Isaac vs Kousuke Endou - Battle for 4th non-smurf 8-B

[deonment]

Lets do this

Isaac:
Endou:
Incon:

 

[deonment]

To start off I will just copy-paste what i posted in the 8-B thread

Anyways on that topic, Isaac for 2nd 8-B, has too much shit for me to mention without needing to specifically bring it up at the moment but the main sticking points are
30+ amps to his already crazy-ass scaling chain above ~18 Tons
Passive AP that is 2 times above the above value and scaling
Passive time slow that slows everything but him down to 80% speed in all aspects
Psy fly which with the soul and censer makes all projectiles null and void
13+ ways for him to res, of which there are even more that are luck-based and multiple with mid-godly levels of res
Has the entirety of this
Too many summons that all massively scale above his own ap with all items
Has the entirety of this too and can use them by just raising his hands, one of which includes historical ee, and he can all use them multiple times
Is intangible though several ways
Has danmaku that would make touhou players cry
Two of any combination of two of these, which all get used multiple times on use
And even more shit that I don't think I need to mention

and I also forgot to put there that he has the finger, which does double his AP in a second and is not affected by the time slow so it does even more damage

 

[Noneless21]

welp, I'm not exactly knowledgable at Arifureta or good at debate but I'll just follow this thread

btw, Kousuke's presence is so thin, even the ancient magic, which is law and limited type 2 concept manip can't detect him so can Isaac detect him?

 

[deonment]

He doesn't need to, his practical carpet bomb of a danmaku can and will just absolutely nuke him without even knowing where he is, this, of course, doesn't take into account that he takes multiple instances of double isaac's ap per second (after all the multipliers) due to finger, and at match start with toxic shock. He also is forced into staying even longer in the aoe of isaac's ap due to passive 80% time slow. And not to mention the entire array of bullshit he has with spacebar items

 

[Noneless21]

he also frequently dodge danmaku in his regular basis, Hajime here can shoot 1000 rounds per minutes for each of his cross bits, and he has about a thousands of those, and he can pretty much dodge all of those

he also got black hole to suck up those projectiles up if needed, and last but not least, he can summon a low 6-B being if very needed to block those attacks

I recommend you to see what bullshit Endou can pull from this thread, Expectro explain it very well on what he can actually do

 

[deonment]

he also frequently dodge danmaku in his regular basis, Hajime here can shoot 1000 rounds per minutes for each of his cross bits, and he has about a thousands of those, and he can pretty much dodge all of those

Isaac makes Touhou danmaku look like baby shit, your best shot at dodging it is literally to be on the atomic scale, look at this and tell me he can dodge isaac spamming this multiple times per second

he also got black hole to suck up those projectiles up if needed, and last but not least, he can summon a low 6-B being if very needed to block those attacks

I mean first of all how fast and through what does he do those, secondly what stops him from dying in 2-3 seconds? he doesn't have a way around the passive damage, which is at a low ball 72 tons worth of damage every second, and in the first 2 seconds, 144 tons, aka one shot

 

[Noneless21]

oh it's automatic, since Hidzuki pretty much know wth is going on to Endou and can go to his side if his life is in danger

do I forgot to tell you that he has a smartphone from another dimension that can resurrect him if needed? If I do forget then there you go

 

[deonment]

oh it's automatic, since Hidzuki pretty much know wth is going on to Endou and can go to his side if his life is in danger

do I forgot to tell you that he has a smartphone from another dimension that can resurrect him if needed? If I do forget then there you go

does it happen in less than a second

I mean if Isaac sees him coming back he raises his hands and does all of this, that, or just keeps spamming tears, which I don't really think they can protect from as they will have multiple ways of bypassing them, through either sheer amount in all directions, multiple aoe explosions, aoe auras that also deal the same damage as the tiers, etc etc etc

 

[Noneless21]

The summoning is indeed instant but since i don't know much bout Endou other than that I'll stop and wait for Expectro to give his analysis

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Isaac don't have a reason to nuke everything do to the simple fact that he can't even know that Kousuke exist, he can't see him even if Kousuke do absolutely nothing in front of him, hell if he somehow could perceive Endou he would forget just forget his existence again while Kousuke still is in front of him without doing nothing, that's Kousuke level of presence even before the beginning of the story, at in each sucessive vol his stealth become stronger and at the end of the main story and in all the after stories his presece become more absurd (an abstract being who existence is based on the conception of be undetectable was so far inferior in natural stealth compared with Kousuke that he was speechless). So no, Isaac isn't going to know that Kousuke even exist so he isn't going to nuke the battlefield (to begin with he can't even nuke the battlefield since his range is tens of meters and they begin at hundreds of meters).

