Kamen Rider Blades vs Youmu Konpaku

ALTERNATE TITLE: ​

FREEZE MY LOVE​

雪​

の​

花​

び​

ら​

で​

踊​

る​

(Dance In The Snow Petal)​

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Oh yeah, looks like Touhou vs Kamen Rider can be a thing
....Albeit very limited for a certain tier and haxes lel, but still i'll take it nonetheless

I feel like only some of the MC Gang that can be used often due of their fairness abilities (Marisa and Youmu) and then Sumireko, beside that HahAHAhaHaHahaHa MiD-gOdLy ReGeN Go BrRrRrRrRrR-
"BuT VEloX- i mean Meg.....WhY DoN'T JuSt WoNDeR GuArDian SaBe-"
Wonder Guardian Saber is too much you bucko, and beside that i don't want go get an MIGRAINE for an ultimate hax vs ultimate hax......maybe i can make Yukari vs WG Saber now i think about it....

Anyway i feel like Youmu is seems fun to be used for a matches, so expect some of a spam with her if i can find a good opponents in tier 2, gonna cracking up those matches for the phantom gardener i tell you there lel
And for the Riders, i'm thorn between sabela or Blades but in the end i decided to go with Rintarou instead because the thematic reason like Cherry Blossom in the zero winter theme and others thing like that....thanks Glay

And without any further wait, let's get to the battle between the Absolute Zero Winter Swordmaster against the Phantom Gardener Swordmaster!

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Winter....
A Beautiful Season yet could be an Terrifying Season as well depend on the weather mood, the snow that fallen to the earth would became an such of amazing views for our sight...
Especially if it's on the hibernated Sakura Tree....the gorgeous and melancholic feeling you could get from it are mesmerizing....

However, right now it's not about the panorama we're focusing on....
As at the moment, the two great swordmasters has met each others in the Sakura Trees Road, somewhere around the fantasical world of Gensokyo
The Saigyou Servant, the Gardener of Spiritual Garden with her two trusted Katana, worth of thousand ways of experiences, from her gramps to her long journeys with the gang for solved the incidents in Gensokyo

Youmu Konpaku....The Phantom-Human​

In front of her, stood an human in a white armor, with the lioness shape, with the mane on his head waved due of the cold wind blowing, alongside his trusted holy sword with water/ice elemental on it
The Co-Leader of Sword of Logos, the Water Swordman that swore to protect the world alongside his trusted friends and the one he love, together with his seiken that tore an thousands way of experiences, from every of his journeys, from the Megids War to defeated the Grimoire....

Shindo Rintarou, Kamen Rider Blades....The Water Swordman​

Both of them were in a intense duel, with their sword clashed, an cold spiritual pressure can be sensed
A duel of swordmasters between the Incident Solver against the Holy Swordmaster that accidently being transported by an unknown power, being targetted due of the fear of threat, he has no choice but defend himself, and coincidently it was Youmu who first noticed him

The duel raged on, so does their determination and will, who's going to emerged victorious here!? The pride of the swords they held are in the pinch! This is not a battle for defended himself anymore, it's a worthy battle between two of great swordmaster!

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• 2-C Youmu is used and this is EoS (Storius Arc to Post-Series/Trio of Deep Sin) Blades being used
• Speed are equalized
• Both are in-characters
• Battlefield take in the place of: Somewhere around the Gensokyo, the Road with Sakura Trees in every sight at the Winter Season
• 
• Staring Distance: 10 Meters
• Win via anything!!
• The Absolute Zero Swordmaster: 7 (Fuji, Myself, Ixa, Pokemon, Harith, Doggo, Ret)
• The Phantom Swordmaster: 0
• Inconclusive: 1 (Pikmin)

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VS

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• BATTLE THEME 1: SMOKING HOT​

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• BATTLE THEME 2: STAND UNRIVALED​

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• BATTLE THEME 3: SAMURAI GHOST GIRL, KILL! KILL! KILL!

• PRE-CLIMAX THEME:BASILISK - KOUGA NINPOU CHOU OPENING​

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• CLIMAX THEME 1: MIRROR OF THE WORLD​

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• CLIMAX THEME 2: IF YOU WERE HERE​

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• CLIMAX THEME 3: EDELWEISS​

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• ENDING AND EPILOUGE: -ELIS-​

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[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

What would Blades’ most likely starting moves be?

And how well does he resist layered soul Manip?

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

Does the touhou character have mid godly stuff again.

and I don’t see blade resisting soul hax

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

What would Blades’ most likely starting moves be?

And how well does he resist layered soul Manip?

Basically, with his final form he start with "1001" way to absolute zero'd the f*** out of your misery, like created an entire battlefield made out from the absolute zero for example

Does the touhou character have mid godly stuff again.

Youmu case is similar with Sumeriko case iirc

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

Youmu case is similar with Sumeriko case iirc

Okay thanks

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

Youmu is weird because she’s half human half phantom. Her phantom half could potentially continue fighting even if her human half were to be killed iirc, and her phantom half can form into a full duplication of Youmu as well, so this fight could quickly become a 2v1. While Youmu’s human body could die from physical destruction, her phantom half likely isn’t as likely.

so I’m not sure if Youmu has ever resisted absolute zero colds, but she can resist colds in general as her phantom half induced frostbite.

Does Blades resist death manipulation? I’m pretty sure even being near Youmu’s phantom half for long could pose a threat to him.

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

Youmu is weird because she’s half human half phantom. Her phantom half could potentially continue fighting even if her human half were to be killed iirc, and her phantom half can form into a full duplication of Youmu as well, so this fight could quickly become a 2v1. While Youmu’s human body could die from physical destruction, her phantom half likely isn’t as likely.

so I’m not sure if Youmu has ever resisted absolute zero colds, but she can resist colds in general as her phantom half induced frostbite.

