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Honkai Impact 3rd

Text feat always look better On-screen feat since more often than not it feel less impressive than text feat (On-screen feat destroy planet but take a bit of time vs Text that just said destroy planet but how does it take is unknown), so its understandable that wanking happen
 
Current progress: (Most general discussion happens in the HSR general discussion now, just so people who read this in the future might know).

A sandbox is being made for Durandal right now. The verse'll end up much cleaner as her busted scaling will be removed and new scaling will be added to the verse.

Kiana - HoV is fully fixed, Flamescion has like 5 scans left to fix. Finality needs doing.
Mei - Has broken scans. Alot of them.
Bronya - Seems to have way less broken scans.
Welt - Seems to be alright? I'll need to properly evaluate it.
Kevin - Has a few broken scans. Needs proper evaluation to find out how many.
Elysia - ^
Durandal - ^
Raven - Seems fine. Doesn't have many scans to begin with.
Otto - A lot of scans we already have and they just need applying here.
Kalpas - Has a broken scan, seems alright otherwise.
Hua - Has broken scans.

Kiana is the bulk of the problem and thanks to her having access to many divine keys or Herrscher powers at varying points we'll have a lot solved for the other profiles.
 
Last edited:
Someone should fix that cosmology page first, it is the face of the verse, i had deleted the HI3rd long ago and didn't play HSR so can't help on that sorry
 
Vietthai96 said:
Never, i'm not gonna be Hoyo slaver again, unless HSR Kiana appears
Click to expand...
Do you not want to see Twitch Streamer Welt making meow noises for chat?
image.png


(I just noticed Archer is in the background lmao)
 
Vietthai96 said:
Someone should fix that cosmology page first, it is the face of the verse, i had deleted the HI3rd long ago and didn't play HSR so can't help on that sorry
Click to expand...
Current plans are: (The more sensitive plans I will be keeping secret.)

  • Fixing current profiles scans'
  • Fixing the profiles, making sandboxes, abandoning faulty Dudu scaling (also being done rn)
  • Introducing new feats to the verse. Not going into which. Then ofc applying them and introducing the profiles made around them. I'll leak that I'm personally going for 6D FG Otto, but I can guarantee it'll be hard for anyone reading this to find out how.

- Likely new HE page, layered hax, HE = Imaginary Energy CRT.

If HE = Imaginary Energy doesn't pass... well, first we need to summarise the Youyun's Classroom databook. It says:

Keep in mind this statement - 'the laboratory has not made any scientific progress in this regard, I still want to take this opportunity to share with everyone our thoughts in this field. Based on the current theory, we tend to believe—' Going on to summarise:

  • The Sea of Data and the Sea of Quanta are supported by Honkai Energy (more rivalry statements, etc).
  • The exact source of Honkai Energy remains a mystery. The scientists behind this databook believe Honkai Energy originates from the properties of space. Namely 'anti-space' or the Imaginary Space.
  • It larps the second law of thermodynamics and says 'as our civilization continues to evolve, accumulating negative entropy within its internal cycle, the corresponding "Imaginary Internal Energy," or Honkai Energy, also rises in tandem.'

Putting this all together:
The Sea of Quanta is supported by the energy from Imaginary Space and negative entropy and HE are inversely proportional. With the AE VN we know this, and they cause HE events to happen. This'd mean all Honkai Energy comes from its proportional Imaginary Space and there's room for the Unknown Imaginary Space of the Cocoon to have its own energy.

So this databook says HE = Imaginary Internal Energy. (No, this can't be used as a counterargument against the 'HE isn't Imaginary Internal Energy' idea. The scientists state most of the book is speculation and theory dependent, but all the conclusions above are backed up by other sources within the game and AE vn... so I'll still use them regardless.)

This presents the issue of the SoQ being fuelled by Destruction Path Energy if you believe Internal Imaginary Energy = Destruction Path Energy, yet given what we know about the Destruction, Nanook has nothing to do with the SoQ and doesn't demonstrate superiority over it. If you believe the Aether thing in the 4.2 optional readable is the SoQ or a subdomain that contradicts with it saying it's Mythus' domain.

