Italian Man vs Russian Mann (Peppino Spaghetti vs Heavy) (5-3-2)

[koopa3144]

• Fight takes place on the top of the Pizza Tower
• Speed is equalized
• Robot War Heavy is being used
• Heavy has all his equipment except Magic Spells
• Peppino has his Shotgun
• Distance is 15 meters
• SBA for anything else

Italian Man: 5
63593084.8 joules AP 539283944 joules Dara

Russian Mann: 3
275307200 Joules

Incon: 1

 

[Popted2]

Peppino wins because he is from Italy while Heavy is from Russia

Italy>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Russia

 

[StretchSebe]

Speed equalization helps the Heavy out, though I think Peppino still has a lot of advantages.

Peppino has far more acrobatics to control distance. Not sure how the Heavy could deal with a super jump. Considering melee combat, Peppino is probably equal in martial arts skill to the Heavy, though Peppino's max melee range is several meters, and his ability to quickly parry would make things a bit one-sided. I'm also not sure what the Heavy could do against an enraged Peppino (especially fitting occurrence considering they'd be on top of the tower lol).

In defense of the Heavy; Peppino can outrun and parry individual bullets, but an automatic gun like the minigun (and assumedly a gun firing multiple bullets like the shotgun) would be a problem. Like how Peppino would have the advantage in melee despite their equal skill, the Heavy would have an advantage here. In melee, having equal lifting strength (to a pre-rage Peppino) also means Peppino probably couldn't grab him for more devastating melee attacks. Not too much of a game changer, but it would make it harder for Peppino to outright overpower him.

Interested to see what others think given these circumstances though!

 

[koopa3144]

Not sure how the Heavy could deal with a super jump.

I dont think the super jump is gonna be very useful here. All heavy has to do to counter it is aim upwards

'm also not sure what the Heavy could do against an enraged Peppino (especially fitting occurrence considering they'd be on top of the tower lol).

I don't think heavy gonna do anything that enrages Peppino.

 

[koopa3144]

Bump

 

[StretchSebe]

Heyo. Had a bad week, but I'm back.

I dont think the super jump is gonna be very useful here. All heavy has to do to counter it is aim upwards

Heavy's weapons aren't inaccurate, but even his most accurate weapons that aren't accurate at long ranges. Super jump can go pretty far.

I don't think heavy gonna do anything that enrages Peppino.

Come to think of it, I'm not sure what he would do to enrage Peppino either lol

 

[koopa3144]

Heavy's weapons aren't inaccurate, but even his most accurate weapons that aren't accurate at long ranges. Super jump can go pretty far.

I mean the fight takes place on the top of the pizza tower, would Pep just fly into space when using Super jump?

 

[StretchSebe]

I mean the fight takes place on the top of the pizza tower, would Pep just fly into space when using Super jump?

Nah, I'm just saying if a rocket jumping soldier at that range is tough for the Heavy to hit with his weapons, I cannot imagine an unusually athletic italian man who could naturally jump even higher being that much easier to hit.

 

[koopa3144]

Bump

 

[TheGatememer]

You know Heavy hard counters rocket jumping soldiers right

Anyways, don't see what's stopping Heavy from, just, shotting Peppino with his minigun that fires 167 bullets per second. Peppino's durability is only like twice as high as Heavy's AP, and even if only a 4th of the bullets land, that's still around 42 bullets hitting Peppino per second.

 

[StretchSebe]

You know Heavy hard counters rocket jumping soldiers right

Market Gardener soldiers I can absolutely agree heavy hard counters, but heavy hard counters rocket jumping soldiers in general?

Anyways, don't see what's stopping Heavy from, just, shotting Peppino with his minigun that fires 167 bullets per second. Peppino's durability is only like twice as high as Heavy's AP, and even if only a 4th of the bullets land, that's still around 42 bullets hitting Peppino per second.

I do think the minigun would be a problem for Peppino still, but I was offering up the super jump as a thing the Heavy would struggle against too. I'm sure there could be more to a fight between the two than what I initially presented. Would like to see this discussion get more attention.

 

[koopa3144]

Bump

 

[TheGatememer]

Market Gardener soldiers I can absolutely agree heavy hard counters, but heavy hard counters rocket jumping soldiers in general?

Yeah

I do think the minigun would be a problem for Peppino still, but I was offering up the super jump as a thing the Heavy would struggle against too. I'm sure there could be more to a fight between the two than what I initially presented. Would like to see this discussion get more attention.

I mean, like Koopa said, would he just self-BFR himself if he super jumps?

 

[StretchSebe]

Finished my semester, am back to discuss. Apologies in advance for the text dump.

Tryed it at a range some more, and heavy can indeed counter rocket jumping with mini. Could have sworn it was not a good counter given the accuracy. I was gonna say this even if he couldn't counter rocket jumping, but I'd of course be fine using the higher accuracy of an irl mini-gun and shotgun, since both weapons are notoriously much more inaccurate in video games than irl.

I mean, like Koopa said, would he just self-BFR himself if he super jumps?

I didn't think he'd be going that far with the super jump. I just thought he'd be going out of reach for the heavy.