Does Blades resist death manipulation? I’m pretty sure even being near Youmu’s phantom half for long could pose a threat to him.

How long does the death hax work?

is it instant or takes a couple of minutes/seconds

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

How long does the death hax work?

is it instant or takes a couple of minutes/seconds

Oops I misremembered, death haxx isn't on her profile for some reason she only resists it.

Anyways right now I'm leaning towards Youmu. Her range with danmaku is huge, Blades doesn't have a resistance to layered soul / mind / emphatic manip meaning he'd be on the downhill with every hit Youmu lands before his inevitable death, Blades doesn't have a way to kill her Phantom half for good meaning Youmu could stay at a range launching off danmaku while her phantom half closes the distance for melee attacks, eventually he would be worn down before he could land an absolute zero kill on Youmu. Her ability to slow down time would also give plenty of chances for decisive blows as well.

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

Oops I misremembered, death haxx isn't on her profile for some reason she only resists it.

Anyways right now I'm leaning towards Youmu. Her range with danmaku is huge, Blades doesn't have a resistance to layered soul / mind / emphatic manip meaning he'd be on the downhill with every hit Youmu lands before his inevitable death, Blades doesn't have a way to kill her Phantom half for good meaning Youmu could stay at a range launching off danmaku while her phantom half closes the distance for melee attacks, eventually he would be worn down before he could land an absolute zero kill on Youmu. Her ability to slow down time would also give plenty of chances for decisive blows as well.

It’s okay if you misremember.


any i vote youmu for pikmin’s reasons

 

[IxaSaga2]

Blades should be able to interact with her Phantom because Saber Riders can interact with Revice Demons which are multiple layered intangible, ghost/spirit like beings.

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

Blades should be able to interact with her Phantom because Saber Riders can interact with Revice Demons which are multiple layered intangible, ghost/spirit like beings.

I don’t think NPI is on his profile but I’ll allow this

Would he be able to bypass the phantom half’s mid godly regeneration though?

 

[IxaSaga2]

I don’t think NPI sis on his profile but I’ll allow this

Would be be able to bypass the phantom half’s mid godly regeneration though?

It's part of his civilian abilities and I'm not sure how the Phantom's Mid Godly works so I'll need an explanation of that. Maybe I missed it but I can't find her Regen in her profile.

I should also probably give a more concrete argument for Blades.
Since he has NPI + AZ, he should be able to freeze any incoming attacks from the Danmaku, or freeze any defensive systems she has. This is because she doesn't have res to AZ which is a complete different beast than any other freezing. Also because of his AZ zone, if Youmu's phantom gets close to him, it'll just freeze and completely shatter.

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

It's part of his civilian abilities and I'm not sure how the Phantom's Mid Godly works so I'll need an explanation of that. Maybe I missed it but I can't find her Regen in her profile.

I should also probably give a more concrete argument for Blades.
Since he has NPI + AZ, he should be able to freeze any incoming attacks from the Danmaku, or freeze any defensive systems she has. This is because she doesn't have res to AZ which is a complete different beast than any other freezing. Also because of his AZ zone, if Youmu's phantom gets close to him, it'll just freeze and completely shatter.

It works just like any mid godly, can regenerate from having her soul completely destroyed. Since the phantom half is spiritual in nature even if its completely obliterated it'll just regen.

Also, if we're taking optional equipment into account, Youmu would have access to a layered time-stop and power nullification via Spell Breaking drug, as well as 8 second Invincibility off of the Three Heavenly Drops spell card, all of which could allow her to land a fatal blow and likely bypass the absolute zero aura.

I'd also like to raise the argument of Youmu's concept manipulation. Once she realizes the danger of his AZ zone, Youmu could absolutely modify/gamify his aura to no longer be lethal to her, which could allow her to fight him without instantly shattering.

 

[IxaSaga2]

It works just like any mid godly, can regenerate from having her soul completely destroyed. Since the phantom half is spiritual in nature even if its completely obliterated it'll just regen.

Also, if we're taking optional equipment into account, Youmu would have access to a layered time-stop and power nullification via Spell Breaking drug, as well as 8 second Invincibility off of the Three Heavenly Drops spell card, all of which could allow her to land a fatal blow and likely bypass the absolute zero aura.

I'd also like to raise the argument of Youmu's concept manipulation. Once she realizes the danger of his AZ zone, Youmu could absolutely modify/gamify his aura to no longer be lethal to her, which could allow her to fight him without instantly shattering.

I was moreso talking about the time of the regen. If she can regen before incap then Blades has no win con which means this is a stomp.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Oh right, optional equipment here are restricted here

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

As for Youmu case, i already asked @Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara to come here since Fuji is the one who said that Youmu case is similar with Sumireko

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

But i'll try my best
So based on what Fuji said, yeah Youmu phantom can regenerate from soul destruction but how about physical destruction? If it's the same as Sumireko then Youmu can't regenerate completely from physical destruction
Which mean she can received a lethal wound and incap

It's moreso due of her half-human half-phantom that can be confusing

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

But i'll try my best
So based on what Fuji said, yeah Youmu phantom can regenerate from soul destruction but how about physical destruction? If it's the same as Sumireko then Youmu can't regenerate completely from physical destruction
Which mean she can received a lethal wound and incap

It's moreso due of her half-human half-phantom that can be confusing

Youmu's phantom is a spiritual entity, though. Physical means of attack don't matter to it.

Youmu herself though is definitely able to be killed by physical destruction, but her phantom isn't.

I was moreso talking about the time of the regen. If she can regen before incap then Blades has no win con which means this is a stomp.