So I'll just argue Imaginary Internal Energy = HE = Destruction Path Energy is a massive name fallacy and get that chucked out regardless. It's much more likely Imaginary Internal Energy is just the amount of Imaginary Energy within a given system - I believe I could make a convincing argument pertaining to this.

Back into the cosmology page, or rather pages. I'd just have the cosmology page be links to other smaller pages like the Sea of Quanta, Imaginary Tree, Cocoon, Ether Anchors, Imaginary Spaces etc:

It'd be a lot and would likely come after the HE = Imaginary Energy CRT, or if that fails, the 'its not Destruction Energy' CRT. I have my own theories on how the cosmology actually works, the Sea of Quanta running on HE, the Tree taking Honkai Energy from the Tree and using that. It loops back into the idea they feed off of each other.

Also reunifying the trees between Hi3 and HSR is something I want to do.
HSR 4.2 talks about the Aether being overlapped upon 3D real space (not counting the time dimension) and I don't see why the Tree's properties can't overlap onto Real Space and do the same thing. It'd form the universe while also not BEING the universe, being another structure. The 10D spatial coordinates of the Tree meaning Leaf Worlds are in different positions would just overlay onto 4D space.

Any coordinates past 4 dimensions not being the same makes room for 'different realities / timelines' which we now know exist because SW fights one of them for her LVL 999. It's just that Emanators can't move in a higher dimensional way, otherwise they'd get to the Tree from the Imaginary Void Domains.

Imaginary Void Domains are supposedly Imaginary Space. I disagree with that too. They're separated on a name basis, aeons never appear there, nobody goes to the Tree there and the same time shenanigans the actual Imaginary Space has isn't apparent here. I think it's just a large conglomeration of Imaginary Energy. It's even known that Imaginary Energy in these amounts destroys anything that touches it, exactly what the Imaginary Void Domains do.

Why the Trees are separate right now is because Herta calls the Tree the Universe, yet she also makes it clear she's putting it in fairy tale terms in the same conversation. The data bank archive also mentions 'The branches of the giant tree bore colorful young leaves, each containing a fragment of the universe's will' - I am pretty sure this is the leaves containing a fragment of the universe's will. Not the Tree. As far as we know the Tree doesn't have a will, so it's talking about the real space of the leaves making up the universe.
Genuinely there's plenty of room to reunify the trees because everything is easily explainable while keeping the Tree as a higher dimensional structure. Especially with the inclusion of MWI and Nous not wiping it out, it gives room for my personal interpretation that Nous only wipes out dead worlds. These'd be ones with no future and this is what I believe Herta's statement meant.

Here, basically everything would be done. The cosmology between HSR and Hi3 would overlap, scaling would be fixed, Hi3 would even have a few upgrades and cleaner upwards scaling. We're not planning on the massive cosmology overhaul right now, there's a lot to be done, as you can see above. It's very optional and not our current focus.
 
PlungingThroughTime said:
So this databook says HE = Imaginary Internal Energy. This presents the issue of the SoQ being fuelled by Destruction Path Energy if you believe Internal Imaginary Energy = Destruction Path Energy, yet given what we know about the Destruction, Nanook has nothing to do with the SoQ and doesn't demonstrate superiority over it. If you believe the Aether thing in the 4.2 optional readable is the SoQ or a subdomain that contradicts with it saying it's Mythus' domain.

So I'll just argue Imaginary Internal Energy = HE = Destruction Path Energy is a massive name fallacy and get that chucked out regardless. It's much more likely Imaginary Internal Energy is just the amount of Imaginary Energy within a given system - I believe I could make a convincing argument pertaining to this.
Click to expand...
I mean the Stellaron/Imaginary Internal Energy is the Harmony's cancer and created by Xipe so it shouldn't be exclusive to the destruction
 
CastoriceTheFifth said:
Shouldn't be exclusive to a single path. Does that help with the argument
Click to expand...
If Imaginary Internal Energy is HE for whatever reason instead of just Imaginary Energy, wouldn't that just mean paths are just subsets of Imaginary Internal Energy (or Imaginary Energy)? We know they're smaller divisions of Imaginary Energy.

Welt even specifies Aeons only 'completely take over [a] part of the Imaginary' and via Himeko's about the aeons we know they're 'free to choose the allocation of Imaginary Energy however THEY wish'.

