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Killer said he WAS the concept of war, not that he fought said concept.
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Ji Ning vs Aatrox
- Thread starter XDragnoir
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I can repost the skill chain Aatrox scales above if need be but to sum it up he fought a thousand year war against an army of Voidspawn that adapt and develop new abilities in seconds and adapt new concepts by existing as well as fought and beat Pantheon (the concept of martial combat and warfare), who himself scales in skill above the likes of Hecarim (Who is a master of every form of martial combat and warfare that exists), Wukong (Who in a few minutes learned the Wuju martial art to a master degree despite using a bo staff as a weapon when Wuju is an exclusively sword-based fighting style that even the most skilled practitioners needed a lifetime to master), and Lee Sin (Who is a master of all Ionian martial arts among other things). Aatrox also scales above the likes of Renekton, a demigod who was used as a one-man army in Shurima and who fought against Xerath, another demigod, for several thousand years straight despite Xerath's power constantly growing over time.
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Depends on how far he can BFR to, Aatrox's attacks have interstellar range and can kill beings that exist in other realms and higher dimensions
If Aatrox hits him with any of his attacks his concept gets killed on a 4-D (Soon to be 6 to 9-D) level
Doesnt need to, Aatrox can force him to come in contact with the blade
How potent is Ji's deconstruction? Aatrox should have a resistance to decon as well from his void resistances (deconstruction didnt exist when that was made), ie. just being near Void rifts causes matter to break down and disintegrate.
He sorta just swings his sword
Definitely going to need a scan for that, Aatrox is near the top of the LoL skill chain with LoL as a verse being one of the most skilled on the entire wiki (Aatrox literally outskilled Garou in a thread before lol). Aatrox spent a millennia fighting an army of Voidspawn that adapt and develop new abilities in seconds and adapt new concepts by existing
His power null is tied into his concept killing, by killing a concept he effectively permanently nullifies the effects and abilities that concept granted to wielders of it, like if he kills the concept of fire, all fire stops existing throughout all of history and throughout the entire multiverse, as do all fire-based abilities. Basically its power null via conceptual erasure.
ShionAH
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Is master yi the most skilled in lol?
ShionAH
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Bro killed their debates
I would like to help you with lol pages btw like Amumus page is the worst one right now he should have death hax on concept levels and on kindreds level
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So, basically what Ning did with the Empyrean God level Demons, only they massively upscale in their understanding from weaker cultivators who can comprehend Daos in a similar manner. Much less Ning himself being able to do the same.
Not a quantifiable skill feat. By that logic, Ning connecting to the Prime Essence of the Sword would give him 7-D skill, which we both know is nonsensical.
Decent but people far, far less skilled than Ning have mastered combat Daos that give them the same proficiency (The Sword, The Saber, Archery etc.)
Ning went from amateur to Dao Domain level in Archery with one session of practice. For reference, it's the same skill jump as from his 1st to 2nd key. And this was a far less skilled Ning than the key being used here.
One man army stuff is Ning's bread and butter, as the Nihilum Zone and Undermoon Lake has showcased.
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Nah, that would be Jax. In terms of raw martial skill it goes:
Jax > Yone > Fiora/Yasuo/Master Yi/Irelia/Leona/Diana/Pantheon/Aatrox/Renekton > Wukong/Lee Sin/Udyr/Hecarim > Shen/Zed/Xayah/Rakan/Camille > Akali/Kayn > Xin Zhao/Poppy/Samira/Akshan > Jarvan IV, Garen, Katarina, Talon, Darius, Draven, Riven, Sylas > Pyke, Illaoi, Jayce, Vi, Ekko, Sett, Rengar, Gangplank, Braum, Sejuani, Olaf, Tryndamere
ShionAH
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Oh yeah jax but I think yi is second more than Yone
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The Voidspawn feat is kinda cool, but you know that if you kill them quickly they simply can't adapt, right? And given most of them aren't as strong as Aatrox, i bet he didn't actually need to show a lot of skill in the fight.
Beating Pantheon doesn't mean much towards skill unless the characters Pantheon scales above are skilled, and well:
Given that LoL takes places in a different universe than your own, you will have to explain a bit more what this means.
