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Madara Uchiha representative Vs demon king representative

theultimate5105 said:
Obitos intang works by him being in another dimension
Zeldris's NPI is likely soul based and is definitly not able to hit Obitos intang which even spatial NPI cannot hit
Click to expand...
It doesn’t matter as soon as Obito touches Zeldris his chakra will be sealed and Zeldris slashes his head off with hellblaze
 
Qawsedf234 said:
NPI is hitting something occupying a space in a non-corporal way. Like a ghost.

Obito's power is warping sections of his body to another dimension, so you just don't hit anything, it just misses.
Click to expand...
Exactly this. I vaguely remember reading this somewhere. This explains why he can still sense things from the real world. Also he is able to stand on the ground instead of slipping through.

My vote is still neutral, but as of now, the wincons

Obito
  • Kamui all Zeldris hearts
  • BFR
Counters against obito:
  • God
  • Darkness construct to defend. The darkness would get kamuid instead of Zeldris body.. I dont remember kamui cutting through multiple objects at the same time. So the kamui leaves holes in Zeldris darkness which gets closed again.
  • Attack at the moment obito wants to BFR him (obito can't stay intangible and BFR at the same time)

Zeldris wincons:
  • If Zeldris grabs obito, it's game over. If zeldris doesn't release him, even izanagi won't activate
  • Forcing obito to stay intangible by dooming the place with hellblaze, using ON, keep following and attacking etc. After 5 min, intangibility reaches its limit. But this depends on his intelligence. Melascula knew Ban couldn't keep the stolen strenght for long. I think Zeldris is at least as smart. He for example knew estarossa would secretly steal the 10c so Zeldris didn't have to go after them himself.
  • Not sure if this would work, maybe zeldris can still curse him like he cursed Merlin?
  • If zeldris forces obito to stay intangible, chances are obito will try to run away (to escape). I think in this case, the peity commandment activates?
Obito's counters:
  • Activate reactivatie intangibility at the right time? That's difficulty when zeldris constantly follows him while the places is doomed with hellblaze.
  • Substituions and distractions?
  • Use physical objects since ninjutsu won't work
Zeldris seems to have better wincons
 
VsReferee said:
Exactly this. I vaguely remember reading this somewhere. This explains why he can still sense things from the real world. Also he is able to stand on the ground instead of slipping through.

My vote is still neutral, but as of now, the wincons

Obito
  • Kamui all Zeldris hearts
  • BFR
Counters against obito:
  • God
  • Darkness construct to defend. The darkness would get kamuid instead of Zeldris body.. I dont remember kamui cutting through multiple objects at the same time. So the kamui leaves holes in Zeldris darkness which gets closed again.
  • Attack at the moment obito wants to BFR him (obito can't stay intangible and BFR at the same time)

Zeldris wincons:
  • If Zeldris grabs obito, it's game over. If zeldris doesn't release him, even izanagi won't activate
  • Forcing obito to stay intangible by dooming the place with hellblaze, using ON, keep following and attacking etc. After 5 min, intangibility reaches its limit. But this depends on his intelligence. Melascula knew Ban couldn't keep the stolen strenght for long. I think Zeldris is at least as smart. He for example knew estarossa would secretly steal the 10c so Zeldris didn't have to go after them himself.
  • Not sure if this would work, maybe zeldris can still curse him like he cursed Merlin?
  • If zeldris forces obito to stay intangible, chances are obito will try to run away (to escape). I think in this case, the peity commandment activates?
Obito's counters:
  • Activate reactivatie intangibility at the right time? That's difficulty when zeldris constantly follows him while the places is doomed with hellblaze.
  • Substituions and distractions?
  • Use physical objects since ninjutsu won't work
Zeldris seems to have better wincons
Click to expand...
Exactly if Obito touches Zeldris his chakra will be sealed and Zeldris can one shot him with hellblaze and ON or steal his soul eventually
 
VsReferee said:
Exactly this. I vaguely remember reading this somewhere. This explains why he can still sense things from the real world. Also he is able to stand on the ground instead of slipping through.

