(JTTW) Sun Wukong CRT

[Antvasima]

Okay. So can the page be created now then, or is there anything left to do here?

 

[Hagane_no_Saiyajin]

We can't really quantify the amount of energy needed for that.

Well, as established earlier, the Silver Way is infinite in size

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

Okay. So can the page be created now then, or is there anything left to do here?

Everything has been checked and given references.

 

[Antvasima]

Yes, but I would prefer a confirmation/go-ahead from staff members that are more knowledgeable about this topic.

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

Yes, but I would prefer a confirmation/go-ahead from staff members that are more knowledgeable about this topic.

Well Planck, QuasiYuri and Confluctor have all given confirmation on the profile itself a while ago. The profile hasn't changed at all since then.

Elizhaa checked the Physiology page and said it was fine and only needed references (Which I added). And even before that Planck Quasi and Confluctor all checked it and thought it was fine.

No changes have really been made to it since the last time they all looked over it.

The Cosmology page hasn't really been changed since the last time Qawsedf234 checked it and said it was fine and only needed references (Which I added).

The only thing that has actually changed since all of them gave those pages their go aheaad was the calcs. Which have been checked twice by now and was stated to be fine by Jasonsith and Dark-Carioca.


If it's necessary to ask them again I can wait obviously, but it seems a bit extra especially since nothing has changed since the last time they stated it was fine.

 

[Antvasima]

Okay. I still prefer to wait for confirmations though.

 

[Antvasima]

@Elizhaa @Qawsedf234 @Confluctor

Is the Sun Wukong page fine to post now?

 

[Udlmaster]

We can't really quantify the amount of energy needed for that.

Infinite.

Wukong is constantly said to have infinite energy.

Which is why he slapped the shit out of Heaven while still an early adult.

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

Infinite.

Wukong is constantly said to have infinite energy.

Which is why he slapped the shit out of Heaven while still an early adult.

Sun Wukong having Infinite Energy or Power has been debunked way too many times in the Novel. He's gotten tired before and exhausted before, couldn't lift certain objects that were most certainly not infinite, and couldn't beat specific opponents without help.

Way too many things happen that prove that while has a lot of Stamina and Power it is finite.

 

[Confluctor]

@Elizhaa @Qawsedf234 @Confluctor

Is the Sun Wukong page fine to post now?

Yeah, looks fine to me

 

[TypeOU]

Sun Wukong having Infinite Energy or Power has been debunked way too many times in the Novel. He's gotten tired before and exhausted before, couldn't lift certain objects that were most certainly not infinite, and couldn't beat specific opponents without help.

Way too many things happen that prove that while has a lot of Stamina and Power it is finite

We also have characters with multiple magnitudes of infinity in attack potency getting tired and exhausted. That's just how it goes with fiction. As I've said back when this thread started, due to the nature of journey to the west, some of his feats and counter feats are up to interpretation, including his inability to lift 3 mountains

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

We also have characters with multiple magnitudes of infinity in attack potency getting tired and exhausted. That's just how it goes with fiction. As I've said back when this thread started, due to the nature of journey to the west, some of his feats and counter feats are up to interpretation, including his inability to lift 3 mountains

I agree, and maybe someone in the future can make a CRT for Infinite Power/Energy and a Tier 3 rating. Personally, I'm content with what he is at.

 

[Udlmaster]

Sun Wukong having Infinite Energy or Power has been debunked way too many times in the Novel. He's gotten tired before and exhausted before, couldn't lift certain objects that were most certainly not infinite, and couldn't beat specific opponents without help.

Way too many things happen that prove that while has a lot of Stamina and Power it is finite.

That’s not what infinite power means in this context.

And lifting strength is different than infinite power too, and to my recollection, only Five phases mountain was any problem and that’s as because the mountain was sealed by the Buddha, he later ended up destroying the mountain range to free himself.

As for him losing against opponents, he never loses outright in strength, he usually loses when someone uses Hax or special weapons against him (Ox’s Diamond ring, Fires of Samadi, etc.) or sometimes because he can’t swim for some reason.

Wukong is constantly shown to have powers that are intentionally limited by the plot because that’s the point.

The party will spend weeks travelling, get captured and Monkey will instantly travel to Guanyin, Buddha or Heaven to get advice and instantly come back like it was nothing.