Nice learning speed feat + bo mastery feat.
That doesn't explain much, kinda like Hecarim's feat.
This isn't a skill feat.
Like, i am waiting for Jax's feats cause i know that guy is skilled, but beyond the fact he should have mastery over 100+ weapons i don't really know much about his fighting skills.
ShionAH
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I think he was the only fighter who was able to literally beat an ascended via pure skill
ShionAH
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Pantheon is pretty skilled but I don't know the scans lol but I do know he is pretty up there
ShionAH
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Pantheons skill: As a member of the Rakkor Tribe Atreus was trained since early childhood in combat, and though he was never recognized as the most skilled of the Rakkor nonetheless he achieved an exceedingly high level of combat skill, his every movement in combat flowing smoothly like liquid, each attack he makes done with the utmost efficiency and each meant as a killing blow. After taking the mantle of the Celestial Pantheon, an entity who embodies the abstract concept of war, Atreus' skill grew to the point that he was able to tie beings such as Aatrox in single combat
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He should be able to cover minor worlds, which are pocket dimension bubbles but I guess it wouldn't matter to his attacks. That aside, he'd still need to get back to the fight in question in 24 hours.
Noted.
And Ning can avoid it. Seriously, that's what "he can make Ning touch it" meant?
Dust and honestly, I'd much rather have that added first.
The one thing Ning ain't worried about then lol.
It's on his Empyrean God tab. Either his powers or feats section. Because I actually complete my profiles. Beating Garou doesn't mean anything here.
And he kills via swinging his sword at the target or?
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Yasuo is the only swordsman in a century who was able to master the Wind Technique, which is a sword style that works by making cuts and thrusts so precise with your sword that you directly manipulate wind currents to the point of being able to create tornadoes with a swing of your sword, and despite being completely nonmagical it is indistinguishable from actual magic. Yasuo is more skilled than Master Yi, who has dozens of years of experience in the art of Wuju, and even before Yi mastered Wuju he was considered one of the most skilled practitioners of the martial art. Wuju Style requires an immense amount of patience and strategy, centered around analyzing the opponent for any openings or weaknesses before killing them with a single cut. Yi has been described as never attacking until landing a strike on his opponent was absolutely guaranteed. Master Yi is more skilled than Lee Sin, a master of all of Ionia's martial arts who is able to fight completely blind just by using his hearing, and just by listening to the movement and breathing of three men was able to determine that one had the early symptoms of lung disease, one had a weak heart that would give out in less than a year, and one had an injured spine that forced him to walk slightly more on his left side.
Lee Sin is more skilled than Shen, a master ninja who has been trained since childhood in the art of ninjutsu in and combat analysis in order to take up the mantle of the Eye of Twilight. Everything that his students Akali and Kennen can do, he can do better, as well as having the ability to automatically react to attacks due to his energy in the spirit realm protecting his body in the physical realm by automatically making him dodge even if he isnt aware of an incoming attack. His skill in combat analysis is such that, while in a crowded, busy ballroom, Shen was able to instantly deduce that his target was half a finger length too far way for him to be able to attack the moment he saw him, despite the latter being in a disguise and a master of stealth attempting to avoid detection.
Shen is more skilled than Akali, a master assassin, having been trained to kill since the moment she was able to walk. Having been personally trained to use shurikens by Kennen, personally trained in the ninja arts, stealth, and subterfuge by Shen, as well as developing her own fighting style of emphasizing speed and agility over strength and becoming a master of the kama and kunai. Her skill is so great that she succeeded her mother as the Fist of Shadow when she was only a teenager, and despite not possessing any innate supernatural abilities like Shen and Kennen she was considered just as deadly as them. She has knowledge of over 300 pressure points on the human body and how to exploit all of them, and can do so offhandedly from across a room that is obscured with a thick smokescreen.
