Hax Layer Evaluation Thread

[Astral_Trinity439]

Quick power null +1 layer proposal for TenSura's Suspended World; I noticed we didn't have this even tho it was relatively simple

3 Layers: Yuuki's 3 Layered Power Null that is already accepted
3 Layer Resistance: Rimuru's Resistance which is also already accepted
4 Layers: Suspended World's Power Nullification effected Rimuru as well.

We can’t win like that! That’s a foul! It may be acceptable in manga or anime, but in real life, that’s just shocking.‘ Those who cannot reach the ‘suspended world’ are no match for those who can, no matter how strong they are.’—It seems that I was right in recognizing that. In fact, there was nothing I could do. ~ Volume 19 Chapter 4

 

[CodeCCLL]

Quick power null +1 layer proposal for TenSura's Suspended World; I noticed we didn't have this even tho it was relatively simple

3 Layers: Yuuki's 3 Layered Power Null that is already accepted
3 Layer Resistance: Rimuru's Resistance which is also already accepted
4 Layers: Suspended World's Power Nullification effected Rimuru as well.

This has already been rejected by Glassman before. Suspended Worlds' powernull works on a completely different mechanism tied to stopping time and cannot be layered.

 

[Astral_Trinity439]

This has already been rejected by Glassman before. Suspended Worlds' powernull works on a completely different mechanism tied to stopping time and cannot be layered.

Hmm, ic. Can you link where it was rejected?

 

[Theglassman12]

Been a while since I checked this thread out, I'll get as much out of the way as I can.

@Eseseso The layered hax for the rings is ok, the emeralds stuff I'm not ok with given the description is talking about stat increase and nothing to imply the abilities/hax potencies are increased.

@Jackof_noTrades068 looks ok.

@Wikisource that's one layer, not two. Gifts are where the Baseline resistances starts going off that description alone.

@Minaaaa Yeah that looks like some boasting and not actual layered scaling.

@Rikimarox2 The will condensing looks pretty straightforward and explicit, though it seems to be off the notion that 360 degrees is the baseline given how a 90 degree focus makes it 4 times stronger, so it looks good to me.

@Detective_Blizzard that doesn't really sound like 9 layers to bypass, just moreso he's shrugging off different aspects of the same kind of control. It would need to bypass someone's resistance and said resistances growing stronger 8 times each.

@Digital_Franz Idk how you got unquantifiable or infinite layers from these scans because they're not telling me anything on how it reaches that level.

 

[Livinmeme]

The layered hax for the rings is ok, the emeralds stuff I'm not ok with given the description is talking about stat increase and nothing to imply the abilities/hax potencies are increased

Maybe a possible rating, due to the somewhat ambious relationship of rings and emeralds?

 

[Theglassman12]

If the emeralds have any other arguments beyond what I've been given for more layers then maybe, but as of now I'm mostly seeing the rings with the best evidence for layered hax, so just upscale what's shown with the rings and you're good.

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

@Detective_Blizzard that doesn't really sound like 9 layers to bypass, just moreso he's shrugging off different aspects of the same kind of control. It would need to bypass someone's resistance and said resistances growing stronger 8 times each.

The thing is that type of control, by its own logic, would be bypassing resistances in order to get there.

Because each fluency in language grants someone a resistance to mind control in the verse, someone who just knows English and Spanish would effectively be immune to it similarly due to the multiple thought patterns. She'd need to bypass that resistance in order to control it, Lupin however just has a brain so complex that she needed to start off with at a 9/18 layer point in order to bypass him. Which he was able to grow stronger from mid-mind control granting him that final 9/18 layer.

Basically, he on all accounts technically already grew 8 times stronger on account of him getting to that point in the first place since anything less would had required less work to bypass.

 

[Theglassman12]

This still sounds like she just needed to say a specific word all in these different languages to get him under a trance rather than him being built with layered hax. This is more akin to unlocking several locks with different keys than overpowering layers of barrier designed to resist an ability.

 

[Wikisource]

@Wikisource that's one layer, not two. Gifts are where the Baseline resistances starts going off that description alone.

