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I think my last comment already describes what I think here.Thank you.
@Elizhaa @Qawsedf234 @SamanPatou @Nehz_XZX
Can you help us out by evaluating the following two posts please?
Okay, understood.Okay. No problem then. I have a hard time keep ing track of the specifics of many different discussions at the same time.
It has been decided to continue discussing that in another thread but there have been mentions of a minimum of 29 layers among other things though that is still being argued about.How many layers of resistance negation is accepted as of now?
is this similar to the ranking in instant death?It has been decided to continue discussing that in another thread but there have been mentions of a minimum of 29 layers among other things though that is still being argued about.
I don't know that series well but from what I've heard there are significant differences.is this similar to the ranking in instant death?
I suppose that may be our only way forward, yes.Bump.
At this pace we may as well just go with a "possibly" type 4 acausality and move on
I'm not entirely sure but if no one else has an issue with it, then I won't oppose it though I do feel like as if it's something that will require further discussion in the future.I suppose that may be our only way forward, yes.
@Theglassman12 @Elizhaa @Qawsedf234 @SamanPatou @Nehz_XZX
Is that fine with you?
You're welcome.Okay. Thank you for the reply.
Acausality Type 4 seems weaker; I kind of have the same thought with the feat would either the (causality manipulation and/or fate manipulation) or/and resistance to causality manipulation and/or fate manipulation.Thank you.
@Elizhaa @Qawsedf234 @SamanPatou @Nehz_XZX
Can you help us out by evaluating the following two posts please?
Concession accepted and moving on, you are choosing to ignore the most basic points that I proposed to you and are now being willingly ignorant in your judgment. You're repeating the same points again and did not address once more why Enryu is considered an irregular (hint, it's kinda important to the argument) and just cycled back to the same circular argumentation that I called in the previous post.If this gets us to finish this thread then fine I'll summarize my final point.
Nothing about your example on Irregular is remotely comparable to the Power of Waking. Nothing about the Power of waking implies that Sora can function on a different cause and effect, and the former is literally a state of being as it's his nature to do it. Not a random ability that just resets whatever happened in the events. It is his actual nature because one of the scans in the OP literally refers to him as a different existence. So if you're going to bring up that CRT maybe pay attention to the scans that's used because they actually have scans that imply a different state of being. Congratulations on taking 2 out of 3 of those examples you have out of context because neither of them have any comparisons with Sora using an ability to get out of a situation. Both of them are just their existences being different than others, hence their type 4 reasoning, and the other is just flat out wrong.
It absolutely is different standards and you know it. I've bothered asked you countless times to define what "standard causality" is in the context of this site and you refused to do so. That's a concession because your whole argument hinges on Sora being bound by "standard causality" and you haven't actually outlined what that is and why Sora is still bound to it.It's not different standards, Simon's page is wrong. He should not have type 4 acausality at all given the only context of this is a literal speech he yells to his foes about how they can do anything. That's not a good reason for type 4 acausality when he's the same type of being as he was before. I can say the same for your argument having any weight because you have taken these examples out of context for the nth time and ignore important scans that differentiate them from Sora. So maybe pay attention for once when I'm saying that they clearly aren't the same. Yeah, overturns fate and predestination, so fate resistance, nothing about this mentions any acausal state.
Yeah, Sora is going to be considered limited but that's only because it's not his inherent nature but because it's more or less a passive force that gives him that nature. This is still applicable for not only Acausality but Type 4 per reasons highlighted countless times already, why else do you think I used Goku Black as an example?And goku black's case is very very limited as he loses the acausal state when his ring is gone, even if you wanna push this for Sora this is at best a limited acausal for him.
Please do everyone a favor and actually read the arguments presented over presuming what my argumentation is.Absorbing someone's entire being into your own and having a power to rewrite fate is not the same thing at all, stop going off topic and stop comparing apples to oranges because that's a non sequiter here.
It's not blood, it's something similar to such but not exactly. It's literally just a power source that emanates from the gods and is considered the equivalent. Also, blood isn't one's existence either If someone is acausality or nonexistence, not all aspects of them is going to be such unless it's specified otherwise.Ah, the god's bloodline, so something unique to their own existence and nothing else, at this point nothing you're bringing up has any weight to it.
Yeah, I don't think these arguments are remotely valid, ton of fallacies and misconceptions are rampant even based on how the site rates the power with tons of precedents that have even been brought up, Sora isn't even the first case of situational acausality as outlined before.Either way to sum up my arguments, Sora's power of waking shouldn't grant him anything beyond some fate resistance since it just functions to rewrite an event that was supposed to happen, nothing about it implies him functioning on a different cause and effect system.