This'd mean Cocolia and the like aren't full HE users, they just use a smaller spectrum of what makes up HE, just like they use a small spectrum of Imaginary Energy, hence the 'path' idea.
 
PlungingThroughTime said:
If Imaginary Internal Energy is HE for whatever reason instead of just Imaginary Energy, wouldn't that just mean paths are just subsets of Imaginary Internal Energy (or Imaginary Energy)? We know they're smaller divisions of Imaginary Energy.

Welt even specifies Aeons only 'completely take over [a] part of the Imaginary' and via Himeko's about the aeons we know they're 'free to choose the allocation of Imaginary Energy however THEY wish'.

This'd mean Cocolia and the like aren't full HE users, they just use a smaller spectrum of what makes up HE, just like they use a small spectrum of Imaginary Energy, hence the 'path' idea.
Click to expand...
Paths are congregations of Imaginary Energy so idk. Not sure whats the difference between usages though.

Still makes more sense that HE and IE are the same thing considering the amount of evidence/statements for it
 
CastoriceTheFifth said:
Paths are congregations of Imaginary Energy so idk. Not sure whats the difference between usages though.

Still makes more sense that HE and IE are the same thing considering the amount of evidence/statements for it
Click to expand...

Yeah, it does. Griseo refers to what is previously called IE (by Sa) as HE and I think that's really damn convincing, especially given everywhere else HE is called 'Internal Imaginary Energy' is a larp of the 2nd law of thermodynamics. More scans would be helpful given I'm going through the hard process of indexing them all rn.

My only concern is that this'd take away Cocolia and the Lord Ravagers having HE as they're only controlling a smaller subset / congregation of HE / IE. To be honest, I don't mind this all too much. It seems odd for them to have it.
 
PlungingThroughTime said:
Yeah, it does. Griseo refers to what is previously called IE (by Sa) as HE and I think that's really damn convincing, especially given everywhere else HE is called 'Internal Imaginary Energy' is a larp of the 2nd law of thermodynamics. More scans would be helpful given I'm going through the hard process of indexing them all rn.

My only concern is that this'd take away Cocolia and the Lord Ravagers having HE as they're only controlling a smaller subset / congregation of HE / IE. To be honest, I don't mind this all too much. It seems odd for them to have it.
Click to expand...
I'm confused on the issue.

This issue doesn't exist if IE = HE right?

And that it's only an issue if its HE = Internal Imaginary Energy?
 
CastoriceTheFifth said:
I'm confused on the issue.

This issue doesn't exist if IE = HE right?

And that it's only an issue if its HE = Internal Imaginary Energy?
Click to expand...

It'd still be an issue as the paths the characters use are just smaller subsets of overall Imaginary Energy, hence the below.
PlungingThroughTime said:
Welt even specifies Aeons only 'completely take over [a] part of the Imaginary' and via Himeko's about the aeons we know they're 'free to choose the allocation of Imaginary Energy however THEY wish'.
Click to expand...

Think of it as this, Imaginary Energy is light, the paths are different wavelengths of light. They're all part of light but just being able to use 'orange' doesn't mean you have access to the full spectrum of light (Imaginary Energy or in this case, Honkai Energy). I hope this analogy is sufficient.

There's more evidence supporting this, two different paths being called Imaginary Internal Energy, that the Imaginary Internal Energy in the World-Cleansing Blood section has 'nature similar to an Emanator of Destruction'. More includes Herta stating in the Irontomb fight there's a 'Path Energy Anomaly', Screwllum stating 'Strong spikes have appeared on the Path chart' (Ofc insinuating they chart the energies of each path, likely picking up destruction as this is also in the Irontomb fight). There's probably more.

It seems paths are just smaller conglomerations of the overarching energy they're made up of, whether this be Internal Imaginary Energy or Imaginary Energy and whichever you think HE is, subsequently a smaller part of Honkai Energy.
 
PlungingThroughTime said:
It'd still be an issue as the paths the characters use are just smaller subsets of overall Imaginary Energy, hence the below.


