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Not autism, but a different, similar problem. Although it's not really about the topic. I have already posted my answer above.Please get to the point. You seem to be autistic like me, so it is likely not easy for you to understand how to interact properly, but you keep misinterpreting our standard approach to how to behave during content revisions, and drag things out in an unnecessary manner.
Edit: Never mind. Thank you for writing an explanation post.
You called someone autistic. You didn't mean it like that, but you straight up insulted him and told him he can't act properly. Just don't throw those words around like that.Okay then. It is part of my job here to try to calm down toxicity though, and there was a post that went over the line in the other connected thread.
He said he was also autistic. It was not an attempt to offend, but to show that he understands me.You called someone autistic. You didn't mean it like that, but you straight up insulted him and told him he can't act properly. Just don't throw those words around like that.
That is correct, yes. I was trying to show sympathy in conjunction with practical instructions.He said he was also autistic. It was not an attempt to offend, but to show that he understands me.
At least that's how I got it
It's just that the word "autistic" and "down" in colloquial speech is often offensive, no matter how sad it may be.That is correct, yes. I was trying to show sympathy in conjunction with practical instructions.
I am mid-level autistic. That is no secret. So I do not understand why it is seen as an insult.
Because it's a meme Ant, nobody's gonna protest itI think that it is far worse that this kind of post was made towards Nik without anybody except me protesting than anything that I said above.
Lihito didn't lose base Raian, but Removal Raian. This is what he says directly when Raian uses his super saiyan against Mokichi. "That's the form he was in when he beat me".Alright, here's my general breakdown of my opinions(and the opinions shared to me by other knowledgeable members). Keep in mind, to staff members reading, that my post will only consist of disagreements on the scaling presented in the OP, not of the stats themselves. Now, let's start.
The OP first proposes that we downscale low-tiers from the High 8-C calculation provided in the OP, due to a few reasons, being that the characters are all within the same realm physically between tiers, and that there are no large tiering differences between, say, low-tiers and god-tiers. I, and many others, disagree with this for many reasons, and I will be addressing arguments presented against my stance.
- To start off, one of the main points brought up is that there being a difference of thousands of times between characters, such as a difference between a 9-A and a High 8-C, is illogical, as there's no way that they logically could've made such a big difference in power simply through training. This is an, in my and several other opinions, a completely moot and irrelevant point. To expect the author to have to acknowledge such monumental gaps in power for them to be acknowledged as valid, when, there are several very valid cases of monumental differences in power, is unreasonable. For example; Gaolong is able to one-shot Kaneda with a SINGLE serious attack, as acknowledged by Kaneda himself, and Kaneda even eventually is instantly defeated. Should we downscale Kaneda from Gaolong? No! He is consistently displayed to be realms weaker, and no matter how "illogical" such a difference may seem on paper, our standards would not allow us to scale Kaneda, one of the weakest fighters physically, someone so pathetically weak and average, that Gaolong, one of the strongest fighters of the series, can casually make him bleed and bruise him heavily without even trying, to Gaolong himself. That just... makes no logical sense. Kaneda isn't even capable of HARMING Gaolong. There are other displays of this. Inaba initially overpowers and ragdolls Ohma not using Advance. But, Ohma uses Advance and instantly tears free from Inaba's hair when he couldn't previously. So, obviously, they shouldn't logically scale to the same value. And a point I see to debunk this is that Inaba "withstood" attacks from Ohma using Advance. And as such, his AP should scale relative to his dura, yes? But he didn't withstand anything. He took the hits, but he didn't withstand them. He literally lost consciousness and got one-tapped. It was even stated that Inaba couldn't even come close to Ohma. The dictionary definition of withstand is to "remain undamaged or unaffected by; resist", but Inaba didn't do that. Other instances of large differences of strength being displayed between character tiers include in the series include instances such as Kaneda being unable to even budge Ohma's arm despite actively trying to break it, Rei one-shotting Nezu, Kiozan being able to one-shot Chiba easily, etc. Kengan characters obviously rely on raw power heavily, and to say they do not is disingenuous.
