Hazbin Hotel/Helluva Boss revisions

[The_Smashor]

The current stats are kind bad
First, the AP. As you can see, we have no idea how far I.M.P. even are from the explosion, as they are completely offscreen when it happens and we don't know exactly where they were when it took place. Plus, they are currently scaled to the full force of the explosion, which anyone who remembers the days of City Block level JoJo's knows can't really stand.

Then the speed. The current speed feats that put people at hypersonic are questionable at best.

The current feat used appears to be aimdodging. There are multiple points where Blitzo isn't even particularly aiming at him, and in the specific scene used for the calc Blitzo isn't even changing his aim at all. Plus, it's pretty clear that they shouldn't really scale to Robo-Fizz at all. Robo-Fizz is pretty clearly depicted as superior by a good bit, tossing Blitzo around like a ragdoll for most of the fight while still being pretty casual, only being defeated through indirect means. People argue that Millie is managing to hold her aim on Robo-Fizz here, but she's clearly not hitting him and she's more comparing to his movement speed (Which is shown to be slower than the bullets from Blitzo's rifle) than his reaction time.

As for Moxxie throwing Blitzo off aim, by going frame-by-frame we can actually see Blitzo is off aim BEFORE the bullet is fired. Blitzo was likely thrown off by some sort of physical contact as he was pulling the trigger.

The AP only really effects the Helluva cast, though since the Hazbin cast's speed is upscaled from them that effects them as well.

So, now we're at sqaure one. What now?
There are numerous feats that can be used. I'm just gonna list 'em off real quick.

Striker survives being crushed by this large statue of himself (The scene might imply he got away from it, but given we literally see him get hit he probably just used the dust cloud to escape)

Striker manages to dodge a gunshot at a very close range, only beginning to dodge after the gun fires. While Striker is generally superior to I.M.P., it's not to nearly the same extent as Robo-Fizz, so they should be able to scale to him.

Striker pulls off and slams down this stelagtite and slams it into the ground

Millie is hit with this large piece of rock

Moxxie is hit with this large piece of rock so hard it shatters and cracks the ground (I've been researching Striker recently, can you tell?)

Millie endures this large explosion nearly point-blank. The same weapon knocks down a building in two shots.
Angelic Weapons Buff
I dislike proposing nerfs without offering some buffs in return, so this should even things out a little bit.

Niffty with an angelic weapon that has no indication of being superior to any other angelic weapon was able to kill Adam. As such, everyone who uses angelic weapons should have said weapons buffed to Adam's 7-A.

 

[y3p_owo]

Adam was already beaten within an inch of his life by Lucifer and was basically caught off guard when Niffty did attack him, so I don't really think they should scale to Adam. Everything else looks good though.

 

[The_Smashor]

Adam was already beaten within an inch of his life by Lucifer and was basically caught off guard when Niffty did attack him, so I don't really think they should scale to Adam. Everything else looks good though.

Fair enough

 

[DaReaperMan]

The current stats are kind bad
First, the AP. As you can see, we have no idea how far I.M.P. even are from the explosion, as they are completely offscreen when it happens and we don't know exactly where they were when it took place. Plus, they are currently scaled to the full force of the explosion, which anyone who remembers the days of City Block level JoJo's knows can't really stand.

Yeah as discussed on the discussion thread, some feats would throw them into the 9-B to 9-A range, since they are beyond consistent there

Then the speed. The current speed feats that put people at hypersonic are questionable at best.

The current feat used appears to be aimdodging. There are multiple points where Blitzo isn't even particularly aiming at him, and in the specific scene used for the calc Blitzo isn't even changing his aim at all. Plus, it's pretty clear that they shouldn't really scale to Robo-Fizz at all. Robo-Fizz is pretty clearly depicted as superior by a good bit, tossing Blitzo around like a ragdoll for most of the fight while still being pretty casual, only being defeated through indirect means. People argue that Millie is managing to hold her aim on Robo-Fizz here, but she's clearly not hitting him and she's more comparing to his movement speed (Which is shown to be slower than the bullets from Blitzo's rifle) than his reaction time.

Fair, I suppose, could use Millie kicking a bullet out of the air(for one example) to replace the speed, but that'd have to be calced.

So, now we're at sqaure one. What now?
There are numerous feats that can be used. I'm just gonna list 'em off real quick.

Striker survives being crushed by this large statue of himself (The scene might imply he got away from it, but given we literally see him get hit he probably just used the dust cloud to escape)

Striker manages to dodge a gunshot at a very close range, only beginning to dodge after the gun fires. While Striker is generally superior to I.M.P., it's not to nearly the same extent as Robo-Fizz, so they should be able to scale to him.

Striker pulls off and slams down this stelagtite and slams it into the ground

Millie is hit with this large piece of rock

Moxxie is hit with this large piece of rock so hard it shatters and cracks the ground (I've been researching Striker recently, can you tell?)

Millie endures this large explosion nearly point-blank. The same weapon knocks down a building in two shots.

Yep, there are a few more, but thisnis a solid collection of calcable tier 9 feats and some of the bullet timing feats

Angelic Weapons Buff
I dislike proposing nerfs without offering some buffs in return, so this should even things out a little bit.

Niffty with an angelic weapon that has no indication of being superior to any other angelic weapon was able to kill Adam. As such, everyone who uses angelic weapons should have said weapons buffed to Adam's 7-A.

This I disagree with for reasons above, Adam was already tap-dancing on Death's door when Nifty stabbed him to death, so yeah.