AP wise Isaac can't do anything to Kousuke by the simple fact that 1)Yaya no Hidzuki (which is treated as if she was his stand) passively protect Kousuke from any danger and since she is tier 6 Isaac isn't going to do anything to her or him (he also lack the NPI to see or interact with Hidzuki). 2) Kousuke fight all the time against things tiers above (just considering the end of the main story he was killing hundreds of Apostles who could annihilate him with one-hit), everything from Miledi labyrinth (a place in which he spend a week even before the afterstories when he get his op development) could have killed him, fought against hundreds of Mother soldiers while severely nerfed, hundreds of thousands of apparitions (abstracts beings with uniques powers based on the conception from which they are born), Hajime (who have hundreds-thousands of robots with his same weaponary, which include a similtaneous firing rate of three hundred pencil missiles each second along with a bullet hell and bigger missiles, btw each missile have homing based on heat, biosignatures and soul signatures to always follow their target), Yue and Kaori needed to combine and nuke an entire forest to even deafeat a virtual Kousuke (not even the real Kousuke) and this was before his fight against the dragon, (a gigant dragon which could affect the entire planet with his powers and was constantly affecting Japan with his powers which each second were becoming stronger, who was constantly cursing and showering Kouki with super layered haxs, and who was summoning constantly more enemies to fight along with dozens of copies of himself, also all the enemies and dragons automatically revived instantly stronger than before), so no, he is accustomed to fight thing that one-shot and with insane danmaku and/or range. 3) Depth V instantly amp 5x all his stats and continuosly make them grow the longer the fight prolong.

Kousuke also have the smartphone which automatically resurrect him via time manip, this is infinitely.

Kousuke also have several haxs to finish Isaac, though against a child the first one he probably will use would be layered mind manip (which is also via law and concept manip Type 2 do to be made with spirit magic).

I mean if Isaac sees him coming back he raises his hands and does all of this

The profile of Isaac specifically state he can only use a limited amount of items, which most need a charge time and have restrictions or disadvantanges, the video I think also mention is with a mod.

 

[Noneless21]

See? This is the bullshits you need to get pass by with

 

[deonment]

Isaac don't have a reason to nuke everything do to the simple fact that he can't even know that Kousuke exist, he can't see him even if Kousuke do absolutely nothing in front of him, hell if he somehow could perceive Endou he would forget just forget his existence again while Kousuke still is in front of him without doing nothing, that's Kousuke level of presence even before the beginning of the story, at in each sucessive vol his stealth become stronger and at the end of the main story and in all the after stories his presece become more absurd (an abstract being who existence is based on the conception of be undetectable was so far inferior in natural stealth compared with Kousuke that he was speechless). So no, Isaac isn't going to know that Kousuke even exist so he isn't going to nuke the battlefield (to begin with he can't even nuke the battlefield since his range is tens of meters and they begin at hundreds of meters).

SBA lets him know that there is an opponent that he has to deal with and as such if he doesn't see one a clear line can be drawn that they are either hiding or whatever else possibility there is, even if he can't recognize that they are there he can recognize that there is still a threat around.
That is entirely because of gameplay limitations, but let's assume that that is true, that is even worse for him as Isaac will use the void by raising his hands and end him multiple times over
Of course, this also ignores the fact that he still has no answer to at least 144 tons of passive damage in the first second of the match while also being passively time slowed to 80% of his speed

