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That's right
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『INFINITE UNIVERSE IN DRAGON BALL SUPER』
- Thread starter LuffyRuffy46307
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It doesn't make sense for Bulma to talk about the observable universe or anything like that. It's like saying bulma only plans to scan the observable universe or like there is nothing but observable universe for Bulma. Jaco is simply not capable of travelling distances that huge which he literally says it and he literally talks about finite distances. Also he wouldn't need to talk about how huge milky way is if they can travel through infinite distances anyway, saying milky way itself is way huge and there are many countless galaxies that's like it as well. (databooks/daizenshuu also says that travelling between galaxies are so hard to the point going to afterlife and then going to a location is even easier + i don't remember which one it was though :d)
also there are other things like dbz frieza had the %70 of the universe in his control or kaoishin realm being 1/10 of the universe(or macrocosm) and etc.
daizenshuu 4 page 16 calls the universe vast, huge. "巨大な宇宙が地球を包みそれを遥かな高みから天界が見おろしている"
"Stated to be an endless expansive space that wraps around all celestial bodies" raw says it to be infinitely expanding. a vast dimension. has countless stars that makes nebulas and that those nebulas make galaxies.
"屋の扉を開けると広大な異空間が広がる。宇宙 この世に存在するすべての天体を包み込んだ、果てしなく広がる空間。『魔界』と両立する、この世における一方の大世界である。ドラゴンボールの世界では、宇宙はあの世の下に位置し、不思議な文様の刻まれた壁によって密閉されている。宇宙の中には、無数の星が集まった『星雲』があり、星雲が無数に集まってできた『銀河』がある"
"果てしなく広がる" = infinitely/endlessly expanding.
"Stated to have darkness that stretches out to infinity" "無限に" means infinitely. 無限に広がる can mean infinitely/endlessly expanding. infinitely expanding darkness.
also considering the other parts in this statement like "tens of thousands of light-years… hundreds of millions of light-years" which is unnecessary when you already say infinite a second before.
"The universe in dragon ball is stated to be infinitely expansive" same for this part which uses 無限に広がる.
と伝えられたこの世はどこまでも果てしない広がりを見せ says it to be expanding endlessly. (the blog also says it in the translation part)
(might be wrong about some of them or all of them or something like that idc :d)
I'd say the universe is finite, or that there are too many things that is inconsistent with both. Also considering the fights as well in the series. I disagree with the thread,
the universe is finite.
also there are other things like dbz frieza had the %70 of the universe in his control or kaoishin realm being 1/10 of the universe(or macrocosm) and etc.
daizenshuu 4 page 16 calls the universe vast, huge. "巨大な宇宙が地球を包みそれを遥かな高みから天界が見おろしている"
"Stated to be an endless expansive space that wraps around all celestial bodies" raw says it to be infinitely expanding. a vast dimension. has countless stars that makes nebulas and that those nebulas make galaxies.
"屋の扉を開けると広大な異空間が広がる。宇宙 この世に存在するすべての天体を包み込んだ、果てしなく広がる空間。『魔界』と両立する、この世における一方の大世界である。ドラゴンボールの世界では、宇宙はあの世の下に位置し、不思議な文様の刻まれた壁によって密閉されている。宇宙の中には、無数の星が集まった『星雲』があり、星雲が無数に集まってできた『銀河』がある"
"果てしなく広がる" = infinitely/endlessly expanding.
"Stated to have darkness that stretches out to infinity" "無限に" means infinitely. 無限に広がる can mean infinitely/endlessly expanding. infinitely expanding darkness.
also considering the other parts in this statement like "tens of thousands of light-years… hundreds of millions of light-years" which is unnecessary when you already say infinite a second before.
"The universe in dragon ball is stated to be infinitely expansive" same for this part which uses 無限に広がる.
と伝えられたこの世はどこまでも果てしない広がりを見せ says it to be expanding endlessly. (the blog also says it in the translation part)
(might be wrong about some of them or all of them or something like that idc :d)
I'd say the universe is finite, or that there are too many things that is inconsistent with both. Also considering the fights as well in the series. I disagree with the thread,
the universe is finite.
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I’m not a fan of the observable universe argument either. Although, Jaco planning to scan the universe and attempting to get to the center, but ultimately not being able to do so does not contradict there being infinite galaxies. Even a line on a plane has an uncountable amount infinite points because of the numbers that exist between 0 and 1 being equivalent to the set of real numbers in terms of cardinality. So, instead of harping on this observable universe point I think we should just point out that having an edge and center doesn’t contradict there being an infinite amount of distance between different points. Also, Jaco never says that it’s a finite distance, but says that the galaxy alone is huge and compares that to the Universe.
I mean it’s referring to him owning people, so that’s not contradictory at all.