Monkey has to also constantly hold back how malicious and destructive he is so he doesn’t get pain-sutta’d constantly.

For example, Monkey can literally become a cosmic being with dozens of arms and breath fire but he can’t do that around Monk.

Or the time he nearly destroyed the Divine Mountain range in a rage because the party had left without him and went to the “DO NOT GO THERE” place.

Also, are we forgetting the time Wukong fought off several constellations and the embodiment of the Cardinal directions?

Then, the mountains on the planet itself are nearly as big as the sun such as Sumeru, if I'm reading the correct profile, shaking Sumeru should be Star level, not Continental.

And why is Buddha's word about Wukong moving Planets taken as a possibility? Like you do know Tathagata is Buddha, right?

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

That’s not what infinite power means in this context.

And lifting strength is different than infinite power too, and to my recollection, only Five phases mountain was any problem and that’s as because the mountain was sealed by the Buddha, he later ended up destroying the mountain range to free himself.

Guanyin straight up says he can't lift something as heavy as all of the water in the oceans and seas. She then casually does so.

Anyway, I'm not saying Sun Wukong is not strong, but he is most certainly not Infinitely so. The Infinitely long rivers are a mistranslation and the Infinite Realms statement was a misunderstanding. So was the infinitely deep river of the Underworld. What he can do is impressive but nothing shows he can do that to an Infinite High 3-A extent.

Also, are we forgetting the time Wukong fought off several constellations and the embodiment of the Cardinal directions?

Ya, he fought the Gods of Time and the Gods of Darkness and Light as well, that's why he has resistance to that stuff. It's also why he's 4-A instead of 4-C like he would have been.

 

[Udlmaster]

Guanyin straight up says he can't lift something as heavy as all of the water in the oceans and seas. She then casually does so.

Because he was nearly beaten to Death by the fires of Samadi briefly before. Also, Guanyin's vase is more than just a container for all the Water in the world. It is heavily symbolic, which, as the allegory for the mind, means that Wukong isn't worthy.

It is a symbol of Good fortune and contains pure water capable of relieving suffering, which would be why Wukong cannot carry it, because he is very far from pure at this point int he story.

The Infinitely long rivers are a mistranslation

What? No they're not, we've had this argument, I've already proven it over and over again.

So was the infinitely deep river of the Underworld.

Yeah, which isn't something I brought up, needless to say, why would it be mistranslated? Do you have any evidence to back that up?

Ya, he fought the Gods of Time and the Gods of Darkness and Light as well, that's why he has resistance to that stuff. It's also why he's 4-A instead of 4-C like he would have been.

Why would that make him 4-A?

If you're saying they have control over all Light and Darkness in the cosmos, then they'd be Infinite, not 4-A.

The Daoist/Buddhist cosmos is infinite.

The Silver Way itself is an infinite galaxy dividing Heaven and Earth because the Jade Emperor didn't want his daughter to marry a Weaver.

Then in the Buddhist notion of the cosmos, around 200 million miles below the Surface there's an infinite layer of Sky.

I've also already shown infinities like the Infinite Dragon Realms, and if you only take them to be finite spaces onto themselves, that would still be High 3-A, Infinite again.

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

Because he was nearly beaten to Death by the fires of Samadi briefly before. Also, Guanyin's vase is more than just a container for all the Water in the world. It is heavily symbolic, which, as the allegory for the mind, means that Wukong isn't worthy.

It is a symbol of Good fortune and contains pure water capable of relieving suffering, which would be why Wukong cannot carry it, because he is very far from pure at this point int he story.

That's never stated in the story and she specifically states its cause he cant lift the oceans. If you can find a scan in the JTTW Novel that says otherwise we can change it.

What? No they're not, we've had this argument, I've already proven it over and over again.

Yes they are, they are not mentioned once within the most accurate translation of the novel. Trust me I searched the entire novel multiple times.

Why would that make him 4-A?

If you're saying they have control over all Light and Darkness in the cosmos, then they'd be Infinite, not 4-A.

The Daoist/Buddhist cosmos is infinite.

The Silver Way itself is an infinite galaxy dividing Heaven and Earth because the Jade Emperor didn't want his daughter to marry a Weaver.

Then in the Buddhist notion of the cosmos, around 200 million miles below the Surface there's an infinite layer of Sky.

