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Lucifer's Creation “infinite dimension”

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VeryGoofyToddler

VeryGoofyToddler

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So I was looking over the revision project when something popped into my mind. Lucifer’s Creation might have infinite dimensions.

As we know Mike Carey explicitly states that he sees Universe and Multiverse as synonymous to describe an all-encompassing Creation. Highlighting that the Universe is the structure or totality and the Multiverse the “multiplicity” of realms and dimensions within it. These are explaining the trimming of Creation and both words can be used.

Mike Carey clearly explains we shouldn't get mixed semantics because they mean the same thing. There's no difference to use each word to explain a Creation that is all-encompassing.

Now that we get Mike Carey explaining that Lucifer's Creation has dimension. We will go over why this is important. Lucifer states time and space are of the mind, of the Will. This makes Infinity a local phenomenon. (Lucifer Vol.1 #20)

This is important because Lucifer mentions that he can materialize infinity as a concept to any matter. Which he explicitly said he did so with time and space, hence why Yahweh’s Creation has an infinite space-time continuum. To him, infinity is a relative term that other beings like the Lilim cannot comprehend. (Lucifer #20)

Now read what Lucifer said correctly:

Think about infinity. It'll come to you. I've folded it through time and space. There's a gate in every world, now every realm.
Click to expand...
(Lucifer Vol.1 #20)

This is important because he shattered it in every world(Universes)and then he said now every realm(dimension). We know this because, in Lucifer’s Creation, there isn't any afterlife. This is because to him such concepts are grotesque. (Lucifer Vol.1 #69)

Elaine said “beneath the worlds” are realms that are unfinished. These realms are dimensions because some of the realms have their own rules. In one there are no abstractions left unfinished. Since he created his Creation as an exact replica of Yahweh it matches it in Universes. We know that these realms are infinite because he used infinity as a concept for each part of Creation within expectations to a few dimensions. While Elaine flies across his Creation in the vast infinite distance from where she started would make these realms infinite as well. (Lucifer Vol.1 #69)

As Lucifer mentions breaking down infinity doesn't make it any smaller. Every mention of infinity is relative to him and beings that can create or shape any concept to that “infinite” degree. The gate for each world and realm as he mentions still is infinite. (Lucifer Vol.1 #49)

When you connect these dots they come together quite well.
 
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VeryGoofyToddler said:
So I was looking over the revision project when something popped into my mind. Lucifer’s Creation might have infinite dimensions.

As we know Mike Carey explicitly states that he sees Universe and Multiverse as synonymous to describe an all-encompassing Creation. Highlighting that the Universe is the structure or totality and the Multiverse the “multiplicity” of realms and dimensions within it. These are explaining the trimming of Creation and both words can be used.
Click to expand...
the scan doesn`t say about the nature of those dimensions and whether they are infinite spatial dimensionms
VeryGoofyToddler said:
Mike Carey clearly explains we shouldn't get mixed semantics because they mean the same thing. There's no difference to use each word to explain a Creation that is all-encompassing.

Now that we get Mike Carey explaining that Lucifer's Creation has dimension. We will go over why this is important. Lucifer states time and space are of the mind, of the Will. This makes Infinity a local phenomenon. (Lucifer Vol.1 #20)

This is important because Lucifer mentions that he can materialize infinity as a concept to any matter. Which he explicitly said he did so with time and space, hence why Yahweh’s Creation has an infinite space-time continuum. To him, infinity is a relative term that other beings like the Lilim cannot comprehend. (Lucifer #20)

Now read what Lucifer said correctly:
Click to expand...
doesn`t really imply anything. Statments about infinity can be as low as tier 2
VeryGoofyToddler said:
(Lucifer Vol.1 #20)

This is important because he shattered it in every world(Universes)and then he said now every realm(dimension). We know this because, in Lucifer’s Creation, there isn't any afterlife. This is because to him such concepts are grotesque. (Lucifer Vol.1 #69)
Click to expand...