I actually addressed most of this in my thread. You’re using hirogaru to mean expanding and that it’s a continuous process when that’s not the case. There’s a native Japanese speaker who gives us the context of how hirogaru is used. Also, hirogaru is also used when it tells us verbatim that an infinite number of galaxies exist too, even in the daizenshuu 7 and chozenshuu 4 scan. It’s simply telling us that it spreads/extends infinitely. You can take a look at this thread. Iirc though, 拡大 would be undoubtedly expand, but that’s not the kanji used the kanji used is hirogaru (広がる).
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I agree with the topic, I expected it would take a little longer to analyze this.
Hasty12345
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The distance between 0 and 1 is 1.
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I mean, then this is just a stealth upgrade thread like with trying to composite DB canon, which should be frowned upon.
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Eh, if no one does it i can do a thread to deal with the speed + AP upgrade resulting from this myself
We should focus on the size for now
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Indeed, but there’s an uncountable infinite number of real numbers between both, countable infinite amount of rational numbers, and 2 natural numbers.
How is that a stealth upgrade? This thread is specifically focusing on the universe size itself instead of any scaling. I honestly don’t see how that’s the case.
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I think we should just redo the thread with all them included. Since
Because its trying to get one piece through the door so a more controversial piece of evidence handled in a separate thread has an easier time getting through the door. Its what happened before when the cosmology of all mediums got composited. Going by the other user they know that something like Infinite Speed Buu Saga characters would hinder this upgrade attempt despite it being a direct byproduct of this. To me I don't see how this isn't a stealth upgrade.
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- #92
What is your opinion about crt?
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Its all Flowery Statements, but unless there's something contradicting them it would qualify for a High 3-A space.
Hasty12345
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Indeed but you keep saying “distance”
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Well, if it is decided to be an outlier and no one shows that supposed scene for a new calc, then we would just continue to upscale from the DBZ speed scalling.....so it isn't really complicated, the AP upgrade is straightforward tho
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Thank you very much for your support, i will list it "agree"
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You can put me down as disagree with this for now.
The original source material takes priority over guidebooks, and in my view Bulma's words contradict those statements.
The original source material takes priority over guidebooks, and in my view Bulma's words contradict those statements.
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I swear this is not objective, that composition topic was made by me, through Dr Slump which contains DBGT, and other things like the anime timeline being put together with anime stuff.
The only changes that will happen is the Kaioshin realm being yet another Universal-sized space-time (previously we lost a space-time, but with this one we will gain it back) and the speed
RoninSlayer200
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can you tell us what the contradiction is?
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metric spaces
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honestly the higher u get through tiers flowery words take over feats
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I'm not a DB supporter and I don't really care much if this is accepted or not, but...
It is said that the scale of the world is beyond human understanding and you decide to give more importance to one human's statement than to multiple statements in different guides?
Hasty12345
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I’ll be sure to let my 8th grade nephew know the answer to the distance between any two points on a Cartesian plane is infinite because some guy on a battleboarding forum said the distance between 0 and 1 is infinite due to there being infinitely many infinitesimal points.
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wait so now it's 4 spacetimes?
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sure, you could let him design our next tiering system as well. see you with 5-C Zeno!
Hasty12345
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Infinite speed to anyone not immobile because the distance between 0 and 1 units of space is infinite!
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it's already 3 is it not?
Hasty12345
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I’m giving an example on how an infinite amount of numbers can exist between 2 points, even if it’s infinitemisal. As long as the distance from the edge and center of an infinite universe isn’t finite, then it’s perfectly fine and q isn’t contradictory.
Your view would be correct, if it was stated the distance between the center and edge was finite, but it’s not. It’s perfectly valid for the distance to be infinite. Considering we have a statement of there being an infinite amount of space and infinite galaxies? Looking for a contradiction when it doesn’t exist.
Hasty12345
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Indeed, but the use of the word “distance” is very liberal and doesn’t convey the point you’re trying to get across when coupled with the analogy/example you used.
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also i don't know where the idea that it can't have a center came from. it would only be contradicted if it had an edge at infinity. if you were to start a line that goes on infinitely [0, infinity), it technically has an "edge" at zero.
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look, i agreed with infinite universe and i still do, but no, Jaco didn't contradicted her, he only said that he doesn't know anyway to reach the center due to how big the universe is, aka he confirms her beliefs of the existence of a center for the universe, and "countless" doesn't intrinsically mean "inifinite" either
just pull up that scan in the daizenshuu saying that the Universe is beyond human understanding instead
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i mean........i understand his concern tho, to make it easier for him to understand your point, you could exemplify it through a more direct example using distances instead of numbers, maybe that will make it easier for him to understand your point
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