IVE GOT ANOTHER CHILD I NEED TO MAKE INTO A CORPSE | Bill Cipher vs Sora | 2-8-0 (um grace? Idk)

[Brogeefrong]

Yeah but Bill basically never does that, he only messed with prestons face once

Does all of Bill's transmutation also do Biology stuff?

Tbh none of those actually do anything that helps here since Sora is a shitty character who resists most of the lethal stuff

there is causality and law manipulation, and sora's own type 4 is more just making a type 4 timeline
also since that bill's plot manipulation is listed as only likely non combat applicable can i allow it

 

[ShionAH]

Does all of Bill's transmutation also do Biology stuff?

Not all

there is causality and law manipulation

never used in combat

also since that bill's plot manipulation is listed as only likely non combat applicable can i allow it

no

 

[Bobsican]

Tbh none of those actually do anything that helps here since Sora is a shitty character who resists most of the lethal stuff

Whoa there, no character bashing, surprisingly Sora is far from a Gary Stu as he can struggle from time to time, and he can't always just save everyone.
The series just has that much power creep.

 

[Brogeefrong]

never used in combat

it affected reality as a whole, wouldnt Sora be affected by reality being screwed with

 

[Undylan]

Whoa there, no character bashing, surprisingly Sora is far from a Gary Stu as he can struggle from time to time, and he can't always just save everyone.
The series just has that much power creep.

Also kept losing his power by the start of almost every main game and wasn't meant to be the Chosen One.

Just a guy thrown into a mess and made the best out of it.

 

[Bobsican]

Sora can manipulate reality itself as a whole with the X-Blade

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

lmao even ford can come back from getting transmuted by bill
worst transmutation user ever

First one was Bill cancelling transmutation by himself, second one was a chain reaction that took out Petrification from everyone.

 

[Brogeefrong]

Sora can manipulate reality itself as a whole with the X-Blade

Could he resist Causality/Law Manipulation

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Bill used biology based transmutation on Preston that ONE TIME and now you are glazing that scene one scene
Bill is NOT using bio transmutation as a first move, there are way too many scenes of Bill using the transmutation sora has resistance to
Bill is washed

It is literally his first transmutation move in the series..?

 

[Bobsican]

Could he resist Causality/Law Manipulation

This is a field effect, it doesn't directly target him, regardless this is listed on the page as capping at tier 2 given how it's explained, while Sora's does reach 5-D.

 

[ShionAH]

This is a field effect, it doesn't directly target him, regardless this is listed on the page as capping at tier 2 given how it's explained, while Sora's does reach 5-D.

You are right it really would not help Bill but no Weirdmageddon on its own is 5D with 12D Range at the very least

 

[Bobsican]

Ahem, "possibly 12-D", there's no in-between as going with that end would just make Bill 1-B here.

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Ahem, "possibly 12-D", there's no in-between as going with that end would just make Bill 1-B here.

12D Range regardless of whether it is applicable to a tier. Being able to affect 12D does not automatically scale you to 1-B on this wiki.

 

[ShionAH]

I am gonna be honest, I am not sure how the Tier 1 was accepted but from what I remember 12D stuff are fully accepted but Bill scaling them through AP is possibly. Though I am not sure so I'll concede.

Anyways this feels like a mismatch or a stomp depending on how the Hearth works

 

[Bobsican]

12D Range regardless of whether it is applicable to a tier. Being able to affect 12D does not automatically scale you to 1-B on this wiki.

Range: Up to Low Complex Multiversal, possibly Hyperversal with abilities

Going by the profile that's simply not the case, either Bill is full 5-D or full 1-B, he's not a smurf.

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

I am gonna be honest, I am not sure how the Tier 1 was accepted but from what I remember 12D stuff are fully accepted but Bill scaling them through AP is possibly. Though I am not sure so I'll concede.

Anyways this feels like a mismatch or a stomp depending on how the Hearth works

It was accepted as possibly because 12D could be equally through String Theory or Brane Cosmology. In first case, it would still be HDE but not Tier-applicable. In the later case, both.

 

[Bobsican]

It not being tier applicable would mean it'd be practically irrelevant, however.

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

It not being tier applicable would mean it'd be practically irrelevant, however.

Range would still be up to 12D, just saying.

 

[Bobsican]

Non-quantitative 12-D, meaning that it can't be used for smurf arguments beyond stuff like BFR.

 

[Brogeefrong]

This is a field effect, it doesn't directly target him, regardless this is listed on the page as capping at tier 2 given how it's explained, while Sora's does reach 5-D.

It still targets reality, which Sora is still in

 

[Bobsican]

My point is that Sora can override it, especially as he scales above baseline 5-D out of also affecting another quantitative 5-D structure at the same time (the Realm of Darkness.

 

[Brogeefrong]

My point is that Sora can override it, especially as he scales above baseline 5-D out of also affecting another quantitative 5-D structure at the same time (the Realm of Darkness.

Can he override it when he's already being affected by weridmageddon?
also does physical form bill start with weridmageddon active

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

also does physical form bill start with weridmageddon active

Yes, otherwise he would not be physical lol.

 

[Bobsican]

Can he override it when he's already being affected by weridmageddon?

He could override cosmological erasure with the X-Blade, so yes.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Yeah but Bill basically never does that, he only messed with prestons face once

Tbh none of those actually do anything that helps here since Sora is a shitty character who resists most of the lethal stuff

Opponent has a clear cut victory
"Yeah, such a shitty character"

Amazing. Sora fra.

 

[ReaperAndBlues]

Kid with giant car keys fra

 

[Brogeefrong]

He could override cosmological erasure with the X-Blade, so yes.

But does the cosmology have any Law or Causality aspects, and Sora doesnt resist those abilities either

 

[ShionAH]

Amazing. Sora fra.

Truth hurts

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Truth hurts

Indeed. Sora wins

 

[AlphaOmegaV1]

But does the cosmology have any Law or Causality aspects, and Sora doesnt resist those abilities either

Since KH3 Sora is being used, he has access to the Power of Waking which grants a bit of Type 4 Acausality among other things. Going with Sora here.

 

[ShionAH]

Indeed. Sora wins

“Ha, I’ve got you with a mischief word twist!” Aah comment

Lets remake with 1-B Bill, then we’ll see who wins

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Truth hurts

Not after 1-B Bill comes in

 

[Bobsican]

But does the cosmology have any Law or Causality aspects, and Sora doesnt resist those abilities either

The cosmology has each world with its own laws, asking whether something has causality is like asking if something has time, which the answer is simply yes per basic cosmological components of a universe.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

Since KH3 Sora is being used, he has access to the Power of Waking which grants a bit of Type 4 Acausality among other things. Going with Sora here.

I believe that's grace

 

[Robo432343]

This is a stomp it can’t be added

 

[Brogeefrong]

Since KH3 Sora is being used, he has access to the Power of Waking which grants a bit of Type 4 Acausality among other things. Going with Sora here.

On the profile it seems like it needs to be activated, and instead just makes a different timeline with different causality

The cosmology has each world with its own laws, asking whether something has causality is like asking if something has time, which the answer is simply yes per basic cosmological components of a universe.

Well he still wouldnt resist it if the Type 4 wont protect him

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Rereading the thread, it indeed looks like a stomp.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

This is a stomp it can’t be added

Opposition seems to be arguing Bill has a chance, so

 

[TheOrangeGuy09]

Opposition seems to be arguing Bill has a chance, so

Well, from what Sora supporting people say, it looks like Sora just resists everything and uses CM1.

 

[LephyrTheRevanchist]

If all Bill supporters agree tis a stomp, I can close it