Las Noches Size Downgrade

[Ghostimuscrime]

Do you mean that the movie's known to be non-canon?

kinda? he once said not to take movies as canon (was not plural but then japanese dont have plurals i was told so whatevs)
but even aside that we dont treat any of the movies as canon aside MON

That's not anything close to what that rule means. We need calculations for most feats because they can be done in a variety of ways that could significantly change the value. Characters can destroy towns without creating a ground-based explosion that demolishes reinforced concrete buildings 1km away. We're still allowed to, and frequently use, references to real-life structures for these sorts of things.

I mean it does we are to not correlate them with their namesakes and that we should use calculations instead, if you're gonna say "this should be scaled to the size of a country because they called it a country" then that's not worth debating in the big year of 2026 when structures can be vastly smaller or bigger than their irl namesake counterparts and I doubt a single soul would find that convincing

I don't understand how that's helped by the place being smaller. No matter what the size of the place ultimately is, I don't think you'd contest that the interior walk is 1.6x shorter than the exterior walk. So either way, there's this contradiction where they probably could've run around the outside, instead of sneaking through the inside, and made better time that way.

Kinda? not entirely tho because again inside that you have this town esque infrastructure so you don't get to make a straight line, realistically it's like unquantifiably more than moving in a chord but less than moving in an arc
but yeah even if the chord is supposed to be 9 days, doing so in a few dozen hours at most breaks the idea, your second line idk if its agreeing or disagreeing with me but they didn't sneak inside, they broke inside, ichigo and friends supplied their own energy to blast them inside the seretei barriers and each of them got shot into opposite corners from each other & then they fought a buncha people and the rest is history, idk what you meant by the last sentence but i felt the need to correct up this part just in case

 

[KingogKings777]

kinda? he once said not to take movies as canon (was not plural but then japanese dont have plurals i was told so whatevs)
but even aside that we dont treat any of the movies as canon aside MON

Didn't Fade to Black get approved for its setting but not events?
Fade to Black's canonicity

 

[Agnaa]

kinda? he once said not to take movies as canon (was not plural but then japanese dont have plurals i was told so whatevs)
but even aside that we dont treat any of the movies as canon aside MON

Yeah that does make using it pretty sus then.

Didn't Fade to Black get approved for its setting but not events?
Fade to Black's canonicity

Oh, I guess that's that?

I mean it does we are to not correlate them with their namesakes and that we should use calculations instead, if you're gonna say "this should be scaled to the size of a country because they called it a country" then that's not worth debating in the big year of 2026 when structures can be vastly smaller or bigger than their irl namesake counterparts and I doubt a single soul would find that convincing

Our calculations correlate them with their namesakes. Like ****, I had this calc accepted by two CGMs, which used 1km diameter for a "town-class fireball" because our baseline for Town level is an explosion 1km in diameter.

They can be vastly smaller or bigger, we estimate it based on the information we have. When we need to calculate a mountain, we typically go with our baseline for that of 610m. We use assumptions based on real-life analogues all the time in calcs, any CGM could tell you this.

Kinda? not entirely tho because again inside that you have this town esque infrastructure so you don't get to make a straight line, realistically it's like unquantifiably more than moving in a chord but less than moving in an arc
but yeah even if the chord is supposed to be 9 days, doing so in a few dozen hours at most breaks the idea, your second line idk if its agreeing or disagreeing with me but they didn't sneak inside, they broke inside, ichigo and friends supplied their own energy to blast them inside the seretei barriers and each of them got shot into opposite corners from each other & then they fought a buncha people and the rest is history, idk what you meant by the last sentence but i felt the need to correct up this part just in case

Sneak through, is what I meant.

Even if moving inside is longer, that just makes this counterargument even weaker.

 

[Arkenis]

Look if the canopy is just some digital image then my point prob wrong

If there are at least nine castles, some of which are entire cities, and which aren't within visual distance of each other, then anything under like 20km diameter seems really hard to justify.

Aaroniero's and Nnoitra's seem to be in the same palace. This one palace seems like a smaller LN and its not seen anywhere when looking at Szayelaporro's palace and other shots people have already brought up.

