocturne not because of difficulty but because apparently there was free DLC that was important to the game while I was like 12 hours in and made me lose motivation. Decided to refresh myself with Persona then get back and start a new game on nocturne with the DLC. 27 hours in and Persona 5 has been wonderful and really enjoying the confidant system which makes the game IMO what it truly is.
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yeah if you actually want to actually access the stuff everyone raves about, the dlc is mandatory. Cause it's an either/or choice between Dante and Raidou, but both include the stuff needed for extras. At least one of them is free.
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Beat the game
LazerDim8000
Username Only- 606
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Hi I have some questions regarding smt , when will the upgrades for SMT be done ? Secondly how high does EMMA demiurge scale in the SMT persona chain ?Beat the game
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Can someone please explain to me the deal with the CU and Mementos?
When Yaldabaoth merged Mementos, Azathoth states that the sea of hearts and reality have become one. Is Mementos the CU? Did both Mementos and the actual CU get merged at the same time?
At the end of P2: IS, you create an alternate timeline by using Cognition from the Sea of Souls (a figurative name for the CU), which is indistinguishable from what Maruki did with manipulating cognition using Mementos. This again brings up the question is Mementos the actual CU or did Maruki also take over the Sea of Souls?
When Yaldabaoth merged Mementos, Azathoth states that the sea of hearts and reality have become one. Is Mementos the CU? Did both Mementos and the actual CU get merged at the same time?
At the end of P2: IS, you create an alternate timeline by using Cognition from the Sea of Souls (a figurative name for the CU), which is indistinguishable from what Maruki did with manipulating cognition using Mementos. This again brings up the question is Mementos the actual CU or did Maruki also take over the Sea of Souls?
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Mementos is a realm within the collective unconscious (P5 calls it the "Metaverse.")
Mementos is also Yaldaboath's domain, so when he fuses reality with the sea of souls he would reasonably do so within said domain, which in this case is Mementos.
LazerDim8000
Username Only- 606
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Is EMMA demiurge above maruki ? It was a threat to even the velvet room and was merging tree of knowledge with the world
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