All this said, I've been also meaning to address the shotgun Peppino has, and firearms situation broadly. Finally compared Peppino's shotgun with Heavies fastest shotgun (The Family Business) in a quick draw scenario (even just eyeballing it, Pep's shotgun could fire a few times before the Heavy revs up his minigun). I assume they would draw their guns at the same time (idk if we'd consider Peppino's initial reaction to the shotgun as part of the drawing), and they seem to fire the first shot roughly at the same times. After that first shot, Peppino's is much faster though.

I don't think Peppino's lack of a need to reload would be a relevant advantage, as either would likely kill the other before needing to reload. I do think the ap for Peppino's shotgun being above small building level is relevant though, since the Heavy would need to use his shotgun (which if I'm not mistaken, is weaker than his minigun) to even match it's speed. Both have access to Mid-Low regeneration, but Peppino has that regeneration without the need to use something external, like the Heavy does with his Sandvich.

 

[ShionAH]

Heavy FRA because minigun

 

[koopa3144]

Heavy FRA because minigun

Counted!

 

[StretchSebe]

If we're going to votes, I'd vote for Peppino.

In tiering, base Heavy is at least 9-B in ap/durability, possibly up to 9-A in durability, and ap with minigun.

Base Peppino is roughly around 9-A in ap/durability, up to 9-A+ in ap/durability with mach run and body slam, and his shotgun is also 9-A+ in ap.

This discrepancy in ap/durability, the fact Peppino has a small laundry list of abilities/powers over Heavy he could use to compound this advantage, and for reasons I gave in the thread prior, I just really struggle to see one of my favorite classes coming out on top in most of the possible scenarios of this matchup.

Heavy FRA because minigun

I was hoping to discuss the shotgun situation more, but Peppino would undoubtedly be able to shoot the Heavy 2-3 times with his shotgun before he could rev up his minigun

 

[koopa3144]

If we're going to votes, I'd vote for Peppino.

Counted!

 

[JustANormalLemon]

You know that equalizing speed will not affect anything, right? sinse It will equalize to heavy reaction speed and not movement speed, I think there is no need to equalize speed here

 

[JustANormalLemon]

You know that equalizing speed will not affect anything, right? sinse It will equalize to heavy reaction speed and not movement speed, I think there is no need to equalize speed here

I read their profiles 3 times and didn't notice that pepino is supersonic instead of subsonic

 

[TheGatememer]

Heavy's Minigun takes less than a second to begin shooting, the Tomislav even less so, so I don't think Peppino, even with his mobility could realistically kill Heavy before he gets riddled with hundreds of bullets in just a few seconds.

 

[JustANormalLemon]

Heavy's Minigun takes less than a second to begin shooting, the Tomislav even less so, so I don't think Peppino, even with his mobility could realistically kill Heavy before he gets riddled with hundreds of bullets in just a few seconds.

Ppeppino can parry the bullets to get out of It's shooting line

 

[TheGatememer]

Ppeppino can parry the bullets to get out of It's shooting line

Peppino isn't parrying hundreds of bullets per second, especially under speed equal, and Heavy can easily re-adjust his aim if he moves around.

 

[Shmooply]

Peppino can parry multiple projectiles and redirect them at the same time, but I don't think it's a major wincon for him.

 

[JustANormalLemon]

Peppino isn't parrying hundreds of bullets per second, especially under speed equal, and Heavy can easily re-adjust his aim if he moves around.

I mean, heavy turning speed still downscale here while his minigun is spining

 

[TheGatememer]

I mean, heavy turning speed still downscale here while his minigun is spining

Heavy can turn really fast even with his Minigun

 

[JustANormalLemon]

Heavy can turn really fast even with his Minigun

Still downsale to his reaction speed(and we can't really see how much he actually tuned in the clip)

 

[Shmooply]

and we can't really see how much he actually tuned in the clip

We can.

 

[JustANormalLemon]

We can.

can you say he turned faster them he does in game?

 

[koopa3144]

Bump

 

[StretchSebe]

Bump

 

[StretchSebe]

Totally not another bump but

I assume they would draw their guns at the same time (idk if we'd consider Peppino's initial reaction to the shotgun as part of the drawing), and they seem to fire the first shot roughly at the same times. After that first shot, Peppino's is much faster though.

This is why I say Peppino would shoot the Heavy twice, as he's able to shoot his Shotgun roughly twice in a second. Even with the tomislav reducing the rev to .8 seconds, that's still one Small Building+ Level shotgun shot Heavy is eating before firing a single bullet.

 

[koopa3144]

Bump

 

[koopa3144]

Bump x2

 

[IamMadeOutOfStone]

i say peppino could super jump pretty high and cancel it mid air (yes you can do that in pizza tower), then slam heavy into a pancake

 

[Arceus0x]

Ehh I'd say Peppi via sheer travel speed and his shotgun which scales vastly above his own AP.

 

[koopa3144]

Ehh I'd say Peppi via sheer travel speed and his shotgun which scales vastly above his own AP.

Counted!

 

[IamMadeOutOfStone]

peppino fra

 

[koopa3144]

peppino fra

Counted!

 

[ShionAH]

Ehh I'd say Peppi via sheer travel speed and his shotgun which scales vastly above his own AP.

How is travel speed gonna help? Minigun DPS>>>Shotgun DPS

i say peppino could super jump pretty high and cancel it mid air (yes you can do that in pizza tower), then slam heavy into a pancake

Whats stopping heavy from you know shooting him while he jumps.