There's also something else I wanted to show when people brought up how big Los Noches looks from outside, but its still very applicable inside.
Sources are linked on the pic.

Here's an image of Manhattan's skyline from Brooklyn 10 miles away.


Here's Boston from 15 miles away.


Here's Toronto's skyline from Adjala-Tosorontio, roughly 30-50 miles away.

Here's Toronto from Niagara Falls 41 miles away.

My point here is, if any of the palaces are in the 100-200m range in height, they'd be visible in most of the shots, but they aren't. Would like some proposal through horizon measurements maybe?

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

Didn't Fade to Black get approved for its setting but not events?
Fade to Black's canonicity

he can like the general plot & themes and cosign them which does not necessarily MEAN that line was either inserted by him or something he believes into being canon or believes at all as we know he didnt write it himself

Our calculations correlate them with their namesakes. Like ****, I had this calc accepted by two CGMs, which used 1km diameter for a "town-class fireball" because our baseline for Town level is an explosion 1km in diameter.
They can be vastly smaller or bigger, we estimate it based on the information we have. When we need to calculate a mountain, we typically go with our baseline for that of 610m. We use assumptions based on real-life analogues all the time in calcs, any CGM could tell you this.

that's aight, if they find it to be valid, I don't have much to say other than personal disagreement as they can be bigger than the baseline or smaller than the baseline we really would never know without inspecting the material (in this case it is quite smaller than what they are alluding to) & the more assumptions you make the weaker the evidence gets, I don't (personally) believe we should take those things over on screen depictions

Even if moving inside is longer, that just makes this counterargument even weaker.

what? mind elaborating?

 

[Agnaa]

what? mind elaborating?

It seemed like you were arguing:

• If they can walk through the interior in less than a day, it shouldn't take them much longer to go around the outside, especially if they run. This contradicts the idea that going around the outside would take 10 days.

But I still think that causes an issue, even without that.

• If they can walk through the interior in less than a day, and in fact, due to all the zig-zagging and sneaking they would've needed to done this would've taken longer than running around the outside, so why wouldn't they do that?

Like, the point of contradiction is that they went through the interior, instead of running around the outside.

But that contradiction is created due to the relative distances, not due to any absolute number put on them.

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

Like, the point of contradiction is that they went through the interior, instead of running around the outside.
But that contradiction is created due to the relative distances, not due to any absolute number put on them.

but said zigzagging by geometrical rules entail at least a duration of >9 days if that gets contradicted the overall size gets contradicted as well, you can't detach those figures & if you think the overall thing is wonky that adds credence to why they are not reliable cuz no matter how you see it, the implied size WAS explicitly contradicted by the story, it is no longer usable

 

[Agnaa]

but said zigzagging by geometrical rules entail at least a duration of >9 days if that gets contradicted the overall size gets contradicted as well, you can't detach those figures & if you think the overall thing is wonky that adds credence to why they are not reliable cuz no matter how you see it, the implied size WAS explicitly contradicted by the story, it is no longer usable

I mean that it's not the size (in units) that was contradicted, it was the relative distances traveled, devoid of units.

We do not lose the contradiction by saying that you can travel from one gate to another in half a day.

Our ways to resolve the contradiction are:

• We say that those moving through the inside were able to travel about as quickly as they would've around the perimeter.
• We say that there are actually only two gates, instead of four.

I can be more sympathetic that, even though size isn't directly contradicted, this still shows issues with the information he provides about the geometry of locations.

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

the relative distances have an equivalent timeframe, you don't loose that because you happen to calculate that (you know like you calculated distance)
if it's another case of cherrypicking you already know I'm gonna disagree with that & i'm pretty sure most would too

We say that those moving through the inside were able to travel about as quickly as they would've around the perimeter.

idk, the rocket infiltration method exposed em to fights that are dangerous to them

We say that there are actually only two gates, instead of four.

about that...

 

[Agnaa]

idk which parts you're getting or not getting so idk how to respond at this point.

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

in regards to two gates, I have shown in the imgur link they actually have 4 gates and the current seretei calc also uses 4 gates, i say about that but it wasnt showing confusion

my third line, I suppose I could say i have a hard time understanding that, I did reply with something but now it looks like you may have meant something else

the first two lines are a direct response to your first line, those are not me showing confusion either

 

[Agnaa]

I know that there are four gates.

