Made in Heaven slight downgrade

[Eficiente]

It should be 3-A rather than Low 2-C.

• Speeding up time to infinity is just hax.
• A new universe being made after it is 3-A.
• The events in the new universe being like in the old one happens due to it being predestined, the "Limited Fate Manipulation" MiH has should be next to Causality Manip due to it. The whole timeline wasn't created from the start, the universe was created from your average big bang and the timeline kept creating itself as time went on. By the time the humans of the old universe arrived at the present they were aware of predestined things and reacted in ways that have no reason to also have been predestined by neither MiH nor the creation of the universe.

• Technically it has been written that "Although it is said that humans can 'shape their own destiny', perhaps that reshaping of destiny is already predestined", but this is either poetic or proven wrong as the sh*t ton of things that were predestined to happen to humanity until the end of the universe never happened as the new universe got screwed.
• By the way everything is presented even if all actions from the old universe were to happen in the new one and the timeline went the same way that would have still been because it was a bit guided by Causality Manip, not because everything was created that way. There is a difference between creating a timeline and all actions in it and creating a universe and knowing how things will go out as time goes on.

Also we should add the implied second universe reset that happened with Pucci's death to his profile.

 

[Thelastmlg]

1. Agreed

2 fate be like: you may have reshaped me, but I have reshaped your reshaping

 

[Braking]

being low 2-C is destroying the universe + Space or and time so agreed on the downgrade

 

[Eficiente]

Destroying the universe + space is 3-A. Destroying the universe + time isn't necessarily Low 2-C as the present time could be destroyed, thus making no more time be in the future but the past still having time; that's 3-A. Destroying the universe + time as in, all of time from the start of the universe to the end is Low 2-C.

Creating the same is Low 2-C too, but here only the universe is created.

 

[Bernkastelll]

Neutral, kinda disagreeing, it was stated that the universe would end and a new course of history would be born, which is impossible if the time also wasnt reseted, and its impossible to Pucci create another universe without the time on it, because if it didnt had time, everything would be frozen, as time doesnt exist

 

[Chariot190]

I'll be back after work. No stupid shit till then

 

[Cloozuma]

I'll be waiting to support chariot.

 

[Braking]

yall fast to get on this shit

 

[Cloozuma]

yall fast to get on this shit

It's JoJo. That's how we do shit here

 

[Rez]

It should be nothing honestly since he isn't directly destroying the universe just speeding it up to it's natural end and reset

 

[Bernkastelll]

It should be nothing honestly since he isn't directly destroying the universe just speeding it up to it's natural end and reset

According to this, he is ending the universe and creating a new course of history

Neutral, kinda disagreeing, it was stated that the universe would end and a new course of history would be born, which is impossible if the time also wasnt reseted, and its impossible to Pucci create another universe without the time on it, because if it didnt had time, everything would be frozen, as time doesnt exist

 

[Eficiente]

The time of the old universe came to an end due to time being speeded up to infinity, that's hax. Time was created for the universe, but creating a present moment in time along with the universe isn't Low 2-C, the rest of the time keeps creating itself because that's what time does, it expands, on its own. Please see the Big Bang page linked above, which was revised and is not the same as it once was.

That said I hope I don't have to say why "creating a new course of history" =/= "creating all of time from the beginning of the universe to end along with space", but the ability MiH has to somewhat influence how things will go in the new universe, being like in the old one but from certain point in time onwards the humans having precog to change things up and at least feel better to what's to come. Because MiH was never stated to have the former and would need to for us to claim so.

 

[Rez]

The universe came to an end because time was Speed up to infinity as well so remove the universal rating entirely

 

[Rez]

According to this, he is ending the universe and creating a new course of history

Yeah and it's done by speeding time to infinity so it's just hax

 

[Chariot190]

The universe came to an end because time was Speed up to infinity as well so remove the universal rating entirely

That's actually an excessive oversimplification, especially looking at the raws. But we'll see once I have everything translated.

 

[TheGunsFinalWrath]

I'll be back after work. No stupid shit till then

this thread is already stupid shit.

p a i n f u l a n d s u f f e r i n g (hi chariot)

 

[Bernkastelll]

Yeah and it's done by speeding time to infinity so it's just hax

I mean yeah, MiH current ratings are all Hax, which include his current Low 2-C stuff

 

[Eficiente]

this thread is already stupid shit.

p a i n f u l a n d s u f f e r i n g (hi chariot)

You should preferably mature from saying things like that and not derail.