Situational acausality? Does that mean he does not have acausality in normal circumstances?Yeah, I don't think these arguments are remotely valid, ton of fallacies and misconceptions are rampant even based on how the site rates the power with tons of precedents that have even been brought up, Sora isn't even the first case of situational acausality as outlined before.
Yes it does, he’s not type 4 because of some speech, he’s type 4 because its repeatedly mentioned by both the characters and the narratorType 4 just doesn't apply to Simon anymore
Anyway, about this...Well, if @Elizhaa and @Theglassman12 agree with each other, we should use their solution here.
Sure, while not everything is necessarily going to be accepted and all, beyond that that's not how the site works, the intent of a CRT is to aim for accuracy, which can be argued from the current status quo, especially with how the matter in terms of acceptance has been shifting across three staff members from one side to the other, so it's far from definitive as things currently standHey Bob, when we agree to let the staff finally decide, that doesn't mean constantly argue more. Last time we're doing this back and forth, and drop the topic and let the staff decide, if it gets accepted, cool, if not whatever, it's not the end of the world.
It might as well be a concession since you have repeated the same points with basically little to no variation on top of repeatedly ignoring the one thing I asked, which was defining "standard causality". It was asked of you because it's important to determining whether Sora is bound to it or not, which you didn't answer and thus I have to take that as you can't reply.Not a concession if I never admitted to being wrong in my points against you. You keep saying why he's an irregular but you never once remotely explain how in any way is this important. If you're going to be so ignorant as to ignore my point that these character's mere existence causes this then you're not tackling my point, so you're conceding to my arguments if you're not going to tackle the actual difference between the two and explain how it's the same thing.
You are trying to say Sora is bound to "standard causality", yet don't even bother defining it like I've bothered requesting for the sake of you having an argument to begin with. The closest thing of my requests that was fulfilled was explaining how Sora is "bound" to standard causality, even so, your example ignores the refutation I already gave you already covers that.Never has been and never will be. If it was different standards then so many other franchises I support would have type 4 for the same vague statements as before. The fact you have to ask me how standard causality is just proves how hard you're reaching. The fact that Sora was literally a part of the book of prophecy and was ****** over by the darkness had Kairi not tried to save him shoots your argument in the foot that he functions in a different cause and effect system. If he functions on a different cause and effect system then he wouldn't have been caught in the prophecy and reset the events to prevent it from happening. It doesn't matter if the book of prophecy doesn't have fate hax or not. The fact he specifically uses the ability to stop something that was predestined to happen means he's changing his own fate, which just grants him either fate manipulation or unconventional resistance by just ignoring it. I can say the same thing about you claiming it's only different standards without bringing up more examples than Simon, if he's the only one you can bring up with shit like this then you're not going to get anywhere here, especially when Type 4 just doesn't apply to Simon anymore.
Didn't explain how Sora is bound to regular causality but okay, I'll take the hint on your part, you have no legitimate argument and are functioning on ad nauseam.Because it stays that way for goku black and has actual Acausal capabilities with the time ring, Sora's power of waking doesn't grant acausality when the kid was affected by what happened in the prophecies and needed kairi to save him.
Stop coloring your text, you make it very hard to read when your text blends with the background. Also no this is a non sequiter because nothing about N.E.O absorbing another being and becoming one with them is the same as Sora using an ability, if you're not going to explain how this is the same thing then your argument has no ground. Actually try to give an in depth explanation instead of just saying "look at this, it has this and it's accepted" without doing any comparison to how this connects to Sora.
non se·qui·tur /ˌnän ˈsekwədər/ Learn to pronounce noun noun: non sequitur; plural noun: non sequiturs; noun: nonsequitur; plural noun: nonsequiturs a conclusion or statement that does not logically follow from the previous argument or statement. "his weird mixed metaphors and non sequiturs"
Except that he’s classified as an irregular in his page which means he’s not a normal human being. Why he’s an irregular isn’t relevant to the topic when the topic is him functioning different because of his state of being. The OP literally has a scan that says “just like you, a different existence within a tower”, meaning it’s something related to their existence and not a power they randomly get.
Your link literally explains Ichor being the blood of the gods. Nothing about this link remotely explains it being different when it's literally god blood. For someone who claims I'm not doing any research you sure are doing the same thing for trying to use Saint Seiya as an example.
Sure, if you lack the time/will to evaluate in good faith we're forced to just rely on other staff, you're still more than welcome to do a CRT to change this if you go back into the topic way after it was applied (if it gets accepted), but I'd still appreciate some more legitimate arguments that don't lean into double standards and fallaciesThis is the last time I'm going to respond to this discussion, let the staff members handle it and close this thread when the accepted stuff has been added.
Well, if @Elizhaa and @Theglassman12 agree with each other, we should use their solution here.