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Kirby Universe revisions 2/Bomberman nerfs

The_Smashor

The_Smashor

15,706
11,448
Yes, I did in fact make somthing like this not too long ago, but before you close it, hear me out, and then give me a good reason for what I've shown to you being false.

As I said in the last thread, Kirby, Galaxia (Meta Knight's sword) and the Master Crown all have been described as Infinate in Planet Robobot, The japanese version of Kirby Super Star Ultra and Kirby's return to dreamland respectively. Why would HAL say that Kirby and Galaxia where infinate as well as the Master Crown if they wern't at the same level of power? Not to mention, some Kirby villains have caused their corruption to go across the universe, spesifically Dark Mind. The Mirrior World is an alternate plane of existanse from the regular world. And, it is implied via Shadow Dedede's description in Triple Deluxe (Shadow Dedede's greatest enemy is his own heart) that Dark Mind actually corrupted the Mirrior World. And he posed a threat to the entire Mirrior World from what the story said, it didn't say that he threatened Mirrior Popstar or anything like that, no, he threatened the entire Mirrior World. Even corrupting Paralel Susie, who is from a seperate part of the universe. Not to mention Drawcia created a dimention, and if Magalor's dimention is considered a Universe, then I don't see why Drawcia's isn't. Also, kinda off topic but, Drawcia Soul dosn't have a part on Drawcia's page. Not to mention Marx's battle seems to take place in another dimention as well, but there's no solid evidence to that. Also, as a side note, these universal feats are from MULTIPLE GAMES. Bomberman's universal feats, for example, are only from ONE game, and he dosn't show a power CLOSE to that in any other game. If Kirby defeating Magalor, Dark Mind and Drawcia are considered outliers, the latter of two are universal due to what I said before, then Bomberman defeating Sitrus and The Angel of Light and Dark should to! So, as such, I feel that Kirby, Meta Knight, Dark Mind, Etc.. should be changed to 4-A, possibly 3-B to 3-A and/or Bomberman should have his tier lowered, since his Bomberman 64 feats are clearly outliers.
 
"Why would HAL say that Kirby and Galaxia where infinate as well as the Master Crown if they wern't at the same level of power?"

Because infinite is just a common type of hyperbole meant to hype something up.

Corrupting/threatening a universe =/= universal.

Magolor's dimension is considered a universe because it has galaxies and supermassive black holes. AFAIK Drawcia's has none of that.

You can't compare Bomberman to Kirby on that basis alone.
 
And as I said, Im not camparing the two. I'm saying what counts as an outlier for Kirby is fair game for Bomberman where in any other game he goes back to struggling against far weaker foes. Bomberman never showed universal power before Bomberman 64 and hasn't shown it since. If defeating the angel of light and dark isn't an outlier for Bomberman and defeating Magalor is one for Kirby, that just dosn't make any sence, as Bomberman has shown feats FAR weaker then Kirby's in games besides Bomberman 64. Honestly, consider that if your HIGHBALLING it Bomberman is star level via the balck hole bomb otherwise (And it's probably not even a real black hole) while Kirby is MSS level. What is more realistic, a star level beating a universal or four multi solar stystem levels beating a universal? They both get stomped, but who would the universal have to use more effort on? Who would come closer to winning? I can see you points and that mine about Kirby in this case are questionable, but that's only half of the title. The other half is Bomberman Nerfs, and that's the part that I feel needs to be changed the MOST. Possibly out of anything out of this wiki, as once again, defeating the angel of light and dark is CLEARLY and outlier.
 
Hey Smashor... I was going to wait like a month to show that thing, couldn't you be more patient?
 
I forgot to mention, Master and Crazy hand appear in Amazing Mirrior. And their not non-canon either. Their ability appears in robobot, and there's nothing that says that their not in the verse. And, the hand that wakes you up in a game over in robobot is called Master Hand in the files, and Kirby casually just eats him in some games if you choose not to continue. Honestly, if you say Master Hand and Crazy hand in Amazing Mirrior isn't canon, then your saying that Kirby just found a Mirrior Shard lying arround in Candy Constilation. Also, Dark Mind might have gotten control over Master Hand and Crazy Hand, actually making him equal to Tabuu. And while this exact thing isn't canon, I thought I might mention that Wiz's hands are Master and Crazy in the manga. The wierd, wierd manga... But anyway, that makes three, possibly four universal characters Kirby has fought and beaten. Not to mention, star dream is ALSO said to have nearly infinate power. Star Dream is a Nova. Do I need to tell you what that means for Marx? Anyway, I'm pretty sure you'll find it hard to debunk this.
 
@Smashor

Cameo characters don't have the same feats in their other media. That's what the hands are in the Kirby series. Cameos. Same with Samus, the Triforce and the other items in Great Cave Offensive, and Mario characters. The manga isn't canon, and there's nothing proving that Dark Mind is equal to Tabuu. Infinite power is hyperbolic for Star Dream.
 