Akali is more skilled than Xin Zhao, a master spear wielder, world renowned for having never lost a one-on-one fight in his life. Hyper-analytical and hyper-observant, even at an early age his skill with a spear was quickly noticed by the Noxian commander who owned him, earning him a spot as a Reckoner due to his martial prowess and rapidly elevating him to fame in gladiatorial combat. On the battlefield Xin Zhao's skill only shined brighter, having singlehandedly killed several hundred Demacian soldiers and only being halted by an entire battalion of the Dauntless Vanguard engaging him all at once, with many of the members of the Vanguard were silently impressed by his skill. He is also highly skilled in hand to hand combat, having disarmed and incapacitated two of King Jarvan III's personal guard, who by his own admission had undergone decades of brutal training to reach their positions, as well as Sword Captain Tianna Crownguard, the leader of the Dauntless Vanguard, as a demonstration of his skill. After becoming Jarvan III's seneschal he achieved feats such as fighting through an army of Freljordian warriors several hundred strong with only Jarvan III as backup and mastering wielding Drakebane, an ancient lance so lethal to wield that in unskilled hands it was as deadly to its wielder as to the enemy, with no prior knowledge of how to wield it as the secrets of how to fight with it had been lost for centuries, and later going on to train Jarvan IV to wield it at a master level. He has also shown a high level of proficiency in dual wielding, able to casually avoid and parry the attacks of an enraged Jarvan IV while wielding a spear and a dulled training sword.
Xin Zhao is more skilled than Jarvan IV, a highly intelligent individual, having been given the finest Demacian education available since he was a child, learning from Demacia's finest historical scholars and tutored in the ways of ruling a kingdom, as well as being personally tutored in the history and politics of Valoran by Xin Zhao, who also taught him about the world’s more spiritual philosophies, as well as the myriad arts of war. He is skilled with a variety of weapons, though his preferred is his lance Drakebane, an ancient lance so lethal to wield that in unskilled hands it was as deadly to its wielder as to the enemy, which he wields with the skill of a master, with even Xin Zhao, his mentor who taught him everything he knew about how to wield the lance in the first place and who had been training in the use of pole-arms and other similar weaponry and who learned how to wield Drakebane from scratch, acknowledging that Jarvan's skill with the weapon far exceeded his own. At the age of 18 Jarvan was awarded the honorary rank of general, leading him to pursue a career on the battlefield, securing numerous victories and quickly growing a respectable reputation as a general, leading from the front lines and able to rally his troops even against impossible odds, such as his small, exhausted, and injured battalion which had barely survived a Noxian ambush going on to help Shyvana kill her mother, a fire elemental dragon.
Jarvan is more skilled than Garen, a highly skilled combatant and strategist, widely considered to be one of the greatest swordsmen in Demacia, having trained non-stop from the age of twelve in the art of combat and war and quickly gaining a fearsome reputation on the battlefield. By the time he turned eighteen he had already served in multiple campaigns, fighting off Freljordian barbarians, mages, and the Noxian military, which granted him a nomination as a member of the Dauntless Vanguard, a position he won with ease through his sheer courage and skill. His skill was so well recognized by the rest of the Vanguard that of the over two thousand members [each being a legendary hero in their own right, the most skilled and well trained soldiers in Demacia, masters of multiple weapons, and boasting extensive knowledge of battle tactics and warfare on top of having accomplished extraordinary feats such as singlehandedly slaying dragons and wyrms, outmatching entire hosts of the Trifarian Legion, and being able to take on entire armies on their own and emerge victorious] he was chosen to be the new Sword-Captain after the previous leader had died, a decision that was unopposed by any member of the Vanguard. As a member of the Dauntless Vanguard, Garen is a master of battlefield strategy, able to communicate entire combat plans to other members of the Vanguard through nothing but subtle eye and facial movements, as well as perceive other members' strategies given in the same manner through just peripheral vision, and doing so at a speed described as blindingly fast by people less trained than them. He is also hyper-observant, as all members of the Vanguard are required to master the art of observation of every aspect of the battlefield as well as potential changes that could be made both within and outside of their line of sight at any given moment and identify what their enemy is observing and how they can potentially advance.