 

[Cloozuma]

Does rewriting history count as creating time?

 

[Thelastmlg]

No, that's causality manipulation or just time travel

 

[Eficiente]

Causality Manip made it so that the history of the new universe was much the same as with the old one, then humans got precog and acted in new ways different from the history of the old universe, having precog alone is already unlike the old universe even if they did nothing with it. That's the new history, you all already knew because you all were able to understand the manga while reading it, Pucci wanted to give humans happiness. There is no "maybe MiH created all of time too" because that needs to be stated and what we have means something else.

I know it's just a question but I can't avoid but to think that asking if the new history is creating all of time is disingenuous, that's like saying that when Kira's Bite the Dust triggers, goes back an hour ago and that hour happens again, all of the time in that hour is created by the ability because it doesn't happen 100% the same, thereby being another history. The Causality Manip in both powers only affects punctual events at a time, tiny things inside the world, and with MiH's doing it way more often, but is not the same as creating all the time in the universe across that hour or the universe's lifespan.

 

[manu_zarri]

Waiting for Chariot, I'm Neutral for now.

Though, MiHur shouldn't be downgraded, since it bends the space-time.

also there is a Universe Level CRT, if it would be accepted then ye no downgrade

 

[Rez]

Though, MiHur shouldn't be downgraded, since it bends the space-time.

That's just hax all of mih's powers are hax he should not have ap for universe reset

 

[Gohanblanco217]

That's just hax all of mih's powers are hax he should not have ap for universe reset

Hax can have a low 2-C tier/AP if it does destroy or affect a Universe or higher that's how it works

 

[manu_zarri]

That's just hax all of mih's powers are hax he should not have ap for universe reset

MiHur works different, it destroys the entire space-time continuum, it's just ED.

 

[Eficiente]

Though, MiHur shouldn't be downgraded, since it bends the space-time

I advise not to comment here if you guys lack knowledge of the topics here, it just gives me more work. If I can put my hands together and bend space-time in the middle that's not Low 2-C, and MiH doesn't even bend space.

also there is a Universe Level CRT, if it would be accepted then ye no downgrade

That's not necessarily true.

Hax can have a low 2-C tier/AP if it does destroy or affect a Universe or higher that's how it works

That's not how it works, if a hax destroys a universe that's 3-A, if it affects it then it's not anything, unless proven to be on a way equal to destroy it. If by universe you mean the whole timeline then that's where Low 2-C starts.

MiHur works different, it destroys the entire space-time continuum, it's just ED.

No it doesn't, the space-time continuum comes to an end naturally by time getting speeded up to infinity. That's like saying that it's Human level to speed up the age of a human until killing them.

 

[Livinmeme]

Disagree with the downgrade because like other people pointed out he reset the timeline and it was his fault and that would classifies as enviorimental destruccion thanks to his ability

 

[Eficiente]

If you reset a program A by setting up to make a new program B and influence here and there how things will go in it to make it like program A but it all functions on its own without you then you are responable for the reset, but you didn't create the full new program. Time and space expand on their own, that wasn't MiH's doing, what MiH did was the thing that doesn't make sense, the new universe at the end of the last one, hence it's the same tier as the Big Bang.

Example aside, a reset of the universe isn't always Low 2-C, it can be many things like Time Manip making it go to the start and leaving it there or Reality Warping to unquantifiably change many things in the present, and likewise a reset can refer to many things, not just "the end of something, how something else may appear, and how that happens", or "the regression of something, how it may start again and how it keeps moving forward", but just the first 2 things of those. Ex. if you reset a video you may put it from the time you are watching it to start, and that's the reset, the video will then advance on its on as you watch it and that's not part of the reset. MiH made the universe come to an end and started a new one, but time happened on its own.

 

[Rez]

MiH made the universe come to an end and started a new one, but time happened on its own.

It all happened because mih speed up the universe to infinity so either removing the low 2-C rating entirely or leaving it as it is and just specifying that it's environmental destruction makes the most sense

 

[Livinmeme]

Question any proves than he reseted the time line and not just the universe?

 

[Rez]

Neutral, kinda disagreeing, it was stated that the universe would end and a new course of history would be born, which is impossible if the time also wasnt reseted, and its impossible to Pucci create another universe without the time on it, because if it didnt had time, everything would be frozen, as time doesnt exist

Question any proves than he reseted the time line and not just the universe?