VeryGoofyToddler said:
Elaine said “beneath the worlds” are realms that are unfinished. These realms are dimensions because some of the realms have their own rules. In one there are no abstractions left unfinished. Since he created his Creation as an exact replica of Yahweh it matches it in Universes. We know that these realms are infinite because he used infinity as a concept for each part of Creation within expectations to a few dimensions. While Elaine flies across his Creation in the vast infinite distance from where she started would make these realms infinite as well. (Lucifer Vol.1 #69)
Click to expand...
What makes those dimensions spatial dimensions and not universes as implied in the scan
VeryGoofyToddler said:
As Lucifer mentions breaking down infinity doesn't make it any smaller. Every mention of infinity is relative to him and beings that can create or shape any concept to that “infinite” degree. The gate for each world and realm as he mentions still is infinite. (Lucifer Vol.1 #49)

When you connect these dots they come together quite well.
Click to expand...
doesn`t mean anything even High 3A can fit that description
 
the scan doesn`t say about the nature of those dimensions and whether they are infinite spatial dimensionms
Click to expand...
The scans are explicitly saying the size of Creation. It pertains to be people who think it just one reality not comprised of sets such as the Universes and Dimensions. You would know this by reading it because Lucifer created most of the logic that comprised the Universe like the need for time, space, and matter. He would have to make these “realms/dimensional” temporal within the expectation of a few that he left unfinished with these concepts.

doesn`t really imply anything. Statments about infinity can be as low as tier 2
Click to expand...
The scan is a reference to infinity in conjunction with the size of time and space. It's not the only infinity he could fit with other concepts like Universes or Dimensions. Where is time and space located in Yahweh’s Creation? Every world and in Lucifer's Creation shattered through “time and space” affecting all his worlds and realms. This is why he said “Think of infinity” to Michael.

What makes those dimensions spatial dimensions and not universes as implied in the scan
Click to expand...
He created time to accelerate his Creation growth to that of Yahweh. As Elaine mentions I'm flying through “physical spaces.” Since his dimensions are that of abstraction we can conclude that he made these spaces fit the dimensions where you have to travel distances.

doesn`t mean anything even High 3A can fit that description
Click to expand...
That's because you are using this as a standalone. He mentions earlier he has the gate in every world and realm. These scans highlight it still is infinite even when you break infinity it doesn't get smaller. Also, remember he folded time and space through every gate to each of these worlds and realms. When you read for compression it can help you.
 
Xearsay said:
I’m confused. Are you proposing that Lucifer’s creation is 2-A or something? If so I think that’s probably fine.
Click to expand...
It's already considered 2-A because it's an exact replica of Yahweh’s Creation. I was using what Lucifer said that could make his Creation have “infinite dimensions.”
 
Elizio33 said:
I don't understand. Do you suggest a High 1-B Lucifer's Creation?
Click to expand...
No, I don't. At best Low 1-C but I was just saying his Creation has infinite dimensions. However, there is no support or direct mention of superiority between each one. I just wanted to point this out because High 1-B is a stretch.
 
So what exactly are you trying to upgrade here? Lucifer's creation should be Low 1-C or what, cause this is kind of confusing. It seems like you're trying to argue for High 1-B, which you said isn't the intent of the crt. A 2-A Lucifer's creation is already accepted iirc. If this is a crt for low 1-C creation, what's a simplified version of the reasoning, because it just seems like a lot of infinite statements posted.
 
Joshn05 said:
So what exactly are you trying to upgrade here? Lucifer's creation should be Low 1-C or what, cause this is kind of confusing. It seems like you're trying to argue for High 1-B, which you said isn't the intent of the crt. A 2-A Lucifer's creation is already accepted iirc. If this is a crt for low 1-C creation, what's a simplified version of the reasoning, because it just seems like a lot of infinite statements posted.
Click to expand...
I'm not arguing for High 1-B as I already mentioned.

I was just arguing that Lucifer’s Creation has infinite dimensions and a possible upgrade to it would be feasible.
 
Elizio33 said:
You means the Low 1-C Universe contains realms like the Afterlife or Heaven? And Lucifer created a copy of this structure?
Click to expand...
No, these realms like Heaven are past the physical Universes. They house abstractions and other concepts that are not within the Universe. It's possible it could be Low 1-C. Lucifer is capable of making his own afterlife, he just didn't, and the realms beneath these worlds seem allegorical to the afterlife. However, the difference is that these realms are infinite in number while the Afterlife contains a 2-A Creation. As a whole Lucifer's Creation could be Low 1-C.
 
Bump. I think people are fine with this and since Lucifer's Creation is equivalent to Yahweh and we will include things like the Silver City, the totality of Lucifer's Creation should be Low 1-C.
 
PrinceofPein said:
OP should add what they are proposing to the OP, I do not know what they are arguing for although it sounds like they are arguing for H1B
Click to expand...
It wasn't my original intention to argue for any tier but now that you mention it Lucifer's Creation should be the same as Yahweh. It should be Low 1-C, 2-A for the size of the Universes having an infinite space-time continuum. Low 1-C for the planes/realms outside of it. There isn't any Heaven or Hell but these infinite realms outside the infinite Universes should account for Low 1-C.
 