Think of it as this, Imaginary Energy is light, the paths are different wavelengths of light. They're all part of light but just being able to use 'orange' doesn't mean you have access to the full spectrum of light (Imaginary Energy or in this case, Honkai Energy). I hope this analogy is sufficient.

There's more evidence supporting this, two different paths being called Imaginary Internal Energy, that the Imaginary Internal Energy in the World-Cleansing Blood section has 'nature similar to an Emanator of Destruction'. More includes Herta stating in the Irontomb fight there's a 'Path Energy Anomaly', Screwllum stating 'Strong spikes have appeared on the Path chart' (Ofc insinuating they chart the energies of each path, likely picking up destruction as this is also in the Irontomb fight). There's probably more.

It seems paths are just smaller conglomerations of the overarching energy they're made up of, whether this be Internal Imaginary Energy or Imaginary Energy and whichever you think HE is, subsequently a smaller part of Honkai Energy.
Click to expand...
I remember there being scans for doomsday beast and Cocolia being able to control imaginary energy at will. Not even path energy. Is that relevant.
 
CastoriceTheFifth said:
I remember there being scans for doomsday beast and Cocolia being able to control imaginary energy at will. Not even path energy. Is that relevant.
Click to expand...
Not gonna lie these really sound like outliers given we haven't seen them display a range of abilities, even Irontomb could only control 'Destruction Path Energy' and he's debatable the highest scaling non-Aeon in the verse.
The TB with a stellaron can only control paths they've previously 'harmonised' with (the Stellarons 100% just work by harmonising with a path and then the user can use it, pun is entirely intended btw. Not sure if the game has went over this, haven't played 3.8) and we haven't seen Cocolia have access to other paths like the TB. Seeing the actual scans would help a bit? No clue, I don't have context on them.

Either way, they still do control Imaginary Energy, just a smaller subset of it. Calling them Honkai Energy users isn't entirely wrong but it's a misrepresentation of what they can do with their Imaginary Energy.

It's not like removing HE would effect their ratings or their abilities tbf.
 
PlungingThroughTime said:
Not gonna lie these really sound like outliers given we haven't seen them display a range of abilities, even Irontomb could only control 'Destruction Path Energy' and he's debatable the highest scaling non-Aeon in the verse.
The TB with a stellaron can only control paths they've previously 'harmonised' with (the Stellarons 100% just work by harmonising with a path and then the user can use it, pun is entirely intended btw. Not sure if the game has went over this, haven't played 3.8) and we haven't seen Cocolia have access to other paths like the TB. Seeing the actual scans would help a bit? No clue, I don't have context on them.

Either way, they still do control Imaginary Energy, just a smaller subset of it. Calling them Honkai Energy users isn't entirely wrong but it's a misrepresentation of what they can do with their Imaginary Energy.

It's not like removing HE would effect their ratings or their abilities tbf.
Click to expand...
This statement also exists and doesn't refer to her Path Energy so theres that
image.png
 
CastoriceTheFifth said:
This statement also exists and doesn't refer to her Path Energy so theres that
image.png
Click to expand...
I mean, like I said, it's not entirely wrong but not entirely right.

I think you'd need to be able to prove paths all use the same (at least) Imaginary Energy (or all of it) to maintain HE, but it genuinely seems unlikely.

This is because of Aeons splitting and joining, like Xipe, I'm pretty sure it increases the amount of IE they control and also gives their pathstriders new abilities, like Sunday having access to Order. Paths splitting presumably splits up abilities too, like how the DH's race lost abilities presumably when Long's path was carved up by Tayzzyronth and presumably Yaoshi (immortality, it makes a hell of a lot of sense when you look at it).

We also see pathstriders of different paths all have different abilities while pathstriders on the same path have similar ones. It just seems incredibly hard to prove otherwise.
 
PlungingThroughTime said:
I mean, like I said, it's not entirely wrong but not entirely right.

I think you'd need to be able to prove paths all use the same (at least) Imaginary Energy (or all of it) to maintain HE, but it genuinely seems unlikely.

This is because of Aeons splitting and joining, like Xipe, I'm pretty sure it increases the amount of IE they control and also gives their pathstriders new abilities, like Sunday having access to Order. Paths splitting presumably splits up abilities too, like how the DH's race lost abilities presumably when Long's path was carved up by Tayzzyronth and presumably Yaoshi (immortality, it makes a hell of a lot of sense when you look at it).