AP wise Isaac can't do anything to Kousuke by the simple fact that 1)Yaya no Hidzuki (which is treated as if she was his stand) passively protect Kousuke from any danger and since she is tier 6 Isaac isn't going to do anything to her or him (he also lack the NPI to see or interact with Hidzuki). 2) Kousuke fight all the time against things tiers above (just considering the end of the main story he was killing hundreds of Apostles who could annihilate him with one-hit), everything from Miledi labyrinth (a place in which he spend a week even before the afterstories when he get his op development) could have killed him, fought against hundreds of Mother soldiers while severely nerfed, hundreds of thousands of apparitions (abstracts beings with uniques powers based on the conception from which they are born), Hajime (who have hundreds-thousands of robots with his same weaponary, which include a similtaneous firing rate of three hundred pencil missiles each second along with a bullet hell and bigger missiles, btw each missile have homing based on heat, biosignatures and soul signatures to always follow their target), Yue and Kaori needed to combine and nuke an entire forest to even deafeat a virtual Kousuke (not even the real Kousuke) and this was before his fight against the dragon, (a gigant dragon which could affect the entire planet with his powers and was constantly affecting Japan with his powers which each second were becoming stronger, who was constantly cursing and showering Kouki with super layered haxs, and who was summoning constantly more enemies to fight along with dozens of copies of himself, also all the enemies and dragons automatically revived instantly stronger than before), so no, he is accustomed to fight thing that one-shot and with insane danmaku and/or range. 3) Depth V instantly amp 5x all his stats and continuosly make them grow the longer the fight prolong.

Unless they are an aoe barrier they literally cannot block the tears which are omnidirectional in spread, they literally do not have any form of non-corporeality or invis, ae 2 doesn't get you any form of non-corporeality, it just means that you cant die as long as what you are based on is still around but eraser hard counters that.

Kousuke also have the smartphone which automatically resurrect him via time manip, this is infinitely.

Kousuke also have several haxs to finish Isaac, though against a child the first one he probably will use would be layered mind manip (which is also via law and concept manip Type 2 do to be made with spirit magic).

can it bring him back from historical ee or 4 different types of transmutation, cause that is what space bar items do

The profile of Isaac specifically state he can only use a limited amount of items, which most need a charge time and have restrictions or disadvantanges, the video I think also mention is with a mod.

That is only for tainted Isaac, not the one showing up here which is normal Isaac, Isaac starts off with at least one full charge at the start of any run so that point is moot, the restrictions mentioned aren't actually pertinent as someone who has actually seen chest game breaks happen since afterbirth and afterbirth+, you can still do game breaks to get every single item in the game, no amount of McMillen patching the game can stop that, the mod was literally just to save time as blank card jera runs or double steam sale + restock that also get chaos before breakfasting are rare and tedious to find.

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

SBA lets him know that there is an opponent that he has to deal with and as such if he doesn't see one a clear line can be drawn that they are either hiding or whatever else possibility there is, even if he can't recognize that they are there he can recognize that there is still a threat around.
That is entirely because of gameplay limitations, but let's assume that that is true, that is even worse for him as Isaac will use the void by raising his hands and end him multiple times over
Of course, this also ignores the fact that he still has no answer to at least 144 tons of passive damage in the first second of the match while also being passively time slowed to 80% of his speed

You don't understand, I mean that Isaac will be unable to even remember that there exist an opponent the moment the match begin, the family of Kousuke constantly forget about his existence despite love him deeply, his best friends constantly forget that he exist, his teachers forget that there is another student, his enemies constantly forget that there exist a threat (be the enemy super elite soldiers who did their all to remember his existence while seeing him directly, elite exorcist who were constantly forgetting his existence despite having a sword clash, heck even Mother with all her super intelligence, sensors and memory banks was constantly forgetting the threat of Kousuke, which in the end was her doom). Isaac is, quite literally unable to know that there exist a threat.

Isaac can't affect Kousuke in any way do to the initial distance been hundreds of meters (so not even his passives would affect Kousuke), he would need to first close the distance until he can affect Kousuke and then decide to use items that don't need to hit (because any projectile or thing that need to enter in contact with Kousuke will be dodged, the skill gap is massive and the fact that he can teleport makes hitting him even more imposible for Isaac), things that are impossible if he is unable to detect the pressence of Kousuke or even remember his existence.