Robo said:
Lucifer's Low 1-C creation is going to be a justification for his AP on his profile?
Click to expand...
Lucifer could very likely create Heaven or at least shape it. Michael matches “Yahweh” in creative potential. So he can create any structure that Yahweh could. Lucifer could as well.
 
VeryGoofyToddler said:
It wasn't my original intention to argue for any tier but now that you mention it Lucifer's Creation should be the same as Yahweh. It should be Low 1-C, 2-A for the size of the Universes having an infinite space-time continuum. Low 1-C for the planes/realms outside of it. There isn't any Heaven or Hell but these infinite realms outside the infinite Universes should account for Low 1-C.
Click to expand...
And why should that be?
Cause nothing in the OP really suggest it.
 
I agree with Lucifer's creation being an infinite universe, but not have infinite number of universes because the scans don't show that.
There is more proof that his creation is infinite more than there being infinite universes. We just know that there are universes that is in his creation but we don't if there is an infinite number of them
 
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Robo said:
I agree with Lucifer's creation being an infinite universe, but not have infinite number of universes because the scans don't show that.
There is more proof that his creation is infinite more than there being infinite universes. We just know that there are universes that is in his creation but we don't if there is an infinite number of them
Click to expand...
There is an “infinite” amount given that Lucifer shaped “infinity” through “time and space” within each of his worlds and realms. That means each of his Univeses has its gate and he was bending infinity to it.

You do realize infinite Universes means the same thing as an infinite amount of Universe right? If you use one to describe something then the other would complement it. The whole OP literally explains it.
 
PrinceofPein said:
And why should that be?
Cause nothing in the OP really suggest it.
Click to expand...
2-A - for Infinite Universes for their own space-time continuum.

Low 1-C - for the dimensions/realms outside the Universes which also was infinite.

The OP literally explains Lucifer's powers and how he bent infinity to quantify the amount of Universes and Dimensions in his realm. There's no reason to tell Michael “think of infinity” and lecture what “infinity” is to the Lilim to tell them he can make infinity from any material given at hand.

There's a reason why he explains “time and space” is of the mind, the will then to tell them that's makes infinity just a local phenomenon.

He literally worded that again to Michael to think of infinity and that he bent it through time and space. To shatter “every” gate in all his worlds and realms. I don't know what Lucifer needs to say to make it more clear. That's literally what's his explaining throughout the entire story.

There's also a good reference to explain this better in case you missed it. Uriel asks Lucifer that he shattered the gates with every piece being in worlds and realms. Then Lucifer reminds him his father's gateway is infinite even breaking infinity down doesn't make it any smaller.

This is important because he tells Michael he bent it through time and space so that every world, as well as every realm, has a gate. Finding the right door would be impossible.

So he makes himself infinity then shatters his gate through time and space with each piece filling a world and now realms. Does this not explain it? Mike Carey literally explains the Multiverse is divided into: worlds, realms, and dimensions. If his Creation is all-encompassing and we use the notion of those pieces to be our set quantity then I don't get the confusion.
 
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PrinceofPein said:
again how is the dimensions outside the universes low 1-C, that is what I am asking
Click to expand...
I don't think it's the tiering I care for. So we can skip past that since I do see the issues involving some of these things. So if we can agree that it does have infinite dimensions based on the evidence, it should be fine as is. It's really something I wanted to point out, my original intention had nothing to do with any tiers.
 
VeryGoofyToddler said:
I don't think it's the tiering I care for. So we can skip past that since I do see the issues involving some of these things. So if we can agree that it does have infinite dimensions based on the evidence, it should be fine as is. It's really something I wanted to point out, my original intention had nothing to do with any tiers.
Click to expand...
Are they infinite? yes based on what I have seen
but you are claiming low 1-C, which is what I do not understand, what exactly is the purpose of the revision? is it just infinite universes outside the multiverse?
 
PrinceofPein said:
Are they infinite? yes based on what I have seen
but you are claiming low 1-C, which is what I do not understand, what exactly is the purpose of the revision? is it just infinite universes outside the multiverse?
Click to expand...
The purpose is to acknowledge Lucifer has things other than just Universes in his Creation. These are the realms outside of it, which later where I would explain better that maybe it needs a tier revamping. This is just to pinpoint something out which may help to determine if it's just more than a 2-A Creation.

In short: We’re just acknowledging infinite realms/dimensions outside the standard infinite Universes in Lucifer's Creation.

Long version: This will help later explain why it can have a tier upgrade. That Lucifer Creation as in the whole/totality is more than just a 2-A structure.
 
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