Luke Skywalker vs Goku

[The_real_cal_howard]

Okay, I remembered something I learned during my early time here. It's because you can't train your internal organs. Sure, he could train his outer body to 3-D perfection, but his inner body still remains untrained as it was when he stopped going through growing.

Also, both, Kaguya and Naruto both severely outclass Vader. All three can one shot Vader. What can Goku do. Kill him harder?

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Regardless, let's say I'm wrong, and it doesn't affect Goku. There's still sooooo many other ways that Luke could mop the floor with Goku. Soul, mind, astral, and subatomic.

 

[Jucaslucas]

1- Okay, I remembered something I learned during my early time here. It's because you can't train your internal organs. Sure, he could train his outer body to 3-D perfection, but his inner body still remains untrained as it was when he stopped going through growing.
2-Also, both, Kaguya and Naruto both severely outclass Vader. All three can one shot Vader. What can Goku do. Kill him harder?

1-That still doesn't explain how he survives a single hit without getting his internal organs turned into pasta. If his KI makes his skin and bones stronger, why not internal organs? It makes his reactions faster, so it does something on his brain for him to react to mftl stuff.

2- This is not about Goku's ap. It's his durability. Kaguya and Naruto's dura is not good enough to survive having their organs crushed, apparently. But Goku's dura is.

Got it?

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

I'm not even referring to organ crushing (only, although by your logic, theirs should be). SW hax in general outclasses most verses, let alone DB.

 

[Jucaslucas]

Well, we've been discussing organ crushing, so I obviously thought you were talking about it . . .

 

[The_real_cal_howard]

Fair enough. I should've been clearer. Also, sorry if I've been a little snarky. I hope I haven't been, but if I was, I apologize.

 

[Jucaslucas]

It's okay.

 

[A_Sword_Dancer]

I doubt goku would survive having his organs crushed, the issue is that they wouldnt get crushed in he first place because of the durability difference.

As for the other things that EU luke can apparently do, I'm not an expert, but unless luke turned into some long range space wizard who doesn't even use a lightsaber anymore he probbaly needs some form of physical contact or projectile or something to use his various one hit kill moves that apparently ignore durability.

 

[fandom_007Goldeneye]

The thing is, Ki doesn't need to wrap around Goku, he stopped Trunks without any aura around him.

Ki is something everyone has like the force, it's in every living things including plants, stars etc

Goku's Ki is on a universal level, his internal organs and body is protected with or without any aura surrounding him, it's safe to say Goku can resist Lukes mind control, might not be for long, but can for a bit because, Goku can also use telepathy as he did talking with Gohan via telepathy during the fight with Vegeta or reading Krillins mind on Namek, Ki and Force are similar but Ki is much much more powerful being able to bust universes and survive attacks that are on that level.

So keeping all that in mind, during the fight, they're both bloodlusted and speed is equalised, if Goku lands 1 hit on Luke, then it's over, but if Goku can't within the short amount of time he has before he's mind is taken over, then Luke wins.

However, Goku is a master martial artist and genius when it comes to fighting, combined with the energy he has to use for beam attacks and such, I say Goku wins this.

 

[Drellix]

Lol this is a stomp in Luke's favor. Goku does not have the ability to resist his mind hax.

 

[PostmodernD]

There is zero evidence that Goku could resist mind control and manipulation on the level Luke posesses.

Being attacked internally and on a molecular level isn't going to be stopped by Goku.

Luke's precog is going to outmatch any sort of martial arts mastery Goku has.

 

[fandom_007Goldeneye]

Lol this is a stomp in Luke's favor. Goku does not have the ability to resist his mind hax.

How do you know that though, Goku can use mind abilities too.

This thread though, Goku is a million leagues above Luke but apparently his mind hax is enough to beat Goku.

 

[Hop_Hoppington-Hoppenhiemer]

Speed equalized it the only reason we are having this discussion.

However assuming they are being fair but bloodlusted... Dunno. Wonder if Goku's body can resist a lightsaber.

 

[fandom_007Goldeneye]

Nvm lol I'm gonna make a Giorno Giovanna vs Luke thread cya

 

[Drellix]

Lol this is a stomp in Luke's favor. Goku does not have the ability to resist his mind hax.

How do you know that though, Goku can use mind abilities too.
This thread though, Goku is a million leagues above Luke but apparently his mind hax is enough to beat Goku.

Luke is above Sidious. Sidious mind ****** over a 2 trillion people. I think this is quite the stomp.

 

[Drellix]

Speed equalized it the only reason we are having this discussion.
However assuming they are being fair but bloodlusted... Dunno. Wonder if Goku's body can resist a lightsaber.

Lightsaber won't even need to be used.

 

[fandom_007Goldeneye]

Lol this is a stomp in Luke's favor. Goku does not have the ability to resist his mind hax.

How do you know that though, Goku can use mind abilities too.
This thread though, Goku is a million leagues above Luke but apparently his mind hax is enough to beat Goku.

Luke is above Sidious. Sidious mind ****** over a 2 trillion people. I think this is quite the stomp.

2 trillion people haha

You mean 2 trillion weak human or alien races.

