Malladus' Tier - Zelda Spirit Tracks

[Eficiente]

So, why is Malladus only Large Island level? He claimed that he was going to destroy the world in the little time he had left.

Not saying Spirit Tracks Link scales to this.

 

[Eficiente]

Also, the random spirits that were unable to kill him at the beginning of the game were able to create train tracks through all of New Hyrule. That can probably be calc'd to something, I guess.

 

[Dust_Collector]

Well he could very easily "destroy the world" in a short amout of time with his current tier and speed. He's way above people who are way above Gyorg, who is 500 gigatons just by existing, and he can move at over mach 1,000 and attack at over 20% the speed of light. The problem with that statement is that like most destroy the world statements it's too vague to give a definitive rating for it.

Although given how we treat quite a few characters as High 6-A for quickly "destroying the world" I think an upgrade seems justifiable.

 

[Eficiente]

I thought he had a similar statement at the beginning of the game, my bad. In any case his current tier and speed come out of nowhere.

 

[Dust_Collector]

What you mean? His profile states he's comparble or superior to certain characters who are High 6-C and Relativistic, although his AP could do with a better justification than "is a final boss so he's comparble to a weakened Ganon".

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Actually, he has his own feats. At the beginning of the game, the "i'm-clearly-not-the-bad-guy"-dude (chancellor whatever) created a bunch of thunderclouds around the tower when he stole Zelda's body. I believe that could count for something, since that arbitrary scaling is just... Wrong. There is nothing (that I'm aware of) that connects Gyorg, or anyone from Hyrule for that matter, to this dude so he can scale.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

What you mean? His profile states he's comparble or superior to certain characters who are High 6-C and Relativistic, although his AP could do with a better justification than "is a final boss so he's comparble to a weakened Ganon".

Being a final boss does not justifies him scaling to something that isn't even connected to him or his world.

 

[Dust_Collector]

We honestly need a thread to decde how to properly scale these characters. I mean, the OOT profiles have these justifications that somehow makes the likes of Phantom Ganon and Volvagia simultaneously stronger and weaker than Twinrova.

Seriously, our scaling chain for the OOT bosses is Phantom Ganon>Saria>Twinova>Phantom Ganon. I've been wanting to make a thread about it but I've been too busy to do it.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

It's a mess, in general, yeah. xD

Volvagia has his own feat too, with the volcanic eruption and all.

Phantom Ganon, on the other hand...

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Wait, Saria above Twinrova? What?

 

[Dust_Collector]

"Comparable to a given Sage [mystics of magical power greater than the likes of Twinrova in power, due to the fact its power was capable of keeping Saria from awakening as a Sage"

This is the reasoning on (OOT) Phantom Ganons profile. The jist of it is that the sages are superior to Twinrova and due to keeping them from awakening as sages the temple bosses scale above the sages. And then we scale Twinrova as far above Onox and Veran who we scale as being comparable or superior to temple bosses (Makes perfect sense right?). I think this is a justification that was copied from the OBD years ago and was never changed.

The temple bosses are definitely tier 6 (Just where in tier 6 is debatable) but they seriously need better justifications than what they have currently.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

But... Even divided Twinrova can keep a sage from awakening...

Quoting Cell: "What? How? I have so many questions!"

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

The reasoning for the Temple bosses in OoT is terrible and it's from before my time.

 

[Dust_Collector]

Twinrova (combined)>>Twinrova (separated)>>Sage>>Twinrova (combined)>>Temple Boss>>Sage

10/10 best power scaling. The scaling really needs to be fixed, especially for OOT characters.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

If I am still online when you make the thread, I could help gather some feats;

(Off the top of my head: Volvagia's Eruption, the water thing freezing Zora's domain, Bongo-Bongo ragdolling Sheik)

 

[Dark649]

I think we should make the scaling easier with:

All Final Bosses [At least High 6-C, likely far higher from Malladus, a final boss should be superior to all the previous bosses, far higher is due his statement. Could be higher if the thunderstorm and train feats are higher than Gyorg feat] >> Majora Mask Bosses [Gyorg feat]/All Late Bosses [Like Bongo Bongo from Argorok feat, both require the same weapon] > All Early Bosses = All Later Bosses [King Dodongo and Dead Hand] >> All Early Minibosses [Like Dangoro]

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

It should not be about being easier. It should make sense and have actual backing. What makes Malladus as strong as Gyorg aside from being the final boss? He is not connected to anything from Hyrule, much less Termina. He shouldn't have a scaling that isn't tide to it in any way.

He has his own feat, he should scale to that.

On the topic of that; what makes Argorok be in the same tier of power as Bongo Bongo and Gyorg and viceversa (I believe Argarok is actually more powerful, based on his own feat)?

 

[Dark649]

Argorok feat was downgraded due to the CAPE storm standard, but could be higher than Gyorg.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Oh, didn't know that. Oh, well. At least they are similar. ovo

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Btw, I have also found some feats for the Wind Waker bosses. Valoo, when calmed, dispersed ash clouds that surrounded the top of Dragon Roost island, and the boss of that place had it trapped by grabbing it's tail. This could be used for BoG Link of WW (before he got the ToC). I have a picture here of the scale of said clouds, so maybe someone can calc it:

 

[TriforcePower1]

I personally think Final bosses should scale from OoT Zelda's statement of base Ganon being capable of destroying the kingdom of Hyrule.

I think we should make the scaling easier with:

All Final Bosses [At least High 6-C, likely far higher from Malladus, a final boss should be superior to all the previous bosses, far higher is due his statement. Possibly 6-B from Ganon's statement] >> Majora Mask Bosses [Gyorg feat]/All Late Bosses [Like Bongo Bongo from Argorok feat] become High 6-C > All Early Bosses become 6-C > All Later MiniBosses High 7-A [King Dodongo and Dead Hand] > All Early Minibosses [Like Dangoro] High 7-A

Is this OK?

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

What in-lore explanation puts Malladus above Gyorg? What in-lore explanation puts Bongo Bongo at the same level as Argorok?

 

[TriforcePower1]

Malladus being a demon king that needed to be sealed away by spirits as they couldn't kill him.

Gyorg is just a fish with a strange name.

Both being bosses that were defeated by a midgame Link that had ToC and MS. Plus that TP is just edgy OoT