My vote is still neutral, but as of now, the wincons

Obito
  • Kamui all Zeldris hearts
  • BFR
Counters against obito:
  • God
  • Darkness construct to defend. The darkness would get kamuid instead of Zeldris body.. I dont remember kamui cutting through multiple objects at the same time. So the kamui leaves holes in Zeldris darkness which gets closed again.
  • Attack at the moment obito wants to BFR him (obito can't stay intangible and BFR at the same time)

Zeldris wincons:
  • If Zeldris grabs obito, it's game over. If zeldris doesn't release him, even izanagi won't activate
  • Forcing obito to stay intangible by dooming the place with hellblaze, using ON, keep following and attacking etc. After 5 min, intangibility reaches its limit. But this depends on his intelligence. Melascula knew Ban couldn't keep the stolen strenght for long. I think Zeldris is at least as smart. He for example knew estarossa would secretly steal the 10c so Zeldris didn't have to go after them himself.
  • Not sure if this would work, maybe zeldris can still curse him like he cursed Merlin?
  • If zeldris forces obito to stay intangible, chances are obito will try to run away (to escape). I think in this case, the peity commandment activates?
Obito's counters:
  • Activate reactivatie intangibility at the right time? That's difficulty when zeldris constantly follows him while the places is doomed with hellblaze.
  • Substituions and distractions?
  • Use physical objects since ninjutsu won't work
Zeldris seems to have better wincons
Click to expand...
Looks alright, what about win cons if he uses ominous nebula?
 
Wouldn't Obito start using genjutsu and rinnegan abilities when he realises he can't pull a kamui gg, plus sharingan can read and predict attacks so wouldn't that help him in avoiding physical attacks.

Not trying to argue for Obito, just making suggestions since I at least know that much about Obito (not on war arc yet).
 
SemiRaedi said:
Wouldn't Obito start using genjutsu and rinnegan abilities when he realises he can't pull a kamui gg, plus sharingan can read and predict attacks so wouldn't that help him in avoiding physical attacks.

Not trying to argue for Obito, just making suggestions since I at least know that much about Obito (not on war arc yet).
Click to expand...
Zeldris has ON and speed amps ant etc since god will null genjutsu as agreed on in another thread
 
speedster352 said:
Zeldris has ON and speed amps ant etc since god will null genjutsu as agreed on in another thread
Click to expand...
Fair enough


Also, if Obito decided to go to the kamui dimension to make a strategy based on Zeldris' moves, would that activate piety since he's technically fleeing even if temporary?
 
SemiRaedi said:
Fair enough


Also, if Obito decided to go to the kamui dimension to make a strategy based on Zeldris' moves, would that activate piety since he's technically fleeing even if temporary?
Click to expand...
Yes it will activate piety if he tries to flee
 
SemiRaedi said:
Wouldn't Obito start using genjutsu and rinnegan abilities when he realises he can't pull a kamui gg, plus sharingan can read and predict attacks so wouldn't that help him in avoiding physical attacks.

Not trying to argue for Obito, just making suggestions since I at least know that much about Obito (not on war arc yet).
Click to expand...
I think genjutsu would be countered by god. If I am correct, genjutsu is a jutsu that works by injecting chakra through the senses of the victim. This jutsu has to go past god which won't work.

What rinnegan abilities can he use?

I doubt it's all attacks. He still should be fast enough in combat. Zeldris and archangel Ludo had a sword fight testing each other out. They clashed so fast that it looked as if they weren't moving. I wonder if Obito can keep up with this. If combat speed is equalized then he should be able to keep up but zeldris has amps. His combat speed could force obito to stay intangible if Zeldris is near.
 