Garen is more skilled than the Trifarian Legion, the elite Noxian military force and the most prestigious warriors the empire could produce, and that hold a reputation known throughout Valoran, even among those who had never fought beside or against them, and are so feared that just two legionaries could take over an entire city. Each member of the Legion is personally trained by Darius, a highly skilled military strategist and combatant whose his fearsome notoriety is so widely recognized even in the lands beyond Noxus that it is not uncommon for entire cities to surrender at the first sight of his banners. Having served in the Noxian warhost since he was 12, Darius has spent most of his life fighting in numerous grueling campaigns of conquest from one end of the known world to the other, as well as crushing a number of rebellions against the throne. As he rose steadily through the ranks he garnered a great respect for his aggression, discipline, and refusal to ever take a backward step, even going so far as beheading a Noxian general after he ordered a retreat, rallying the scattered warbands and winning a great and unexpected victory against a far more numerous foe.
Aatrox scales above everyone on this list
Lee Sin is more skilled than Shen, a master ninja who has been trained since childhood in the art of ninjutsu in and combat analysis in order to take up the mantle of the Eye of Twilight. Everything that his students Akali and Kennen can do, he can do better, as well as having the ability to automatically react to attacks due to his energy in the spirit realm protecting his body in the physical realm by automatically making him dodge even if he isnt aware of an incoming attack. His skill in combat analysis is such that, while in a crowded, busy ballroom, Shen was able to instantly deduce that his target was half a finger length too far way for him to be able to attack the moment he saw him, despite the latter being in a disguise and a master of stealth attempting to avoid detection.
Shen is more skilled than Akali, a master assassin, having been trained to kill since the moment she was able to walk. Having been personally trained to use shurikens by Kennen, personally trained in the ninja arts, stealth, and subterfuge by Shen, as well as developing her own fighting style of emphasizing speed and agility over strength and becoming a master of the kama and kunai. Her skill is so great that she succeeded her mother as the Fist of Shadow when she was only a teenager, and despite not possessing any innate supernatural abilities like Shen and Kennen she was considered just as deadly as them. She has knowledge of over 300 pressure points on the human body and how to exploit all of them, and can do so offhandedly from across a room that is obscured with a thick smokescreen.
Akali is more skilled than Xin Zhao, a master spear wielder, world renowned for having never lost a one-on-one fight in his life. Hyper-analytical and hyper-observant, even at an early age his skill with a spear was quickly noticed by the Noxian commander who owned him, earning him a spot as a Reckoner due to his martial prowess and rapidly elevating him to fame in gladiatorial combat. On the battlefield Xin Zhao's skill only shined brighter, having singlehandedly killed several hundred Demacian soldiers and only being halted by an entire battalion of the Dauntless Vanguard engaging him all at once, with many of the members of the Vanguard were silently impressed by his skill. He is also highly skilled in hand to hand combat, having disarmed and incapacitated two of King Jarvan III's personal guard, who by his own admission had undergone decades of brutal training to reach their positions, as well as Sword Captain Tianna Crownguard, the leader of the Dauntless Vanguard, as a demonstration of his skill. After becoming Jarvan III's seneschal he achieved feats such as fighting through an army of Freljordian warriors several hundred strong with only Jarvan III as backup and mastering wielding Drakebane, an ancient lance so lethal to wield that in unskilled hands it was as deadly to its wielder as to the enemy, with no prior knowledge of how to wield it as the secrets of how to fight with it had been lost for centuries, and later going on to train Jarvan IV to wield it at a master level. He has also shown a high level of proficiency in dual wielding, able to casually avoid and parry the attacks of an enraged Jarvan IV while wielding a spear and a dulled training sword.
Xin Zhao is more skilled than Jarvan IV, a highly intelligent individual, having been given the finest Demacian education available since he was a child, learning from Demacia's finest historical scholars and tutored in the ways of ruling a kingdom, as well as being personally tutored in the history and politics of Valoran by Xin Zhao, who also taught him about the world’s more spiritual philosophies, as well as the myriad arts of war. He is skilled with a variety of weapons, though his preferred is his lance Drakebane, an ancient lance so lethal to wield that in unskilled hands it was as deadly to its wielder as to the enemy, which he wields with the skill of a master, with even Xin Zhao, his mentor who taught him everything he knew about how to wield the lance in the first place and who had been training in the use of pole-arms and other similar weaponry and who learned how to wield Drakebane from scratch, acknowledging that Jarvan's skill with the weapon far exceeded his own. At the age of 18 Jarvan was awarded the honorary rank of general, leading him to pursue a career on the battlefield, securing numerous victories and quickly growing a respectable reputation as a general, leading from the front lines and able to rally his troops even against impossible odds, such as his small, exhausted, and injured battalion which had barely survived a Noxian ambush going on to help Shyvana kill her mother, a fire elemental dragon.