I'm pretty sure the mid-godly is near instantly.

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

I'm pretty sure the mid-godly is near instantly.

Then it’s a stomp?

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

Then it’s a stomp?

I wanna wait for @Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara to weigh in first

 

[Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara]

But i'll try my best
So based on what Fuji said, yeah Youmu phantom can regenerate from soul destruction but how about physical destruction? If it's the same as Sumireko then Youmu can't regenerate completely from physical destruction
Which mean she can received a lethal wound and incap

It's moreso due of her half-human half-phantom that can be confusing

Youmu's phantom half can recover near instantly (spirit regen is like 2 seconds at most if you're going from 0 spirit to "full"), but Youmu's human half is still very vulnerable. Idk how situations like this are treated in VS matches, so I'll leave that up to the experts as to whether or not Youmu's physical body dying would be a loss.

As for Youmu case, i already asked @Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara to come here since Fuji is the one who said that Youmu case is similar with Sumireko

Correct. Spirit Manipulation is more or less the same across the board. There are very few exceptions to how the ability is used, and virtually no differences in what the ability can do across all users. It's a verse power for a reason.

Anyways, I don't think Youmu can do much against attack reflection/power null against her projectiles, as well as elemental intangibility. She can't get close because of AZ, making her melee wincons with possession/BFR relatively useless, and she can't get close enough for her passives to take effect either I'd imagine. However, her magic circle/time slow makes it unlikely for Blades to hit her at a range as well, so this is really a war of attrition to see if Blades can spam power null/attack reflection enough to either reliably hit Youmu or get within range for the AZ to take effect, or if Youmu can brute force her way through Blades' defensive abilities with overwhelming danmaku, or BFR his soul with infinite range sword slashes.

It's a tough choice, honestly, but the way I see it, Youmu having at least 2 instantly regenerating phantoms by her side to soak hits, own attack reflection, power modification (which she MIGHT use if she catches on to Blades' AZ early enough), time hax, perception hax, and vibration manipulation to push back Blades if she really needs to would mean she'll slightly more reliably land the one hit she needs to snowball into a victory.

TL;DR: Youmu takes this very, VERY high diff.

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

I vote for youmu based on fujiwara’s reasoning

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

Youmu's phantom half can recover near instantly (spirit regen is like 2 seconds at most if you're going from 0 spirit to "full"), but Youmu's human half is still very vulnerable. Idk how situations like this are treated in VS matches, so I'll leave that up to the experts as to whether or not Youmu's physical body dying would be a loss.


Correct. Spirit Manipulation is more or less the same across the board. There are very few exceptions to how the ability is used, and virtually no differences in what the ability can do across all users. It's a verse power for a reason.

Anyways, I don't think Youmu can do much against attack reflection/power null against her projectiles, as well as elemental intangibility. She can't get close because of AZ, making her melee wincons with possession/BFR relatively useless, and she can't get close enough for her passives to take effect either I'd imagine. However, her magic circle/time slow makes it unlikely for Blades to hit her at a range as well, so this is really a war of attrition to see if Blades can spam power null/attack reflection enough to either reliably hit Youmu or get within range for the AZ to take effect, or if Youmu can brute force her way through Blades' defensive abilities with overwhelming danmaku, or BFR his soul with infinite range sword slashes.

It's a tough choice, honestly, but the way I see it, Youmu having at least 2 instantly regenerating phantoms by her side to soak hits, own attack reflection, power modification (which she MIGHT use if she catches on to Blades' AZ early enough), time hax, perception hax, and vibration manipulation to push back Blades if she really needs to would mean she'll slightly more reliably land the one hit she needs to snowball into a victory.

TL;DR: Youmu takes this very, VERY high diff.

This fight actually goes hard as hell I might have to note this down for someday

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

This fight actually goes hard as hell I might have to note this down for someday

It might make a great death battle tbh

 

[Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara]

Damn

Now I actually want this lol

vergil who?

 

[Shiroiyo]

I will bring something more in Youmu's favor, phantoms in Touhou can affect people's minds/emotions, this hax is not instantaneous but if the battle really goes on, it's one more advantage for Youmu.

 

[Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara]

i thought i mentioned that :v

I'll play devil's advocate here and say I don't recall any specific range being given for phantom passives; What's the range of Blades' passive AZ?

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

Damn

Now I actually want this lol

vergil who?

Might be worth pushing honestly, I'll need to see if there's much in terms of connections though. While Vergil v Youmu will always have a special place in my heart because the animation potential is insane this one is also damn cool, I've wanted a KR vs Touhou MU for a while now.

Might be another fight worth making a blog on someday.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

i thought i mentioned that :v

I'll play devil's advocate here and say I don't recall any specific range being given for phantom passives; What's the range of Blades' passive AZ?

Based on his range, kilometers

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Might be worth pushing honestly, I'll need to see if there's much in terms of connections though. While Vergil v Youmu will always have a special place in my heart because the animation potential is insane this one is also damn cool, I've wanted a KR vs Touhou MU for a while now.

Might be another fight worth making a blog on someday.

