Arkenis
They/Them- 15,010
- 6,555
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JUJUTSU KAISEN SPEED DOWNGRADE CONT.
- Thread starter PrinceofPein
- Start date
- Status
Arkenis
They/Them- 15,010
- 6,555
u beat me to it BRUHNaoya says Ogi is insignificant compared to Naobito.
The fact that Naoya is the leader of the Hei (which includes Ogi) proves that he is stronger than Ogi, so his statement is reliable.
Not convinced?
Gege himself said that Naobito is considerably stronger than Maki's father.
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Thread is themed after speed 
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Yeah, I am.
You’re intentionally being dishonest. Naoya had no way of knowing ANY of that information, all he knew, all he could feel, was his aura that was so imposing he put his hands up as to surrender to him. This same Yuta, one year earlier, punched the **** out of Geto, another Special Grade before he could react.
Unless you’re saying Maki can outspeed two special grades, I see no reason why the implications aren’t present. Naoya isn’t a threat to Yuta.
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It’s upsetting that you’re trying to speed scale via someone being scared and you think that it’s clear cut scaling
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I think it is. You don’t have any refutation outside of “it’s not clear cut”.
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Your argument in a thread about speed is literally "skill issue"
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Don’t see how, but sure.
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Faster than =/ faster than someone's tier. You're contending Naobito is on a different level so much so that Yuta can't scale. Yuta has been consistently portrayed as someone > current Maki, and even fought 3 reincarnated sorcerers who themselves were prime in their own times. The idea that Naoya is on some level of speed that can't be contended with, or that Yuta is < current Maki despite Maki being called an "ant" by Sukuna, is ******* stupid. Not gonna sugar coat it. You're blatantly ignoring the baseline logic of this manga by trying to play this game, and literally all evidence points against this.
Once again, even when Naoya ******* understood it was just Yuta, he still wanted no smoke.
The same noaya who foguth Maki after she killed the claim.
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Yeah no, read the chapter where Maki kills Ogi, it's specifically stated that Ogi was actually on par with his brother but would have never been considered for head because of his daughters.Naoya says Ogi is insignificant compared to Naobito.
The fact that Naoya is the leader of the Hei (which includes Ogi) proves that he is stronger than Ogi, so his statement is reliable.
Not convinced?
Gege himself said that Naobito is considerably stronger than Maki's father.
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Because that is all the refutation needed. Someone being scared of someone else doesn’t equate to that person being the same speed as the other.
That’s it. That’s all the refutation that is needed. The proposition you are making does not inherently line up with the statements being said.
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No, you have to take context into account which you clearly aren’t doing. Do you know what implicit means?
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Yes and there is no implicit suggestion that he is above him specifically in speed as well. What he could be feeling was Yuuta’s overwhelming power or other high end moves instead of his speed. Also the person who made the claim that he rivaled Naobito was Ogi himself.
But considering there are contradictory statements from multiple other sources confirming that Ogi wasn’t on par with Naobito, this statement by Obi can be considered boasting and cruelty on his part to his daughters
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| "My older brother's Cursed Technique doesn't have much of a history. So his technique was not an important factor in the dispute" |
We literally have an explicit statement from the author about Naobito being much stronger than Ogi, and that Ogi is underestimating Naobito, what are you arguing about?
Naoya (who is confirmed to be stronger than Ogi by being his superior in rank) says that he deserves to stand alongside Toji and Gojo, do you accept his boastful statement?
Choso specifically said that Yuji will have an easier time running away from Yuta, because Naoya is a 'speed type'.
So having a strong or creepy aura doesn't correlate with speed higher than Naoya's.
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You aren’t responding to my point. Power means nothing, once again, Naoya challenged Maki despite knowing she slew the whole clan. He was that confident that his speed could deal with her power and speed despite the gap in power.
Vs Yuta he literally quit upon feeling his aura alone and this was something he reaffirmed once learning whose aura it was. Meaning Naoya was not confidemt that his CT would give him any chance at beating him.
now tell me, since you claim to know what implicit means, what information can we draw from the above?
Incorrect. The only person who dispute Ogi’s claim is Noaya and not only is he super biased, but someone dorectly benfotting from the politics of the clam system. The context of Ogi’s monologue is giving the audience the true situation of Ogi and meant to contextualize why he hates his daughters.
If Ogo is anywhere near Naobito, it means he is someone who scales relative to him.
Mind you, Yita murders the whole clan. Please reasses yoir argument because it’s not good.
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Could you send that statement? It's hard to find the translated Fanbook pages....
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Mobile now and can’t respond in depth jntil tomorrow but the above doesn’t even matter, no one is saying Ogi > Naobito, the point is that they are relatove and that Naobito’s CT alone is not something that puts him > Ogi alone. If they are relative (meaning that Naobito can’t just speedblitz no diff his brother) and Maki can blitz Ogi, it means Maki was clearly on a speed level at least on par with SP
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That Yuuta can beat Naoya in a fight. Not that Yuuta is inherently faster or even on par with Naoya. Yuuta can have techniques that can make it so his CT won’t be effective on him, that doesn’t mean Yuuta by himself is relative to Naoya in speed when he’s using his CT.
Hell you even mention how Naoya is an incredibly biased character who during his whole interaction with Maki kept underestimating her and denying her worth by saying she was incomparable to Toji. The narrative there plainly establishes how Naoya sees Maki and his view on her beneath him. This same type of bias cannot be seen for Yuuta however.
Nope it was explicitly confirmed by Gege that Naobito was “considerably more powerful” than Ogi. Who he also confirmed “didn’t know his true power.”
Which in turn makes Naoya’s comment more substantiating and true while Ogi’s is less so.
