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『INFINITE UNIVERSE IN DRAGON BALL SUPER』

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Damage3245 said:
Think about what you're saying, please. How can she be asserting that she's (and by extension the others) are at the edge of the Observable Universe? By definition the observer is at the center of the Observable Universe.
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which is unironically why Bulma is extremely dumb here believe it or not, even in the case of a finite observable universe her statement would make no sense because almost by definition an observer is at the center of the observable universe. the fact that such an obviously and blatantly stupid statement is being given so much credence for the sole purpose of avoiding a conclusion that has been reiterated countless times by reliable guide statements is.....not surprising to me.

and this is coming from someone who doesn't actually agree with the thread, just don't like Bulma's nonsensical statement being used here.
 
Ryzen7900X said:
which is unironically why Bulma is extremely dumb here believe it or not, even in the case of a finite observable universe her statement would make no sense because almost by definition an observer is at the center of the observable universe. the fact that such an obviously and blatantly stupid statement is being given so much credence for the sole purpose of avoiding a conclusion that has been reiterated countless times by reliable guide statements is.....not surprising to me.

and this is coming from someone who doesn't actually agree with the thread, just don't like Bulma's nonsensical statement being used here.
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Here's the thing though - you're very close to getting what I'm talking about.

Bulma's statement would not be extremely dumb if she wasn't talking about the Observable Universe, but for the Universe as a whole.
 
the bulma thing requires more workarounds to go by, i really don't understand how many straightforward statements don't hold more value

but as qawsed said just get more staff input, all arguments have been presented and no one convinced the other, it's fruitless
 
didn't bulma say that u must go to the center then move from there?

the way i understand it, it's just bulmas radar being limited in range
 
Damage3245 said:
Here's the thing though - you're very close to getting what I'm talking about.

Bulma's statement would not be extremely dumb if she wasn't talking about the Observable Universe, but for the Universe as a whole.
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it would be. it doesn't make any more sense. i'm going to assume that the entire universe is finite and only as big as the observable universe (a conclusion you clearly support), in that case, her statement is just blatantly wrong and stupid (which you yourself have said above). we know by definition that she's talking about the observable universe though, due to two statements.

one stating that the universe is beyond human comprehension, and the second one from Jaco reiterating that and asking her if she has any idea of the actual scope of the universe (which she does not, not as much as Jaco anyway) even if you don't believe that Jaco is "correcting her". with this in mind, she could NOT have been talking about anything other than the observable universe.
 
MrTayman616 said:
what? jaco doesn't call her that she's wrong? he just says the distance is so huge for him to travel.
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Correction he doesn't say that he couldn't go to the centre because distance is so huge he just responds to bulma that since the galactic patrol covers only this galaxy so no one would know about a way when bulma asked him to take her to galactic patrol for info
 
Ryzen7900X said:
it would be. it doesn't make any more sense. i'm going to assume that the entire universe is finite and only as big as the observable universe (a conclusion you clearly support), in that case, her statement is just blatantly wrong and stupid (which you yourself have said above). we know by definition that she's talking about the observable universe though, due to two statements.

one stating that the universe is beyond human comprehension, and the second one from Jaco reiterating that and asking her if she has any idea of the actual scope of the universe (which she does not, not as much as Jaco anyway) even if you don't believe that Jaco is "correcting her". with this in mind, she could NOT have been talking about anything other than the observable universe.
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This doesn't make sense either. there is no reason for bulma to assume every super dragon ball is inside the observable universe. and the "universe is beyond human comprehension", if someone says the universe is infinite, they will be uncapable of understanding it? also it doesn't talk about the mortal universe but the universe 7 itself no?
 