 

[Minos_the_Judge]

In fact, the author of the calculations of hypersonic feats himself noted that he did not really believe that these were legitimate feats, and he just wanted his calculation to be in the profile, because at that time everyone agreed that this was a legitimate feat, and to convince them he could not.

I agree. But I feel like angel weapons somewhat ignore the durability of angels or something.

 

[ShionAH]

I still think Angelic stuff ignore durability but dont know if thats accepted

I would like to say Blitz is equal to Striker and fully enraged Millie is slightly above him according to the festival episode

 

[The_Smashor]

I personally don't think angelic weapons ignore durability, inherently. The soul-destroying properties have only been noted to work after death, plus it wouldn't make sense for Angels to have inherit durability lower than Sinners. I think Angelic Weapons are just the only things strong enough to get past an angel's immense toughness.

Honestly, invulnerability and type 5 immortality should probably be removed from the angels' profiles, since Lute and Lucifer both show against Vaggie and Adam that if you're physically strong enough you can still damage an angel with your bare hands.

 

[ShionAH]

since Lute and Lucifer

Angelic Magic has the same Negation of Angelic Metal.

 

[The_Smashor]

Lute and Lucifer weren't using angelic magic, they were using their bare hands. At most, Lucifer was maybe enhancing his strikes with fire.

I also haven't seen the statement that says angelic magic has the same properties as angelic weapons.

 

[DaReaperMan]

Lute and Lucifer weren't using angelic magic, they were using their bare hands. At most, Lucifer was maybe enhancing his strikes with fire.

I also haven't seen the statement that says angelic magic has the same properties as angelic weapons.

Lute and Lucifer are also, oh ya know, ANGELS!

 

[ShionAH]

I also haven't seen the statement that says angelic magic has the same properties as angelic weapons.

Adams holy light was a threat to the sinners, proving that the light has the same power as metal

 

[The_Smashor]

Lute and Lucifer are also, oh ya know, ANGELS!

Except, despite Lute ripping off Vaggie's wings with her bare hands, she and Adam were surprised when an Angel was permanently killed by an angelic weapon. Given Vaggie could regenerate her wings that were ripped off and not her eye that was stabbed... yeah.

 

[The_Smashor]

Adams holy light was a threat to the sinners, proving that the light has the same power as metal

Sinners can be damaged by normal weapons and attacks, it's angelic weapons that can kill them permanently.

 

[ShionAH]

Sinners can be damaged by normal weapons and attacks, it's angelic weapons that can kill them permanently.

Yeah, Angelic Magic can also kill them permanently. Its literally the source of Angelic metal

 

[DaReaperMan]

Except, despite Lute ripping off Vaggie's wings with her bare hands, she and Adam were surprised when an Angel was permanently killed by an angelic weapon. Given Vaggie could regenerate her wings that were ripped off and not her eye that was stabbed... yeah.

They didn't even know the Exorcist was killed with an Angelic Weapon. All they knew was that an Exorcist had been killed in hell during the Extermination. That's it.

 

[The_Smashor]

Yeah, Angelic Magic can also kill them permanently. Its literally the source of Angelic metal

And this is confirmed where?

 

[The_Smashor]

They didn't even know the Exorcist was killed with an Angelic Weapon. All they knew was that an Exorcist had been killed in hell during the Extermination. That's it.

Okay, they were shocked that an exorcist was killed at all despite tearing a different exorcist's wings off with their bare hands.

 

[ShionAH]

And this is confirmed where?

When Adam shot Sir Pentious everyone knew he was dead, if Angelic Magic didnt kill Sinners then they wouldnt even be sad for Pentious

There is also how Adam is not dumb enough to use an ability that doesnt even kill anyone lmao, Adam also spawned his axe with his Angelic Powers and just like normal Angelic Weapons it was shown to be a threat that could kill Alastor

Charlie also created Angelic Trident with her Angelic Magic

 

[DaReaperMan]

Okay, they were shocked that an exorcist was killed at all despite tearing a different exorcist's wings off with their bare hands.

Because they thought they were invincible to all but the strongest people in hell, and those people were supposed to never interfere.

Did you even watch the show my dude?

 

[The_Smashor]

When Adam shot Sir Pentious everyone knew he was dead, if Angelic Magic didnt kill Sinners then they wouldnt even be sad for Pentious

There is also how Adam is not dumb enough to use an ability that doesnt even kill anyone lmao, Adam also spawned his axe with his Angelic Powers and just like normal Angelic Weapons it was shown to be a threat that could kill Alastor

Charlie also created Angelic Trident with her Angelic Magic

Fair, but this wouldn't necessarily apply to bare knuckle strikes or sheer tearing power, since there's no evidence of magic being used there. Lute was also able to tear off her own arm with sheer pulling strength when it was crushed by a rock, without her touching her own arm at all, meaning her own sheer strength is the only thing that could have done it.

I was more looking for proof that angelic magic was the source of angelic metal. Charlie's Trident likely isn't angelic metal, since Adam was able to regenerate from it just fine, which he shouldn't be able to do against an angelic weapon since, again, Vaggie could regenerate her wings just fine when they were torn off but couldn't regenerate her eye. Stolas also notably has bandages around his stab wound from Striker's angelic knife.

Regardless, there certainly isn't sufficient evidence for Type 5 immortality, Angels clearly have a concept of death; and what we used to give them invulnerability seems more like a combination of regeneration and durability.

Did you even watch the show my dude?

Let's try to keep this civil, attitudes like that are what has a sizable portion of the internet making fun of this hobby.

 

[The_Smashor]

Bump