I mean, his second key already massively upscale above 38 tons (the calc was from a feat of vol 4 while he was getting stronger in later each vol) and his afterstories self far supass in every single way his second key and can instantly amp himself with 5x and grow stronger each second (the amp and sucessive strengthening also apply to his speed and othe stats). So even in the case that he could affect Kousuke from the beginning with the passive damage (which he can't do to lack of range) Kousuke would receive a damage of 3.7x his calced AP which his far from one shot both do to rules of 7x difference and because with Kousuke stamina that level of damage is far from be level, then the moment he reach Depth V Kousuke would actually have the AP advantage (190 vs 144) and will become futher stronger and with the 5x amp and sucessive strengthening he actually will also have the speed advantage against the 80% slowing, additionally he can easily heal himself with medicine (which can bring people at the brink of death to full health), he can also heal himself with his glove which restore things with time manip, the glove also can deal with the slowing effect by restoring him to his previous state before the debuff, arguably his Soul Shell could also protect him against the debuffing but well. As a side note his glasses makes Kousuke perception increase to the point of see everything in slow motion, along with give him analytical prediction and various types of special visions.

Unless they are an aoe barrier they literally cannot block the tears which are omnidirectional in spread, they literally do not have any form of non-corporeality or invis, ae 2 doesn't get you any form of non-corporeality, it just means that you cant die as long as what you are based on is still around but eraser hard counters that.

They can make big aura construct (which she usually use to make big hands) so she actually can form an barrier around him, he can also make space isolation barriers with his kunais and I think even he can even make barriers with gravity manip (will need to look at some of his scenes to confirm that). When I made the crt adding everything from Hidzuki I thought that abstract existence included those things but if they don't have then I guess I have to correct that with a crt, here are some of the scans I posted in the original crt showing her non-corporeality and invisibility:

(The other tourists can’t see them?)

Kousuke muttered in his heart. Even though multiple strange creatures had clearly appeared, the tourists were only staring at the broken stone paving in a daze. They weren’t paying attention to the apparitions at all. Chapter 405

「No, no. Don’t mind the likes of me. It seems that it’s you two instead who are being the most troubled after all.」

Fukube’s eyes were slightly narrowed.

「The video, it wasn’t faked wasn’t it?」

In the videos or pictures, the white mist monsters that Kousuke and Hinata faced weren’t recorded. That included the strange techniques of the attackers.

However, it was confirmed that they were doing something which caused physical destruction as the result. Chapter 406

『Of course. The opponents mainly consisted of casters but, the possibility of them bringing some types of apparitions with them is high. I already sent bullets and artifacts that will be effective even against them to Karm, along with healing items. Join up with him on site and resupply there.』Chapter 416

Eraser would need to erase her lengend, conception through all the worlds (since she is the mix of conceptions from many different worlds, not only Earth) to kill her:

「Apparitions are existences that is born from legends of other worlds. The heaven tree absorbed the thoughts of the people that are filled with those legends and grant them shape. The heaven tree is the lynchpin of this world with such role.」

According to her, the residences of this world were existences that were materialized from the legends of other worlds.

Legends were the wishes and prayers of the people, or perhaps objects of reverence, or even symbols of fear.

Those things were called as “conception” in general. It was a form of energy that was similar to magic power and the like.

And then, this conception existed in any world. The heaven world absorbed those conceptions through the great trees of other worlds, converted them into the unique energy of this world that was called “thought element”, and gave it form.

「Then……that nine-tails and karasu tengu……they are really existences like in the books?」

「No hero-sama. Certainly the origin of the apparitions are legends, so they possess similar ability. However, their personality is different. They are born in this world, and the self of each of them is established while living in this world. They aren’t existence inside fairy tales, but a living life in this world.」

Aularodde spoke with a serious gaze. Affectionate heart that was befitting a goddess could be seen from her eyes. It was as though she loved those apparitions from her heart.

「In addition, it’s not just hero-sama’s world that has legends. ……There are tens of thousands, hundreds of millions of legends across many worlds. There are many similar existences among those legends, and sometimes they will mix and raise their first cry of birth in this world.」

…

「I see……that’s why you said that they are immortal.」

「Yes. An apparition’s death will only come when the legend that is their origin is completely forgotten.」

Aularodde nodded and continued explaining. According to her, naturally the existences that were talked in mythology――the like of god, divine beast, and evil god seemed to exist too.