Killerdrone123 said:
Correction he doesn't say that he couldn't go to the centre because distance is so huge he just responds to bulma that since the galactic patrol covers only this galaxy so no one would know about a way when bulma asked him to take her to galactic patrol for info
Click to expand...
He says it after Bulma asks him to bring her to galactic patrol. at first he says he can't travel distances that huge, saying one galaxy is already very huge etc
 
MrTayman616 said:
This doesn't make sense either. there is no reason for bulma to assume every dragon ball is inside the observable universe
Click to expand...
she said to go to the center and start moving from there, in no where did she imply they all will be there
 
MrTayman616 said:
This doesn't make sense either. there is no reason for bulma to assume every super dragon ball is inside the observable universe. and the "universe is beyond human comprehension", if someone says the universe is infinite, they will be uncapable of understanding it? also it doesn't talk about the mortal universe but the universe 7 itself no?
Click to expand...
oh yeah she does actually. know why? Because as Jaco pointed out, Bulma has absolutely no clue of the actual scope of the universe (or anything beyond it for that matter). she literally doesn't know it. everyone here who thinks she does is the one assuming it baselessly simply because she's smart, but she IS wrong here and its literally on panel. if you wish to be willfully ignorant though that's a whole other matter.
 
MrTayman616 said:
He says it after Bulma asks him to bring her to galactic patrol. at first he says he can't travel distances that huge, saying one galaxy is already very huge etc
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He says no one would know how to get there since it could be far away and galactic patrol doesn't go beyond there own galaxy he doesn't say that he can't travel there cause distance is huge he never confirms that he knows there is a centre or something
 
Ryzen7900X said:
oh yeah she does actually. know why? Because as Jaco pointed out, Bulma has absolutely no clue of the actual scope of the universe (or anything beyond it for that matter). she literally doesn't know it. everyone here who thinks she does is the one assuming it baselessly simply because she's smart, but she IS wrong here and its literally on panel. if you wish to be willfully ignorant though that's a whole other matter.
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no? Bulma(anime) literally says her plan wasn't going to center with Jaco but asking Jaco to bring her to galactic patrol to find someone who can go there, which jaco also says it only covers their galaxy and no one would know how to pass distances that huge.
Killerdrone123 said:
He says no one would know how to get there since it could be far away and galactic patrol doesn't go beyond there own galaxy he doesn't say that he can't travel there cause distance is huge he never confirms that he knows there is a centre or something
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he says it before bulma says "bring me to galactic patrol". also he wouldn't be talking about the distances being huge but he'd be talking like "there is no such thing like the center" etc.
 
i'll just say this straight up. Bulma is completely wrong here, it doesnt matter how smart you believe she is, intelligence doesnt make you immune to being wrong about things you have absolutely zero clue about. Much less something as difficult to grasp as the scope of the universe.

with this in mind, it only makes sense to say that she is talking about the observable universe ONLY. we know this due to two statements, the first is the universe being beyond comprehension for humans (and this includes Bulma), the second being Jaco verbatim telling her that she's out of her mind and has no clue about the scope of the actual universe, which Bulma DOES NOT disagree with or tries to fire back at.

lastly, there is also a sort of narrative implication supporting this idea and that is the Dragon radar. the fact that it has very limited range, also somewhat implies that it can only scan within the observable universe, or at least not beyond Bulma's own understanding of the universe.
 
MrTayman616 said:
no? Bulma(anime) literally says her plan wasn't going to center with Jaco but asking Jaco to bring her to galactic patrol to find someone who can go there, which jaco also says it only covers their galaxy and no one would know how to pass distances that huge.
Click to expand...
i have no idea what your point here is. in both continuities, manga and anime, Jaco states that Bulma has no idea of the true scope of the universe. that's the only relevant point here. Bulma is the actual unreliable source here believe it or not evident by her lack of understanding here. i don't know what you're arguing about, a point I never even made?
 
MrTayman616 said:
no? Bulma(anime) literally says her plan wasn't going to center with Jaco but asking Jaco to bring her to galactic patrol to find someone who can go there, which jaco also says it only covers their galaxy and no one would know how to pass distances that huge.

he says it before bulma says "bring me to galactic patrol". also he wouldn't be talking about the distances being huge but he'd be talking like "there is no such thing like the center" etc.
Click to expand...
Dude he literally it isn't possible to go there since universe has countless galaxies or there being a centre he never says that there is a centre but he can't go there cause his ship isn't capable of.This is literally what he says in anime he never implied there is a centre