Trust me, when Cap. America vs Ichigo being made in the future in the one of the DB season, it will opening a Can of Del Monte Greatness by introducing the Kamen Rider Verse on DB
And literally made the Kamen Rider Verse more feared

 

[Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara]

Based on his range, kilometers

oh then why the fuck is this even a debate

Youmu just dies instantly, I was working off the assumption that the aura was tens to a few hundred meters. can we still pretend his aura has that range because tbh that was a way more enjoyable debate

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

oh then why the fuck is this even a debate

Youmu just dies instantly, I was working off the assumption that the aura was tens to a few hundred meters. can we still pretend his aura has that range because tbh that was a way more enjoyable debate

Why did the debate start with her 10m away when his death aura works in kilometers

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

oh then why the fuck is this even a debate

Youmu just dies instantly, I was working off the assumption that the aura was tens to a few hundred meters. can we still pretend his aura has that range because tbh that was a way more enjoyable debate

I might be incorrect tbh lel, so i'll let Ixa answer this

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Oh actually, i know why you guys said "why is this a debate then"
It seems that you guys mistaking Blades AZ as passive, while in truth no it is not, even the AZ battlefield need to be activated first

The thing is he love to spam it, so even without the battlefield, Blades can make many of AZ obstacles and projectiles

 

[Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara]

Oh actually, i know why you guys said "why is this a debate then"
It seems that you guys mistaking Blades AZ as passive, while in truth no it is not, even the AZ battlefield need to be activated first

The thing is he love to spam it, so even without the battlefield, Blades can make many of AZ obstacles and projectiles

Oh, then it's a one stroke duel, where Youmu has to use her instant win moves before he uses his.

sooooo incon ig

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

Oh, then it's a one stroke duel, where Youmu has to use her instant win moves before he uses his.

sooooo incon ig

Well I mean. Youmu basically always starts with danmaku. Would Blades start with AZ to freeze said danmaku? If so that'd likely give away his primary strategy and give Youmu a bigger chance to get off her instant win before he gets his

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Isn't Youmu always combined her danmaku with the melee attacks? That could give her something
And for instance, i want to know how skillful Youmu is as Blades/Rintarou skill in general are f***ing busted, as the man can fought equally against someone that can skip time, have a countless timeline precog, and some of the mons with at least thousand of years experience

I believe Youmu (and Touhou) skill in general are pretty busted as well but i want to make sure

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

Isn't Youmu always combined her danmaku with the melee attacks? That could give her something
And for instance, i want to know how skillful Youmu is as Blades/Rintarou skill in general are f***ing busted, as the man can fought equally against someone that can skip time, have a countless timeline precog, and some of the mons with at least thousand of years experience

I believe Youmu (and Touhou) skill in general are pretty busted as well but i want to make sure

Youmu is able to use danmaku independently of sword slashes, that's not a problem. She just uses a lot of sword slashes to create danmaku patterns.

How long Youmu's been alive isn't quite deteriminable. We know she was trained by a master who was likely hundreds of years old, and she regularly fights against characters with insane abilities (Sakuya Izayoi's time powers are much more impressive than just skipping time, and characters like Reimu who passively manipulates fate & probability in her favor).

I could potentially see an argument for Blade being more skilled if he can overcome people with insane precog & defeat others with thousands of years of experience with the blade, though Youmu wouldn't be too far behind, and would have methods of evening the playing field with her time-slowing, range, and the fact she can turn the fight into a 2v1 which, would be difficult even for someone incredibly skilled.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Okay as i expected, they are pretty much equal in skills department then
So Youmu instant win button is her soul hax, right? How's that work again?

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

Okay as i expected, they are pretty much equal in skills department then
So Youmu instant win button is her soul hax, right? How's that work again?

Basically on any attack Youmu lands (danmaku, physical, sword strike), the opponent's spirit is reduced and then absorbed by Youmu. Spirit includes things like the soul, and can affect mental & emotional states, stamina, and would eventually crush his guard and nullify his powers. Meaning on every hit Youmu lands, she's draining his soul and absorbing it, restoring her own spirit as well.

This basically makes a snowball effect of once Youmu gets in her first solid hit, Blade will be performing worse and worse due to stamina reduction, his soul being damaged, and his mental and emotional state being damaged, until eventually his soul his completely oblitherated. Since he can't regen from soul destruction like Touhou characters... that'd be his end.

Youmu's sword also has its own notable soulhaxx in that she can slash spirits and send them to Nirvanha, meaning if she gets a good slash on Blade she could either destroy his soul outright or just BFR it to Nirvahna.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Basically on any attack Youmu lands (danmaku, physical, sword strike), the opponent's spirit is reduced and then absorbed by Youmu. Spirit includes things like the soul, and can affect mental & emotional states, stamina, and would eventually crush his guard and nullify his powers. Meaning on every hit Youmu lands, she's draining his soul and absorbing it, restoring her own spirit as well.

I see, so it will come to whether Blades can overcome the danmaku, which i think he could as the range of his projectiles and other ranged attacks can overcome it (like froze the bullets)
Still those haxes will chip him slowly if he get hit, as for emotional and mental draining, i think Blades willpower can cover it (like made his emotion and mental lasted longer)

This basically makes a snowball effect of once Youmu gets in her first solid hit, Blade will be performing worse and worse due to stamina reduction, his soul being damaged, and his mental and emotional state being damaged, until eventually his soul his completely oblitherated. Since he can't regen from soul destruction like Touhou characters... that'd be his end.

Yeah but in other hand, she can't defend herself from the AZ shennanigans Blades has, and other things that Blades has like turned into an water to hit her inside, the power null that can render most of her danmaku lost it's properties, and attack reflection will overwhelmed Youmu here so much

This is basically repeating what Fuji said above when he first appeared, with few addition: RPL and Cloth bending
With RPL based on the temperature, he might can overcome the danmaku faster and has many answer to deal with it
Cloth bending here grant Blades to flies and swim, and even made him into a hedgehog to defend himself

Youmu's sword also has its own notable soulhaxx in that she can slash spirits and send them to Nirvanha, meaning if she gets a good slash on Blade she could either destroy his soul outright or just BFR it to Nirvahna.