Yes, I know. What I mean here about bypass resistance. Gift can resistance magic (baseline resistance) but can affect each other => 1 layer affect.

And Authority can bypass another Authority's resistance (which can resist to Gift's effect => 1 layer resistance) aka 2 layer affect. Sorry about unclearly description.

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

This still sounds like she just needed to say a specific word all in these different languages to get him under a trance rather than him being built with layered hax. This is more akin to unlocking several locks with different keys than overpowering layers of barrier designed to resist an ability.

Kinda a bit of both honestly, she used trigger words specifically so she could be under the radar since she's supposed to be dead from like half a century ago (Chronological continuity in this verse is weird) which she had planted into his head from that long ago in order to get it to work. However under normal circumstances (EX: The maid or her just saying "I'm your mother" to him and failing) she's able to just talk to someone normally and then mind control them in basically any way she needs to.

However, it's also evidence of each language acting as a barrier designed against her since she outright describes it as "I would find a way to make the seeds of truth I had planted in his subconscious bloom once again, except this time on a grander and more beautiful scale than before." She's using the exact same ability however it's in a more complex and well "layered" method in order to, and I quote, "probe all of his thought patterns and reconstruct what I had taught him within every corner of his mind". She's quite literally using her powers in a way in order to bypass each resistance he has by literally activating every neuron in his brain in order to get it to work, and it still failed.

It's less "several locks with different keys" and more "she planted a bunch of landmines which exploded in rapid succession after 60 years of prep time"

 

[Theglassman12]

@Wikisource it doesn't really tell me that with the authority being able to affect each other, do you have anything to make it more clearer than that.

@Detective_Blizzard Yeah not really seeing this as layered hax tbh, this sounds way too specific in its mechanic to be considered what's we classify as layered hax.

 

[Detective_Blizzard]

Eh, gonna be a long while until I get that train moving anyway. Probably could make better arguments for it when I get to it specifically (this verse has a lot of content just not in it lol)

 

[Wikisource]

@Wikisource it doesn't really tell me that with the authority being able to affect each other, do you have anything to make it more clearer than that.

Here about full of context in chapter 244. Kim Suho's Gift can't affect to six demons, protected by Demon King's Authority but Kim Hajin with his Authority: Punish and Discipline can kill six demons.

Kim Suho said as he pointed his sword at the six remaining demons.
They were all high-class demons blessed with the Demon King's Authority. Because Authorities existed above the realm of Gifts, Kim Suho's Sword Saint Gift did not work on them. As such, he had to
face them with pure swordsmanship.
-You humans are stronger than we thought.
-But we're bored now. There will be no more playing around.
"Of course, that doesn't mean I think I'll lose."

Kim Suho smiled and began to gather his magic power to use his ultimate skill.
Using Misteltein as a catalyst, a secret technique capable of toppling a mountain was starting...
No, it was about to start.
Before the golden magic power Kim Suho was emitting took shape, starlight began to flash in the sky.
Chwaaaa....
Dozens of streaks of light fell, like shooting stars flying through the sky.
"W-What?"
"?"
"Wow...."
Kim Suho canceled his ultimate skill, Jin Seyeon and Aileen looked up at the beautiful scenery in a
daze, and Yi Yongha took out a camera and began taking pictures.
The demons only stared at it with disdain.
Soon, the shooting stars touched the ground. The targets of the starlights were obviously demons.
However, the demons stood in place without much thought. They were confident in being able to
withstand this attack.
-Hah?
Then, a short death throe escaped one demon's mouth.
That was it.
Kim Hajin's Authority, [Punish and Discipline], turned ordinary magic bullets into light-attribute bullets
with 4.5 streaks of Stigma, piercing the six demons' bodies and burning their souls directly. ~ Chapter 244

 

[Digital_Franz]

@Digital_Franz Idk how you got unquantifiable or infinite layers from these scans because they're not telling me anything on how it reaches that level.

As I explained, the difference in Status is reflected in the HAX and the resistances. Unqualifiable comes just from the fact that the Status cannot be quantified and the chain that comes from this difference is the same. It is shown that among the constellations of the same rank there are always differences in Status which already makes layers appear.