We agreed on not using anything from outside of the JTTW Novel. Let's not argue over this again.

I've also already shown infinities like the Infinite Dragon Realms, and if you only take them to be finite spaces onto themselves, that would still be High 3-A, Infinite again.

That's a statement from a less accurate translation. Sun Wukong does not scale to them in any way.

 

[Udlmaster]

Yes they are, they are not mentioned once within the most accurate translation of the novel. Trust me I searched the entire novel multiple times.

Citation, because there isn't "most accurate" translation of JTTW, because this isn't some manga series where there's "the official translation" by some company, there's many different translations, and the ones I have read confirm that many things in the cosmos are infinite.

We agreed on not using anything from outside of the JTTW Novel. Were not arguing going over this again.

The Silver Way is literally mentioned in the story, and this is what it would mean. These things have meaning you know?

The Silver Way is translated as the Milky Way into English, but obviously, they don't call it that, because that's the Western name for it, just like Chinese people don't call them China, China. It was originally called the Middle Kingdom.

This is what I mean about context and how nuances are lost in translation and when people who don't know the background context, come to wrong conclusions.

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

Citation, because there isn't "most accurate" translation of JTTW, because this isn't some manga series where there's "the official translation" by some company, there's many different translations, and the ones I have read confirm that many things in the cosmos are infinite.

The Silver Way is literally mentioned in the story, and this is what it would mean. These things have meaning you know?

The Silver Way is translated as the Milky Way into English, but obviously, they don't call it that, because that's the Western name for it, just like Chinese people don't call them China, China. It was originally called the Middle Kingdom.

This is what I mean about context and how nuances are lost in translation and when people who don't know the background context, come to wrong conclusions.

I don't know what you want me to say, this is what's accepted. If people hadn't ruined Mythology profiles so badly to the point they got banned and stopped digging into religion so much when making them we wouldn't need to do it this way.

The Sun Wukong profile got deleted and remade so many times because a consensus could never be reached. In any case no matter what the profile is not going to change as long as you bring up things that have already previously been rejected.

 

[Udlmaster]

The reason why the original revision for Wukong didn't go through was people were doing what's happening now.

They're taking translation as literal, like the Milky Way just being the Milky Way galaxy and not actually what it would be to a Chinese artist in the 16th century, or any of the context.

The crux last time was "As many sands in the Ganges river" was taken to literally be that number that we know now, not the proverb.

As I said, I'm not using religion to scale Wukong, but people see me using the actual context behind the words spoken and freak out like I'm going to drop the Diamond Sutra onto the profile and declare Wukong is tier 0.

Nothing I'm saying is from the Religion, it's what these words mean.

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

The reason why the original revision for Wukong didn't go through was people were doing what's happening now.

They're taking translation as literal, like the Milky Way just being the Milky Way galaxy and not actually what it would be to a Chinese artist in the 16th century, or any of the context.

The crux last time was "As many sands in the Ganges river" was taken to literally be that number that we know now, not the proverb.

As I said, I'm not using religion to scale Wukong, but people see me using the actual context behind the words spoken and freak out like I'm going to drop the Diamond Sutra onto the profile and declare Wukong is tier 0.

Nothing I'm saying is from the Religion, it's what these words mean.

The Universe in JTTW is Infinite, but not because of the Milky Way statement. Atm a single World in JTTW is Low 1-C to 1-C in size.

 

[Elizhaa]

@Elizhaa @Qawsedf234 @Confluctor

Is the Sun Wukong page fine to post now?

It largely seems fine.

 

[Udlmaster]

It largely seems fine.

Not really, a bunch of things don't make sense atm.

Dharma Bodied Buddha. This is the Dharmakaya, Dharma Body or Truth Body, these aren't different things.

Great Sage Equal to Heaven is not a stronger version of Wukong, the only time Wukong gets stronger is during his training to be a Daoist Immortal.

In fact, Wukong was given the title of Great Sage Equal to Heaven specifically because it was an empty title with no actual meaning.

While I think Wukong is a genius, he is not an Extraordinary Genius.

His first key being "Post Buddha sealing" doesn't make sense, because Great Sage Equal to Heaven comes before being released, and Wukong isn't actually weakened by his time under Five Phases Mountain (IIRC)

The Buddha isn't Dharmakaya. The scans in the JTTW cosmology blog do not say this either.