That's just the scale his mind attack can reach, it does not mean it's powerful enough to take over a universal beings mind.

Anyways lemme go make that thread

 

[Drellix]

Lol this is a stomp in Luke's favor. Goku does not have the ability to resist his mind hax.

How do you know that though, Goku can use mind abilities too.
This thread though, Goku is a million leagues above Luke but apparently his mind hax is enough to beat Goku.

Luke is above Sidious. Sidious mind ****** over a 2 trillion people. I think this is quite the stomp.

2 trillion people haha
You mean 2 trillion weak human or alien races.

That's just the scale his mind attack can reach, it does not mean it's powerful enough to take over a universal beings mind.

Anyways lemme go make that thread

You realize that 1) That's the entire population of Coroscant that Sid mind ******. 2) What does Goku being universal on STRENGTH have anything to due with his resistance to ridiculous mind hax? Also what stops Luke from completely changing Goku's body to be weaker then a fly?

 

[A_Sword_Dancer]

I hate that '2 trillon mind haxed' claim. Unless a significant portion of those people had some sort of high level mind hax resistance, the only feat that shows is aoe.

 

[Drellix]

I hate that '2 trillon mind haxed' claim. Unless a significant portion of those people had some sort of high level mind hax resistance, the only feat that shows is aoe.

I don't think you understand that number. That's more than a thousand times the number on our planet alone. And that's still low balling it.

 

[The_Everlasting]

I hate that '2 trillon mind haxed' claim. Unless a significant portion of those people had some sort of high level mind hax resistance, the only feat that shows is aoe.

If we can't judge the potency of mind hax by how many people it affects at once, how are we supposed to judge its potency?

 

[A_Sword_Dancer]

I hate that '2 trillon mind haxed' claim. Unless a significant portion of those people had some sort of high level mind hax resistance, the only feat that shows is aoe.

If we can't judge the potency of mind hax by how many people it affects at once, how are we supposed to judge its potency?

Mind haxing a lot of people who have no resistance does not demonstrate the ability to mind hax even one person who has a moderate or high level of mind hax resistance. It's a feat for range and number of targets, but for potency you'd ned to mind hax someone who actually has the ability to resist and break through that resistance anyway.

In other words, mind hax yoda and I'll be impressed, mind hax an infinite amount of non jedi children and its still something but it's not going to convince me that you can mind hax yoda.

 

[RadicalMrR]

1.What is up with this organ nonsense Hit was attacking Goku's organs from the outside with Universal AP so the force stands no chance of doing better

2.Goku is actually tring to not let his Ki out of his body constantly, it actually takes more effort for him to hold it in then let it out, not to mention this is Kaio Ken Goku so it's even harder for him to keep it in control.

3.An experienced comebatente like Goku can hold his breath for hours so he will find time to IT, also he has been shown to be able to IT to King Kai even when King Kai doesn't want him there.

 

[PostmodernD]

Weren't some of the people Sidious mind screwed Jedi? People with high levels of will and at least some form of reisistance? Or am I remembering this wrong?

 

[The_Everlasting]

@Sword

And how is that relevant when Goku doesn't have any resistance?

 

[Ryukama]

Lucas and Sword are right. There is no damn way Goku's organs are octovigintillions of times weaker than the rest of his body. He would not be able to properly function. Plus as Lucas has said Goku's organs technically have durability feats via taking those attacks at such massive speeds and power. You can't just keep saying "that's not how durability works." In the real world it is and especially when the organs have showings of durability like that you can't turn around and say they don't count.

 

[RadicalMrR]

^Because the fight is determined by one thing, can Luke mind Hax Goku before Goku destroies everything

 

[Ryukama]

@Radical I'm not saying Goku could win or wouldn't fall to other hax but these notions of "force not thinking to reach the organs," organs being octoviginitillions of times weaker than the rest of the body, and durability feats of his organs suddenly not being how dura works are just completely absurd.

 

[BruceTheBatman]

Luke also has subatomic matter manipulation.

 

[AguilaR101]

Goku wins, the shockwave of his attacks are independent of combat speed and they travel up to quintillions of times the speed of light, (see Beerus vs Goku fight).

He also demonstrated enough ability to predict where an opponent would be .1 second after a timestop, that gives him a heck of a speed advantage.

 

[RadicalMrR]

Goku-11 (Possibly 13, some people are argueing him but not voting)

Luke-6 (Possibly 7 for the same reasons above, +1 if you count the Op's vote which I don't know how to feel about)

2-Inconclusive

Please help me re count this thread is giant

 

[Aparajita]

Luke wins via Subatomic Matter Manipulation. Sidious was capable of transmuting objects into other objects and Luke is far beyond his skill at that point.

With Speed Equalized, Luke's mental force would shatter Goku's Shōki (or mind, his will), (which is one of the key points in creating Ki). Without Will, there is no Ki.

Without Ki, there's no energy blast, no IT, nothing. Not even superhuman durability.

 

[The_Everlasting]

Given how badly this thread was derailed (Since, you know, it's 150+ responses long), I'm just going to close it.