Well that would be good, if Youmu can overcome Blades LS (his LS is around class T while Youmu is just around class 25)
Alongside those advantages i said, BFR'd Blades would be so difficult

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Overall, both wincon here so damn high here, incon is the highest chance but i'll let the others (Pikmin and Ixa/Nice) to comment first
Man i'm basically carried Blades here as Ixa is offline right now

 

[IxaSaga2]

Dang, a lot happened while I was sleep. I have work soon so I have to be VERY brief here. (Also please don't start FRA chains while I'm busy)

To address his frozen zone thing, it's thought based. Although his power null is for his sword swings. He can also do gusts of icy winds and other stuff.

For Skill: During this is the point in the series, Blades fought and defeated a person that is omnisicent in Blades's timeline (not omniscience in the whole verse but knows everything in his timeline basically).

Also, there is a thing that I failed to bring up and that is his Cloth Manip. It's like an activated adaptation where one of them is a hedgehog ability. This lets him gain spikes that are pretty similar to Needle Hedgehog (which damages the person attacking him with dura neg spikes)

Blades has supernatural willpower against mind and emotional stuff.

I'm running out of time so BYE.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

To address his frozen zone thing, it's thought based. Although his power null is for his sword swings. He can also do gusts of icy winds and other stuff.

At least it's not passive, and iirc Blades doesn't start with Frozen Zone ever since THS debut, but that thing is still one of his major AZ bending so he's likely will go with it

For Skill: During this is the point in the series, Blades fought and defeated a person that is omnisicent in Blades's timeline (not omniscience in the whole verse but knows everything in his timeline basically).

I already said that above, still Youmu can matched up with Blades skill

Also, there is a thing that I failed to bring up and that is his Cloth Manip. It's like an activated adaptation where one of them is a hedgehog ability. This lets him gain spikes that are pretty similar to Needle Hedgehog (which damages the person attacking him with dura neg spikes)

Blades has supernatural willpower against mind and emotional stuff.

I already bring that points above lel

 

[Nicetoderp]

How long Youmu's been alive isn't quite deteriminable. We know she was trained by a master who was likely hundreds of years old, and she regularly fights against characters with insane abilities (Sakuya Izayoi's time powers are much more impressive than just skipping time, and characters like Reimu who passively manipulates fate & probability in her favor).

Okay, did Youmu defeated them? Or her Master at least? And was her Master serious about killing her at full since allll of the bullshit mentioned above was meant to kill Blades and he surpassed them all by a humongous margin, this also include Zooous Predator, a massively amp up Megid General who can easily counter any techniques he saw once and killed previous generation Blades.

And being slower isn't a problem at all since negging speed blitz via skill is a thing.

There's also the fact that he face off against Sage of the Wise, a reanimated corpse of the Four Sages, who invented all sword techniques of every Riders in the series, allowing them to slap Blades and basically just about every Riders like they were punk, until all of the Riders straight up inventing new techniques on the spot in order to defeated the Four Sages and they were starting off MUCH stronger than Blades too, Sage of The Wise Spartan almost one-shot Blades.

And still, Blades have precog, does Youmu have the feats to keep up?

Also, what exactly is Youmu AP?

 

[IxaSaga2]

Made it to work but I’ll take a little time to respond again.

At least it's not passive, and iirc Blades doesn't start with Frozen Zone ever since THS debut, but that thing is still one of his major AZ bending so he's likely will go with it

Well, he doesn’t use it because everyone either resists it or that it will basically kill Mei. He has no real reason to use it in series but out of it, he has good reason to.

I already said that above, still Youmu can matched up with Blades skill

Oh I thought you were referring to Calibur. I’m talking about Solomon and Storious who basically knows everything from beginning of universe to the end of universe.

I already bring that points above lel

O

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Made it to work but I’ll take a little time to respond again.

Well, he doesn’t use it because everyone either resists it or that it will basically kill Mei. He has no real reason to use it in series but out of it, he has good reason to.

Which is why i said "likely going to use it" but i get it lel

Oh I thought you were referring to Calibur. I’m talking about Solomon and Storious who basically knows everything from beginning of universe to the end of universe.

Nodded

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

How would the fight be if we used saber or Solomon instead?

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Okay, did Youmu defeated them? Or her Master at least? And was her Master serious about killing her at full since allll of the bullshit mentioned above was meant to kill Blades and he surpassed them all by a humongous margin, this also include Zooous Predator, a massively amp up Megid General who can easily counter any techniques he saw once and killed previous generation Blades.

Well not counting on Youki for now as i let them answer it, but i recall that she can equally fought Sakuya and Reimu, not defeated them but that should be enough
Beside that she has fought many of Yokais that are very bs since her debut in PCB like Mokou which is an true immortal that lived for a thousand years of battle experience (at least against Kaguya), Tenshi, and so on
I want to listed them all but i'm tired atm lel

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

As for precog, i'm sure that she has fought a Yokais that has the abilities to foresight but i couldn't remember

 

[IxaSaga2]

Which is why i said "likely going to use it" but i get it lel

Nodded

Logging back on to add to this. Being able to precog countless x timelines such as Calibur is nothing compared to Solomon and Storious. Being omniscient in Saber’s universe gives them knowledge to every ability/skill/event that ever existed and will exist in the future.

So not just people from thousands of years ago, this spans from beginning of universe, to end of universe.

also, going back to the time skip thing, it’s not time skip, it’s time erasure, a totally different thing to time skip.