They say "Mind is the Buddha and the Buddha is Mind; Both Mind and Buddha are important things. If you perceive there's neither Mind nor Thing (Buddha), Yours is the Dharmakaya of True Mind."

This is stating that when you remove the division between the Buddha and Mind and see both as nothingness, you achieve the Highest Enlightenment of the Dharmakaya.

Another thing is the Great Way, or Great Dao.

It is not the Buddha's teaching, that is the Dharma, the Dao is a force intrinsic to the Cosmos and is the origins of it.

In the opening chapters, it literally tells us this:

The Divine Root Conceives and the Spring Breaks Forth As the Heart's Nature Is Cultivated, the Great Way Arises Before Chaos was divided, Heaven and Earth were one; All was a shapeless blur, and no men had appeared. Once Pan Gu destroyed the Enormous Vagueness The separation of clear and impure began.

Another is when the Daoist Patriarch begins to explain the way, he does begin to explain the Three Vechicals soon after which makes it confusing, but before he does this, it says this:

When Sun Wukong was outside the doors he bowed to all his spiritual elder brothers and laid out his bed on the verandah. The next morning and every following day he studied language and deportment under his spiritual elder brothers, expounded the scriptures, discussed the Way, practiced calligraphy, and burnt incense. When he had any spare time he would sweep the grounds, dig the vegetable patch, grow flowers, tend trees, look for kindling, light the fire, carry water, and fetch soy. Everything he needed was provided. Thus six or seven years slipped by in the cave without his noticing them. One day the Patriarch took his seat on the dais, called all the Immortals together, and began to explain the Great Way.

The best evidence that they are not the same is when it talks about the Dharma and the Great Way separately in the same sentence, in this sentence, it says the Dharma is the way TO the Great Way, not that they are the same.

When the Dharma king would destroy it the Dharma is infinite;
The Dharma runs through heaven and earth, opening the Great Way.
The origins of ten thousand Dharmas all come down to one;
The features of the Three Vehicles are basically the same.

It can be confusing, because the Dao, the Way, isn't very well defined in the book, because it assumes the Reader already has foreknowledge, a lot of what it talks about is Short-hand.

Short-hand is basically where a writer will use cultural knowledge and facts to portray something to the Reader/viewer.

So for example, in Hercules (Disney version), when Hercules wants to see where he belongs, he gets on his knees and prays to Zeus like a Christian would pray to God.

Now, obviously, this isn't how Greeks would pray to a God, they'd do sacrifices and rituals, but prayer and kneeling before a God is short-hand for piety and gets that info across.

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

Not really, a bunch of things don't make sense atm.

Dharma Bodied Buddha. This is the Dharmakaya, Dharma Body or Truth Body, these aren't different things.

Forgot to change the name for that, I'll do it in a bit.

Great Sage Equal to Heaven is not a stronger version of Wukong, the only time Wukong gets stronger is during his training to be a Daoist Immortal. In fact, Wukong was given the title of Great Sage Equal to Heaven specifically because it was an empty title with no actual meaning. In fact, Wukong was given the title of Great Sage Equal to Heaven specifically because it was an empty title with no actual meaning.

His first key being "Post Buddha sealing" doesn't make sense, because Great Sage Equal to Heaven comes before being released, and Wukong isn't actually weakened by his time under Five Phases Mountain (IIRC)

Neutral to this, more people agreed to it than disagreed.

While I think Wukong is a genius, he is not an Extraordinary Genius.

Neutral, since it was accepted. If anyone else has issues with it they should speak up about it.

The Buddha isn't Dharmakaya. The scans in the JTTW cosmology blog do not say this either.

They say "Mind is the Buddha and the Buddha is Mind; Both Mind and Buddha are important things. If you perceive there's neither Mind nor Thing (Buddha), Yours is the Dharmakaya of True Mind."

This is stating that when you remove the division between the Buddha and Mind and see both as nothingness, you achieve the Highest Enlightenment of the Dharmakaya.

I'll edit that since a Dharma Bodied Buddha is as you said not a different thing.

 

[Udlmaster]

Neutral, since it was accepted. If anyone else has issues with it they should speak up about it.