That's one of the aspects that creates the contradiction, where losing it would lose the contradiction.

• The characters can move from the edge, to the center, and decided to do this instead of moving to another gate due to it being faster.
• The characters could've moved more freely by going to another gate, due to not needing to keep cover inside.
• There are four gates, meaning that the distance from one gate to another is a quarter of the circumference. Making the distance to one barely longer than the radius, and quite possibly even shorter given the winding streets one would have to navigate.

Those three things are what create the contradiction, and we'd need to ditch one of them in order to not have the contradiction.

The contradiction does not come from any particular distance (such as a ten day's walk) being attributed to it.

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

The characters can move from the edge, to the center, and decided to do this instead of moving to another gate due to it being faster.

one thing i wanna clarify is that they did not choose the chord believing it was faster, they chose to rocket into the seretei because the initial gate was hard to enter as explained in chapter 76

in ch79 Kukaku tells her plan to launch them into the seretei with the rocket

in ch84 & 85 they break in and are "shot" in alternate directions landing near the edge

so the first idea that they knew the chord is faster than the arc is false, it was never stated and couldnt be known based on info given and situation thats happening

The characters could've moved more freely by going to another gate, due to not needing to keep cover inside.

this part i'd say is true

There are four gates, meaning that the distance from one gate to another is a quarter of the circumference. Making the distance to one barely longer than the radius, and quite possibly even shorter given the winding streets one would have to navigate.

As you know (and sorry im repeating this to reinforce for those who skipped the bible swaps)

it IS a shorter distance but not by an order of magnitude, would still require those 9 days

---

so they unfortunately are not ditchable, after this topic, it'd be preferable to wrap things up because other topics have more or less been exhausted with the pro side just going on infinite repetition without being able to respond to their counters

 

[Agnaa]

one thing i wanna clarify is that they did not choose the chord believing it was faster, they chose to rocket into the seretei because the initial gate was hard to enter as explained in chapter 76

in ch79 Kukaku tells her plan to launch them into the seretei with the rocket

in ch84 & 85 they break in and are "shot" in alternate directions landing near the edge

so the first idea that they knew the chord is faster than the arc is false, it was never stated and couldnt be known based on info given and situation thats happening

I don't think that's true? From this scan, they considered walking to another gate, but determined that doing so would take too long.

So they must have believed that the chord was faster than the arc.

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

lil bro that's not what I said, the concept of chord vs arc wasnt a thing with them, they thought blasting in was a faster method, it was the rocket vs arc, they're juggling options on how to get entry

 

[Agnaa]

Is it something like, they thought that by rocketing in they'd land closer to their destination, but something ****** up, and they landed near an edge instead?

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

Is it something like, they thought that by rocketing in they'd land closer to their destination, but something ****** up, and they landed near an edge instead?

tbh they wouldnt know that, all they would know is that you'd be skipping SOME distance (this part is true and uncontradicted)

rocket method = only have to travel 1 radius at most (1 chord)
arc method = have to reroute to another gate and then travel 1 radius unit (1 arc + 1 chord)

 

[Agnaa]

Yeah okay.

So rocketing in lets them bypass reinforcements (and as a bonus, skip some distance) without travelling one arc first.

So the contradiction does stand, there.

Fair enough~

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

DUBSSS

 

[Hellscream]

It seemed like you were arguing:

• If they can walk through the interior in less than a day, it shouldn't take them much longer to go around the outside, especially if they run. This contradicts the idea that going around the outside would take 10 days.

But I still think that causes an issue, even without that.

• If they can walk through the interior in less than a day, and in fact, due to all the zig-zagging and sneaking they would've needed to done this would've taken longer than running around the outside, so why wouldn't they do that?

Like, the point of contradiction is that they went through the interior, instead of running around the outside.

But that contradiction is created due to the relative distances, not due to any absolute number put on them.

Agnaa

The point is, they were not walking.
Ichigo in particular was shown in a haste and was shown running.

If they do not walk, the walking statement does not get invalidated.
Higher tier characters like Captain level shinigami can also cover these distances instantly with shunpo, and ichigo and his gang are all superhuman in this arc.
Ichigo in is a bit stronger than a lieutenant and continued to upscale through the arc.