We also see pathstriders of different paths all have different abilities while pathstriders on the same path have similar ones. It just seems incredibly hard to prove otherwise.
Click to expand...
This just meant that Pathstriders and Emanators potency are different, but generally Emanators are unrestricted (i.e they can draw as much IE as they want) so I don't know why this is a problem
 
Voidnether said:
This just meant that Pathstriders and Emanators potency are different, but generally Emanators are unrestricted (i.e they can draw as much IE as they want) so I don't know why this is a problem
Click to expand...
It's not about quantity of HE. If it was then Irontomb would be able to draw Harmony Path Energy. Path Energy wouldn't even be an idea. The issue is each path energy is a smaller subset of overarching Imaginary Energy and thus they don't control all Imaginary Energy, just their Path Energies.

If HE is Imaginary Internal Energy, I can still prove Imaginary Internal Energy is used to refer to multiple paths and therefore, as they both have different abilities, can't be controlling the whole spectrum of HE.

If HE is Imaginary Energy, I can still prove Paths are smaller wavelengths of 'Imaginary Energy' like colours are to light and that pathstriders and Emanators control their own path's energy, thus not controlling the whole spectrum of HE. Emanators draw IE from their Path, hence not being able to use other path's abilities.

This is why it isn't wrong to call them Imaginary Energy / HE users. They do use this energy source, just a smaller spectrum of it that means they don't get access to every path's abilities.

(BTW, look at the Aeon designs, they all feature specific colour theming, just something I find cool)
 
PlungingThroughTime said:
It's not about quantity of HE. If it was then Irontomb would be able to draw Harmony Path Energy. Path Energy wouldn't even be an idea. The issue is each path energy is a smaller subset of overarching Imaginary Energy and thus they don't control all Imaginary Energy, just their Path Energies.

If HE is Imaginary Internal Energy, I can still prove Imaginary Internal Energy is used to refer to multiple paths and therefore, as they both have different abilities, can't be controlling the whole spectrum of HE.

If HE is Imaginary Energy, I can still prove Paths are smaller wavelengths of 'Imaginary Energy' like colours are to light and that pathstriders and Emanators control their own path's energy, thus not controlling the whole spectrum of HE. Emanators draw IE from their Path, hence not being able to use other path's abilities.

This is why it isn't wrong to call them Imaginary Energy / HE users. They do use this energy source, just a smaller spectrum of it that means they don't get access to every path's abilities.

(BTW, look at the Aeon designs, they all feature specific colour theming, just something I find cool)
Click to expand...
Yeah that'd make sense, generally the one who has access to every Path's abilities like a specific one if they're granted the entirety of said Path such as Noblesse Worm when Aha decided to give it like the entirety of Path of Elation for some reason. Basically unless you'd have access to the entirety of their Path or shown to be able to use all anyway like Khaslana with the 12 Coreflames, I mean it's basically just something exclusive to the Aeons (Acheron is also an exception tbh, since IX's hax is comprised of her own abilities including Horizon of Existence's hax). But I don't know who would thought that you could use the Path Energy of like every Paths when the only maximum is that we have someone like Evernight who's capable of drawing powers from Destruction, Remembrance and Enigmata (Multiple Paths basically). I still think however it'd be fine if like we consider the lower-end Pathstriders to be low-level HE, higher-end Pathstriders to be high-level HE and I think the Lord Ravager-level stuff could get replaced with just like Emanator level if that's a thing. If you're asking me though, they won't get the abilities of a Herrscher but they just derive from low-level HE and high-level HE abilities including their own such as Emanator's shared resistance to Sunday's tuning since all Emanators could do it anyway. Wouldn't make sense to not be listed there.
 
At the same time, unironically you could argue Khaslana has Irontomb's EE because he had Fusionism that merged with Irontomb lol on the profiles. But that just goes to show that I think Khaslana's capable of using everything in Path of Destruction when he himself has pseudo-black hole albeit not the same thing as Zephyro's white hole in the first place. I'm still skeptical, but yeah if it's someone granted the entirety of their Path's powers, they could use all of the abilities there.
 
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