There was no mythology bunch among the invasion this time was because in the past Aularodde had faced them at the very beginning and defeated them. Even now she kept interfering with the conception to prevent them from being revived.

In other words, she succeeded in temporarily sealing the mythological existences, but because of that Aularodde’s power was constantly being greatly limited.

Hearing that, Hajime recalled the relationship between Lutria and her divine spirits. Chapter 385

And eraser isn't actually that broken since it need to touch the enemy and with the instincts and skill of both Hidzuki and Kousuke that's basically impossible.

can it bring him back from historical ee or 4 different types of transmutation, cause that is what space bar items do

Restoration magic is ancient magic which control time, ancient magic by itself is a mix of high levels of magic and science which manipulate the elements above the laws of the world, which can rewrite the laws of the universe and reality, along with manipulate abstract concepts, so yes, I would say they can bring back things from the eraser (though first the eraser would have to be used against them and hit them, which is basically impossible), same with the transmutation though in that case Pandora’s Hope is probably more than enough.

That is only for tainted Isaac, not the one showing up here which is normal Isaac, Isaac starts off with at least one full charge at the start of any run so that point is moot, the restrictions mentioned aren't actually pertinent as someone who has actually seen chest game breaks happen since afterbirth and afterbirth+, you can still do game breaks to get every single item in the game, no amount of McMillen patching the game can stop that, the mod was literally just to save time as blank card jera runs or double steam sale + restock that also get chaos before breakfasting are rare and tedious to find.

I don't understand what you said.

 

[Celestial_Pegasus]

Reminds me Kousuke should have memory manipulation no? People constantly forget the guy even exists, it's so absurd even automatic doors, in otherwords inanimate objects, forget him, and this was beginning of series, before he honed his stealth even more, and not even afterstories where his stealth is described as an erasure of existence itself, and conceptions which embody undetectability, can't even compare to his stealth.

It's absurdly broken (like i wonder if another character in the wiki has stealth this broken, but probably someone somewhere), and abysslord is a 5x amp, which in the course of a fight will make him like Country level.

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Reminds me Kousuke should have memory manipulation no? People constantly forget the guy even exists, it's so absurd even automatic doors, in otherwords inanimate objects, forget him, and this was beginning of series, before he honed his stealth even more, and not even afterstories where his stealth is described as an erasure of existence itself, and conceptions which embody undetectability, can't even compare to his stealth.

It's absurdly broken (like i wonder if another character in the wiki has stealth this broken, but probably someone somewhere), and abysslord is a 5x amp, which in the course of a fight will make him like Country level.

To futher support the inanimate objet part the Apostles and machines of Mother also were unable to detect or remember him, though that was after gain magic and skills and begin his training to make his stealth stronger.

Actually, after the dragon fight he gained the Depth VI which initially should be an 6x amp and together with the infinite mana from the necklace let him finish the dragon (who was a tier 5 dangerous even to people of Hajime party level), so with abysslord he can reach tier 5 territory. Should be made a crt to add the memory manip and the new Depth VI or we should tackle that in the current crt?

I actually know one character with comparable stealth to Kousuke and the guy was the protagonist of his novel and ended as a higher dimensional god, he is Yu Ilhan (the profile is a bit lacking but well).

 

[Perequeliri993]

This battle is absurd

 

[Noneless21]

This battle is absurd

Welcome to top 5 strongest match

 

[deonment]

we have a child who looks like the crossbreed between an angel and a devil, who has been turned into a robot, and numerous other visual effects that come from his items in one corner
and in the other corner we have an edgelord
only on vsbw

 

[Perequeliri993]

Guys, did you know there's a video actually displaying Isaac with all his items at once?

 

[Noneless21]

Guys, did you know there's a video actually displaying Isaac with all his items at once?

we do, Deon show us that, still not helping Isaac from remembering Kousuke

 

[Perequeliri993]

we do, Deon show us that, still not helping Isaac from remembering Kousuke

Actually, the one he linked had less items than the one I linked, which actually has every passive item in the game.

Not saying Isaac would remember him, just wanted to be more specific that he can oneshot 18 tons beings just by starting the fight, not willingly shooting.

 

[Noneless21]

Actually, the one he linked had less items than the one I linked, which actually has every passive item in the game.