- The OP considers a fighter's "condition" to be a key, determining factor in most Kengan fights. For example, Okubo Naoya, in this scan, is stated to be the strongest out of a group of characters, yet, at the same time it's stated he may not be able to defeat any one of them, based on his condition. This makes sense, yes, but let's look at what "condition" really means here. In Kengan, most of the time, if your condition is poor to the point someone is capable of defeating you when otherwise you'd be much stronger or even comparable, it's usually when you're in a state where you are critically injured to the point you literally cannot fight in top condition. To say that condition is such a big influence on fights all the time is objectively incorrect. Especially when, as I've displayed, strength is such a big factor in Kengan fights. One's condition RARELY comes into consideration in these fights, and when it does, it's when the character in question is in an extremely painful state.
The OP then proceeds to propose that we cross-scale between Asura and Omega, which is just... wrong. The scaling between characters between the two mediums is so inconsistent that it's just not possible, and any knowledgeable member will agree with me. To confirm, this is a disapproval of the SCALING used, not the stats themselves.
- A prime example of scaling massively changing between iterations lay in one character, The Superman, Lihito. In Asura, Lihito was the weakest of the weak. So weak, Ohma Tokita in his weakest iteration can one-shot him with zero effort. So weak, a casual Raian can effortlessly defeat him even without amping himself with Removal. Yet, later, in Omega, he's able to fight Mokichi and harm him, someone who can injure Raian on that level. Clearly, a high difference in strength between the character in each iteration, yes? This is once AGAIN displayed when Himuro, someone who can have his arm broken by Kaneda, a guy whose acknowledged to be the tournaments weakest fighter, was then able to contend with someone as strong as Haruo. Now, you can argue that, in this specific instance, Kaneda won through skill and ingenuity, and while he did, he was still able to damage Himuro, something he wouldn't be able to do if he was that much weaker than Himuro. See the difference here? The scaling between each character changes very much. And, I don't think the argument that because they didn't grow 1000 something times, the scaling doesn't vary, works. This is something that happens in fiction ALL THE TIME. Between keys and series, not every character becomes a million billion times stronger. That does not mean that characters will all scale in relativity to each other.
I'm done now.
...Okay? This isn't a debunk. For a couple reasons:Lihito didn't lose base Raian, but Removal Raian. This is what he says directly when Raian uses his super saiyan against Mokichi. "That's the form he was in when he beat me".
A technique... which involves... brute force... that one-shot Chiba.Shiba broke Kiozan's nose with a page earlier, so I don't understand why you say they're not comparable. Even the Chiba page seems to suggest scaling. Kiozan defeats Chiba not by brute force, but by throwing him headfirst into concrete using him and his body mass. This is a technique.
This isn't a debunk towards my points.On the other points I am neutral. Okubo can really lose to Himuro if they aren't fresh as a pickle, but in Ohma's example, we can see that their durability doesn't suffer from that.
They aren't. They are wrong.Nick's arguments seem more reasonable and fit the logic of the verse.
That's not how we do things here. We can't arbitrarily downscale characters like that, if they don't scale they don't scale, simple as that.As I understand it, Nik is not talking about full scaling, but about descending to the very bottom of the same level tier. This makes sense given the fact that characters are capable of dealing damage and taking a lot of attacks.
Whoa, buddy, don't overstep.They aren't. They are wrong.
This is mutual, but believe me, if the participants or moderators write that they agree with you, then I will not write to them that you are actually wrong and they have chosen the wrong option.How am I overstepping my bounds? I believe your opinion is wrong, so I say it's wrong. I apologize if that seems like I'm trying to pull something, but I genuinely believe you're wrong.
I don't care how you feel about it. Be kind, do not decide for others whether they have chosen the right position or notSounds like a you problem, then. I don't care.
He... wasn't?I don't care how you feel about it. Be kind, do not decide for others whether they have chosen the right position or not
"I agree with this opinion.He... wasn't?
Stating an opinion is not deciding for someone else. I don't know what backwards debating there is in Russia, but in America it's giving your opinion, everyone on this thread is doing it, Azontr, you, Darthsorox, we're all giving opinions.
"No, it’s wrong" is still an opinion."I agree with this opinion.
- No, it's wrong"
This is not an expression of opinion, but childishness and an attempt to impose your idea
Don't pretend to be chased. I'm just pointing out the incorrectness of your behavior aboveI'd appreciate it if you would quit doubling down on calling me a child throughout this entire thread just for asserting my opinion. Leave me alone.
You are breaking the thread right now."No, it’s wrong" is still an opinion.
BTW it is quite childish of you to repeatedly call someone else childish, seeing as you ain't the bigger man here just because you can type an 8-letter word to insult to someone.
But it's best if I don't derail the thread