Kingdom Hearts 2-A Upgrade

[Bobsican]

One of the Forky Asks a Question episodes affirms that the Toy Story setting is made of "unlimited parallel universes", which is pertinent to KH as we currently accept the Toy Story stuff as a canon crossover from both sides (further details here), and by extension it wouldn't make sense for Young Xehanort to have more reach than the KH of worlds, meaning that everyone that currently scales to 2-B would scale to 2-A instead if this gets a pass.

 

[FriendOfTheTeaParty]

This guy is not a reliable source with objective cosmic knowledge, and hes just citing theories, and he uses "possibly", saying that it is still debated. I wouldnt even consider this for a possibly rating either, since it's not like tails from tails tube episode who is just making reliable claims. He's basically just saying "this theory could possibly exist" but not even in a way that'd matter for a possibly rating.

 

[Bobsican]

How is he not a reliable source? The official media press entry for the episode affirms that he's explaining all there is, and the rest of the episode doesn't act like he was wrong or anything as to imply further intent on unreliability, which matters per the law of conservation of detail, especially as this worldbuilding made up nearly the entire episode.

At most I could see a compromise for a "likely" / "possibly" as he does state that the whole deal is still being debated, even though he then also claims that there's yet to be another theory in the setting to be within their grasp.

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

simple and clean, agree

 

[FriendOfTheTeaParty]

How is he not a reliable source? The official media press entry for the episode affirms that he's explaining all there is,

Which is what science and scientific theories try to do (yknow what hes espousing in uncertain terms). It doesn't mean they objectively exist.

 

[Bobsican]

As far the Toy Story setting goes it'd matter as it's exposition made for the purposes of its world, otherwise this'd be implying that this is a filler episode merely exposing lies when the intent is never implied to be in that direction. Fictional stories can be more factual about their contents than real life can be of itself, after all, even if the former tends to borrow from the latter.

 

[FriendOfTheTeaParty]

As far the Toy Story setting goes it'd matter as it's exposition made for the purposes of its world, otherwise this'd be implying that this is a filler episode merely exposing lies when the intent is never implied to be in that direction. Fictional stories can be more factual about their contents than real life can be of itself, after all, even if the former tends to borrow from the latter.

Dude I'm gonna be real here but I think a lil too much wankery and vsbwisms is getting to your head here.

It's not that he's lying per se. Scientists arent lying when they use theories. They're just saying the world could be like this from what they have extensibly observed and deduced. There's also many conflicting theories all with their own strengths and weaknesses. Just because a lot of them might be wrong doesn't mean that the proponents are lying. It is about intent.

Also the other problem is you treating this like it's deep world building, when the point is that various topics are being explored in laymans terms to educate and teach children about certain topics watching the show.

 

[Bobsican]

Uh, funnily enough, as noted earlier, Buttercup at the end points out that there's yet to be another field theory on the matter, meaning that there's no other known theories in their setting as that that topic goes to begin with.

 

[FriendOfTheTeaParty]

Uh, funnily enough, as noted earlier, Buttercup at the end points out that there's yet to be another field theory on the matter, meaning that there's no other known theories in their setting as that that topic goes to begin with.

son.

My points still stands. I was using an example on how it's not lying even if it might not be necessarily true (and he uhh says its a possibly, unconfirmed and being debated so theres not even a possibility of interpreting a lie). Using this as objective proof of cosmology is laughable when even then it's still used in very unconfirmed and uncertain terms. I wouldn't even use it for a possibly since there's not strong enough evidence for that. There is no reason to treat his word in an educational show for children (not even meant for serious world building as you claim) as the gospel.

 

[Bobsican]

Quoting from the wiki guidelines for its use:

Possibly​

Should be used to list a statistic for a character with some basis, but inconclusive due to the justification being vague or non-definitive. The probability of the justification in question for being reliable should be notable, but mild. This term should be used sparingly.

Seems like quite spot-on given the circumstances. It being an educational show for children doesn't discredit the content, in fact if anything it's meant for all ages, and we know that Pixar respects the intellect of the audience.

John Lasseter sums up the respect the artists feel for Arndt: “The level of intelligence Michael brought to the table is fantastic. We believe our audiences are very, very smart, We aim for the highest common denominator in our movies, and we know the audience will be there.

 

[Mbpoops]

I agree with mgq so far

 

[Armorchompy]

Children or not this is plainly not a viable source. It's one individual with no specific insight onto the nature of the verse citing unconfirmed real life theories just the same as you or I might when discussing the world(s) we live in. (Note that what he's saying isn't "there's no other theory", it's "there is no theory everyone agrees upon", including string theory).

The source being a gag isn'r helping matters but there's just zero reason to think the guy knows what he's talking about to begin with.

 

[Anonymous_Learner]

upon further countere, I'm against this crt

 

[Cropfist]

Disagree, it's openly a speculative throwaway statement

 

[ThatBoiRick]

I don’t inherently think this is enough evidence to support a raw 2-A argument, however I do think it could qualify for “possibly 2-A” considering Disney seems to be treating the convo with some narrative importance.

Then again I believe it would be better to add more arguments from other context (Kingdom Hearts) to better support 2-A than just a talking fork.

 

[Bobsican]

Children or not this is plainly not a viable source. It's one individual with no specific insight onto the nature of the verse citing unconfirmed real life theories just the same as you or I might when discussing the world(s) we live in. (Note that what he's saying isn't "there's no other theory", it's "there is no theory everyone agrees upon", including string theory).

The source being a gag isn'r helping matters but there's just zero reason to think the guy knows what he's talking about to begin with.

I'm listening to the scan carefully and he doesn't verbatim say that, I may as well quote the statements made in the video while at it:

There are 8 planets plus or minus Pluto, and we live in the Milky Way Galaxy in the universe containing billions of galaxy, quasar, pulsar, nebula (sic), joined of tons of matter and dark matter interacting with energy, which according to Einstein, molds the shape of space-time, and is possibly contained within unlimited parallel universes, connected by string-like filaments, although, it's still being debated, and a grand new field theory is yet to be within our grasp.

Meaning that as far it's known within public research in-verse (as much the characters have shown to browse the internet for information in Toy Story 3), this is portrayed as the current standard on the matter.

 

[Thanganimator]

Why do we need to upgrade them to 2A when they already have 6D?

 

[Bobsican]

It matters for the lower tiers that currently scale to 2-B stuff.

 

[ThatBoiRick]

Why do we need to upgrade them to 2A when they already have 6D?

It would upscale the KH1 cast and select characters

 

[Crabwhale]

Absolutely ridiculous source for an upgrade. Denied.

 

[Hecky2222]

Agree with @BestMGQScalerEver points here

 

[Jepilstiltskin]

Bro...

 

[FriendOfTheTeaParty]

I'm listening to the scan carefully and he doesn't verbatim say that, I may as well quote the statements made in the video while at it:



Meaning that as far it's known within public research in-verse (as much the characters have shown to browse the internet for information in Toy Story 3), this is portrayed as the current standard on the matter.

He's saying "grand unified theory" which is referring to GUT. An actual concept.

 

[ExcelsisBerny]

Yeah I disagree with the upgrade as well.

 

[Bobsican]

Hm, the feedback has been nice, and there isn't really any further counterargument to be made, so this thread can be closed, thanks everyone.