I'm not entirely sure what would make him Extraordinary Genius, he's very talented and combat smart, but we aren't going to be giving Goku Extraordinary Genius now, are we?

His best intelligence feat before he becomes a Buddha to my knowledge is him mastering Daoist Immortality in a short time, which is extremely impressive, but not Extraordinary Genius level, just Genius.

For example, Wukong's intellect doesn't exceed the peak of Humanities, as he was very easily tricked by Xuanzang relatively early into the Book.

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

I'm not entirely sure what would make him Extraordinary Genius, he's very talented and combat smart, but we aren't going to be giving Goku Extraordinary Genius now, are we?

His best intelligence feat before he becomes a Buddha to my knowledge is him mastering Daoist Immortality in a short time, which is extremely impressive, but not Extraordinary Genius level, just Genius.

For example, Wukong's intellect doesn't exceed the peak of Humanities, as he was very easily tricked by Xuanzang relatively early into the Book.

Fair point. As for The Great Way and Dharma separation I'll go through that in a bit to make the distinction.

 

[Udlmaster]

Fair point. As for The Great Way and Dharma separation I'll go through that in a bit to make the distinction.

I mean mostly, it's a nitpick, but it does change the way we scale things.

Because it means Buddha preaches the way to go beyond the Dao and sees it as nothing, and the Dao is the origins of Yin and Yang.

 

[Elizhaa]

It's doesn't seem to be Extraordinary genius, looking back; genius seems fairer. I am fine with other updates. For the sealing key, I am somewhat neutral on the new points but I think supporting scans should be provided for better judgment.

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

I mean mostly, it's a nitpick, but it does change the way we scale things.

Because it means Buddha preaches the way to go beyond the Dao and sees it as nothing, and the Dao is the origins of Yin and Yang.

True, but still good to correct it. Anything else I should take note of?

 

[Jasonsith]

I'm not entirely sure what would make him Extraordinary Genius, he's very talented and combat smart, but we aren't going to be giving Goku Extraordinary Genius now, are we?

His best intelligence feat before he becomes a Buddha to my knowledge is him mastering Daoist Immortality in a short time, which is extremely impressive, but not Extraordinary Genius level, just Genius.

For example, Wukong's intellect doesn't exceed the peak of Humanities, as he was very easily tricked by Xuanzang relatively early into the Book.

Well Kenshiro IS extraordinary genius under his profile for learning how to fight and use pressure point magic really well. He mastered some new technique a very few can master or counter.

Kenshiro (Hokuto no Ken)

Kenshiro (拳けん士し郎ろう, Kenshirō?) is the protagonist of the Hokuto no Ken franchise, the 64th successor of the Hokuto Shinken style of martial arts, and the greatest of all of them in its 1,800 years. Originally an orphan from Taiseiden, Asura, and a descendant of the Hokuto Sōke bloodline, he was...

vsbattles.fandom.com

Wonder if that changes how we view things.

 

[Udlmaster]

Some of the

Well Kenshiro IS extraordinary genius under his profile for learning how to fight and use pressure point magic really well. He mastered some new technique a very few can master or counter.

Kenshiro (Hokuto no Ken)

Kenshiro (拳けん士し郎ろう, Kenshirō?) is the protagonist of the Hokuto no Ken franchise, the 64th successor of the Hokuto Shinken style of martial arts, and the greatest of all of them in its 1,800 years. Originally an orphan from Taiseiden, Asura, and a descendant of the Hokuto Sōke bloodline, he was...

vsbattles.fandom.com

Wonder if that changes how we view things.

I imagine then that rating is incorrect, for example, Goku has many similar feats, such as instantly copying techniques after seeing them once, and he is far from an Extraordinary genius.

Intellect and Combat prowess aren't the same thing, as you can be a total brainlet and still have Masterful Martial Arts.

Like, I'm pretty sure Haki did that, where they got a Neanderthal from Amber or Ice and he was like a God of Martial arts and stomped out everyone despite being incredibly stupid.

The requirements for Intellect are:

"Individuals whose knowledge spreads over many fields of science and who vastly surpass the intellects of the smartest humans on Earth. At this level, many are capable of creating futuristic technology, executing complex strategies even under high pressure, and potentially even accurately predicting the future through sheer mental calculations, or outperforming supercomputers. This is where super scientists of exceptional scientific knowledge begin to appear."