The reason why they did not travel through the outside, like i stated prior is because they did not have a single day to spare, or else rukia would've been executed.
Moving to the other gate by running for example, would also introduce uncertanties with the gate guardian, and them potentially being stopped again.
Nothing here is contradictory.

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

This line has been responded to several times, everytime it's proven wrong you just duck the counterarguments and parrot the same line again like some broken repeat machine

at this point you're just stone walling

 

[Agnaa]

Agnaa

The point is, they were not walking.
Ichigo in particular was shown in a haste and was shown running.

If they do not walk, the walking statement does not get invalidated.
Higher tier characters like Captain level shinigami can also cover these distances instantly with shunpo, and ichigo and his gang are all superhuman in this arc.
Ichigo in is a bit stronger than a lieutenant and continued to upscale through the arc.

The reason why they did not travel through the outside, like i stated prior is because they did not have a single day to spare, or else rukia would've been executed.
Moving to the other gate by running for example, would also introduce uncertanties with the gate guardian, and them potentially being stopped again.
Nothing here is contradictory.

Applies to Ichigo, not some of the others who (as Ghostimuscrime says) had to blend in with the population.

 

[Hellscream]

Applies to Ichigo, not some of the others who (as Ghostimuscrime says) had to blend in with the population.

The entirety of soul society was on a witch hunt for ichigo, they blended in by disguising themselves as shinigami which allowed them to move freely.



You can literally see the shinigami on a hunt for them here.

 

[Hellscream]

This line has been responded to several times, everytime it's proven wrong you just duck the counterarguments and parrot the same line again like some broken repeat machine

at this point you're just stone walling

No offense, but i CBA arguing with people that selectively pick out scans without explaining the further context to people.

You have failed to address any of my arguments.

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

I'd like to add the entirety of ichigo's journey was not running, a lot of it especially the underground passage had him just randomly walk & stroll and a few pages later in the same chapter we see he's arrived near the castle that has rukia

No offense, but i CBA arguing with people that selectively pick out scans without explaining the further context to people.

if you cant-be-arsed to actually respond to arguments people make then you don't have any business in this thread as your comments just clutter & stonewall, piss poor accusations will get you nowhere dude

 

[Hellscream]

I'd like to add the entirety of ichigo's journey was not running, a lot of it especially the underground passage had him just randomly walk & stroll and a few pages later in the same chapter we see he's arrived near the castle that has rukia


if you cant-be-arsed to actually respond to arguments people make then you don't have any business in this thread as your comments just clutter & stonewall, piss poor accusations will get you nowhere dude

You should atleast bother to show every prior scene before arriving there.

 

[Phsccarvalho]

How are the votes going?

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

I'd like to add the entirety of ichigo's journey was not running

You should atleast bother to show every prior scene before arriving there.

sigh, that running scene was before he got to the edge of the inner circle dude (this is still a significant fraction of the overall diameter that should exceed 10 days)

The entirety of soul society was on a witch hunt for ichigo, they blended in by disguising themselves as shinigami which allowed them to move freely.

Looks like he edited his comment to add more answers that i didn't see anyways It did not allow them to move freely as they were still questioned by multiple people, blending in makes them go careful and calmly

• In ch120, Uryu & Orihime are questioned by randoms and had people suspect them more
• They get caught by the guy
• They encounter crowds
• They get caught by Mayuri (mayuri vs uryu fight begins)
• uryu staggers and walks while wounded to the castle (this is not running obviously)

that's not really free movement like you say

---

why are we assuming characters who never have displayed faster than normal travel speeds to have that? that needs to be proven by hellscream instead of just making a bunch of claims, orihime never displayed good travel speed feats in the series, chad was figuring out his powers so he wouldnt be able to do stuff like shunpo either, Ganju & Hanataro's case are the same as Ichigo's

 

[Hellscream]

Bro.

Show the scenes prior.
Like jesus ******* christ.

Orihime and uryu running

Mayuri compliments Uyru for his speed

Ichigo also arrived way before them.

Now stop quoting me.