Not saying Isaac would remember him, just wanted to be more specific that he can oneshot 18 tons beings just by starting the fight, not willingly shooting.

what passive if i may ask?

 

[Perequeliri993]

The 700+ of them

 

[Tatsumi504]

Actually, the one he linked had less items than the one I linked, which actually has every passive item in the game.

Not saying Isaac would remember him, just wanted to be more specific that he can oneshot 18 tons beings just by starting the fight, not willingly shooting.

Doesn't endou scale massively above 38 tons and can even reach tier 6? Honestly not seeing how he loses

 

[Noneless21]

The 700+ of them

i want to ask what is the passive? and does it have a really large aoe? since Endou can outrange if he wants to

Doesn't endou scale massively above 38 tons and can even reach tier 6? Honestly not seeing how he loses

and also this, he can also just go deeper in his Abysslord form and become much stronger, almost as strong as moon level in fact

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Doesn't endou scale massively above 38 tons and can even reach tier 6? Honestly not seeing how he loses

He does, the 38 tons feat is from vol 4 of main story, the main story have a total of 13 vols plus the more than 440 chapters of the after stories (an after stories in which he had three entire arcs were the protagonist was him instead of Hajime party, in total like 100 chapters of those 440 chapters were focused on Kousuke becoming super crazy, and he get developed even on other chapters of the after stories so).

Chronologically speaking the 38 tons feats happen two years after Kousuke third arc in the after stories, and since the after stories technically cover the things until five years after return to Earth then the feat would be something of at least five years ago.

And then there come Kousuke Abyss Lord amp which at Depth V instantly make him 5 times stronger (so massively above 190 tons) and his stats continue to grow overtime to the point that after some minutes he is like tier 6 and with some more time he reach tier 5, there is also the protection from Hidzuki who is tier 6 and will save his husband whenever he is in real danger (she literally crossed the gaps between worlds to save Kousuke once, and this was before they actually become lovers or anything like that). And finally, Abyss Lord amp not only apply to his ap but also to his speed and all other stats so he Isaac amazingly hard, Hidzuki also blitz.

So, stat wise Isaac can't do anything to Kousuke, and hax wise Kousuke also win so.

 

[Perequeliri993]

Doesn't endou scale massively above 38 tons.

In this video you can see what more or less is necessary to one shot Delirium, an 18 tons being, which is 160 dmg with some multihitting attacks. In the other video Isaac has 37407 dmg and a crap ton of multihitting attacks. Of course, if we take this literally, it would be stat scaling (or however it's called), which is not permitted here, but this should give you an idea that he's at least equal, likely higher to 38 tons.

can even reach tier 6? Honestly not seeing how he loses

oh, so he has a tier 6 form that is not restricted? then I think this is a stomp, the only things of his that bypass durability are active items, which he wont be able to use because he wouldn't even know that he's in a battle, apparently.

i want to ask what is the passive? and does it have a really large aoe? since Endou can outrange if he wants to

I mean, he has too much passives, but more notably, and the ones I remember at the top of my head is the automatic poisonous gas and the barrage of tears that happens when you enter a room, and both scale to his dmg stat, in fact, the poisonous gas doubles it. He has a range of more than 20 meters, but it's hard to tell how much.

He does, the 38 tons feat is from vol 4 of main story, the main story have a total of 13 vols plus the more than 440 chapters of the after stories (an after stories in which he had three entire arcs were the protagonist was him instead of Hajime party, in total like 100 chapters of those 440 chapters were focused on Kousuke becoming super crazy, and he get developed even on other chapters of the after stories so).

Chronologically speaking the 38 tons feats happen two years after Kousuke third arc in the after stories, and since the after stories technically cover the things until five years after return to Earth then the feat would be something of at least five years ago.

And then there come Kousuke Abyss Lord amp which at Depth V instantly make him 5 times stronger (so massively above 190 tons) and his stats continue to grow overtime to the point that after some minutes he is like tier 6 and with some more time he reach tier 5, there is also the protection from Hidzuki who is tier 6 and will save his husband whenever he is in real danger (she literally crossed the gaps between worlds to save Kousuke once, and this was before they actually become lovers or anything like that). And finally, Abyss Lord amp not only apply to his ap but also to his speed and all other stats so he Isaac amazingly hard, Hidzuki also blitz.