Jarvan is more skilled than Garen, a highly skilled combatant and strategist, widely considered to be one of the greatest swordsmen in Demacia, having trained non-stop from the age of twelve in the art of combat and war and quickly gaining a fearsome reputation on the battlefield. By the time he turned eighteen he had already served in multiple campaigns, fighting off Freljordian barbarians, mages, and the Noxian military, which granted him a nomination as a member of the Dauntless Vanguard, a position he won with ease through his sheer courage and skill. His skill was so well recognized by the rest of the Vanguard that of the over two thousand members [each being a legendary hero in their own right, the most skilled and well trained soldiers in Demacia, masters of multiple weapons, and boasting extensive knowledge of battle tactics and warfare on top of having accomplished extraordinary feats such as singlehandedly slaying dragons and wyrms, outmatching entire hosts of the Trifarian Legion, and being able to take on entire armies on their own and emerge victorious] he was chosen to be the new Sword-Captain after the previous leader had died, a decision that was unopposed by any member of the Vanguard. As a member of the Dauntless Vanguard, Garen is a master of battlefield strategy, able to communicate entire combat plans to other members of the Vanguard through nothing but subtle eye and facial movements, as well as perceive other members' strategies given in the same manner through just peripheral vision, and doing so at a speed described as blindingly fast by people less trained than them. He is also hyper-observant, as all members of the Vanguard are required to master the art of observation of every aspect of the battlefield as well as potential changes that could be made both within and outside of their line of sight at any given moment and identify what their enemy is observing and how they can potentially advance.
Garen is more skilled than the Trifarian Legion, the elite Noxian military force and the most prestigious warriors the empire could produce, and that hold a reputation known throughout Valoran, even among those who had never fought beside or against them, and are so feared that just two legionaries could take over an entire city. Each member of the Legion is personally trained by Darius, a highly skilled military strategist and combatant whose his fearsome notoriety is so widely recognized even in the lands beyond Noxus that it is not uncommon for entire cities to surrender at the first sight of his banners. Having served in the Noxian warhost since he was 12, Darius has spent most of his life fighting in numerous grueling campaigns of conquest from one end of the known world to the other, as well as crushing a number of rebellions against the throne. As he rose steadily through the ranks he garnered a great respect for his aggression, discipline, and refusal to ever take a backward step, even going so far as beheading a Noxian general after he ordered a retreat, rallying the scattered warbands and winning a great and unexpected victory against a far more numerous foe.
Aatrox scales above everyone on this list
ShionAH
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limited mind hax I think
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Question, why Noxus and Ionia still fight wars if he killed Pantheon then?
ShionAH
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"Aatrox killed god but now...now he is against a MAN."
Pantheon did NOT die.
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Because Atreus quite literally willed the concept of war back into existence
ShionAH
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you posted it twice btw
ShionAH
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also what do you think amumus hax should be? Death hax on conceptual level or kindreds level in other words
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Not sure but this isnt really the thread to discuss that
ShionAH
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Yeah sorry I was just curious
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Aatrox is just skill scaled, he has no skills of his own. Same scaling could be made for Ji Ning but with even more characters from within his novel.
While Ji Ning has "skills" done by himself thanks to his own mastery and comprehension of martial and sword arts.
While Ji Ning has "skills" done by himself thanks to his own mastery and comprehension of martial and sword arts.
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I'd ask for jus a few more minutes, still responding to some stuff and would like clarification on a few things before votes start getting cast if thats alright
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What? Even if Aatrox is more skilled, which isn't as clear as you're implying it is, Ning has powers beyond his skill to allow him to win a CqC fight.
Ning has a danger sense to tell him the sword is dangerous and he can't touch it as well as a 360° vision, so that he doesn't have any blind spots.
He can also create several barriers to block any attacks, and he has long range powers to keep his distance.
Also, Conceptual lock.