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

Mayuri compliments Uyru for his speed

this is not for travel speed, this is for a combat attack he did

Orihime and uryu running

1) don't change what you said, you said they get to move freely, the events they had to go through proves otherwise
2) they don't get to freely run, only when the coast is clear, otherwise they're stuck with convincing people to let em slide
3) there's additional lines I've added to the post above, you also need to prove her travel speed with travel speed feats

Now stop quoting me.

nuh uh

 

[Hellscream]

this is not for travel speed, this is for a combat attack he did

1) don't change what you said, you said they get to move freely, the events they had to go through proves otherwise
2) they don't get to freely run, only when the coast is clear, otherwise they're stuck with convincing people to let em slide
3) there's additional lines I've added to the post above, you also need to prove her travel speed with travel speed feats

nuh uh

They don't need to move freely all the time, it doesn't debunk it.

Just the fact that they're shown running obliterates your entire premise and non stop yapping.
They also faced Mayuri near the barracks where rukya was held.

Orihime as a human was already listed as an athletic human, before getting amped by her fullbringer powers, chad was already superhuman, and so was Uryu.
All of them had amps.

 

[Agnaa]

why are we assuming characters who never have displayed faster than normal travel speeds to have that? that needs to be proven by hellscream instead of just making a bunch of claims, orihime never displayed good travel speed feats in the series, chad was figuring out his powers so he wouldnt be able to do stuff like shunpo either, Ganju & Hanataro's case are the same as Ichigo's

True!

Although many profiles omit those sorts of things even if characters have them, so I'll be fine with people providing decent evidence here (as opposed to requiring them to already be on profiles).

 

[Hellscream]

You're also asserting that all of them landed near the outer wall, which was only the case for chad, and was actually shown.

So their starting locations are different, meaning distance to center is not the same.

Prove that all of them started near the outer walls, and got to the center from there.

Hirenkyaku, the movement technique used against mayuri also applies to travel speed, as it's the quincy variant of Shunpo and sonido, which is used for travel and combat.

So basically anything you've posted has been obliterated.

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

Ganju & Hanataro's case are the same as Ichigo's

meant to say orihime here instead of ichigo my fault

They don't need to move freely all the time, it doesn't debunk it.

an unconfirmed amount of distance was ran where as we know with certainty they got hit with several hiccups along the way, you can't claim the one, two instances they got to run normally they ran at super high MHS travel speeds

They also faced Mayuri near the barracks where rukya was held.

mind proving this dear hellscream?

Orihime as a human was already listed as an athletic human, before getting amped by her fullbringer powers, chad was already superhuman, and so was Uryu.
All of them had amps.

WHAT AMP
they got fought battles and got tired if anything, you gotta prove the amp as well as prove they get their travel speeds boosted to a good amount because the only piece of evidence that they could travel fast is shunpu/sonido (for the non knowledgeable: these are high speed movement techniques for bleach characters, orihime and chad dont have this)

also orihimes profile says she's atheletic in combat speed

You're also asserting that all of them landed near the outer wall, which was only the case for chad, and was actually shown.

actually they were all shot at nigh equal distances away from the center, we know this because when we saw them split up, they all had a similar arc length to chad's meaning they also got shot at similar distances, with ichigo we outright know he was at the inner circle's edge before he went with hantaro

Hirenkyaku, the movement technique used against mayuri also applies to travel speed, as it's the quincy variant of Shunpo and sonido, which is used for travel and combat.

can't prove this was ever used in his travel speed especially because orihime does not know of any of these techniques and they went together without being outpaced or whatever
after orihime and uryu split, uryu fought mayuri and at that time he was too wounded to run as we see him painfully walk to the castle, so no instance allowed him to use his exclusive high speed technique

 

[Hellscream]

meant to say orihime here instead of ichigo my fault

Ganju is shown to outrun shinigami, similar to ichigo, hanataro is also a shinigami

an unconfirmed amount of distance was ran where as we know with certainty they got hit with several hiccups along the way, you can't claim the one, two instances they got to run normally they ran at super high MHS travel speeds

Doesn't address what i said

mind proving this dear hellscream?