 
Ryzen7900X said:
with this in mind, it only makes sense to say that she is talking about the observable universe ONLY. we know this due to two statements, the first is the universe being beyond comprehension for humans (and this includes Bulma), the second being Jaco verbatim telling her that she's out of her mind and has no clue about the scope of the actual universe, which Bulma DOES NOT disagree with or tries to fire back at.
Click to expand...
to me it seems like she said the entire universe, but was wrong about how large it is
 
Killerdrone123 said:
Dude he literally it isn't possible to go there since universe has countless galaxies or there being a centre he never says that there is a centre but he can't go there cause his ship isn't capable of.This is literally what he says in anime he never implied there is a centre

Click to expand...

the point is he never even implied there isn't a centre. he didn't contradict that there is one. he does the literally opposite. he calls the distances huge, insanely far, "Even just our galaxy is ridiculously vast, and there is outrageous amount of galaxies in the universe"
 
Damage3245 said:
Here's the thing though - you're very close to getting what I'm talking about.

Bulma's statement would not be extremely dumb if she wasn't talking about the Observable Universe, but for the Universe as a whole.
Click to expand...
But like, the Observable Universe is only what we can see here on earth. Like the light that reaches us, if our universe is infinite then there's space beyond what we can see/know
 
MrTayman616 said:
the point is he never even implied there isn't a centre. he didn't contradict that there is one. he does the literally opposite. he calls the distances huge, insanely far, "Even just our galaxy is ridiculously vast, and there is outrageous amount of galaxies in the universe"
Click to expand...
which does absolutely nothing to contradict an infinite universe nor does it support your conclusion. just the fact that Bulma decidedly lacks knowledge on the scope of the universe is enough to conclude that the (forced) implication of her talking about the entire universe (which as i just said she doesn't know about) as opposed to just the observable universe, should be taken with a bucket of salt
 
MrTayman616 said:
the point is he never even implied there isn't a centre. he didn't contradict that there is one. he does the literally opposite. he calls the distances huge, insanely far, "Even just our galaxy is ridiculously vast, and there is outrageous amount of galaxies in the universe"
Click to expand...
Again he never confirmed a centre on other hand he just proved that the universe is extremely vast so not even galactic patrol would be able to do anything regarding it
 
Spinoirr said:
But like, the Observable Universe is only what we can see here on earth. Like the light that reaches us, if our universe is infinite then there's space beyond what we can see/know
Click to expand...
Hence if Bulma is making the assertion that they're at the edge of the Universe (and why would she, if she didn't know?), and nobody contradicts her on that point, that means that the Universe in Dragon Ball isn't infinite. There is a limit to it.


Anyway; I'm fine waiting for more staff.
 
Killerdrone123 said:
Again he never confirmed a centre on other hand he just proved that the universe is extremely vast so not even galactic patrol would be able to do anything regarding it
Click to expand...
says vast. says insanely far, says one galaxy is huge and there are outrageous amount of them. all of them talks about finite distances.
 
Damage3245 said:
Hence if Bulma is making the assertion that they're at the edge of the Universe (and why would she, if she didn't know?), and nobody contradicts her on that point, that means that the Universe in Dragon Ball isn't infinite. There is a limit to it.
Click to expand...
I have already refuted your point, the earth is at the edge of a galaxy and not at the edge of the Universe.
 
Damage3245 said:
Hence if Bulma is making the assertion that they're at the edge of the Universe (and why would she, if she didn't know?), and nobody contradicts her on that point, that means that the Universe in Dragon Ball isn't infinite. There is a limit to it.


Anyway; I'm fine waiting for more staff.
Click to expand...
Anyways, a infinite universe can have a edge

Like they're videos on how this is the case
 
LuffyRuffy46307 said:
I have already refuted your point, the earth is at the edge of a galaxy and not at the edge of the Universe.
Click to expand...
It doesn't make sense for this to be the situation here. Did everyone in db forgot the meaning of universe? also they would just want to go the the center of the galaxy in a case like that.
Sus said:
she said to go to the center and start moving from there, in no where did she imply they all will be there
Click to expand...
I believe it's wrong. the original line is 宇宙の中心心に行くかいろいろ移動しながらじゃないと探せないわ which means either they have to go to the center or they have to do it in many different area. which the center is easier.
 
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