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I understand, I just wanted the scan for another purpose, I don't have a position regarding the current discussion of the topic.
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Will respond tomorrow
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Oh no I feel you, more so responded to that comment using your comment.
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I guess the debate will be about whether:
1- Naobito is considerably stronger than Ogi.
2- Ogi did not know Naobito's true power.
docs.google.com
1- Naobito is considerably stronger than Ogi.
2- Ogi did not know Naobito's true power.
You can read two separate translations of the databook:
Jujutsu Kaisen Official Fanbook ENG
docs.google.com
| Q: How did Naobito become the Zenin family’s head? A: Simply because he’s a strong sorcerer. If it's only based on strength then Toji is also the same, but without cursed tools Toji can only fight against humans. |
| How did Naobito become the head of the Zenin family? Akutami: It's simply because he's a powerful jujutsu sorcerer. If it were about only strength, Toji would've also been a contender but without his cursed tools, he can only fight against regular humans. |
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Still waiting for a single speed statement
Arkenis
They/Them- 15,010
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Can we just go with what the story tells us, aka what Gege has been trying to tell us? Ogi is not on his brother's level, his statement about himself is biased, that's clear as day, Gege confirmed dude didn't know what he was talking about. So drop this Ogi = Naobito. Ogi's just a bitter old man who's mad his kids were worthless and mad he's a loser so he took it out on his kids lmaooo.
Yuta and Naoya scaling is so very obvious they do not scale in any way. Who Yuta has fought kinda proves that, he's fighting with special grades, taking on past sorcerers, being second to Gojo in unusual abilities, being hyped up to be the person who's gonna beat Kenjaku, the guy who can take on Sukuna, he's gonna be good as Gojo someday, the story points to Yuta being in a completely different ballpark from everyone else, so again who cares if Naoya was scared, the story overall is telling us Yuta > Naoya.
Yuta and Naoya scaling is so very obvious they do not scale in any way. Who Yuta has fought kinda proves that, he's fighting with special grades, taking on past sorcerers, being second to Gojo in unusual abilities, being hyped up to be the person who's gonna beat Kenjaku, the guy who can take on Sukuna, he's gonna be good as Gojo someday, the story points to Yuta being in a completely different ballpark from everyone else, so again who cares if Naoya was scared, the story overall is telling us Yuta > Naoya.
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Not in speed
Arkenis
They/Them- 15,010
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"not in speed" Gege ain't make yuta just for some dork Naoya to be relative to him, please reread the manga.
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"Please reread the manga" please give speed feats
Your only argument of Yuta being in the same ballpark of speed is that "he's strong and I don't believe he'd be that slow". Fallacious reasoning throughout this entire thread.
Give speed feats or statements, not imaginary implications
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This ain't a good argument bruh
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KingTempest makes more sense to me, this character (Naoya) has been stated to be a speed type, unlike the other character you are trying to scale him from.
If the speed difference isn't that vast, a slower character could very well intimidate and even defeat a faster character.
That's one of the reasons why we don't scale All Might (Mach 66-100) to Number 6 (Mach 168) since the speed difference doesn't make it unwinnable for All Might and there's really nothing N6 can do to him (N6 believes All Might to be a unbeatable God).
If the speed difference isn't that vast, a slower character could very well intimidate and even defeat a faster character.
That's one of the reasons why we don't scale All Might (Mach 66-100) to Number 6 (Mach 168) since the speed difference doesn't make it unwinnable for All Might and there's really nothing N6 can do to him (N6 believes All Might to be a unbeatable God).
PrinceofPein
Username Only- 8,979
- 5,898
- Thread starter
- #672
Checked all the thread they have open about JJK and none really address or conflicts with this, so this is fine to apply
So those affected by this is
maki
Yuji
Megumi
Nobara
Kento
Yuta
Todo
Jogo
Hanami
Mahito
Finger bearer
Choso
jiro
Geto
Did I miss anyone?
So those affected by this is
maki
Yuji
Megumi
Nobara
Kento
Yuta
Todo
Jogo
Hanami
Mahito
Finger bearer
Choso
jiro
Geto
Did I miss anyone?
Arkenis
They/Them- 15,010
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what is the speed?
PrinceofPein
Username Only- 8,979
- 5,898
- Thread starter
- #674
to maki/ slightly above maki and below maki
Arkenis
They/Them- 15,010
- 6,555
speed tier?
PrinceofPein
Username Only- 8,979
- 5,898
- Thread starter
- #676
yeah, the thread is about speed
Arkenis
They/Them- 15,010
- 6,555
Bruh what is the speed tier they are at
PrinceofPein
Username Only- 8,979
- 5,898
- Thread starter
- #678
scales below mach 3Bruh what is the speed tier they are at
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Narrative scaling wise to make it work
Characters like post Shibuya Yuji would need to be superhuman, maybe the lowest ends of subsonic.
Above them would be Maki partial awakened (unhealthy) via keeping up with Naoya, Human Naoya who would speed of sound full speed.
Next would be Naoya (womb curse) who is supersonic, along with Maki partial awakened (healthy) being in that tier, with full curse naoya being mach 3 supersonic+
True Awakened Maki would be hypersonic (i think she has a mach 6 calced feat against Naoya)
Kenjaku, tsukimo and hyped up Choso would be hypersonic too (Casual kenjaku has a mach 8/9ish feat)
Jackpot Hikari would be Massively Hypersonic via lightning dodge by extension Kashimo
Then Gojo most likely
Yuuta I can see being anywhere between hypersonic to massively hypersonic
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This thread is about speed, come on, bro.Bruh what is the speed tier they are at
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