ShionAH
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Aatrox is more skilled and it seems pretty clear to me
Uh I never said anything about the sword? I think sword needs a limited mind hax btw. Aatrox landing a hit is still very much possible via the skill difference
Non-Physical Interaction
No idea what that is
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Would you be able to clarify a bit more on this? Im unfamiliar with the verse.
Skill Chain i posted below clarifies this
Nice, then it would balance out a bit as Hecarim is far less skilled than Aatrox, though what is a Daos exactly?
Same as Hecarim, Wukong is far less skilled than Aatrox
Hmm, that would be an issue, i dont recall Aatrox having anything that would let him come back from that...
This is a conundrum, would it be incon in a case like this? If one character BFRs the other but that character kills them from the place theyre BFRed to bu cant come back?
Pretty much what the video clip showed, if he's reduced to just his sword body he can actively move to another target (either someone in the area if SBA is in effect or to Ji himself) and if they come in contact with the weapon he possesses them.
Fair, though would scans suffice? Because technically it is on there already (the matter manip and absorption covers it as like i said deconstruction didnt exist back then).
Why so?
Hey come on, it was a complete profile for the time it was made : T
Aye, that or with his sword beams which have the same effect
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All Void Fiengods have enough comprehension to instantly master lesser Daos and basically reach Ning's 2nd key levels of skill. The army he fought for a century all had demons that vastly surpassed this.
Noted I guess?
Aspect of reality and concept of the universe. From something as mundane as ink to something like space, time, infinity etc. Even combat paths like swordsmanship, archery and use of spears fall under this.
On the condition they kill him, maybe.
And Ning won't let that happen. Between skill, caution and precognition, he'll avoid it with little issue. Or just nuke the sword come to think of it. Ning has a oneshot worthy AP advantage.
I suppose.
The aformentioned skill debate and his agility. He was capable of dodging several thousand arrows that were faster than him as a 4 year old and at the age of 10 could block raindrops from touching him via swordplay.
I see.
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I mean, going by the lore bits from the other Celestials and Targonian Aspects, who are all comparable to Aatrox, the Voidborn get very strong very, very quickly. Hell in one of Diana's stories a newborn Voidspawn nearly tore off one of her arms, with Diana being able to match Pantheon in power.
The skill list clarifies it a bit better, but i can try to grab specifics if youd like.
Curious if Aatrox's ability to jut spawn chains on his opponent that restrict their movement would do anything
I mean, Aatrox has ranged abilities as well so that wouldnt matter too much
What does that do?
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Ning teleports or just turns into wind or an elemental form to leave that.
He uses conceptual manipulation to lock space and prevent even thought based powers.
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I see, so its a tossup between that and Aatrox's war against the void (Voidborn do the same thing as the demons but they dont do it instantly, but Aatrox fought them for 10x as long and they were constantly absorbing new information the entire time he fought them)
Gotcha
Definitely one of the weirder instances of an incon ive seen lol
The sword has at least universe level durability
Every demacian soldier is able to do that arrow feat and theyre fodder for basically anyone marginally more skilled in the list i posted. Even Darius can solo an entire army of them.
Teleportation would work, turning into wind/elemental form not so much as Aatrox's stuff works on guys like Xerath who are just pure nonphysical energy as well as Janna who can turn into wind
Hmm, does he lead with this?
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So, an even feat then.
There is nothing like that on the profile but assuming it's true, does it resist deconstruction anyway?
I think you forget that this was a 4 year old Ji Ning. Who was complete fodder level. Like, scaled essentially below everyone in the setting at the time.
Noted then.
On at least 2-3 separate occasions, yes. The only time he doesn't is against opponents that he knows beforehand will resist it.
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Pretty much yeah
Huh, for some reason its listed in the immortality section but not the durability section, i'll have to fix that when i revise his page, my bad. But yeah it does, the sword has the same properties as Aatrox's host bodies as the sword itself is Aatrox.
Oh i know, both 4 year old Ji and basic ass Demacian soldiers are fodder level that scale below everyone.
Aight, because Aatrox doesnt really have any way around that, if he were manipulating Aatrox's concept directly he would but not just manipulating concepts around him
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Outliving a universe isn't a durability feat...
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