He's there right after fighting, and we can safely assume it's not far away as he's heavily wounded,

WHAT AMP
they got fought battles and got tired if anything, you gotta prove the amp as well as prove they get their travel speeds boosted to a good amount because the only piece of evidence that they could travel fast is shunpu/sonido (for the non knowledgeable: these are high speed movement techniques for bleach characters, orihime and chad dont have this)

fullbringer powers being activated.
Fullbringers also possess spiritual pressure, which amps all statistics.

also orihimes profile says she's atheletic in combat speed

Before she had her fullbringer powers awakened.

actually they were all shot at nigh equal distances away from the center, we know this because when we saw them split up, they all had a similar arc length to chad's meaning they also got shot at similar distances, with ichigo we outright know he was at the inner circle's edge before he went with hantaro

Uhuh, so can you tell me what this angle of entrance is?
Does that look like the center to you?

can't prove this was ever used in his travel speed especially because orihime does not know of any of these techniques and they went together without being outpaced or whatever
after orihime and uryu split, uryu fought mayuri and at that time he was too wounded to run as we see him painfully walk to the castle, so no instance allowed him to use his exclusive high speed technique

I don't need even need to prove this lol.
Just the fact that they ran is enough.

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

Ganju is shown to outrun shinigami, similar to ichigo, hanataro is also a shinigami

being shinigami means nothing, shinigamis get hurt from fall damage, shinigamis get hurt if the bathing water is too hot, a lot of shinigami are fodder garbage, shinigami don't inherently have evidence of high speeds (outside shunpo/sonido which none of the non ichigo folk have)

Doesn't address what i said

it does but why dont you address this?

He's there right after fighting, and we can safely assume it's not far away as he's heavily wounded,

no that has no proof, they just cut to the point where he reaches them, you have no proof of this, it's purely a charitable unbacked assumption

fullbringer powers being activated.
Fullbringers also possess spiritual pressure, which amps all statistics.

this does not prove higher travel speed capabilities also chad at this point is very new to his powers and does not have any techniques hes learned, you're taking stuff that might be buffed for the combat speed and applying it to travel speed and again you need either feats or statements of the characters either being able to go that fast or have shown going that fast, you don't proof of that so this does not work

Before she had her fullbringer powers awakened.

her second key is what im talking about, she gets her powers in arc1

Uhuh, so can you tell me what this angle of entrance is?
Does that look like the center to you?

when i said center i meant center of this
where the gang split away in up down right left, their arc angles are nigh equal to each other

I don't need even need to prove this lol.
Just the fact that they ran is enough.

so you can't prove the one thing that's necessary here?
that's rough buddy

 

[Agnaa]

I suppose the main practical questions that CGMs should vote on here are:

1. Should we permit calcs to use Nel's statement for LN's size, if the calculation uses visuals scaling off of that?
2. Should we permit calcs to use Nel's statement for LN's size, if the calculation uses no visuals for scaling?
3. Should the size of LN given by Nel's statement be re-evaluated (likely by making it lower, assuming that a "three days walk" includes breaks)?
4. Should we permit calcs to scale LN-related feats purely off of visuals, ignoring Nel's statement?
5. Should the size of LN given by purely visual scaling, as provided in the OP, be re-evaluated (OP was 5.4km, I've found visual combinations that go as low as 1.7km, YmTheSuper found an off-site calc of 13km)?
6. Should those calculations be revised in other regards (averaging 5m and 3400m to get a "better size estimate" is not a good method)?

For which I'd say

1. Yes.
2. Ideally only if necessary (so, if the manga provides no usable visuals), but if 1 is rejected, then yeah.
3. Yes.
4. No.
5. If 4 is accepted, then yeah.
6. Yes.

If I missed any, lmk and I'll get back to it tomorrow.

 

[Hellscream]

being shinigami means nothing, shinigamis get hurt from fall damage, shinigamis get hurt if the bathing water is too hot, a lot of shinigami are fodder garbage, shinigami don't inherently have evidence of high speeds (outside shunpo/sonido which none of the non ichigo folk have)

(they're all superhuman, all of them possess reiatsu)

it does but why dont you address this?