The real cal howard said:
@Smashor
Cameo characters don't have the same feats in their other media. That's what the hands are in the Kirby series. Cameos. Same with Samus, the Triforce and the other items in Great Cave Offensive, and Mario characters. The manga isn't canon, and there's nothing proving that Dark Mind is equal to Tabuu. Infinite power is hyperbolic for Star Dream.
Click to expand...
Tell me... did the Triforce or Samus appear in 10 different Kirby games?

The Mangas continue game by game since always the stories of the games in a different continuity, just because they haven't been translated for cultural differences doesn't mean that they are non-canon.

You see Smashor?, This is what I mean with having the things more organized.
 
>Not mentioning the Falchion cameo

  • TRIGGERED
Jokes aside, even if the hands are canon, what proof is there to them being just as powerful as they are in Smash?

For example, let's say, Polygon Man (PlayStation All-Stars) appears in God of War as a cameo and Kratos beats him, does that mean that Kratos scales to him?
 
They're as canon as every other single manga for Nintendo, which is ambiguous at best (except Metroid).

Still a cameo regardless, and no, they didn't appear in 10 different Kirby games. Not as actual characters, anyway. It's either a clever naming, which means nothing, or like a sticker or something. The Smash Bros. ability (excluding in Amazing Mirror) doesn't count either, as that's just DLC. It's not even available during the main game for Robobot. It's like saying Kirby canonically eats amiibos
 
The real cal howard said:
They're as canon as every other single manga for Nintendo, which is ambiguous at best (except Metroid).

Still a cameo regardless, and no, they didn't appear in 10 different Kirby games. Not as actual characters, anyway. It's either a clever naming, which means nothing, or like a sticker or something. The Smash Bros. ability (excluding in Amazing Mirror) doesn't count either, as that's just DLC. It's not even available during the main game for Robobot. It's like saying Kirby canonically eats amiibos
Click to expand...
Dude... Where do you get your information?
 
According to this, the Smash ability was not even a DLC in Kirby's Dream Collection: Special Edition.

And I disagree with "It's either a clever naming, which means nothing, or like a sticker or something", and the "Not as actual characters" What even is a character for you?
 
Just a correction. Both Master and Crazy Hand are an important part of the game (Kirby and the Amazing Mirror) since they had a Mirror Shard, and nothing changes that. Without it you can't finish the game or fight the final boss. They are actual bosses, with official artwork, and both appear in the manga. and are needed in order to finish the game and battle Dark Meta Knight and Dark Mind.

Not saying anything 'bout their Level or anything like that tho
 
@Eficiente. First off, most of Kirby's page is done by me, so I do know my stuff, so don't act like I don't. I know that bit. I've gotten that myself. And I'm still right. Fact of the matter is that you can only get that in extremely hard to reach places, just like all of the HAL rooms.

Dream Collection wasn't even a real game. It was a collection of games. And I"m not even stating that the Smash ability doesn't exist in canon. I'm saying that it's not a factor in determining Master Hand and Crazy Hand as characters in Kirby, being the exact same beings they are in the Smash series. Because for the most part, they're exactly what I'm saying they are. Cameo characters. A character (from a specific series) is one that exist inside said series. Doesn't have to make regular appearances, or even have a line. But if they're simply a gag in a game, which in the Game Over scenes, "Master Hand" definitely is, it's not a character. Just as much as the mouse in Dora the Explorer is a character.
 
Dream Collection is absolutely canon. Magolor returns in that game and gets referenced in miiverse posts+DDD Drum Deluxe... That's when Magolor started building parks around Dreamland.
 
How can they be cameo characters if they are needed in order to complete the game itself?They have an Mirror Shard, THE LAST MIRROR SHARD, they are needed for fixing the Dimensional Mirror, for fighting Dark Meta Knight and Dark Mind!... It doesn't make any sense...
 
In the same sense as most characters in Kingdom Hearts are cameo characters, crossover at best. As important as they are, Cloud, Hercules, even Donald and Goofy are crossover characters.

Also, encountering Samus is needed to get the true ending of Dream Land 3. Doesn't mean she's any less of a cameo character.
 
@The real cal howard Well I don't remember very well Dora the Explorer, but I'm more than sure that it didn't have different interactions with Dora as a living being, that's why I consider him a character.
 
The real cal howard said:
First off, many. Second off, that's not Master Hand. Because that's a left hand.
Click to expand...
I can't argue with that. I'm just going to say that it doesn't really matter.

Can we discuss the the Big Bang thing?
 
Should we close this thread and talk about it another day? I doubt Bomberman get nerf.
 
Eficiente said:
Should we close this thread and talk about it another day? I doubt Bomberman get nerf.
Click to expand...
Accept he REALLY needs one. Once again, Bomberman 64 is clearly an outlier. But otherwise, yeah. This is going nowhere when it comes to Kirby. I should have just made two seperate threads.
 
I didn't know much about Bomberman, yes this looks like a clear outlier.
 
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