 

[manu_zarri]

I advise not to comment here if you guys lack knowledge of the topics here, it just gives me more work. If I can put my hands together and bend space-time in the middle that's not Low 2-C, and MiH doesn't even bend space.

bending Space-Time on Universal Range is Low 2-C, since it's considerable significantly affecting, especically "warping". also ye i know tiering aswell, since months, and just because recently im inactive dosen't mean that i forgot everything

That's not necessarily true.

If it gets accepted we can say goodbye to the Downgrade, unless we want agrue that MiH universe destruction is only hax which is a no.

No it doesn't, the space-time continuum comes to an end naturally by time getting speeded up to infinity. That's like saying that it's Human level to speed up the age of a human until killing them.

Let me take scans.

Here the Explanation from Jorge in the novel, also MiHur in the novel works on cube house, which is a universe sized space-time. and the end of universe influence it aswell

 

[Livinmeme]

pretty sure when he refers to a "new history" is because humanity is going to be diferent because the people he killed are different than their original countrapart

 

[Livinmeme]

bending Space-Time on Universal Range is Low 2-C, since it's considerable significantly affecting, especically "warping". also ye i know tiering aswell, since months, and just because recently im inactive dosen't mean that i forgot everything

If it gets accepted we can say goodbye to the Downgrade, unless we want agrue that MiH universe destruction is only hax which is a no.

Let me take scans.

Here the Explanation from Jorge in the novel, also MiHur in the novel works on cube house, which is a universe sized space-time. and the end of universe influence it aswell

Jorge joestar aint canon you know?

 

[manu_zarri]

Jorge joestar aint canon you know?

Read what mine discussion is about

Though, MiHur shouldn't be downgraded, since it bends the space-time.

 

[Chariot190]

Can someone please give me a quick rundown of what's being discussed, some extremely important shit came up last night (and today but I can put a few minutes aside) so i didn't really much time in.

Though I did translate the a few jap scans.

 

[Rez]

pretty sure when he refers to a "new history" is because humanity is going to be diferent because the people he killed are different than their original countrapart

No all the previous events will repeat in the new universe regardless and main plan is to reset the universe so people can have control on their fate essentially everyone who lives the reset and moves to the new universe still keeps their memory of the events from previous universe subconsciously and when Pucci dies the reset happens again and an entirely different universe is formed where he never existed thus causing any events that happened because of him to have never happened as well

 

[Livinmeme]

Can someone please give me a quick rundown of what's being discussed, some extremely important shit came up last night (and today but I can put a few minutes aside) so i didn't really much time in.

Though I did translate the a few jap scans.

1. does MIH resets the time line or just the universe
2. is affecting time and space to that degree Low 2-C
3.ඞ

 

[Rez]

If you reset a program A by setting up to make a new program B and influence here and there how things will go in it to make it like program A but it all functions on its own without you then you are responable for the reset, but you didn't create the full new program. Time and space expand on their own, that wasn't MiH's doing, what MiH did was the thing that doesn't make sense, the new universe at the end of the last one, hence it's the same tier as the Big Bang.

Example aside, a reset of the universe isn't always Low 2-C, it can be many things like Time Manip making it go to the start and leaving it there or Reality Warping to unquantifiably change many things in the present, and likewise a reset can refer to many things, not just "the end of something, how something else may appear, and how that happens", or "the regression of something, how it may start again and how it keeps moving forward", but just the first 2 things of those. Ex. if you reset a video you may put it from the time you are watching it to start, and that's the reset, the video will then advance on its on as you watch it and that's not part of the reset. MiH made the universe come to an end and started a new one, but time happened on its own.

Can someone please give me a quick rundown of what's being discussed, some extremely important shit came up last night (and today but I can put a few minutes aside) so i didn't really much time in.

Though I did translate the a few jap scans.

This part is of the most importance

 

[manu_zarri]

2. is affecting time and space to that degree Low 2-C

Affecting Space-Time on a Universe scale is Low 2-C.

Low 2-C | Universe level+: Characters who are capable of significantly affecting[1], creating and/or destroying an area of space that is qualitatively larger than an infinitely-sized 3-dimensional space. Common fictional examples of spaces representing such sizes are space-time continuums of a universal scale.