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

I see, so it will come to whether Blades can overcome the danmaku, which i think he could as the range of his projectiles and other ranged attacks can overcome it (like froze the bullets)
Still those haxes will chip him slowly if he get hit, as for emotional and mental draining, i think Blades willpower can cover it (like made his emotion and mental lasted longer)

Yeah but in other hand, she can't defend herself from the AZ shennanigans Blades has, and other things that Blades has like turned into an water to hit her inside, the power null that can render most of her danmaku lost it's properties, and attack reflection will overwhelmed Youmu here so much

This is basically repeating what Fuji said above when he first appeared, with few addition: RPL and Cloth bending
With RPL based on the temperature, he might can overcome the danmaku faster and has many answer to deal with it
Cloth bending here grant Blades to flies and swim, and even made him into a hedgehog to defend himself

Well that would be good, if Youmu can overcome Blades LS (his LS is around class T while Youmu is just around class 25)
Alongside those advantages i said, BFR'd Blades would be so difficult

Spirit Manipulation works on characters even with supernatural willpower, it’s on the spirit Manip page itself.

him turning into water wouldn’t help, Youmu still has NPI and this would force him to get close: close enough to be in instant soul bfr range. (He’s lucky Youmu wasn’t in 17.5, which have every character in it water absorption abilities, otherwise this would’ve been a Youmu wincon lol)

Youmu has her own attack reflection & barriers meaning returned attacks won’t really matter when she can just negate them. Youmu innately can fly as well so Blades doesn’t gain a maneuverability advantage there.

Youmu’s blades can slash spirits on contact, so all it would take is one slash to send the soul to Nirvana. She doesn’t even need to cut deep necessarily.

Okay, did Youmu defeated them? Or her Master at least? And was her Master serious about killing her at full since allll of the bullshit mentioned above was meant to kill Blades and he surpassed them all by a humongous margin, this also include Zooous Predator, a massively amp up Megid General who can easily counter any techniques he saw once and killed previous generation Blades.

And being slower isn't a problem at all since negging speed blitz via skill is a thing.

There's also the fact that he face off against Sage of the Wise, a reanimated corpse of the Four Sages, who invented all sword techniques of every Riders in the series, allowing them to slap Blades and basically just about every Riders like they were punk, until all of the Riders straight up inventing new techniques on the spot in order to defeated the Four Sages and they were starting off MUCH stronger than Blades too, Sage of The Wise Spartan almost one-shot Blades.

And still, Blades have precog, does Youmu have the feats to keep up?

Also, what exactly is Youmu AP?

We don’t know if Youmu ever defeated her master. However Youmu has fought Sakuya & Reimu several times across the series, she’s lost many fights but always gave them a good battle, however she’s also defeated Sakuya & Reimu at least once across the many fighting games & versus games.

@Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara is more familiar with Touhou scaling chains than I, I’m not actually sure where Youmu places on the 2C ladder, she has a few chains tho

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

Logging back on to add to this. Being able to precog countless x timelines such as Calibur is nothing compared to Solomon and Storious. Being omniscient in Saber’s universe gives them knowledge to every ability/skill/event that ever existed and will exist in the future.

So not just people from thousands of years ago, this spans from beginning of universe, to end of universe.

also, going back to the time skip thing, it’s not time skip, it’s time erasure, a totally different thing to time skip.

Question does this omniscient stuff also apply to people too (maybe what’s going on in their minds and stuff)


though I ask you, how different would this fight be if Solomon or saber were used?

 

[IxaSaga2]

Question does this omniscient stuff also apply to people too (maybe what’s going on in their minds and stuff)


though I ask you, how different would this fight be if Solomon or saber were used?

Well Solomon not sure. Saber at this point has Xross Saber and Wonder Almighty so it’s fucked for her. Saber can just create an ability that completely negates everything she has.

Maybe, during the end, we see Touma seeing everyone’s stories. But idk if they know everyone’s thoughts.

 

[IxaSaga2]

Spirit Manipulation works on characters even with supernatural willpower, it’s on the spirit Manip page itself.

him turning into water wouldn’t help, Youmu still has NPI and this would force him to get close: close enough to be in instant soul bfr range. (He’s lucky Youmu wasn’t in 17.5, which have every character in it water absorption abilities, otherwise this would’ve been a Youmu wincon lol)

Youmu has her own attack reflection & barriers meaning returned attacks won’t really matter when she can just negate them. Youmu innately can fly as well so Blades doesn’t gain a maneuverability advantage there.

Youmu’s blades can slash spirits on contact, so all it would take is one slash to send the soul to Nirvana. She doesn’t even need to cut deep necessarily.
We don’t know if Youmu ever defeated her master. However Youmu has fought Sakuya & Reimu several times across the series, she’s lost many fights but always gave them a good battle, however she’s also defeated Sakuya & Reimu at least once across the many fighting games & versus games.

A few things to address here, since no resistance to AZ, her barriers or any defensive will only be shattered.

Also, shouldn’t his AZ just shatter her sword?

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Well Solomon not sure. Saber at this point has Xross Saber and Wonder Almighty so it’s fucked for her. Saber can just create an ability that completely negates everything she has.

Which is why i planning to use WG Saber against Yukari lel

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

Which is why i planning to use WG Saber against Yukari lel

This should be An actual death battle tbh

 

[IxaSaga2]

Which is why i planning to use WG Saber against Yukari lel

I would like to announce that I'm taking a break from VSB.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

I would like to announce that I'm taking a break from VSB.

No, you come back here, Donatello
Well luckily Yukari vs WG Saber will be made after one last major CRT of Saber Riders being published and accepted so your sanity is safe....for now

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Anyway we need to vote now, also Fuji is seems not being around right now so things might get a lil' slow

 

[IxaSaga2]

No, you come back here, Donatello
Well luckily Yukari vs WG Saber will be made after one last major CRT of Saber Riders being published and accepted so your sanity is safe....for now

Oh don't worry, the revision will probably be in months. (And I've already made a ton of work)

Also, shouldn’t his AZ just shatter her sword?