So, stat wise Isaac can't do anything to Kousuke, and hax wise Kousuke also win so.

Yeah... Isaac gets stomped

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

oh, so he has a tier 6 form that is not restricted? then I think this is a stomp, the only things of his that bypass durability are active items, which he wont be able to use because he wouldn't even know that he's in a battle, apparently.

The funny thing is that even if the op wanted to restrict Abyss Lord isn't possible with the current vs rules because passive or abilitites that activate regardless of the user will can't be restricted, and by the current point in the after stories Kousuke have reached a point in which he enter in Abyss Lord mode even if he don't want (and believe me he normally don't want that because the mode have the side effect of turn him in chuuni).

 

[Perequeliri993]

The funny thing is that even if the op wanted to restrict Abyss Lord isn't possible with the current vs rules because passive or abilitites that activate regardless of the user will can't be restricted, and by the current point in the after stories Kousuke have reached a point in which he enter in Abyss Lord mode even if he don't want (and believe me he normally don't want that because the mode have the side effect of turn him in chuuni).

****

 

[Tatsumi504]

He does, the 38 tons feat is from vol 4 of main story, the main story have a total of 13 vols plus the more than 440 chapters of the after stories (an after stories in which he had three entire arcs were the protagonist was him instead of Hajime party, in total like 100 chapters of those 440 chapters were focused on Kousuke becoming super crazy, and he get developed even on other chapters of the after stories so).

Chronologically speaking the 38 tons feats happen two years after Kousuke third arc in the after stories, and since the after stories technically cover the things until five years after return to Earth then the feat would be something of at least five years ago.

And then there come Kousuke Abyss Lord amp which at Depth V instantly make him 5 times stronger (so massively above 190 tons) and his stats continue to grow overtime to the point that after some minutes he is like tier 6 and with some more time he reach tier 5, there is also the protection from Hidzuki who is tier 6 and will save his husband whenever he is in real danger (she literally crossed the gaps between worlds to save Kousuke once, and this was before they actually become lovers or anything like that). And finally, Abyss Lord amp not only apply to his ap but also to his speed and all other stats so he Isaac amazingly hard, Hidzuki also blitz.

So, stat wise Isaac can't do anything to Kousuke, and hax wise Kousuke also win so.

Hmm, my arifureta knowledge is limited to the anime. Maybe i should start the novel.

440 chapters worth of after stories, wtf?

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Hmm, my arifureta knowledge is limited to the anime. Maybe i should start the novel.

440 chapters worth of after stories, wtf?

The novel is far better, specially at the beginning because the first half of season 1 was pure trash, they did very wrong in that part. If you read the novel begin with the light novel and latter if you liked it you can read the after stories that still aren't adapted to light novel format.

No joke the after stories already are more than two times longer than the actual main story, they aren't far from be three times longer at this point.

 

[Tatsumi504]

The novel is far better, specially at the beginning because the first half of season 1 was pure trash, they did very wrong in that part. If you read the novel begin with the light novel and latter if you liked it you can read the after stories that still aren't adapted to light novel format.

No joke the after stories already are more than two times longer than the actual main story, they aren't far from be three times longer at this point.

Honestly, why does anime have to butcher most LN's. Only one I've seen that actually sticks to the plot is Eighty-six

 

[Expectro2000xxx]

Honestly, why does anime have to butcher most LN's. Only one I've seen that actually sticks to the plot is Eighty-six

It have to do with how hard is to adapt books to other media (either movies, tv series, animes, comics, etc).

That said however at least in the case of Arifureta anime they were able to adapt part of the charm/essence of novels (which is really the characters and their interactions, the battles and plot are also very important parts of the novel but the most important thing are actually the characters), is why despite having various bad things people still enjoy a lot the anime and generally speaking left most of those watching it satisfied.

The worst of the anime is the first half of season one (they changed the most thing in vol 1 and did that weird beginning, and in vol 2 they literally omitted around 140 pages and I know that for sure because I counted it), the rest of the season was acceptable adapted and the charm of the characters was beginning to be show. Season two was well adapted and although the battle still weren't close to the novel or anything amazing they still did considerably better than season one.