Bc it's useless

no that has no proof, they just cut to the point where he reaches them, you have no proof of this, it's purely a charitable unbacked assumption

If you can't even deduct that he was nearby, simply from the state he was in, then idk what to tell you

this does not prove higher travel speed capabilities also chad at this point is very new to his powers and does not have any techniques hes learned, you're taking stuff that might be buffed for the combat speed and applying it to travel speed and again you need either feats or statements of the characters either being able to go that fast or have shown going that fast, you don't proof of that so this does not work

You don't need visual evidence, you can scale them from other characters that have the feats.

her second key is what im talking about, she gets her powers in arc1

Correct, meaning he gets amped in act 1, and is shown to be relative so superhumans.

when i said center i meant center of this
where the gang split away in up down right left, their arc angles are nigh equal to each other

The person that was launched the furthest in that picture is Chad, who was launched near the wall, and considering that they were not launched from the actual center of seireitei, some were closer than others.

Your initial claim is that they all reached the center from the boundaries of the outer wall.
But you lack the tracking capabilities of your own arguments.

They entered close to a wall because of their entry angle, not in the middle of seireitei, the person that landed close to that wall and got launched out was chad.
So all of them did not land near the outer walls, just chad.
Your argument is only valid if the entry point was the exact center of the seireitei.

so you can't prove the one thing that's necessary here?
that's rough buddy

 

[Ghostimuscrime]

Your argument is only valid if the entry point was the exact center of the seireitei.

dude straight up ignored the argument I made and repeated his old shit omg

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I think it’s time to wrap up this thread agna was open to evidence which you were not able to provide & anymore yipyap on this would just go in circles and drag out the thread even more so I’d say let’s start counting votes
I have work tomorrow and we can’t spend forever on this

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I suppose the main practical questions that CGMs should vote on here are:

1. Should we permit calcs to use Nel's statement for LN's size, if the calculation uses visuals scaling off of that?
2. Should we permit calcs to use Nel's statement for LN's size, if the calculation uses no visuals for scaling?
3. Should the size of LN given by Nel's statement be re-evaluated (likely by making it lower, assuming that a "three days walk" includes breaks)?
4. Should we permit calcs to scale LN-related feats purely off of visuals, ignoring Nel's statement?
5. Should the size of LN given by purely visual scaling, as provided in the OP, be re-evaluated (OP was 5.4km, I've found visual combinations that go as low as 1.7km, YmTheSuper found an off-site calc of 13km)?
6. Should those calculations be revised in other regards (averaging 5m and 3400m to get a "better size estimate" is not a good method)

the 4 cgms on the pro side voted for a total downgrade including ones with calcs, which means keeping the current stuff is outta the question
but damage did say he only agrees with the downgrade and not necessarily the 5.34 km end so that means we need to find a new & more consistent version & use that to recalc all the feats

Ideally the best would be to use all the px scaleable shots, you take all the (valid) visuals and avg them out to get the best possible end this is one option, the other is that the most I'm willing to compromise with is an average end, you take nel's statement you take the multiple visual shots (minus the ones needing circle extrapolation) average them and use them for everything, this way you can have this compromised version where you have the ups of the nel statement but you don't betray the visuals and thus avoid being hypocritical as Qawsed said so

Option A : Armorchompy, M3X, Damage3245, Floxy​

All Visual pixel scalable shots averaged to be the new basis of all Hueco Mundo Arc Calcs

Option B : Damage3245​

All (valid) visual shots + nel's statement get averaged together to reflect the most accurate end

 

[Hellscream]

dude straight up ignored the argument I made and repeated his old shit omg

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I think it’s time to wrap up this thread agna was open to evidence which you were not able to provide & anymore yipyap on this would just go in circles and drag out the thread even more so I’d say let’s start counting votes
I have work tomorrow and we can’t spend forever on this

All are running here, from the koryu initially, and then the kototsu later on, which is high speed.,
They were there for 7 days straight, and they had to constantly run, due to the koryu, and the kototsu.


You didn't make a counter argument.
Failed to address their entrance point, failed to prove that all of them landed near walls.
Which destroys your wall to center argument.

Claimed that shinigami are human level, when they are trained to be able to fight hollows, and possess spiritual pressure.
All of them are trained warriors.

So yes, it's time to wrap it up, you failed to debunk anything, now put my fries in the bag.