I also need this answered first

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

I also need this answered first

Well prolly, Youmu is a mix-between ranged and CQC fighter, so most of the time she's going with her danmaku spam
So she can keep the distance between her and Blades, alongside the time slow for further distance keeping

 

[IxaSaga2]

Well prolly, Youmu is a mix-between ranged and CQC fighter, so most of the time she's going with her danmaku spam
So she can keep the distance between her and Blades, alongside the time slow for further distance keeping

My brother, you kinda started her deep inside the AZ range. We also explained how her Danmaku isn't a win-con for her.

 

[Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara]

Youmu doesn't really stack up to the insane skill feats I've seen from Blades (nobody in Touhou does tbh), and if his AZ is something he loves to spam, I think Youmu is going to be really hard pressed to find a single advantage when her first danmaku volley fails. She still has thought-based perception hax and enough defensive tools to keep herself alive, but Blades can do the same with intangibility (elemental intang isn't something Touhou NPI ever really touches upon and is something most characters explicitly can't counter, except literally one time), power null, attack reflection, and AZ, so it's really only a matter of time until he just outskills enough to get in close and finish the fight. KR Blades wins mid to high diff imo

This is, of course, assuming he at no point just activates his instant win button of several kilometer range AZ.

Also, Youmu's place on the scaling chain is a bit up in the air, but for now I'd say she's kinda low; Youmu >/= Mokou = Kaguya > Doremy, so really only two steps above the baseline for what 2-Cs scale to (several dozen universes).

I also need this answered first

Yes, but Youmu can extend her swords with energy, so she can still use melee attacks at a safe enough distance.

Also, she has two of them, so :v

 

[IxaSaga2]

Also, Youmu's place on the scaling chain is a bit up in the air, but for now I'd say she's kinda low; Youmu >/= Mokou = Kaguya > Doremy, so really only two steps above the baseline for what 2-Cs scale to (several dozen universes).

I don't think you can improve universes from scaling alone since 3 universes is infinitely larger than 2 universes.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Youmu doesn't really stack up to the insane skill feats I've seen from Blades (nobody in Touhou does tbh)

Really? I thought Touhou skills are pretty damn good, surprise surprise

nd if his AZ is something he loves to spam, I think Youmu is going to be really hard pressed to find a single advantage when her first danmaku volley fails. She still has thought-based perception hax and enough defensive tools to keep herself alive, but Blades can do the same with intangibility (elemental intang isn't something Touhou NPI ever really touches upon and is something most characters explicitly can't counter, except literally one time), power null, attack reflection, and AZ, so it's really only a matter of time until he just outskills enough to get in close and finish the fight. KR Blades wins mid to high diff imo

I say both can win high diff, but based on your argument, looks like Blades take this
There's something about this:

I'd also like to raise the argument of Youmu's concept manipulation. Once she realizes the danger of his AZ zone, Youmu could absolutely modify/gamify his aura to no longer be lethal to her, which could allow her to fight him without instantly shattering

This could help Youmu for sure

 

[Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara]

I don't think you can improve universes from scaling alone since 3 universes is infinitely larger than 2 universes.

Nah, we do allow scaling chains for low 2-C and above, we just don't do tier jumps from it.

Really? I thought Touhou skills are pretty damn good, surprise surprise

I never said they weren't! KR is just on another level of bullshit.

This could help Youmu for sure

Yeah, true, power mod could kick in. But that'd require Youmu to realize the nature of Blades' ability, decide if it's too "unfair" for her to bypass normally, and actually name it, all before Blades just nukes the area with AoE AZ. Name manipulation isn't something Touhou characters whip out at a moment's notice if they're in-character, so I'd say that it's one possible wincon, just kinda unlikely.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Alright then, guess this is a wrap now
One for Blades (Fuji)

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

If only we had the abilities Youmu should have on her profile right now, this match’s discussion would be much different

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

I still lean towards this being an incon, both have thought based methods to give themselves a perfect opportunity to win the fight in one hit. All Youmu needs is one slash for soul bfr (which she can do with extended range energy slashes) and all Blades needs is to get within range.

Youmu actively has a method to negate Blade’s one wincon if the fight goes on long enough for Youmu to realize she can’t get in or let him get close, so while I say incon, I lean more towards Youmu taking it just barely.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

If only we had the abilities Youmu should have on her profile right now, this match’s discussion would be much different

I have a funny feeling that even with that stuff, Blades still emerged victorious

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Anyway, this match is so worthy with my BATTLE MUSIC/SONG LIST
Gonna add all of it later

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

I have a funny feeling that even with that stuff, Blades still emerged victorious

I don’t think Blade would emerge victorious against insane fate/probability manipulation

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

Did I vote already?

if not I vote incon for pikmins reasons

 

[IxaSaga2]

In before Kuroto Dan or Zero-One riders come in with their probability scaling.

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

In before Kuroto Dan or Zero-One riders come in with their probability scaling.

Dan will always be god.

 

[IxaSaga2]

Dan will always be god.

Remember when you hated him?

The crazy thing is, KR Outsiders gives us the chance to scale 01 and Saber Riders together which is like, the two infamous series containing of some of the most broken haxers in KR excluding God Tiers. And then you put Genm Musou into the mix.....YIKES.

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

Remember when you hated him?

The crazy thing is, KR Outsiders gives us the chance to scale 01 and Saber Riders together which is like, the two infamous series containing of some of the most broken haxers in KR excluding God Tiers. And then you put Genm Musou into the mix.....YIKES.

Kirasagi told me that I would like him soon enough

 

[IxaSaga2]

Kirasagi told me that I would like him soon enough

I'm telling you, KR characters are something else. A person almost everyone despises at first, made into a character that is almost universally loved by the fandom, all done in a few episodes no less.