Which isn't something that Kenshiro would fit into.

 

[Hagane_no_Saiyajin]

Sun Wukong feat in a nutshell:



Also, would have happened if he did win his bet against Buddha?

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

Well luckily even with The Great Way and the Dharma being separate scaling doesn't really change due to other supporting scans.

Also, would have happened if he did win his bet against Buddha?

He would have taken the throne from the Jade Emperor. Of course him winning was impossible.

 

[Udlmaster]

Also, would have happened if he did win his bet against Buddha?

The result would have likely been the same.

Wukong loses.

The trick to Buddha's gamble was that, in order to beat Siddhartha Gautama, you'd have to see the world as a Buddha, so that the World is nothingness and you have left it behind, stopped moving entirely.

And in such a case, Wukong would realize the futility of what he's doing, and how he doesn't want nor deserve the Throne of the Jade Emperor and would have joined the Buddha and leave Heaven to recover.

 

[Antvasima]

Well Kenshiro IS extraordinary genius under his profile for learning how to fight and use pressure point magic really well. He mastered some new technique a very few can master or counter.

Kenshiro (Hokuto no Ken)

Kenshiro (拳けん士し郎ろう, Kenshirō?) is the protagonist of the Hokuto no Ken franchise, the 64th successor of the Hokuto Shinken style of martial arts, and the greatest of all of them in its 1,800 years. Originally an orphan from Taiseiden, Asura, and a descendant of the Hokuto Sōke bloodline, he was...

vsbattles.fandom.com

Wonder if that changes how we view things.

Well, the sum totality of everything listed in his intelligence section did seem to place him a bit beyond regular upper border human limits, but maybe "Genius in martial arts" would have been better?

 

[Hagane_no_Saiyajin]

Which isn't something that Kenshiro would fit into.

Alphys or W.D. Gaster fit better into the Extraordinary Genius category

Although Wukong does have the intelligence feat of learning and practicing toaist immortality which usually take millions of years to learn (with the Jade Emperor taking 9.6 billion years to learn) but it only took him, what was it? a couple of decades or was it centuries?

 

[Antvasima]

Alphys or W.D. Gaster fit better into the Extraordinary Genius category

Although Wukong does have the intelligence feat of learning and practicing toaist immortality which usually take millions of years to learn (with the Jade Emperor taking 9.6 billion years to learn) but it only took him what was it a couple of decades or was it centuries?

That does seem like an Extraordinary Genius feat, yes.

 

[Udlmaster]

True, but still good to correct it. Anything else I should take note of?

Gotta ask, why is the Buddha’s word being used for the possibly section?

Shouldn’t that just be flat out confirmation?

 

[Udlmaster]

Alphys or W.D. Gaster fit better into the Extraordinary Genius category

Although Wukong does have the intelligence feat of learning and practicing toaist immortality which usually take millions of years to learn (with the Jade Emperor taking 9.6 billion years to learn) but it only took him what was it a couple of decades or was it centuries?

No, that’s not what happened with the Jade Emperor.

The Jade Emperor mastered Daoist Immortality practically immediately, he's beyond protege for Daoist practices, literally being an avatar of Yuanshi Tianzun, the Manifestation of the Dao. He didn't reincarnate and continue to practice Daoism in each life for that length of time, he just sat in a cave and cultivated the Dao as the same entity that entire time.

The Jade Emperor spent millions to Billions of years cultivating because cultivation of the Dao is what gives a person their power. In a very stripped down sense, he was stockpiling power until he became the strongest entity within Reality and Heaven (not including the Pure Heavens).

In JTTW, Buddha actually points out that the Jade Emperor practically has limitless Dao and would have crushed Wukong if he had taken up arms against him.

 

[Hagane_no_Saiyajin]

Jade Emperor mastered Daoist Immortality practically immediately, he's beyond protege for Daoist practices, literally being an avatar of Yuanshi Tianzun

Okay, maybe the Jade emperor isn't the best example, are there any more examples of how long it took to learn Daoist immortality?

 

[ActuallySpaceMan42]

Gotta ask, why is the Buddha’s word being used for the possibly section?

Shouldn’t that just be flat out confirmation?

I guess it should be most lkely, I only have it at possibly because of how vague the statement is. We don't know how he's moving them, how far he can move them, etc.