VsReferee said:
What rinnegan abilities can he use?
Click to expand...
All of them, in character he doesn't use them but he hasn't gone up against opponents like Zeldris
VsReferee said:
I doubt it's all attacks. He still should be fast enough in combat. Zeldris and archangel Ludo had a sword fight testing each other out. They clashed so fast that it looked as if they weren't moving. I wonder if Obito can keep up with this. If combat speed is equalized then he should be able to keep up but zeldris has amps. His combat speed could force obito to stay intangible if Zeldris is near.
Click to expand...
Sasuke and Naruto at the valley of the end were comparable and sasuke using his sharingan prediction could see several images of were Naruto would be and what attacks he would use before Naruto even made them and set up counters before Naruto even got into position.

Mangekyo sharingan is > normal sharingan which did the feats listed above so it should help alot against Zeldris and his amps.
 
SemiRaedi said:
All of them, in character he doesn't use them but he hasn't gone up against opponents like Zeldris

Sasuke and Naruto at the valley of the end were comparable and sasuke using his sharingan prediction could see several images of were Naruto would be and what attacks he would use before Naruto even made them and set up counters before Naruto even got into position.

Mangekyo sharingan is > normal sharingan which did the feats listed above so it should help alot against Zeldris and his amps.
Click to expand...
Yes but Zeldirs has ON and omnious bind to help him and he can soul steal and has piety that will activate if obito tries to flee
 
speedster352 said:
Yes but Zeldirs has ON and omnious bind to help him and he can soul steal and has piety that will activate if obito tries to flee
Click to expand...
While I doubt he can predict ominous nebula and bind exactly, if he predicts him going into a strange stance then he'll go intangible and back up a safe distance.
 
SemiRaedi said:
While I doubt he can predict ominous nebula and bind exactly, if he predicts him going into a strange stance then he'll go intangible and back up a safe distance.
Click to expand...
Yes but physical contact will happen eventually and obito chakra will be sealed. Actually just Zeldris putting his arm out will activate Omnious bind. ON activates instantly and is way faster than obito.
 
speedster352 said:
Exactly
Click to expand...
Through contact with kamui which will probably kill him.

The match kinda seems to be very skewered towards Zeldris if obito has no knowledge that touching Zeldris means game over, although I may be wrong so correct me if I'm wrong.
 
SemiRaedi said:
Through contact with kamui which will probably kill him.

The match kinda seems to be very skewered towards Zeldris if obito has no knowledge that touching Zeldris means game over, although I may be wrong so correct me if I'm wrong.
Click to expand...
Yes they both have win cons but Zeldris has a higher chance of winning try to get the supporters of the verse here
 
SemiRaedi said:
Through contact with kamui which will probably kill him.

The match kinda seems to be very skewered towards Zeldris if obito has no knowledge that touching Zeldris means game over, although I may be wrong so correct me if I'm wrong.
Click to expand...
No, it wouldn't kill him imo. Demons can regenerate from a hole in their head. Unless obito kamui all 7 hearts he wins. He will have to use this technique 7 Times. Zeldris will ofcourse dodge it after seeing what kamui can do (if he doesn't use god)

Chances are that kamui puts a lot of strain on his eyes. Intangibility would reach his limit. I have never seen obito spamming kamui.

I only see obito reaching his limit the longer zeldris is around tbh.
 
VsReferee said:
No, it wouldn't kill him imo. Demons can regenerate from a hole in their head. Unless obito kamui all 7 hearts he wins. He will have to use this technique 7 Times. Zeldris will ofcourse dodge it after seeing what kamui can do (if he doesn't use god)

Chances are that kamui puts a lot of strain on his eyes. Intangibility would reach his limit. I have never seen obito spamming kamui.

I only see obito reaching his limit the longer zeldris is around tbh.
Click to expand...
Obito spams kamui through the intag, the bfr being a part of the same group of abilities, hashirama cells give him very good stamina which allows him to use sharingan abilities with much less strain.

The reason why he doesn't spam the bfr is because in character he only uses it on fodder since he doesn't need it against the opponents he fights against in Naruto.

Since he isn't dumb, he'll eventually resort to it against Zeldris.
 
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