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

I'm telling you, KR characters are something else. A person almost everyone despises at first, made into a character that is almost universally loved by the fandom, all done in a few episodes no less.

It’s called character development and good writing

 

[IxaSaga2]

It’s called character development and good writing

+1 to that.

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

also Ex-aid taught me that if you see a horrible thread, it will you give you the bugster virus.

fortunately this thread did not give me the bugster virus.

 

[Mad_Dog_of_Fujiwara]

damn y'all are making me wanna watch Kamen Rider now :v

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

damn y'all are making me wanna watch Kamen Rider now :v

You should, it's such of fun and good whacky franchise
And a better superheroes than any of western superheroes that they ever done in past decades

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Remember when you hated him?

The crazy thing is, KR Outsiders gives us the chance to scale 01 and Saber Riders together which is like, the two infamous series containing of some of the most broken haxers in KR excluding God Tiers. And then you put Genm Musou into the mix.....YIKES.

All of the Riders in Outsiders are in their post-series, right?

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Anyway, i'm gonna go with Blades based on the arguments that has been presented above, and beside i'm one of the folks that are contributed on his arguments lel

• Blades: 2 (Fuji, Myself)
• Youmu: 0
• Incon: 2 (Pikmin, Pokemon)

 

[IxaSaga2]

All of the Riders in Outsiders are in their post-series, right?

Yea. It includes Ryuki Riders, multiple Faiz characters, Diend, Foundation X, Ganma Superior from Saber X Ghost, Genm, Horobi, Thouser, Kenzan, Desast, new rider/corp called Zein. So yea, Outsiders is a mega crossover between a lot of series. This is also the first time we see Mari's actress back in KR since 2009, and her first portrayal of Mari since 2004.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Yea. It includes Ryuki Riders, multiple Faiz characters, Diend, Foundation X, Ganma Superior from Saber X Ghost, Genm, Horobi, Thouser, Kenzan, Desast, new rider/corp called Zein. So yea, Outsiders is a mega crossover between a lot of series. This is also the first time we see Mari's actress back in KR since 2009, and her first portrayal of Mari since 2004.

Post-Series scaling between all of those chars will be so much whack lel

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Anyway, are you gonna vote? @IxaSaga2

 

[IxaSaga2]

Post-Series scaling between all of those chars will be so much whack lel

Yet its' going to be soooooo much fun.

Anyway, are you gonna vote? @IxaSaga2

I think it's an incredibly close fight but it's just that Blades has just edges it out because Youma has to rely more on chance while Blades has a consistent deal breaker.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Yet its' going to be soooooo much fun.

I think it's an incredibly close fight but it's just that Blades has just edges it out because Youma has to rely more on chance while Blades has a consistent deal breaker.

I guess i'll take that as a vote for Blades
That's three for Rintarou

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

I’m switching from incon to blades, just to make things faster and easier

 

[Artorimachi_Meteoraft]

damn y'all are making me wanna watch Kamen Rider now :v

try ex-aid it’s one of the best.

@MagiSinbad, and the others recommended it to me and it’s really awesome.

also is highly memeable. I won’t spoil it to you obviously though.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

Hey @Ciruno_Fortes_(COB) , i know you're been around in this thread somewhere lel
Anyway that's 4 for Blades

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

So uh

Did we come to a ruling on if Blades not being able to kill Youmu permanently due to her Phantom's Mid-Godly matters or not?

Are we considering it just an incon since Blades can kill her physical form, but never permanently take out her Phantom?

is it a Blades win since, while he can never kill Youmu permanently, he's capable of keeping her in a continuous loop?

This also raises the possibility of, well, once he tries to leave Youmu's phantom, it has full capabilities to start trying to get the one slash needed to kill him for good.

I don't think I can say in good full faith that this is a Blades WIN unless he has the capacity to put Youmu down permanently, which I just don't think he has.

While I lean towards Youmu winning due to her having the ability to remove his one wincon via power modification, I could see this as an incon since it's ultimately an MU where its a one stroke duel of who gets their one shot off first, where one character can't permanently be killed by the other, but can be trapped in a death loop.

 

[Kisaragi_Megumi]

So uh

Did we come to a ruling on if Blades not being able to kill Youmu permanently due to her Phantom's Mid-Godly matters or not?

Are we considering it just an incon since Blades can kill her physical form, but never permanently take out her Phantom?

is it a Blades win since, while he can never kill Youmu permanently, he's capable of keeping her in a continuous loop?

This also raises the possibility of, well, once he tries to leave Youmu's phantom, it has full capabilities to start trying to get the one slash needed to kill him for good.

I don't think I can say in good full faith that this is a Blades WIN unless he has the capacity to put Youmu down permanently, which I just don't think he has.

While I lean towards Youmu winning due to her having the ability to remove his one wincon via power modification, I could see this as an incon since it's ultimately an MU where its a one stroke duel of who gets their one shot off first, where one character can't permanently be killed by the other, but can be trapped in a death loop.

I trusted Fuji on this one to answering it since she's the one who said that Blades take this mid or high diff
But i mean he can just froze her indefinitely when he soon know that her phantom side can't be taken down

 

[Kirbonic_Pikmin]

I trusted Fuji on this one to answering it since she's the one who said that Blades take this mid or high diff
But i mean he can just froze her indefinitely when he soon know that her phantom side can't be taken down

Since he uses AZ, that freezes on a molecular level and causes things to instantly shatter

So… once the phantom shatters… it regenerates. It’d just be a loop of coming back until blades stops freezing, which would then re-open him to attack

 

[IxaSaga2]

There's no reason why Blades can't just sit there with his AZ zone until he reaches one of the sba wincons.

 

[Doggo]

Blades fra

 

[Harith0cell]

Voting blades for reason above.