 

[Theglassman12]

That doesn’t sound like unquantifiable, let alone infinite layers of potency. You’re gonna need a lot more than that.

 

[Digital_Franz]

That doesn’t sound like unquantifiable, let alone infinite layers of potency. You’re gonna need a lot more than that.

Yeah I saw that Infinite wasn't really possible since there is no infinite Status. I think Unquantifiable is the way to go. If you have a way to count layers and deal with the fact that everything can instantly change due to a Status increase then let me know.

 

[Theglassman12]

Still not seeing unquantifiable layers without the evidence to provide it as such.

 

[Digital_Franz]

Still not seeing unquantifiable layers without the evidence to provide it as such.

What evidence is needed since what I have given seems not concrete. And what is the number of layers with the current evidence?

 

[Theglassman12]

From those few scans there’s like 1-3 layers at best, for it to be unquantifiable you’d need to be able to have some UES or some range feat that affects an unquantifiable amount of folks with resistance to said hax, and it being condensed to a specific target to increase in potency.

 

[Digital_Franz]

From those few scans there’s like 1-3 layers at best,

I can get at least 6 layers out with the in-verse mechanisms alone.

for it to be unquantifiable you’d need to be able to have some UES

I don't see the connection with the UES but that's not a problem. I was going to justify the existence of an UES through the Status.

or some range feat that affects an unquantifiable amount of folks with resistance to said hax,

It would only be in numbers (the scale) and their resistances can be of the same level.

and it being condensed to a specific target to increase in potency.

Some can multiply their Status to be able to affect their opponents.

 

[Theglassman12]

Well you should bring the scans to prove that being a thing then.

 

[Digital_Franz]

Well you should bring the scans to prove that being a thing then.

The multiplication of the Status?

 

[Wikisource]

Here about full of context in chapter 244. Kim Suho's Gift can't affect to six demons, protected by Demon King's Authority but Kim Hajin with his Authority: Punish and Discipline can kill six demons.

Bump

 

[Theglassman12]

@Digital_Franz I'm talking about everything else you've been saying.

@Wikisource idk if that's gonna help since that just mentions you can kill them.

 

[Wikisource]

@Wikisource idk if that's gonna help since that just mentions you can kill them.

Kim Suho's Gift doesn't work on six demons but Kim Hajin's Authority can affects to them.

 

[Digital_Franz]

@Digital_Franz I'm talking about everything else you've been saying.

OK.

With the difference in Status and what is said in-verse we have: Low-grade Dokkaebi<Low-grade Constellation<Low-grade Outer God<Mid-grade Dokkaebi<Mid-grade Constellation<Mid-grade Outer God<High-grade Dokkaebi<High-grade Constellation<High-grade Outer God.

For the range I have a feat of a Low-grade Outer God which affected several incarnations (humans) but not on an unquantifiable scale.

For the UES I didn't expect it to be used here so we'll probably pick up when I've done a CRT to get it accepted.

 

[Digital_Franz]

Well you should bring the scans to prove that being a thing then.

I also have this scan. Can it help in any way? Another Fear Inducement feat on a large scale.

 

[Testarossa002]

This thread should be pinned
Spent a while looking for it.

Anyways
Here's my layers proposal for Wolyaverse, a new verse I'm working on and to be published real soon.

Bump

 

[Theglassman12]

@Digital_Franz you're gonna need to explain a lot to help justify the unquantifiable to infinite layers, posting individual scans isn't helping me understand your case.

@Testarossa002 Power null looks fine, idk where you got 12 layers for sensing with those 3 statements. Possession is fine.

 

[Wikisource]

Kim Suho's Gift doesn't work on six demons but Kim Hajin's Authority can affects to them.

Bump

 

[Testarossa002]

idk where you got 12 layers for sensing with those 3 statements.

Only those at the same level of cultivation can sense each other. There are 13 levels of cultivation with sensing

 

[Digital_Franz]

@Digital_Franz you're gonna need to explain a lot to help justify the unquantifiable to infinite layers, posting individual scans isn't helping me understand your case.

I understand. When I evaluate the UES I will just repost the scans or should I add other things?